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Tim Cook Says Apple Is Focusing on an Autonomous Car System

174 points by nthuser 9y ago

delinka 9y ago
Dear Tim, Please focus on Mac hardware. Please focus on giving me the hardware tools to work and play on the macOS platform. Continue improving your mobile devices. Consider adding and improving only those things that will continue to make my business and leisure tasks smoother, simpler, and more enjoyable. I'd rather you didn't take focus from the things you've traditionally done well to do something that's never been in your wheelhouse. If you want to get involved with automobiles, work with the industry to improve my life while I'm riding along in the autonomous vehicle, but please don't try to build the autonomous vehicle. I'd prefer you wait until the market is saturated with terrible implementations so you can learn from others' mistakes and come along with a much-improved offering. But for now, just give me and my fellows Macs we can depend on for everything, a reliable mobile experience that doesn't throw out the habits we gained on the previous iteration, and the tools to make great software for your platforms. --d
- TeMPOraL 9y ago
  Dear 'delinka, We regret to inform you, but you are a part of a market niche known as "power users". That niche is but a small part of our customer base, and like all other big companies in the industry, we no longer care about you. Don't be sad about gradually losing useful tools - enjoy the new, shiny toys instead. Sincerely, Apple.
  - agumonkey 9y ago
    Rest assured that you are not losing pro tools, instead you are getting new ones, we work dilligently to provide you with the best Uber like cars so you can be the best Taxi. -- Pear
  - jobu 9y ago
    Many of the current "power users" are also "trend setters". If those users start switching away from Apple then it's going to be a big hit to Apple's brand value (and their ability to sell middling products and high prices).
    - giobox 9y ago
      Are they though? Not saying you're wrong, but that's a giant assumption without data to back it up. That Mac sales are still up year over year suggests to me that the complaints of pro users (which lets face it, date back to 2010, when the cheesegrater Mac Pro was getting long in the tooth) have had little or no impact on sales.
    - IBM 9y ago
      This is a mantra that's been repeated whenever "pro users" feel like Apple is neglecting them, but there isn't actually any evidence that this is true. It may have been true at one point in the 90s, when Apple's customer base was much smaller, but today it sounds more like a jilted ex trying to guilt someone back into a relationship. I'm still waiting to see this effect in action from when Apple supposedly threw away the Final Cut Pro 7 userbase over night. That was back in 2011, 6 years should have been plenty of time to see this play out. Or perhaps the movers and shakers in Hollywood don't have as much influence as they thought.
      - monkmartinez 9y ago
        I disagree. I naturally ask advise from people who I know to have extensive domain experience. That is, I ask my plumber buddy about the best water heater to buy. I ask my realtor buddy, where are the homes selling the most. and so on. I get asked all the time about buying laptops. I used to recommend Apple, but it has become very difficult to do so for a myriad of reasons. Lately, I have found that most people can get by with a chrome book after looking at their requirements.
        1123581321 9y ago
        Can you explain a bit further? MacBooks have always been premium laptops. Are you saying low end laptops are able to serve basic needs better than a few years ago? I agree with that, and take it to be a sign of a mature market, not a failing of Apple's.
  - jshevek 9y ago
    "all other" ? Dell does great work with Linux on some XPS laptops. Ubuntu may not be what we want, but the foundation is set for other distros.
- oddevan 9y ago
  As a fellow Mac user, I get it. Especially after the (to put it lightly) dry spell that was 2016, I understand wanting Apple to focus on the Mac and on making their current devices best-of-breed. And given what we just saw at WWDC, I'm inclined to think they're moving in that direction again. But the way Tim is framing this, they're looking at it as an AI problem. He doesn't go into the feel of driving or the wonderfully bad user interfaces of current cars, he describes it as "the mother of all AI projects." So while this is "something that's never been in [their] wheelhouse", they're approaching it from the AI side. And AI, given WWDC, is something they are very much trying to make their wheelhouse. And it sounds like they're doing it in a very Apple-like way: work on the hardest problem they can, then take what they've learned and apply it. Even if they don't make a car, or even a driving platform they can sell, the AI things they'll learn will show up in Siri, iOS, and everywhere else. So yeah, I want them to focus on Mac hardware. But I also want them to learn and grow. And I think they might, might, be starting to do both.
  - blktiger 9y ago
    +1 - AI is becoming fundamental to our computing experiences whether it's in a car, on your phone, or on your desktop. Good AI is probably the next big leap in usefulness on any device, whether it's a car or a desktop. So it makes sense for Apple to focus on it now, in order to make their devices better in the future. That said, Apple is big enough to have multiple focus areas, just because this is a focus to them doesn't mean they don't have other teams properly focusing on the Mac or iOS.
    - PayForPeenus 9y ago
      fundamental <--- not true. It's becoming an enabler, yes. Fundamental, no. Plus AI is terribly subjective, unfortunately. It's neither thought producing or augmentative to the process - but that's my OWN 2c on it. However, it _is_ important from an enabler for technology to be more "natural" to the way we interact with our technology.
