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Various deficiencies are definitely a problem in my friend population, where many of them are vegans. The vegan diet is a diet of deficiencies, and since none

Various deficiencies are definitely a problem in my friend population, where many of them are vegans. The vegan diet is a diet of deficiencies, and since none of them are particularly careful about what they eat, I worry that it is making them all worse off. Iron and B12 may be the most obvious, but also D3, calcium, zing, animal based nutrients like creatine, and I'm sure others. Unfortunately, this becomes a touchy subject with them very quickly, and most of them believe "being vegan is healthier," but are uninterested in engaging with or supporting this claim.

danenania 9y ago
I'm not vegan, but the counterargument I've heard is that an unbalanced omnivore diet can also lead to deficiencies/nutrition problems, and that actually the average vegan diet is more balanced overall than the average omnivore diet, so it's unfair to single out vegans when eating a healthy and varied diet is a challenge for everyone. In other words, you should probably be just as worried about your non-vegan friends who eat too much meat, not enough leafy greens, not enough vitamins, etc.
- ThomPete 9y ago
  How can a vegan diet be more balanced? It lacks diversity which as far as I understand is the primary foundation for good healthy diet. Many different things in not too much quantity.
  - pmichaud 9y ago
    Strictly speaking vegan is obviously a more limited subset of omnivore. But in a practical sense, it would surprise me if vegans didn't have more variety in their diet. I was vegetarian for almost a decade, basically my 20s, and what became clear immediately was that I had to figure out different stuff to eat. Default food wouldn't work anymore, so I have to branch out a lot and find foods that I would've never thought about before. I think my experience is relatively common. That having been said, it IS easier to have a deficient diet, if you're not paying attention. "Carbitarian" is what some people call veg-ns who just hork down pasta, bread, and whatever other unhealthy nonfood is technically animal-free. So I think it's possible that veg-ns have a more diverse diet on average, and that they also are statistically more likely to have deficiencies (something like a bimodal distribution). Obviously, these are empirical questions.
    - Moto7451 9y ago
      I think you mean to say that veganism is a subset of vegetarianism? Omnivores by definition eat animal products. I'm typically vegetarian to suit my own wacky body chemistry and slow metabolism (tldr; lowered/normalized my blood pressure, cholesterol, lost weight etc by diet changes and exercise) and would like to underline the point you're making about finding dietary substitutes. Protein consumption was the hardest thing for me to adjust back into nominal ranges. It's pretty easy to overconsume carbs (carbitarianism) on the way to getting the 50-100g of protein needed for a typical semi-active to active day.
      - nradov 9y ago
        Has your slow metabolism been confirmed by lab tests? Many people seem to think they have a slow metabolism but very few actually do.
        Moto7451 9y ago
        I suppose I don't fit the scientific definition of a slow metabolism. I clock in at around 1800 calories per day, which is within a nominal range. That said, I cannot eat the way the rest of those around me can without gaining huge amounts of weight. I've lost 100lbs and it took a lot of time to figure out that I just can't eat the same as my friends do and maintain a healthy weight.
        nradov 9y ago
        Most likely you're overestimating how much your friends actually eat. Unless you're monitoring them 24/7 then you don't really know for sure.
    - Tharkun 9y ago
      I suppose it's possible for vegans/vegetarians to eat better/more balanced than many omnivores, purely because they're much more likely to be taking an active interest in nutrition. The folks who eat frozen pizza every night probably aren't the most balanced eaters.
  - myth_drannon 9y ago
    For example milk (calcium) prevents iron absorption, so you might say a person eats meats hence his diet is balanced and rich in iron but he will suffer from iron defiency if too much milk is consumed. Also there is no natural source of B12 in commercial farm meat and fish since they are not grass fed and not ocean plankton fed. But the feed they get does have B12 exactly like a proper vegan diet where the person takes pills .
    - chimeracoder 9y ago
      > For example milk (calcium) prevents iron absorption, so you might say a person eats meats hence his diet is balanced and rich in iron but he will suffer from iron efficiency if too much milk is consumed Calcium can inhibit iron absorption, but not to this degree. A typical healthy individual will still be able to absorb iron from dairy products, because dairy products themselves contain iron. Where it becomes a problem is for people who are already anemic. Remember that the body doesn't need very much iron in the first place, since it's capable of recycling it. It only needs to replace the small amount that's lost in this cycle. And furthermore, the body's absorption of iron is already pretty inefficient, so the effects of naturally-occurring calcium in dairy aren't this extreme.
