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Kazakhstan built a futuristic city to host Expo 2017, but attendance is low
- roryisok 9y agoAwful, awful website for mobile. I was redirected three times before I reached the article page, which itself popped and reloaded a few times before I could read anything. Then three separate modal windows pestering me to subscribe or log in or sign up to the newsletter stopped me because they wouldn't close. How have we fucked up the mobile web experience so much?
- the_duke 9y agoI'm getting really tired of the "website sucks on mobile" comments. Yes, a lot of sites are not optimized for mobile devices. That doesn't mean I want to read a rant about it on every 3rd article.
- realPubkey 9y agoI'm with him/her. This website makes me angry and the HN-comments are the only way to express these feelings.
- julianj 9y agoI understand your point and would agree in most cases. I am usually pretty forgiving of mobile popups, etc. However, in this case I gave up before even making it to the real article. I felt like I was in a loop of modals that wouldn't relent until I subscribed. Give it a shot and let me know if I am wrong.
- moron4hire 9y agoIf people don't complain, developers won't know they need to fix their shit. Push the pain back on bad devs.
- mysterydip 9y agoThat assumes the devs read here, no?
- fiblye 9y agoYou'd be surprised how many devs do. And if it's not specifically the web devs for this site lurking, discouraging others from following the same path isn't bad. I personally got two screen-filling pop ups on this site, the second of which was a survey before I was even able to browse. If anyone out there is considering doing this on your site, consider that I added this site to my growing list of filters and will never visit it again.
- Bakary 9y agoThis assumes they want to fix the issue, or have a credible incentive to do so.
- roryisok 9y agoExactly, this could well be by design
- BoorishBears 9y agoYou know what? It's usually me thinking this about that kind of comment, but this one really is that bad. It's not that it's not optimized for mobile, it's like the site was optimized against mobile.
- roryisok 9y agoI couldn't have put it better. It's as if they're degrading the experience so you'll use some proprietary app. If I'd been prompted to visit the play store it would not have been a surprise
- ecshafer 9y agoI had no issue reading this on a mobile browser.
- roryisok 9y agoWhat platform, out of interest?
- scott_karana 9y agoNot gp, but it worked well for me on iOS safari.
- aisofteng 9y agoNor did I (iOS).
- clydethefrog 9y agoAlthough AMP has a lot of problems discussed often on this website, it seems adding /amp at the end of the URL fixes the problem. (Also been trying this regularly on desktop as well to bypass the normal layout full of pop-ups and dark patterns. /amp is becoming a cheat code to get an old school light-weight page!)
- jacquesm 9y agoWhat a terrible waste. Especially in Kazakhstan that money could have had some serious positive impact if spent wisely.
- Jedd 9y agoThe same could be said of almost anywhere, and almost any public event that is more for show than for benefit. EDIT: I agree with jacquesm's sentiment ... but I feel we are too forgiving of these kinds of wasteful spends when they're in our own backyards.
- gcb0 9y agolike Olympics, f1, world cup, TED, etc etc. it was 5bi spent for entertainment. Just like lots of other billions are everywhere in the world. just because it was in a country you perceive as poor and failed it shocks you. yeah, it probably had corruption and half that money disappeared, just like on the rich events I listed above. But, this is the same mentality that demonize food stamps and social programs for the poor in your rich country that are not 100% focused on making those poor people complacent and effective workers. (ps: "you" used as in the undefined plural subject form. I don't know the person I'm replying :)
- Jedd 9y ago> like Olympics, f1, world cup, TED, etc etc. It's disingenuous to claim that I lump those in the same category. Let's focus on my 'more for show than for benefit' qualification. > it was 5bi spent for entertainment. Just like lots of other billions are everywhere in the world. Do you mean 'just like other billions everywhere else spent on entertainment' or 'just like other billions everywhere else spent'. I'm not sure you're accurately reflecting my views by suggesting that I think entertainment has equal value to non-entertainment activities. > just because it was in a country you perceive as poor and failed it shocks you. Yeah, so stop right there. I was working for the treasury department for NSW at the time that we were gearing up for the Sydney Olympics (later re-branded the NSW Olympics (later re-branded, as funding was sought further up the chain, as the Australian Olympics). There's nothing imperial, us-or-them, poor-vs-rich country about this. Take that particular card off the table. > But, this is the same mentality that demonize food stamps and social programs for the poor in your rich country that are not 100% focused on making those poor people complacent and effective workers. It really, really, is not.
- ensiferum 9y agoNice page. My mobile browser janked immediately. Even back button didn't work.
- gcb0 9y agocompletely disagree. with mobile Firefox and the no-script extension (plus uBlock origin, but that only matters after I whitelist the site) the page rendered perfect, with images, and very fast. ;)
- rdl 9y agoYeah, it killed my Chrome on iOS; there was no way to click the "close ad" button, and then it crashed my Chrome session. I restarted the browser and went back, but probably will just skip foreignpolicy.com links in the future.