  - numerlo 9y ago
    Did we watch the same WWDC? macOS is in maintenance mode no mater how they try to mask it and still somehow I keep experiencing more bugs with every release. At least they are going to update their hardware this time around huh? Is that what passes for "being focused on macs" these days? Last year was like they completely forgot about us, this year they are throwing us breadcrumps. EDIT: Since I keep getting the same replies, I'm gonna edit it here too: 1. When you are in maintenance mode and you still manage to introduce more bugs than you are fixing then your are doing something wrong (usually that's a result of limiting the budget of a department and as a consequence hiring less experienced developers) 2. Every new feature the last few years has been ported from iOS and without much care. I still can't believe they have yet to make Siri and Spotlight one unified product (at least make Spotlight more powerful, I can't even set a timer with it). And to add to this, being in maintenance mode doesn't have immediate effects. If Apple continues like this somewhere down the line macOS is gonna end up quite behind (and a big mess due to points 1. and 2.)
- usaphp 9y ago
  > I'd rather you didn't take focus from the things you've traditionally done well to do something that never been in your wheelhouse like how they were a computer company and then decided to go into cellphone business?
  - mikeash 9y ago
    Exactly. As an Apple user and fan since the late 80s, 2007 was when it all went to hell.
    - yequalsx 9y ago
      I can't tell if this is sarcasm or if you are being genuine here. I'm taking it as sarcasm. If so well done. Apple has hundreds of billions of dollars. They can focus on more than a few products. It's natural that they look into AI.
      - mikeash 9y ago
        It's 100% genuine. Obviously Apple has been very successful following this path, but I'm much less happy with Apple 2017 than I was with Apple 2007, and it all stems from the iPhone.
        giobox 9y ago
        In an alternate universe where Apple doesn't launch the iPhone, do you think the company would still be nearly as relevant in 2017? Getting annoyed at Apple for embracing mobile in 2007 is a fools game - if they hadn't made the iPhone, one of their competitors would have gotten close enough eventually and drastically reduced Apple's stature in the industry. Complaints like these remind of the Mac OS 9 holdouts when OS X was so obviously the future.
        mikeash 9y ago
        The comparison to Mac OS 9 makes no sense. Apple was dying in the late 90s. The OS was extremely obsolete and the whole company was on the verge of falling over. They needed a big change to survive, and that was OS X, which suddenly gave them a modern OS and made their computers popular in many segments which had previously completely ignored them. Apple was doing just fine in 2007. OS X was in great shape. They had recently transitioned from the faltering PowerPC CPUs to x86, which revitalized their hardware offerings and opened up a world of new possibilities for users to dual-boot or virtualize other OSes. Their market share was pretty solid, and their share of PC profits was quite high. You say "stature in the industry" as if there's a single "the industry" that encompasses both PCs and phones. If Apple hadn't done the iPhone then maybe Microsoft or Nokia would have done better, but so what? That wouldn't affect Apple in the PC market. Wikipedia says the top five PC makers are Lenovo, HP, Dell, Asus, and Apple, and as far as I know Apple is the only one with a substantial smartphone business. Of course Apple wouldn't be nearly as relevant overall in a world where they never produced the iPhone. I don't care about that. I see no reason why the Mac wouldn't be about as relevant in the personal computing space, which is what I care about. In any case, I'm not just annoyed at the existence of the iPhone, but the nature of it. If the iPhone had been a Mac-like open platform instead of this walled garden bullshit, all of my complaints would go away. I have no problem with mobile per se, I have a problem with pervasive vendor-controlled code signing, not getting root on my own devices, etc.
- IBM 9y ago
  Reminds me of this classic comment on Macrumors when the iPod launched [1]: Sounds very revolutionary to me. :mad: hey - heres an idea Apple - rather than enter the world of gimmicks and toys, why dont you spend a little more time sorting out your pathetically expensive and crap server line up? :mad: or are you really aiming to become a glorified consumer gimmicks firm? :mad: [1] https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/apples-new-thing-ipod.500/ https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/apples-new-thing-ipod.5...
  - badsectoracula 9y ago
    Didn't people said the same thing about iPhone, that Apple would fail if they enter in the already oversaturated phone market and they should stick with what they do best instead?
    - bvi 9y ago
      Indeed. Can't wait to look back at this thread 10 years from now.
      - maneesh 9y ago
        The only difference is Jobs and Cook
    - izacus 9y ago
      I'm sure people said negative things about Pippin, iTunes Ping and other products as well. Beware of survival bias.
  - mort96 9y ago
    Well, that guy was right to be worried. Apple made extremely successful consumer products, but where are their servers? You could rightly argue that it's better for apple to focus on other stuff than servers, but it most definitely wasn't better for the people who depended on their server hardware and software.
  - charlesism 9y ago
    Tim wasn't CEO when the iPod launched.
- throwaway-1209 9y ago
  The only real improvements I'd suggest is switching back to NVIDIA across their entire product line and offering 32 and 64GB in MBP. I kind of struggle to think what else they could improve. Do you have any concrete suggestions? I do agree that autonomous cars are a money pit not worth pursuing right now.
  - alasdair_ 9y ago
    Faster processors would be nice. The current gen macbook pro is appallingly slow for the price.
    - throwaway-1209 9y ago
      Faster processors do not exist. The current gen MBP already uses the latest Kaby Lake chips.