  - Mikeb85 9y ago
    > How can a vegan diet be more balanced? It lacks diversity which as far as I understand is the primary foundation for good healthy diet. How does it lack diversity? There's far, far more non-animal foodstuffs in the world than types of meat/fish... Also, most traditional and 'varied' diets contain far more vegetable matter than meat anyway.
    - pferde 9y ago
      Yes, and all those non-animal foodstuffs are available also to normal people, in addition to additional foodstuffs which come from animals. Vegan diet is less diverse by definition, as they merely limit themselves, they do not eat anything non-vegans can't. Simple maths.
      - Mikeb85 9y ago
        Saying it's 'less diverse' isn't the same as saying it 'lacks diversity'...
        shitgoose 9y ago
        is it?
      - sdenton4 9y ago
        You're confusing there space of possibilities with the space of what's actually consumed. An omnivore's diet is not more diverse if they only eat pepperoni pizza.
        charlesdm 9y ago
        I'm not vegan, but isn't it possible to live healthy, as a vegan?
        ChristianBundy 9y ago
        Very much so. Notice that none of the "vegans are unhealthy" claims are substantiated by any evidence.
- scythe 9y ago
  It's actually pretty rare to eat too much meat. Meat is expensive, despite subsidies. Unless you deliberately go out of your way to eat lots of meat, you won't be eating that much. Furthermore, the combination of meats, vitamin D-added milk, and enriched cereals, the latter two courtesy of the FDA who have centuries of history fighting malnutrition, and who for example introduced hominy grits to the South to combat pellagra, tends to hit everybody's basic nutrition requirements with the exceptions of dietary fiber, vitamin C, and potassium. While good health is still dependent on eating a variety of vegetables, it's important to give the US food system its due -- it produced pretty good results before the modern Age of Excessive Sweeteners.
  - abrowne 9y ago
    > the FDA who have centuries of history fighting malnutrition Founded in 1906.
    - darkmarmot 9y ago
      Well, 1.11 centuries. It's plural!
- pilsetnieks 9y ago
  He mentioned that they're not very careful about what they eat. Regardless of the diet, you have to pay attention to what you're consuming, otherwise you're going to have problems.
zosophorous 9y ago
Perhaps that is true for a vegan diet where you only eat standard American food, but a whole foods plant-based diet has been shown time after time to lower risks for all sorts of diseases, from heart disease to cancer to parkingsons and MS. Iron and calcium are in plants, D is in fact added to milk, and can be added to a plant based diet via a pill as well if you don't synthesize enough. You are an animal; your body creates enough creatine (creatine production is in fact downregulated when you consume meat). B12 can also be added via a pill, and it is already added to many foods like cereal. When you look deeper into the facts, you will see that the Standard American Diet faces far more deficiencies, the most obvious being fiber.
- markeroon 9y ago
  This is true, but the bioavailability of non-heme iron is 14-18% of heme iron https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Iron-HealthProfessional/ https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Iron-HealthProfessional/ It makes sense to just eat a balanced diet.
  - petre 9y ago
    Also zinc and copper is found in animal sources. The only non-animal source for vitamin D is UV exposed mushrooms.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - lostlogin 9y ago
      Or alternatively you can just go outside for a bit.
      - cperciva 9y ago
        You could sunbathe naked in Vancouver for six months a year and not get enough vitamin D.
screye 9y ago
This is surprising to me, as in India a large part of the population is vegetarian. We don't seem to be susceptible to the same problems. The move away from Milk products & Eggs seems to open a huge nutrient gap that the vegan population hasn't adequately identified how to fill.
- akg_67 9y ago
  Actually, there are higher incident of B12 deficiency in Indian vegetarians as found by a study done in late 90s (sorry I don't have specific reference). Indians dont have a practice of regular/ preventive doctor visits, annual checkup and diagnostic testing. They only go to doctor when there are significant medical issues. So these issues are not found until they morph into bigger problems. I have a quite a few younger cousins who died in their 30's. Not a single one ever was tested for cholesterol despite poor eating habits and obesity. Recently I noticed a few startups in India focusing on diagnostic testing. But their user base seems to still be elderly than young people.
  - nradov 9y ago
    There is little evidence that annual checkups actually produce better health outcomes for people without serious chronic medical conditions.
- simonsarris 9y ago
