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What if it is raining? What about when it is too far away to arrive without being sweaty? What if it is too cold to be outside for long? What if it is too far u

What if it is raining? What about when it is too far away to arrive without being sweaty? What if it is too cold to be outside for long? What if it is too far uphill? What if you need to take a child with you? Or two people from out of town? What about bringing back furniture from ikea? How do you leave the city and go out to the surrounding area? What if you need to get somewhere faster than a bike can take you? Cars remain necessary.

CalRobert 9y ago
* Somehow all those Danes and Dutch manage in the rain. * If it's that far away it probably isn't "urban". 15 km is doable for most able-bodied people in 45 minutes or so. (edit) Before somebody says 'BUT LA (or the bay or whatever) IS BIGGER THAN THAT!' - note that what the US calls "urban" is generally "suburban" by any reasonable definition of the word. Fremont's not a city, just a parking lot with a mayor, as described in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlTvSUCCqPo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlTvSUCCqPo ) * There's no bad weather, only bad clothes (if it's a snowstorm, then you shouldn't be driving either) * It's called a bakfiet, or a trailer, or their own bike * See above. Also, rail, bus, etc. * Trailer, taxi, or short-term car rental (car2go, zipcar, etc.) * For urban centers, trains or buses, for rural areas, you will find a number of companies happy to let you use their vehicle for a period of several days in exchange for money * In general, that would be somewhere out of aforementioned urban area so the previous answers reply. Some cycles have motors fitted to them - "motor-cycles" they're called, I think. For people who really, really need to zoom across urban centres (carefully and with extra training), ambulances, police cars, and fire engines remain an option.
IshKebab 9y ago
If it's raining you can wear a waterproof and waterproof trousers. The Netherlands are totally flat so you're unlikely to ever get sweaty. If you do pretty much all workplaces over a certain size provide showers at work. If it's cold you can wear a jacket. It's never that cold in Europe. You can get bikes that carry children. If you need to go long distances or move large things, sure use a car. I don't think anyone is advocating completely banning them but your objections are silly.
marsRoverDev 9y ago
If it's raining, you ride or take public transport there. Most employers and commercial centres offer showers for cyclists. If it's too cold, you wear more clothes. Admittedly, most places with good bike use do not have many hills. In cities which have good bike use I see people with trolley-like things attached to the front of their bike - which are useful for kids and also transporting things around. For two people out of town, getting to yours suddenly becomes their problem. Bringing back furniture from ikea is a nonissue as they offer delivery, and the cost of that is still way lower than owning a car. If you want to leave a city you can always rent a car. Getting from A-B faster than a bike will take you is a taxi job, though your mind readjusts. In cities like copenhagen or amsterdam, bikes have enough mindshare that these concerns are pushed to the back of mind. The fact that you can remain healthy, passively, is a massive bonus; and the lack of cars is stark in comparison to other western countries. Copenhagen is an extreme case of this; nothing much on the roads except for Teslas, some taxis and buses. Everyone else is on bikes.
Fradow 9y ago
Let's answer point by point (I'm not a heavy bike user, but I used to bike everyday to work): - What if it is raining? You use a raincoat. If it's really raining too heavily, use public transportation (bus/metro/tram). It doesn't happen too often in most areas, as far as I know. - What about when it is too far away to arrive without being sweaty? There is very little "too far" when in a big city. If it's really too far, use public transportation, or if it's outside the city, a taxi (or equivalent) or rental. If it happens too much, you are not in an area favorable to bikes, sorry. - What if it is too cold to be outside for long? Are you in an area where it's often below 0°C? If not, it's really not too cold. If you are, well sorry, you are not in an area favorable to bikes either. - What if it is too far uphill? Public transportation on the way up, shared bikes on the way down. That's how it's done here at least. Or you train to go uphill if you have you own bike. - What if you need to take a child with you? You use a bike which have an attachment to carry a child. It's very common in the Netherlands. - Or two people from out of town? They take a bike too. Or they rent a car if they are not confortable using bikes. - What about bringing back furniture from ikea? You pay Ikea to deliver it to your door. Or you rent a truck. - How do you leave the city and go out to the