- codyb 9y ago
  Hmm, I'm all for Apple's entry into the autonomous car sector. The more players the better in my opinion. Autonomous cars have the promise to reduce congestion, asthma rates, and lives lost to car crashes and they'll be a tremendous boon to major metropolitan areas when they're ready for full scale deployment. Apple's the richest company in the world and it seems like they are actually focusing a bit on the MacPro and some of the other pro offerings power users need. I'm also confident with the amount of money they have, they can certainly do both.
- vlozko 9y ago
  Are you insinuating that they can't do both? They're certainly working on the things that you're asking for. Maybe not at the pace and direction that you personally want but they're not stagnating, either. They've already said they'll have a new Mac Pro out next year. They've introduced a new iMac Pro. They're investing heavily into AR/VR. They're big enough to do a lot of different things. It's like asking Microsoft to focus on Windows and Surface instead of putting in effort into their Hololens. Again, why can't they do both?
  - jobu 9y ago
    > Are you insinuating that they can't do both? Well they certainly aren't doing both at the moment. All of the Mac hardware updates have been so heavily "form over function" that they aren't very appealing to people that just need to get shit done. My 3 year old Macbook Pro is still very fast, and since I use most of the ports on a regular basis it's arguably more useful than the new Macbook Pro.
  - newscracker 9y ago
    Apple's company and team structure is very different from the more common organization model adopted by Microsoft, Google and others. It's a "functional organization", where teams and people are organized by expertise and not products as such. [1] That's why Apple, at least to the rest of us outside, seems to be struggling to make new Macs and not paying adequate attention to certain things even though it has so much cash (in other words, not being able to work on multiple things in parallel when things get tougher). It's not an easy problem to solve without making sweeping changes in how the company is organized and works. Is it frustrating for some classes of users? Of course, yes! But it cannot be wished away just by external pressure and commentary. [1]: https://stratechery.com/2016/apples-organizational-crossroads/ https://stratechery.com/2016/apples-organizational-crossroad...
    - johnsmith21006 9y ago
      I agree and will also say the structure made more sense with Jobs versus without. Not changing the structure after Jobs did not make sense, imo.
- jshevek 9y ago
  I don't think this needs to be a zero sum game (they can improve macOS' many problems and also work on self driving AI), but your point stands. Apple doesn't seem to care about certain classes of users.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
aerovistae 9y ago
again?
- heavymark 9y ago
  Apple has been focusing on it for many many years, but the news today is that Cook himself has admitted it is a focus rather than they his limited past remarks such as that they are watching the space.
some62345 9y ago
Apple is very good in coming into a market that has existed for a while and applying their design principles. I don't usually associate them with cutting edge technology. Autonomous cars haven't existed for a while so I'm a bit skeptical Apple will be able to deliver something trustworthy.
- slap_shot 9y ago
  This assumes Apple is going to release the car before autonomous cars become an established market. Apple probably could have released HomePod back in 2014 around the time Alexa was released. They chose to watch the market unfold and enter when they felt was right. There's no reason they can't be working on a car that won't be released for 5+ years, after the market has matured.
  - Avenger42 9y ago
    Apple typically doesn't announce that far out, though. They usually announce when their products are much closer to market, once they've got a device or two built and in hand that they can show off (like the recent HomePod and iMac Pro). Granted, earlier this year we saw them meet with Apple-centric press to tell them "don't worry, we're building another Mac Pro, just not in 2017", but those present pointed out how un-Apple-like it was to make such an announcement.
    - slap_shot 9y ago
      That's exactly my point - there is no working demonstration. This could be 5+ years away for all we know. If Tim Cook unveiled the new car today, som62345's concern would be valid. For now, we just know it is an area of interest for Apple and they may one day release a product. Perhaps the more interesting part of this is that this is the the second time since Steve Job's death that Apple has revealed an area that is working in before unveiling the product.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
mrweasel 9y ago
The fact that Apple is repeatedly referred to as "The iPhone maker" makes me a little sad. Anyway: except for the obvious answer "money" I don't really see why Apple feel the need to compete in the autonomous car market. Is it because Samsung makes cars?
- votepaunchy 9y ago
  Automation is much more than just cars.
  - stupidcar 9y ago
    Why does Apple need to get into automation of any sort? As I see it, Apple is about making devices that consume your time, whereas automation is about making devices that free up your time. More automation benefits Apple inasmuch as the less time people spend on tasks like driving, the more time they have to spend using their iPhone/iPad/Mac. But they are still very different problem domains, and it's not clear to me how most of Apple's strengths in creating consumer-friendly electronics will help it in automation, when the whole point is to eliminate human interaction. It seems like Apple would be better off just investing some of its cash pile into a plethora of automation startups. Let those startups concentrate on automating everything, while Apple concentrates on capturing all the free time it opens up for people.
    - boardwaalk 9y ago
      For manufacturing their own products, perhaps. Apple has a history of bringing things in-house (see P.A. Semi and the A* chips).
- heavymark 9y ago
  Imagine it's the other way around. I'm sure Apple has been working on car tech for far long than Samsung, but Samsung has been working on it because Apple is. While Cook is mentioning it officially today, as you know they have been hiring countless people from the auto industry for many many years as they work on the tech. AI is integratal to Apple across all their product lines so makes sense to also do AI for autonomous systems such as a car. Apple isn't saying they will build their own car necessarily, they are saying they would build the underling tech for the car, that they would then presumably license to luxury car makers.
KKKKkkkk1 9y ago
If the interview took place June 5th, why has Bloomberg been sitting on it until now?