- gewoonkris 9y agoSince the title isn't very informative about the content of the article: it's about the 2017 world expo which is held in Kazachstan and the steadying decline of visitors to these events. I hadn't even heard of the fact there currently was a world expo in Kazachstan if it wasn't for this article. For previous expo's I at least remember them having quite some coverage in the news.
- Roritharr 9y agoSame here, I hadn't heard of it. Currently checking pricing for a trip.
- Theodores 9y agoJust like The Millennium Dome, in a country far, far away: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_Dome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_Dome This did not work and there was just a huge void of content that no amount of inspiration could 'fill'. I worked on it and did not go to see the finished work, I was that ashamed! Compare and contrast with something like the German IFA trade show that really does show off the technology of the future. Perhaps the problem is compounded when you have to make it nationalistic as is required for a world type of Expo. The world is too global for country pavilions to work, for instance, why would Ford Motor Co. build a stand on an American pavilion when they have been a global company for the last century and market themselves as local product in all of their major markets.
- abritinthebay 9y agoBut the Dome was great, it was exceedingly fun! The problem it had was incompetent management and fraudulent financial planning. It's visitors still put it in the top 10 attractions for the year and no-one I know who went didn't enjoy it. Just because there were fraudulent and frankly stupid claims of how many visitors it would get (which nobody believed) doesn't put it in this category
- deanclatworthy 9y agoAgreed. There seems to be this disingenuous memory of the dome from a lot of the population. I remember visiting as a teenager and had a fantastic time. Like you, I've never spoken to anyone that visited who didn't enjoy it. Now it remains an iconic London landmark and is used for events every week - providing somewhat of a legacy. I wish it had remained as some kind of national science museum. It would have had a longer lasting cultural impact.
- abritinthebay 9y agoI think it's because tabloids harped on that it was going to be awful for 2 years and the swirled on ANY info after the fact that could criticize it. Obviously it was not a sensible financial investment but it was a significant cultural touchstone (and the space is still in use as well as being iconic)
- Libbum 9y agoI'm heading to the Expo in August, and to be honest I didn't expect to be inundated with crowds -- so this article is of no surprise. With that being said; I think what Kazakhstan is doing with their foreign policy, tourism and re-imagining their capital is commendable though. They've just dropped tourist visa requirements this year, so many countries have unfettered travel access now; soon they will convert (back) to the Latin alphabet from Cyrillic to be more accessible in the global market; and Astana looks like a real jewel. Their economy and living conditions are rising, and for the ninth largest country in the world it's sad that basically no-one travels there. Whilst the "if you build it, they will come" motto hasn't necessarily happened overnight, I think that the facilities that have been constructed for the fair will ultimately become a solid investment over time.
- nsnick 9y agoThe facilities in a city that no one lives in? It would be like building facilities in Naypyidaw or Brasilia, capitals built to escape from their people.
- mrisoli 9y agoWhat do you mean Brasilia? It might have an empty feeling sometimes(especially compared to other crowded Brazilian cities), but it is growing and thriving, can't say the same about Astana or Naypyidaw because I've never been to either
- soneca 9y agoBrasília for some time is trying to be less dependent on the government to grow, but I doubt it will be successful in any economic sector outside of public one. The stadium built there for World Cup is the biggest shame and example that GP is right. Anyway, the assessment of building a capital to escape its population is correct regardless.
- dudus 9y agoThe Stadium is not only in Brasilia. All over the country they built stadiums for world cup that are underutilized or in places where there isn't even a league to play into it.
- doug1001 9y agoi've followed this Expo indirectly because a professional fighter i follow (Gennady Gennadyvich Golovkin) is from Karaganda, a small mining town in KZ. Golovkin, aka "GGG", is regarded by many (most?) current and former professional boxers and boxing commentators as the best fighter in the world regardless of weight class (P4P). Several months ago, GGG's promoter (K2) said via press release that they were in serious discussions--with an expectation of success--to have GGG's next fight in Astana during the Expo. the economics of fight promotions is mysterious, at least to me, but i should think getting this fight in Astana during the World Expo would have been a massive economic boost to offset the Expo's staggering cost more than that though. GGG is not just a professional fighter from Kazakstan; he's the stuff of legends: Olympic silver medalist, World Amateur Champion (2X), amateur record of 352 wins, five losses, and a current professional record of 37-0. For eight years--from 2008 to 2016--he won every one of his fights by knockout. About five years ago when GGG Was just a contender, he called out Sergio Martinez, the current champion in GGG's weight class, SM's trainer said publicly "there's no way i'm putting Sergio in with that animal". in an interview a couple of years ago (available on youtube), when a reporter asked Manny Pacquiao about GGG's, Pacquiano just shook his head in disbelief. during a fight with the British Champion, Matthew Macklin, Jim Watts, former LW world champion and ITV commentator said "Matthew Macklin is a terrific fighter, but there's nothing he can do, this fellow [GGG] is just on another level which until tonight i didn't even know existed" About a minute later, GGG hit MM with a left hand to the ribcage (GGG is a right-handed fighter!) MM went down immediately and remained there for about 20 minutes. needless to say, he's idolized in his home country and to have him return to fight in KZ (for the first time since becoming a professional) during the World Expo--you couldn't write a better movie script. and yet the deal somehow fell through on the Expo side. All of the money spent on the Expo and none of it earmarked to underwrite this sporting event--disappointing
- maxxxxx 9y agoThe whole idea of a world expo seems pretty outdated these days. Nobody cares anymore.