  Some vegetarians in developing countries do not have a B12 problem (which also causes anemia) because their food and water are more dirty, and there (B12) bacteria producing. For those vegans at least, their best bet is to accidentally eat enough food contaminated with bacteria or feces to consume decent quantities of B12. Source: The Dietitian's Guide to Vegetarian Diets, 3rd edition, 2011. See page 192. https://books.google.com/books?id=eJ10HoYQ2woC&pg=PA183#v=onepage&q&f=false https://books.google.com/books?id=eJ10HoYQ2woC&pg=PA183#v=on...
  - zionic 9y ago
    This comment was both disgusting and enlightening. Wow, who would have thought some people derive nutritional value from feces-laden water?!
alanbernstein 9y ago
Most, really? Have you spoken to "most" vegans?
- Retra 9y ago
  That's not how statistical inference works.
gonyea 9y ago
I'm not sure Rural and Vegan intersect much. Doubtful this Is the source issue. I'd wager a sedentary lifestyle and stimulants are a major culprit.
dgacmu 9y ago
> The vegan diet is a diet of deficiencies, and since none of them are particularly careful about what they eat First off, B12 is important, but most vegan milk-substitute things have 25% or 50% of the US RDA of B12 per serving. Not all - a lot of almond milk isn't supplemented with B12 (to which i grumble). They're often also iron-supplemented. Here, for example, is the nutrition label for Silk Organic Unsweetened Soy Milk: https://silk.com/sites/default/files/products/nutrition/SK_2443_nleas_OrganicSoyUnsw.png https://silk.com/sites/default/files/products/nutrition/SK_2... Note the vitamin D and calcium in there as well. The FDA is generally clever about the requirements they put on things -- the potential for such deficiencies is well-known, and so is addressed at a few places. Creatine isn't a necessary nutrient - our kidneys and livers synthesize it. Finally, I, at least get a lot of "zing" in my diet by being creative about what we cook. (Sorry, couldn't resist) Zinc, however, you should pay attention to, but eating a diversity of beans and nuts (and tofu) covers it quite well. Seriously, though: It's not hard to have the bases covered. If you're really concerned and not just concern-trolling, sit down with your friends and a copy of Cron-o-Meter, which is one of the most comprehensive meal nutrition profilers around. It's what I used when figuring out the overall layout for our family's meals, and it did lead me to a few cheats -- like favoring molasses as a sweetener, throwing flaxseed in place of part of the flour in a bunch of recipes, etc., to make sure we were hitting all the targets. Useful software.
- taneq 9y ago
  Beans, nuts and tofu may be 'good' vegetable sources of zinc but they're still awful compared with meat. You'd have to eat 2.5 cups of baked beans every single day to maintain recommended daily intake. (Not concern-trolling, just a vegetarian who was disgruntled to discover how easy it is to become zinc deficient, after specifically asking a GP if I needed to take any supplements, and was told no. I take a 25mg daily supplement now.) Source: https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Zinc-HealthProfessional/ https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Zinc-HealthProfessional/
ChristianBundy 9y ago
> The vegan diet is a diet of deficiencies This is, unfortunately for you, completely fabricated. I'd recommend at least checking Google Scholar before making silly claims on HN. If you'd like to make a claim, cite your source. If you'd like to circlejerk the "vegan is bad, meat is good" fiction, downvote instead.
- lsc 9y ago
  Eh, op is right and wrong. You certainly can get everything you need and be very healthy as a vegan, but... if you eat about what a normal person eats except without the meat and cheese? you are, as they say, gonna have a bad time. As a child, I insisted on being a vegitarian - as long as my parents cooked for me (and were careful to see to it that I had a balanced diet, compete proteins, lots of nutritional yeast, etc... They had spent time as vegetarians themselves, so knew how to do that.) I was quite healthy. After I moved out? I did very poorly, because I wasn't willing or able to put in the effort to see to it that I had balanced nutrition. That's the thing; as a meat eater? There are a lot of ways for me to get complete nutrition (and yes, it comes with a lot of other things that I don't need, but at least I get what I do need.) - so even someone who puts minimal effort into eating a balanced diet is not going to suffer from deficiencies very often, if they eat meat in the traditional manner. (Quite the opposite, really.) If you put the same effort in but avoid all meat and animal products? at least in the place and time where I live? You are probably going to make yourself sick. In a culture where most people eat meat, you need to put in a lot more effort and research in order to avoid deficiencies as a vegetarian. You could argue that this is a truism and that the same could be said for a meat-eater in a culture that just ate vegetables. Most cultures have evolved a traditional set of foods that won't leave you with severe deficiencies of anything, and so if you cut out certain classes of food from that tradition, you need to pay more attention to what you are consuming in order to see to it that you get enough of the nutrients you need.
cylinder 9y ago
Don't forget Vitamin K2.