- accountyaccount 9y ago
  filler for a slow news day?
- johnbellone 9y ago
  Perhaps an embargo?
- sparkling 9y ago
  1. Wait for a big AAPL stock dip, like in the last week 2. Buy high-leveraged CFDs on AAPL 3. Release the news 4. Profit
  - jetti 9y ago
    Wouldn't that count as insider trading as they would have information that wasn't yet released, AFAIK, to the public?
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
amelius 9y ago
.
- JumpCrisscross 9y ago
  > Cars will be a service...and that clashes with what Apple stands for Someone should get a memo over to the App Store, Apple Music, Apple Pay, iTunes, iCloud and other services teams. They only brought in like $7 billion of revenues last quarter [1]. [1] https://www.macrumors.com/2017/05/02/app-store-revenue-up-40-percent/ https://www.macrumors.com/2017/05/02/app-store-revenue-up-40...
  - Eridrus 9y ago
    But how much of a premium would an Apple car be able to command in this scenario? All those services only really make money due to ecosystem lock in. Unless you expect some iOS-centric reason to order an Apple car with a higher price, I can't imagine why this would be good for Apple.
    - tachyonbeam 9y ago
      Apple is a luxury brand. They would likely be making a luxury car. People would buy it, among other things, for trendiness, prestige and social standing.
      - intoverflow2 9y ago
        >Apple is a luxury brand is it? Doesn't look that way when you think about the iPhone and iPad market shares.
        JumpCrisscross 9y ago
        They're around 1/3 to 2/5 of smartphones in the United States [1] and about 1/5 worldwide [2]. (About 2/5 of people, worldwide, own a smartphone [3].) Meanwhile, Apple captures something like 90% of global smartphone profits [4]. High-end margin leaders sell luxury products. [1] http://fortune.com/2017/01/18/apple-iphone-market-share-2/ http://fortune.com/2017/01/18/apple-iphone-market-share-2/ [2] https://www.strategyanalytics.com/strategy-analytics/blogs/devices/smartphones/smart-phones/2017/01/31/global-smartphone-shipments-hit-a-record-1.5-billion-units-in-2016 https://www.strategyanalytics.com/strategy-analytics/blogs/d... [3] http://www.pewglobal.org/2016/02/22/smartphone-ownership-rates-skyrocket-in-many-emerging-economies-but-digital-divide-remains/ http://www.pewglobal.org/2016/02/22/smartphone-ownership-rat... [4] http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/23/apple-captures-record-91-percent-of-global-smartphone-profits-research.html http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/23/apple-captures-record-91-perc...
cx1000 9y ago
After reading all the speculation about Apple's car project for so long, I'm actually a little underwhelmed hearing their plans. I'm not surprised at what they're doing, but there has been so much secrecy over nothing. I wonder why they kept it so close to their chest.
- pulse7 9y ago
  Maybe because a few years ago this seemed unreachable, huge, special... (therefore secrecy). Today everybody knows it is reachable and near...
- dustinarmstrong 9y ago
  Investors. Don't want to be seen as straying too far from the path or doing anything risky.
  - johnsmith21006 9y ago
    Think investors want the opposite. Apple to get in there and innovate again and do something. No 4k or HDR or VR or AI or 2 in 1s, etc.
- mattnewton 9y ago
  The article says this plan to do just the kit is a deviation from the original plan of project Titan, which was to do the whole kit and caboodle.
Shivetya 9y ago
Going to be interesting to see how the final regulations are written and which company benefits the most. By this I mean this whole area is will pretty much the Wild West. There are initial regulations governing the requirements of such work but they are by no means final. An example of how favoritism towards manufacturers works in this area is the 7500 tax rebate for battery equipped cars. It was practically carved out to meet the requirements GM had for the first generation Volt. GM also played a big factor in how DRLs were regulated, they wanted to save money on the the voltage converter so a higher limit was allowed.
lovemenot 9y ago
How is this going to play out for Apple? Ideally, they'd want to make all the hardware, software and services. Just one model at first. Yet that was too much of a stretch. So they are focusing on autonomous driving systems which would have to integrate with third parties' dumb cars. I could see Google or Microsoft executing such a strategy. Not Apple though. They'd need to control all the parts. Only Tesla can make the car that Apple would be proud of, but couldn't make on their own. So I predict that Apple acquires Tesla for its brand, products and heir-apparent.
- Eridrus 9y ago
  Tesla's current market cap is 61B, compared to Ford's 45B. There's a lot of growth expectation baked into that price already. No matter how much money they burned on trying to make a car, it will pale in comparison to trying to buy Tesla.
  - mattnewton 9y ago
    I agree. Assuming a car maker like ford would sell it would be a much better buy - realistically one of the smaller ones would.
  - skybrian 9y ago
    Yes, that sounds like a great reason to wait for a cheaper price. (Imagine the discount if they screwed up the Model 3 launch.)
    - throwaway-1209 9y ago
      Imagine the lost opportunity if they don't screw it up, too, while you're at it. Although historically stock usually does drop on such momentous occasions, even if everything goes well.
    - alasdair_ 9y ago
      Then again, imagine you are Walmart right at the point that Amazon was moving from selling books to selling everything. The same logic could easily apply.
ebbv 9y ago
I'm convinced one of the issues with Tim Cook era Apple is failure to focus. Trying to do too many things at once is what leads companies to be mediocre at all of them.