surrounding area? If you really need to (most of the time, you don't), you use a taxi (or equivalent) or a rental. - What if you need to get somewhere faster than a bike can take you? Taxi. To sum up: they are necessary if your location is not bike friendly (heavy rain often, too cold to be outside, really lackluster public transportation, or not in a big city). Otherwise, you can live without car, you just need to plan ahead for the occasions you go out of the city or need to transport things. It's cheaper in the long run too. I understand it may be hard to conceive if you always owned a car. Try to buy a bike and use it whenever possible. At some point, you may find that you don't use your car anymore. Or you may not, and you really do need a car, that's understandable too. Source: 28 years old, living in Paris, I never owned a car. I rely on friends and family car when outside of Paris. If I couldn't rely, I would rent a car when going on vacations and that's it. Unless I move out of Paris, I don't plan to own a car, ever.
matt4077 9y ago
The basic idea is to abolish personal cars, do great things with the space that would free up, and use car sharing for when you need it. But here are some answers to each of you point. Note that I have frequently seen all these being done many times. In a dense urban environment, biking is completely normal, and used for everyday transport by everyone from teenagers to people long retired: - Rain: There is waterproof clothing. It's actually quite fun to bike through rain. - Sweat: Workplaces should offer a place to take a shower–many actually do. But it's also acceptable to break a sweat from time to time. you only start smelling after x hours anyway, because that's a biological process. I'm also not sure if I don't sweat more in public transport or the office itself: remember, most of the world doesn't use AC. - Cold: I've spend many hours on a bike in 0degF weather and it's not a problem. The only "heavy-duty" clothing you need is for hands and your head. - Gravity: What goes uphill, must come downhill. With the right gearing, hill's aren't a problem. They just take longer in one direction than the other. Electric bikes are also an obvious solution to this, especially when they charge with brake energy. - Children: Child-seats in the back, or child trailers are quite common. The latter carry two children easily. - Visitors: "Bike-Sharing" also means sharing bikes with out-of towners. - IKEA: is the prototypical first stop for freshmen here in Germany, almost none of whom have a car. They seem to somehow manage, usually by renting a truck. Besides: I don't know any cars that could fit the usual IKEA haul. - Visiting the provinces: Public transport (+bike on public transport), or car sharing - Speed: Public transport again, or taxi, or car sharing: I have an archive of 12000km of rides through a dense city (Berlin), and I average 22km/h during the day, and 25km/h at night. That's almost exactly the average speed of a subway traveller (including changing trains etc.). It's also about as fast as a car during normal daytime, and much faster than rush hour traffic.
- 8xde0wcNwpslOw 9y ago
  >It's actually quite fun to bike through rain. Whatever floats your boat. I would like to remind you that you do live in a bubble, though. Even if it doesn't quite keep you dry in the rain.
  - matt4077 9y ago
    Everyone lives in their own bubble. "Real America" is as much a bubble as "Guinea wheat farmer". But since biking has positive externalities, I have no qualms proselytising.
hawski 9y ago
I think that the future are electric bikes and electric cargo-bikes. I've seen lots of them in Berlin. Also (at least in Germany) you can borrow a cargo bike from Ikea: http://www.ikea.com/ms/de_DE/img/local_store_info/hamburg_altona/pdf_files/Service_Leihfahrrad_HH-Altona_1406_Internet.pdf http://www.ikea.com/ms/de_DE/img/local_store_info/hamburg_al... First 3 hours free, then 5 EUR/h.
imgabe 9y ago
> What if it is raining? Then you get wet. You're not made of sugar, you'll be fine. > What about when it is too far away to arrive without being sweaty? Then you'll be sweaty for 10 minutes until it dries. If more people bike, you'll have an easy time convincing your employer to provide showers. > What if it is too cold to be outside for long? Pedal faster. It will warm you up and you you won't be outside as long. Double win. Also, wear appropriate clothing. Unless we're talking about Winnipeg or something where you get frostbite within 5 minutes, cold air will not hurt you. > What if you need to take a child with you? Or two people from out of town? What about bringing back furniture from ikea? How do you leave the city and go out to the surrounding area? Zipcar or other car-sharing services if you absolutely need a car. Uber and Lyft are also options. They make child seats for bikes and special bikes that can easily carry 2 small children. > What if you need to get somewhere faster than a bike can take you? For any bikeable distance in a city, the bike is almost always faster than driving.