danenania 9y ago

I'm not vegan, but the counterargument I've heard is that an unbalanced omnivore diet can also lead to deficiencies/nutrition problems, and that actually the average vegan diet is more balanced overall than the average omnivore diet, so it's unfair to single out vegans when eating a healthy and varied diet is a challenge for everyone. In other words, you should probably be just as worried about your non-vegan friends who eat too much meat, not enough leafy greens, not enough vitamins, etc.

ThomPete 9y ago
How can a vegan diet be more balanced? It lacks diversity which as far as I understand is the primary foundation for good healthy diet. Many different things in not too much quantity.
- pmichaud 9y ago
  Strictly speaking vegan is obviously a more limited subset of omnivore. But in a practical sense, it would surprise me if vegans didn't have more variety in their diet. I was vegetarian for almost a decade, basically my 20s, and what became clear immediately was that I had to figure out different stuff to eat. Default food wouldn't work anymore, so I have to branch out a lot and find foods that I would've never thought about before. I think my experience is relatively common. That having been said, it IS easier to have a deficient diet, if you're not paying attention. "Carbitarian" is what some people call veg-ns who just hork down pasta, bread, and whatever other unhealthy nonfood is technically animal-free. So I think it's possible that veg-ns have a more diverse diet on average, and that they also are statistically more likely to have deficiencies (something like a bimodal distribution). Obviously, these are empirical questions.
  - Moto7451 9y ago
    I think you mean to say that veganism is a subset of vegetarianism? Omnivores by definition eat animal products. I'm typically vegetarian to suit my own wacky body chemistry and slow metabolism (tldr; lowered/normalized my blood pressure, cholesterol, lost weight etc by diet changes and exercise) and would like to underline the point you're making about finding dietary substitutes. Protein consumption was the hardest thing for me to adjust back into nominal ranges. It's pretty easy to overconsume carbs (carbitarianism) on the way to getting the 50-100g of protein needed for a typical semi-active to active day.
    - nradov 9y ago
      Has your slow metabolism been confirmed by lab tests? Many people seem to think they have a slow metabolism but very few actually do.
      - Moto7451 9y ago
        I suppose I don't fit the scientific definition of a slow metabolism. I clock in at around 1800 calories per day, which is within a nominal range. That said, I cannot eat the way the rest of those around me can without gaining huge amounts of weight. I've lost 100lbs and it took a lot of time to figure out that I just can't eat the same as my friends do and maintain a healthy weight.
        nradov 9y ago
        Most likely you're overestimating how much your friends actually eat. Unless you're monitoring them 24/7 then you don't really know for sure.
  - Tharkun 9y ago
    I suppose it's possible for vegans/vegetarians to eat better/more balanced than many omnivores, purely because they're much more likely to be taking an active interest in nutrition. The folks who eat frozen pizza every night probably aren't the most balanced eaters.
- myth_drannon 9y ago
  For example milk (calcium) prevents iron absorption, so you might say a person eats meats hence his diet is balanced and rich in iron but he will suffer from iron defiency if too much milk is consumed. Also there is no natural source of B12 in commercial farm meat and fish since they are not grass fed and not ocean plankton fed. But the feed they get does have B12 exactly like a proper vegan diet where the person takes pills .
  - chimeracoder 9y ago
    > For example milk (calcium) prevents iron absorption, so you might say a person eats meats hence his diet is balanced and rich in iron but he will suffer from iron efficiency if too much milk is consumed Calcium can inhibit iron absorption, but not to this degree. A typical healthy individual will still be able to absorb iron from dairy products, because dairy products themselves contain iron. Where it becomes a problem is for people who are already anemic. Remember that the body doesn't need very much iron in the first place, since it's capable of recycling it. It only needs to replace the small amount that's lost in this cycle. And furthermore, the body's absorption of iron is already pretty inefficient, so the effects of naturally-occurring calcium in dairy aren't this extreme.
- Mikeb85 9y ago
  > How can a vegan diet be more balanced? It lacks diversity which as far as I understand is the primary foundation for good healthy diet. How does it lack diversity? There's far, far more non-animal foodstuffs in the world than types of meat/fish... Also, most traditional and 'varied' diets contain far more vegetable matter than meat anyway.
  - pferde 9y ago
    Yes, and all those non-animal foodstuffs are available also to normal people, in addition to additional foodstuffs which come from animals. Vegan diet is less diverse by definition, as they merely limit themselves, they do not eat anything non-vegans can't. Simple maths.
    - Mikeb85 9y ago
      Saying it's 'less diverse' isn't the same as saying it 'lacks diversity'...
      - shitgoose 9y ago
        is it?
    - sdenton4 9y ago
      You're confusing there space of possibilities with the space of what's actually consumed. An omnivore's diet is not more diverse if they only eat pepperoni pizza.
      - charlesdm 9y ago
        I'm not vegan, but isn't it possible to live healthy, as a vegan?
        ChristianBundy 9y ago
        Very much so. Notice that none of the "vegans are unhealthy" claims are substantiated by any evidence.
scythe 9y ago
It's actually pretty rare to eat too much meat. Meat is expensive, despite subsidies. Unless you deliberately go out of your way to eat lots of meat, you won't be eating that much. Furthermore, the combination of meats, vitamin D-added milk, and enriched cereals, the latter two courtesy of the FDA who have centuries of history fighting malnutrition, and who for example introduced hominy grits to the South to combat pellagra, tends to hit everybody's basic nutrition requirements with the exceptions of dietary fiber, vitamin C, and potassium. While good health is still dependent on eating a variety of vegetables, it's important to give the US food system its due -- it produced pretty good results before the modern Age of Excessive Sweeteners.
- abrowne 9y ago
  > the FDA who have centuries of history fighting malnutrition Founded in 1906.
  - darkmarmot 9y ago
    Well, 1.11 centuries. It's plural!
pilsetnieks 9y ago
He mentioned that they're not very careful about what they eat. Regardless of the diet, you have to pay attention to what you're consuming, otherwise you're going to have problems.