- scj 9y ago
  "... it comes from saying no to 1,000 things to make sure we don't get on the wrong track or try to do too much. We're always thinking about new markets we could enter, but it's only by saying no that you can concentrate on the things that are really important." - Steve Jobs
tomkinstinch 9y ago
Interestingly, I saw a white "Apple Maps" branded van in my city recently, with four (Velodyne?) LiDAR heads on the roof, one on each corner, along with cameras in the center. Such a system would produce way more LiDAR data than they need for routine mapping, but perhaps enough to build a database for autonomous driving. I live far from Silicon Valley, so they must be confident that data will be useful eventually—enough so to justify the cost of driving around the country and storing an immense volume of LiDAR data.
- michaelt 9y ago
  Quite a few mapping companies have some LIDAR on their vehicles these days. Tele Atlas: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Tele_Atlas_camera_automobile_2008-02-29_1.jpg https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Tele_Atlas_camera_au... TomTom: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Mapping_van_tomtom_with_five_lidars.jpg https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Mapping_van_tomtom_w... and of course Google: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Google_Maps_Car_at_Googleplex.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Google_M... While detailed LIDAR data is valuable for self-driving vehicles, you can also put it to more mundane uses. For example detecting where the kerbs are relative to the mapping vehicle; and detecting whether that featureless concrete-coloured thing the cameras captured was a barrier or not.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
desireco42 9y ago
I think Apple is seriously in need of direction and good vision. I never believed that Jobs had such immense impact, I thought that he as a excellent leader was providing vision and guidance but also using a lot of other smart people like Jonathan Ive and Cook to create excellent products. To me, it seems that without him others are lost and just doing 'what is right' is hard for them. Wish them the best, but they need to get their core business right (said he who types this on 6 yrs old Macbook Air)
chrismealy 9y ago
Apple's genius will be to get people to pay luxury car prices for something built by brutalized Chinese labor.
intoverflow2 9y ago
Bothers me that Apple invests it's time on this. Honestly if Apple disappeared tomorrow someone else would manage to fill this car gap just fine. But if Apple disappeared tomorrow who would fill the gap their computer hardware and OS left? Windows is getting slowly better but I don't think it will ever truly manage to be as slick as OS X. Especially when the passionate Windows insist on using an 8 year old OS and devs insist on writing software using the same systems and libraries they were using 15+ years ago. To me Apple is only valuable as a computer company, an Apple car would just be a toy for the super rich. I do wonder if this project came about as a way to keep talent in the building?
- askafriend 9y ago
  Yeah I agree with you, Apple is only valuable as a computer company - they should have just stuck to computers. They should have never wandered off into making mp3 players and cell phones which are just toys for the rich. /s
  - leggomylibro 9y ago
    "Just stick to computers" is exactly what they did; they just put a new interface on them to make the smartphone. A CPU is an application processor is a CPU. Apple's pioneering innovations have always been with regards to design, not really technology.
  - intoverflow2 9y ago
    Think your privilege is showing that you're equating a three figure purchase to a six figure.
    - askafriend 9y ago
      Focusing on Autonomous and straight up building and selling a car are completely different things. Everyone here is assuming the latter with no evidence to support it.
yodon 9y ago
This seems completely backwards. In terms of its products, Apple is already essentially a luxury automobile manufacturer today, it just happens to be a luxury auto manufacturer that makes laptops rather than cars. They make expensive, high grade physical products whose quality and status help people of means define their personal brands and lives in ways that bring joy and function. That's indistinguishable from the role of a BMW or Audi or etc. Google, Amazon, and Microsoft are all much better equipped and positioned to build amazing AI. It's that Jony Ives chassis, exterior, and interior that that would set the automotive industry on fire.
- amelius 9y ago
  > It's that Jony Ives chassis, exterior, and interior that that would set the automotive industry on fire. If his car design is anything like his watch designs, then I doubt it.
  - yodon 9y ago
    Good point (normally I'd just upvote you but that doesn't do as good a job of communicating you'd influenced the opinion of the person you were responding to)
deleted 9y ago
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skc 9y ago
This is fantastic if only for the competition and innovation such an announcement will bring. I feel autonomous cars going mainstream could be more transformative than many realize.
pakl 9y ago
In the interview, Tim Cook says nothing about working on cars. He recognizes that a new core technology is needed for autonomous systems, but doesn't say anything to imply they're working on a car. Along with Cook recently saying humans should be involved in decision-making, there are some very interesting AI-related statements coming out of Apple these days.
ruffrey 9y ago
How about focusing on putting 32 GB of memory in a laptop.
PayForPeenus 9y ago
Apple, like Tesla, share the same valley space in Southern San Fran. Elon Musk has eluded to this as well, as a reality in the very near future. To be perfectly frank, it's a natural fit for these two to be on the same vector and with the OS developer cycles with Apple after iterations with Darwin / Unix - which oh ya BTW runs some of the NASA space junk we have floating around - is the natural fit for Tesla. Maybe .. just maybe we see the Apple OS running Tesla cars in this fashion. I mean, it's almost obvious that these two are dating. I think the rest of the world maybe ignores it, but to me .. it's damn near obvious what the collaboration is, possibly already.