CalRobert 9y ago

* Somehow all those Danes and Dutch manage in the rain. * If it's that far away it probably isn't "urban". 15 km is doable for most able-bodied people in 45 minutes or so. (edit) Before somebody says 'BUT LA (or the bay or whatever) IS BIGGER THAN THAT!' - note that what the US calls "urban" is generally "suburban" by any reasonable definition of the word. Fremont's not a city, just a parking lot with a mayor, as described in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlTvSUCCqPo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlTvSUCCqPo ) * There's no bad weather, only bad clothes (if it's a snowstorm, then you shouldn't be driving either) * It's called a bakfiet, or a trailer, or their own bike * See above. Also, rail, bus, etc. * Trailer, taxi, or short-term car rental (car2go, zipcar, etc.) * For urban centers, trains or buses, for rural areas, you will find a number of companies happy to let you use their vehicle for a period of several days in exchange for money * In general, that would be somewhere out of aforementioned urban area so the previous answers reply. Some cycles have motors fitted to them - "motor-cycles" they're called, I think. For people who really, really need to zoom across urban centres (carefully and with extra training), ambulances, police cars, and fire engines remain an option.

IshKebab 9y ago

If it's raining you can wear a waterproof and waterproof trousers. The Netherlands are totally flat so you're unlikely to ever get sweaty. If you do pretty much all workplaces over a certain size provide showers at work. If it's cold you can wear a jacket. It's never that cold in Europe. You can get bikes that carry children. If you need to go long distances or move large things, sure use a car. I don't think anyone is advocating completely banning them but your objections are silly.

marsRoverDev 9y ago

If it's raining, you ride or take public transport there. Most employers and commercial centres offer showers for cyclists. If it's too cold, you wear more clothes. Admittedly, most places with good bike use do not have many hills. In cities which have good bike use I see people with trolley-like things attached to the front of their bike - which are useful for kids and also transporting things around. For two people out of town, getting to yours suddenly becomes their problem. Bringing back furniture from ikea is a nonissue as they offer delivery, and the cost of that is still way lower than owning a car. If you want to leave a city you can always rent a car. Getting from A-B faster than a bike will take you is a taxi job, though your mind readjusts. In cities like copenhagen or amsterdam, bikes have enough mindshare that these concerns are pushed to the back of mind. The fact that you can remain healthy, passively, is a massive bonus; and the lack of cars is stark in comparison to other western countries. Copenhagen is an extreme case of this; nothing much on the roads except for Teslas, some taxis and buses. Everyone else is on bikes.

Fradow 9y ago

Let's answer point by point (I'm not a heavy bike user, but I used to bike everyday to work): - What if it is raining? You use a raincoat. If it's really raining too heavily, use public transportation (bus/metro/tram). It doesn't happen too often in most areas, as far as I know. - What about when it is too far away to arrive without being sweaty? There is very little "too far" when in a big city. If it's really too far, use public transportation, or if it's outside the city, a taxi (or equivalent) or rental. If it happens too much, you are not in an area favorable to bikes, sorry. - What if it is too cold to be outside for long? Are you in an area where it's often below 0°C? If not, it's really not too cold. If you are, well sorry, you are not in an area favorable to bikes either. - What if it is too far uphill? Public transportation on the way up, shared bikes on the way down. That's how it's done here at least. Or you train to go uphill if you have you own bike. - What if you need to take a child with you? You use a bike which have an attachment to carry a child. It's very common in the Netherlands. - Or two people from out of town? They take a bike too. Or they rent a car if they are not confortable using bikes. - What about bringing back furniture from ikea? You pay Ikea to deliver it to your door. Or you rent a truck. - How do you leave the city and go out to the surrounding area? If you really need to (most of the time, you don't), you use a taxi (or equivalent) or a rental. - What if you need to get somewhere faster than a bike can take you? Taxi. To sum up: they are necessary if your location is not bike friendly (heavy rain often, too cold to be outside, really lackluster public transportation, or not in a big city). Otherwise, you can live without car, you just need to plan ahead for the occasions you go out of the city or need to transport things. It's cheaper in the long run too. I understand it may be hard to conceive if you always owned a car. Try to buy a bike and use it whenever possible. At some point, you may find that you don't use your car anymore. Or you may not, and you really do need a car, that's understandable too. Source: 28 years old, living in Paris, I never owned a car. I rely on friends and family car when outside of Paris. If I couldn't rely, I would rent a car when going on vacations and that's it. Unless I move out of Paris, I don't plan to own a car, ever.