- mrisoli 9y agoI agree, the idea behind the expo was to have worldwide showcases for stuff most people would not have been able to see otherwise, but with the internet that seems pretty useless. Showcasing just for the show is a little bit outdated, I suppose they could pivot around some concept, like major sporting events are still very popular(Olympics and World Cup).
- Donzo 9y agoIt's sort of like what Facebook did to class reunions.
- mrisoli 9y agoDefinitely, I've been to one such reunion where you just kinda awkwardly answer "Yeah, I saw that on your Facebook page" a lot of the time, there's still some value to face to face interaction even for those things anyway.
- wott 9y agoYes, you can finally punch in the face the one guy you hated at school, and who didn't get any better 20 years later. That how class reunions usually end, do they not?
- BurningFrog 9y agoYeah. You can think of a World Expo as a very poorly implemented web site. You have to travel to the data, not the other way around. Before we could instantly ship data anywhere, it made a ton of sense to put many things in one location so you'd only have to travel to one place, but now it's rather pointless.
- aluhut 9y ago
- tuna-piano 9y agoIn the article, “There’s two big ways to piss off the Kazakhs. Mention Borat, or call the dome the Death Star.” The title: "Kazakhstan Spent $5 Billion on a Death Star and It Doesn’t Even Shoot Lasers" Laughed out loud.
- Markoff 9y agoBorat: Kazakhstan Spent $5 Billion on a Death Star and It Doesn’t Even Shoot Lasers fixed for author
- atmosx 9y agoSo first, the gov goes MiTM[1] all the way[1]. Then hosts a futuristic tech expo ? I don't know that current status is, but that doesn't make much sense. [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10663843 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10663843
- vbezhenar 9y agoThey don't MitM now and I'm not aware of any MitM attempts in the past. There was strange page at telecom.kz, like you linked, but it wasn't implemented, at least not yet.
- Devid2014 9y agoLast info I got from peoples who lived in Kazakhstan s that you need to use custom certificate from government to use HTTPS and such stuff. This mean that MitM will be done for all HTTPS traffic there.
- vbezhenar 9y agoSome government websites use custom-signed certificates because of some stupid reasons, so if you want to use them, it's suggested to install those root certificates, so browser won't complain. That's the only reason I could imagine that someone told you about it. You don't need those root certificates for other websites.
- kukabynd 9y agoYep, it wasn’t live and no MitM is present in any provider service.
- GONGR 9y agoBtw, the article is blocked in Kazakhstan...
- vbezhenar 9y agoI've read it just a few hours ago. Doesn't work now indeed. What a shame.
- kyleblarson 9y agoGreat success
- rocky1138 9y agoI was considering visiting Kazakhstan until they announced that all Internet users would have to accept a government self-signed certificate authority to use the network.
- vbezhenar 9y agoThat's wrong, you don't need that. But some websites, notably including most popular porn sites are banned.
- Devid2014 9y agoAFAIK you require to use it by the law. If you have other information please point to the source, it would be nice to know it for sure.
- vbezhenar 9y agoI'm from Kazakhstan and I've opened https://news.ycombinator.com https://news.ycombinator.com using Kazaktelecom (largest internet provider) without installing any root certificates right now. I can't answer for other operators, but mobile operators don't MitM either.
- rocky1138 9y agoPrevious discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10663843 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10663843
- kukabynd 9y agoI understand why’d you think that it did/does really happen but in the reality, it doesn’t. As most of other political activity in Kazakhstan, words often get lost and don’t lead to any actions. That’s the case with MitM page that was published by the biggest provider in the country. It never actualized and I bet it won’t as the backlash from the worldwide community makes the country look bad. Leaders simply don’t want that, nobody does actually. So, please, give it another consideration.
- Markoff 9y agoTIL there is Expo in 2017, completely forgot that this is still a thing in age of internet. Seem like even bigger nonsense than dictat...pardon Olympic games