MarkMc 9y ago
I can't see any sustainable competitive advantage in autonomous car tech. The iPhone has strong network effects and a luxury brand. But auto driving tech is strictly a commodity - if the next Ford Focus comes with a "Powered by Apple" label nobody will pay more than if the label read "Powered by Google".
- dep_b 9y ago
  I would pay less for a car labeled "Powered by Google", I don't know if that counts? If I'm going to be datamined while it works and left stranded with a device that I can use for 20 years yet only gets 3 years of updates, then I want that car maker to pay me to use it, not the other way around. But powered by Apple? Meh. For many people it still means "but I'm not using anything by Apple".
deegles 9y ago
I have a theory that the drop in Apple's software quality over the last few years can be attributed to the 'top' internal talent moving to this project. It would be a great career builder and since it requires a big investment there would be demand from up high to have the best talent in place, even at the expense of other projects.
- photojosh 9y ago
  Drop? I updated from 10.10 to 10.12 on my 13" MBP only recently, and it is worlds better. Likewise I've found iOS 10 to be the most stable ever, even as I do more and more on it. I have experienced some recent bugs (couldn't download any apps for a while), but they got resolved fairly quickly. Yes, you have people arguing there's been a drop in software quality, it seems to have been a great click-bait topic in 2016 particularly. I think this article accurately describes the situation: https://medium.com/@AlexandraMint/apple-s-elephant-in-the-room-5383a43dc413#.54i4rzaqs https://medium.com/@AlexandraMint/apple-s-elephant-in-the-ro...
skyzyx 9y ago
You realize that he didn’t mention anything about cars, right?

174 points by nthuser 9y ago

Dear Tim, Please focus on Mac hardware. Please focus on giving me the hardware tools to work and play on the macOS platform. Continue improving your mobile devices. Consider adding and improving only those things that will continue to make my business and leisure tasks smoother, simpler, and more enjoyable. I'd rather you didn't take focus from the things you've traditionally done well to do something that's never been in your wheelhouse. If you want to get involved with automobiles, work with the industry to improve my life while I'm riding along in the autonomous vehicle, but please don't try to build the autonomous vehicle. I'd prefer you wait until the market is saturated with terrible implementations so you can learn from others' mistakes and come along with a much-improved offering. But for now, just give me and my fellows Macs we can depend on for everything, a reliable mobile experience that doesn't throw out the habits we gained on the previous iteration, and the tools to make great software for your platforms. --d

TeMPOraL 9y ago
Dear 'delinka, We regret to inform you, but you are a part of a market niche known as "power users". That niche is but a small part of our customer base, and like all other big companies in the industry, we no longer care about you. Don't be sad about gradually losing useful tools - enjoy the new, shiny toys instead. Sincerely, Apple.
- agumonkey 9y ago
  Rest assured that you are not losing pro tools, instead you are getting new ones, we work dilligently to provide you with the best Uber like cars so you can be the best Taxi. -- Pear
- jobu 9y ago
  Many of the current "power users" are also "trend setters". If those users start switching away from Apple then it's going to be a big hit to Apple's brand value (and their ability to sell middling products and high prices).
  - giobox 9y ago
    Are they though? Not saying you're wrong, but that's a giant assumption without data to back it up. That Mac sales are still up year over year suggests to me that the complaints of pro users (which lets face it, date back to 2010, when the cheesegrater Mac Pro was getting long in the tooth) have had little or no impact on sales.
  - IBM 9y ago
    This is a mantra that's been repeated whenever "pro users" feel like Apple is neglecting them, but there isn't actually any evidence that this is true. It may have been true at one point in the 90s, when Apple's customer base was much smaller, but today it sounds more like a jilted ex trying to guilt someone back into a relationship. I'm still waiting to see this effect in action from when Apple supposedly threw away the Final Cut Pro 7 userbase over night. That was back in 2011, 6 years should have been plenty of time to see this play out. Or perhaps the movers and shakers in Hollywood don't have as much influence as they thought.
    - monkmartinez 9y ago
      I disagree. I naturally ask advise from people who I know to have extensive domain experience. That is, I ask my plumber buddy about the best water heater to buy. I ask my realtor buddy, where are the homes selling the most. and so on. I get asked all the time about buying laptops. I used to recommend Apple, but it has become very difficult to do so for a myriad of reasons. Lately, I have found that most people can get by with a chrome book after looking at their requirements.
      - 1123581321 9y ago
        Can you explain a bit further? MacBooks have always been premium laptops. Are you saying low end laptops are able to serve basic needs better than a few years ago? I agree with that, and take it to be a sign of a mature market, not a failing of Apple's.
- jshevek 9y ago
  "all other" ? Dell does great work with Linux on some XPS laptops. Ubuntu may not be what we want, but the foundation is set for other distros.
oddevan 9y ago
As a fellow Mac user, I get it. Especially after the (to put it lightly) dry spell that was 2016, I understand wanting Apple to focus on the Mac and on making their current devices best-of-breed. And given what we just saw at WWDC, I'm inclined to think they're moving in that direction again. But the way Tim is framing this, they're looking at it as an AI problem. He doesn't go into the feel of driving or the wonderfully bad user interfaces of current cars, he describes it as "the mother of all AI projects." So while this is "something that's never been in [their] wheelhouse", they're approaching it from the AI side. And AI, given WWDC, is something they are very much trying to make their wheelhouse. And it sounds like they're doing it in a very Apple-like way: work on the hardest problem they can, then take what they've learned and apply it. Even if they don't make a car, or even a driving platform they can sell, the AI things they'll learn will show up in Siri, iOS, and everywhere else. So yeah, I want them to focus on Mac hardware. But I also want them to learn and grow. And I think they might, might, be starting to do both.