matt4077 9y ago

The basic idea is to abolish personal cars, do great things with the space that would free up, and use car sharing for when you need it. But here are some answers to each of you point. Note that I have frequently seen all these being done many times. In a dense urban environment, biking is completely normal, and used for everyday transport by everyone from teenagers to people long retired: - Rain: There is waterproof clothing. It's actually quite fun to bike through rain. - Sweat: Workplaces should offer a place to take a shower–many actually do. But it's also acceptable to break a sweat from time to time. you only start smelling after x hours anyway, because that's a biological process. I'm also not sure if I don't sweat more in public transport or the office itself: remember, most of the world doesn't use AC. - Cold: I've spend many hours on a bike in 0degF weather and it's not a problem. The only "heavy-duty" clothing you need is for hands and your head. - Gravity: What goes uphill, must come downhill. With the right gearing, hill's aren't a problem. They just take longer in one direction than the other. Electric bikes are also an obvious solution to this, especially when they charge with brake energy. - Children: Child-seats in the back, or child trailers are quite common. The latter carry two children easily. - Visitors: "Bike-Sharing" also means sharing bikes with out-of towners. - IKEA: is the prototypical first stop for freshmen here in Germany, almost none of whom have a car. They seem to somehow manage, usually by renting a truck. Besides: I don't know any cars that could fit the usual IKEA haul. - Visiting the provinces: Public transport (+bike on public transport), or car sharing - Speed: Public transport again, or taxi, or car sharing: I have an archive of 12000km of rides through a dense city (Berlin), and I average 22km/h during the day, and 25km/h at night. That's almost exactly the average speed of a subway traveller (including changing trains etc.). It's also about as fast as a car during normal daytime, and much faster than rush hour traffic.

8xde0wcNwpslOw 9y ago
>It's actually quite fun to bike through rain. Whatever floats your boat. I would like to remind you that you do live in a bubble, though. Even if it doesn't quite keep you dry in the rain.
- matt4077 9y ago
  Everyone lives in their own bubble. "Real America" is as much a bubble as "Guinea wheat farmer". But since biking has positive externalities, I have no qualms proselytising.

hawski 9y ago

I think that the future are electric bikes and electric cargo-bikes. I've seen lots of them in Berlin. Also (at least in Germany) you can borrow a cargo bike from Ikea: http://www.ikea.com/ms/de_DE/img/local_store_info/hamburg_altona/pdf_files/Service_Leihfahrrad_HH-Altona_1406_Internet.pdf http://www.ikea.com/ms/de_DE/img/local_store_info/hamburg_al... First 3 hours free, then 5 EUR/h.

imgabe 9y ago

> What if it is raining? Then you get wet. You're not made of sugar, you'll be fine. > What about when it is too far away to arrive without being sweaty? Then you'll be sweaty for 10 minutes until it dries. If more people bike, you'll have an easy time convincing your employer to provide showers. > What if it is too cold to be outside for long? Pedal faster. It will warm you up and you you won't be outside as long. Double win. Also, wear appropriate clothing. Unless we're talking about Winnipeg or something where you get frostbite within 5 minutes, cold air will not hurt you. > What if you need to take a child with you? Or two people from out of town? What about bringing back furniture from ikea? How do you leave the city and go out to the surrounding area? Zipcar or other car-sharing services if you absolutely need a car. Uber and Lyft are also options. They make child seats for bikes and special bikes that can easily carry 2 small children. > What if you need to get somewhere faster than a bike can take you? For any bikeable distance in a city, the bike is almost always faster than driving.