zosophorous 9y ago

Perhaps that is true for a vegan diet where you only eat standard American food, but a whole foods plant-based diet has been shown time after time to lower risks for all sorts of diseases, from heart disease to cancer to parkingsons and MS. Iron and calcium are in plants, D is in fact added to milk, and can be added to a plant based diet via a pill as well if you don't synthesize enough. You are an animal; your body creates enough creatine (creatine production is in fact downregulated when you consume meat). B12 can also be added via a pill, and it is already added to many foods like cereal. When you look deeper into the facts, you will see that the Standard American Diet faces far more deficiencies, the most obvious being fiber.

markeroon 9y ago
This is true, but the bioavailability of non-heme iron is 14-18% of heme iron https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Iron-HealthProfessional/ https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Iron-HealthProfessional/ It makes sense to just eat a balanced diet.
- petre 9y ago
  Also zinc and copper is found in animal sources. The only non-animal source for vitamin D is UV exposed mushrooms.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - lostlogin 9y ago
    Or alternatively you can just go outside for a bit.
    - cperciva 9y ago
      You could sunbathe naked in Vancouver for six months a year and not get enough vitamin D.

screye 9y ago

This is surprising to me, as in India a large part of the population is vegetarian. We don't seem to be susceptible to the same problems. The move away from Milk products & Eggs seems to open a huge nutrient gap that the vegan population hasn't adequately identified how to fill.

akg_67 9y ago
Actually, there are higher incident of B12 deficiency in Indian vegetarians as found by a study done in late 90s (sorry I don't have specific reference). Indians dont have a practice of regular/ preventive doctor visits, annual checkup and diagnostic testing. They only go to doctor when there are significant medical issues. So these issues are not found until they morph into bigger problems. I have a quite a few younger cousins who died in their 30's. Not a single one ever was tested for cholesterol despite poor eating habits and obesity. Recently I noticed a few startups in India focusing on diagnostic testing. But their user base seems to still be elderly than young people.
- nradov 9y ago
  There is little evidence that annual checkups actually produce better health outcomes for people without serious chronic medical conditions.
simonsarris 9y ago
Some vegetarians in developing countries do not have a B12 problem (which also causes anemia) because their food and water are more dirty, and there (B12) bacteria producing. For those vegans at least, their best bet is to accidentally eat enough food contaminated with bacteria or feces to consume decent quantities of B12. Source: The Dietitian's Guide to Vegetarian Diets, 3rd edition, 2011. See page 192. https://books.google.com/books?id=eJ10HoYQ2woC&pg=PA183#v=onepage&q&f=false https://books.google.com/books?id=eJ10HoYQ2woC&pg=PA183#v=on...
- zionic 9y ago
  This comment was both disgusting and enlightening. Wow, who would have thought some people derive nutritional value from feces-laden water?!

alanbernstein 9y ago

Most, really? Have you spoken to "most" vegans?