- blktiger 9y ago
  +1 - AI is becoming fundamental to our computing experiences whether it's in a car, on your phone, or on your desktop. Good AI is probably the next big leap in usefulness on any device, whether it's a car or a desktop. So it makes sense for Apple to focus on it now, in order to make their devices better in the future. That said, Apple is big enough to have multiple focus areas, just because this is a focus to them doesn't mean they don't have other teams properly focusing on the Mac or iOS.
  - PayForPeenus 9y ago
    fundamental <--- not true. It's becoming an enabler, yes. Fundamental, no. Plus AI is terribly subjective, unfortunately. It's neither thought producing or augmentative to the process - but that's my OWN 2c on it. However, it _is_ important from an enabler for technology to be more "natural" to the way we interact with our technology.
- numerlo 9y ago
  Did we watch the same WWDC? macOS is in maintenance mode no mater how they try to mask it and still somehow I keep experiencing more bugs with every release. At least they are going to update their hardware this time around huh? Is that what passes for "being focused on macs" these days? Last year was like they completely forgot about us, this year they are throwing us breadcrumps. EDIT: Since I keep getting the same replies, I'm gonna edit it here too: 1. When you are in maintenance mode and you still manage to introduce more bugs than you are fixing then your are doing something wrong (usually that's a result of limiting the budget of a department and as a consequence hiring less experienced developers) 2. Every new feature the last few years has been ported from iOS and without much care. I still can't believe they have yet to make Siri and Spotlight one unified product (at least make Spotlight more powerful, I can't even set a timer with it). And to add to this, being in maintenance mode doesn't have immediate effects. If Apple continues like this somewhere down the line macOS is gonna end up quite behind (and a big mess due to points 1. and 2.)
usaphp 9y ago
> I'd rather you didn't take focus from the things you've traditionally done well to do something that never been in your wheelhouse like how they were a computer company and then decided to go into cellphone business?
- mikeash 9y ago
  Exactly. As an Apple user and fan since the late 80s, 2007 was when it all went to hell.
  - yequalsx 9y ago
    I can't tell if this is sarcasm or if you are being genuine here. I'm taking it as sarcasm. If so well done. Apple has hundreds of billions of dollars. They can focus on more than a few products. It's natural that they look into AI.
    - mikeash 9y ago
      It's 100% genuine. Obviously Apple has been very successful following this path, but I'm much less happy with Apple 2017 than I was with Apple 2007, and it all stems from the iPhone.
      - giobox 9y ago
        In an alternate universe where Apple doesn't launch the iPhone, do you think the company would still be nearly as relevant in 2017? Getting annoyed at Apple for embracing mobile in 2007 is a fools game - if they hadn't made the iPhone, one of their competitors would have gotten close enough eventually and drastically reduced Apple's stature in the industry. Complaints like these remind of the Mac OS 9 holdouts when OS X was so obviously the future.
        mikeash 9y ago
        The comparison to Mac OS 9 makes no sense. Apple was dying in the late 90s. The OS was extremely obsolete and the whole company was on the verge of falling over. They needed a big change to survive, and that was OS X, which suddenly gave them a modern OS and made their computers popular in many segments which had previously completely ignored them. Apple was doing just fine in 2007. OS X was in great shape. They had recently transitioned from the faltering PowerPC CPUs to x86, which revitalized their hardware offerings and opened up a world of new possibilities for users to dual-boot or virtualize other OSes. Their market share was pretty solid, and their share of PC profits was quite high. You say "stature in the industry" as if there's a single "the industry" that encompasses both PCs and phones. If Apple hadn't done the iPhone then maybe Microsoft or Nokia would have done better, but so what? That wouldn't affect Apple in the PC market. Wikipedia says the top five PC makers are Lenovo, HP, Dell, Asus, and Apple, and as far as I know Apple is the only one with a substantial smartphone business. Of course Apple wouldn't be nearly as relevant overall in a world where they never produced the iPhone. I don't care about that. I see no reason why the Mac wouldn't be about as relevant in the personal computing space, which is what I care about. In any case, I'm not just annoyed at the existence of the iPhone, but the nature of it. If the iPhone had been a Mac-like open platform instead of this walled garden bullshit, all of my complaints would go away. I have no problem with mobile per se, I have a problem with pervasive vendor-controlled code signing, not getting root on my own devices, etc.
IBM 9y ago
Reminds me of this classic comment on Macrumors when the iPod launched [1]: Sounds very revolutionary to me. :mad: hey - heres an idea Apple - rather than enter the world of gimmicks and toys, why dont you spend a little more time sorting out your pathetically expensive and crap server line up? :mad: or are you really aiming to become a glorified consumer gimmicks firm? :mad: [1] https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/apples-new-thing-ipod.500/ https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/apples-new-thing-ipod.5...