Retra 9y ago
That's not how statistical inference works.

gonyea 9y ago

I'm not sure Rural and Vegan intersect much. Doubtful this Is the source issue. I'd wager a sedentary lifestyle and stimulants are a major culprit.

dgacmu 9y ago

> The vegan diet is a diet of deficiencies, and since none of them are particularly careful about what they eat First off, B12 is important, but most vegan milk-substitute things have 25% or 50% of the US RDA of B12 per serving. Not all - a lot of almond milk isn't supplemented with B12 (to which i grumble). They're often also iron-supplemented. Here, for example, is the nutrition label for Silk Organic Unsweetened Soy Milk: https://silk.com/sites/default/files/products/nutrition/SK_2443_nleas_OrganicSoyUnsw.png https://silk.com/sites/default/files/products/nutrition/SK_2... Note the vitamin D and calcium in there as well. The FDA is generally clever about the requirements they put on things -- the potential for such deficiencies is well-known, and so is addressed at a few places. Creatine isn't a necessary nutrient - our kidneys and livers synthesize it. Finally, I, at least get a lot of "zing" in my diet by being creative about what we cook. (Sorry, couldn't resist) Zinc, however, you should pay attention to, but eating a diversity of beans and nuts (and tofu) covers it quite well. Seriously, though: It's not hard to have the bases covered. If you're really concerned and not just concern-trolling, sit down with your friends and a copy of Cron-o-Meter, which is one of the most comprehensive meal nutrition profilers around. It's what I used when figuring out the overall layout for our family's meals, and it did lead me to a few cheats -- like favoring molasses as a sweetener, throwing flaxseed in place of part of the flour in a bunch of recipes, etc., to make sure we were hitting all the targets. Useful software.

taneq 9y ago
Beans, nuts and tofu may be 'good' vegetable sources of zinc but they're still awful compared with meat. You'd have to eat 2.5 cups of baked beans every single day to maintain recommended daily intake. (Not concern-trolling, just a vegetarian who was disgruntled to discover how easy it is to become zinc deficient, after specifically asking a GP if I needed to take any supplements, and was told no. I take a 25mg daily supplement now.) Source: https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Zinc-HealthProfessional/ https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Zinc-HealthProfessional/

ChristianBundy 9y ago

> The vegan diet is a diet of deficiencies This is, unfortunately for you, completely fabricated. I'd recommend at least checking Google Scholar before making silly claims on HN. If you'd like to make a claim, cite your source. If you'd like to circlejerk the "vegan is bad, meat is good" fiction, downvote instead.

lsc 9y ago
Eh, op is right and wrong. You certainly can get everything you need and be very healthy as a vegan, but... if you eat about what a normal person eats except without the meat and cheese? you are, as they say, gonna have a bad time. As a child, I insisted on being a vegitarian - as long as my parents cooked for me (and were careful to see to it that I had a balanced diet, compete proteins, lots of nutritional yeast, etc... They had spent time as vegetarians themselves, so knew how to do that.) I was quite healthy. After I moved out? I did very poorly, because I wasn't willing or able to put in the effort to see to it that I had balanced nutrition. That's the thing; as a meat eater? There are a lot of ways for me to get complete nutrition (and yes, it comes with a lot of other things that I don't need, but at least I get what I do need.) - so even someone who puts minimal effort into eating a balanced diet is not going to suffer from deficiencies very often, if they eat meat in the traditional manner. (Quite the opposite, really.) If you put the same effort in but avoid all meat and animal products? at least in the place and time where I live? You are probably going to make yourself sick. In a culture where most people eat meat, you need to put in a lot more effort and research in order to avoid deficiencies as a vegetarian. You could argue that this is a truism and that the same could be said for a meat-eater in a culture that just ate vegetables. Most cultures have evolved a traditional set of foods that won't leave you with severe deficiencies of anything, and so if you cut out certain classes of food from that tradition, you need to pay more attention to what you are consuming in order to see to it that you get enough of the nutrients you need.

cylinder 9y ago

Don't forget Vitamin K2.