- badsectoracula 9y ago
  Didn't people said the same thing about iPhone, that Apple would fail if they enter in the already oversaturated phone market and they should stick with what they do best instead?
  - bvi 9y ago
    Indeed. Can't wait to look back at this thread 10 years from now.
    - maneesh 9y ago
      The only difference is Jobs and Cook
  - izacus 9y ago
    I'm sure people said negative things about Pippin, iTunes Ping and other products as well. Beware of survival bias.
- mort96 9y ago
  Well, that guy was right to be worried. Apple made extremely successful consumer products, but where are their servers? You could rightly argue that it's better for apple to focus on other stuff than servers, but it most definitely wasn't better for the people who depended on their server hardware and software.
- charlesism 9y ago
  Tim wasn't CEO when the iPod launched.
throwaway-1209 9y ago
The only real improvements I'd suggest is switching back to NVIDIA across their entire product line and offering 32 and 64GB in MBP. I kind of struggle to think what else they could improve. Do you have any concrete suggestions? I do agree that autonomous cars are a money pit not worth pursuing right now.
- alasdair_ 9y ago
  Faster processors would be nice. The current gen macbook pro is appallingly slow for the price.
  - throwaway-1209 9y ago
    Faster processors do not exist. The current gen MBP already uses the latest Kaby Lake chips.
codyb 9y ago
Hmm, I'm all for Apple's entry into the autonomous car sector. The more players the better in my opinion. Autonomous cars have the promise to reduce congestion, asthma rates, and lives lost to car crashes and they'll be a tremendous boon to major metropolitan areas when they're ready for full scale deployment. Apple's the richest company in the world and it seems like they are actually focusing a bit on the MacPro and some of the other pro offerings power users need. I'm also confident with the amount of money they have, they can certainly do both.
vlozko 9y ago
Are you insinuating that they can't do both? They're certainly working on the things that you're asking for. Maybe not at the pace and direction that you personally want but they're not stagnating, either. They've already said they'll have a new Mac Pro out next year. They've introduced a new iMac Pro. They're investing heavily into AR/VR. They're big enough to do a lot of different things. It's like asking Microsoft to focus on Windows and Surface instead of putting in effort into their Hololens. Again, why can't they do both?
- jobu 9y ago
  > Are you insinuating that they can't do both? Well they certainly aren't doing both at the moment. All of the Mac hardware updates have been so heavily "form over function" that they aren't very appealing to people that just need to get shit done. My 3 year old Macbook Pro is still very fast, and since I use most of the ports on a regular basis it's arguably more useful than the new Macbook Pro.
- newscracker 9y ago
  Apple's company and team structure is very different from the more common organization model adopted by Microsoft, Google and others. It's a "functional organization", where teams and people are organized by expertise and not products as such. [1] That's why Apple, at least to the rest of us outside, seems to be struggling to make new Macs and not paying adequate attention to certain things even though it has so much cash (in other words, not being able to work on multiple things in parallel when things get tougher). It's not an easy problem to solve without making sweeping changes in how the company is organized and works. Is it frustrating for some classes of users? Of course, yes! But it cannot be wished away just by external pressure and commentary. [1]: https://stratechery.com/2016/apples-organizational-crossroads/ https://stratechery.com/2016/apples-organizational-crossroad...
  - johnsmith21006 9y ago
    I agree and will also say the structure made more sense with Jobs versus without. Not changing the structure after Jobs did not make sense, imo.
jshevek 9y ago
I don't think this needs to be a zero sum game (they can improve macOS' many problems and also work on self driving AI), but your point stands. Apple doesn't seem to care about certain classes of users.

deleted 9y ago

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aerovistae 9y ago

again?

heavymark 9y ago
Apple has been focusing on it for many many years, but the news today is that Cook himself has admitted it is a focus rather than they his limited past remarks such as that they are watching the space.

some62345 9y ago

Apple is very good in coming into a market that has existed for a while and applying their design principles. I don't usually associate them with cutting edge technology. Autonomous cars haven't existed for a while so I'm a bit skeptical Apple will be able to deliver something trustworthy.

slap_shot 9y ago
This assumes Apple is going to release the car before autonomous cars become an established market. Apple probably could have released HomePod back in 2014 around the time Alexa was released. They chose to watch the market unfold and enter when they felt was right. There's no reason they can't be working on a car that won't be released for 5+ years, after the market has matured.
- Avenger42 9y ago
  Apple typically doesn't announce that far out, though. They usually announce when their products are much closer to market, once they've got a device or two built and in hand that they can show off (like the recent HomePod and iMac Pro). Granted, earlier this year we saw them meet with Apple-centric press to tell them "don't worry, we're building another Mac Pro, just not in 2017", but those present pointed out how un-Apple-like it was to make such an announcement.
  - slap_shot 9y ago
    That's exactly my point - there is no working demonstration. This could be 5+ years away for all we know. If Tim Cook unveiled the new car today, som62345's concern would be valid. For now, we just know it is an area of interest for Apple and they may one day release a product. Perhaps the more interesting part of this is that this is the the second time since Steve Job's death that Apple has revealed an area that is working in before unveiling the product.
deleted 9y ago
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mrweasel 9y ago

The fact that Apple is repeatedly referred to as "The iPhone maker" makes me a little sad. Anyway: except for the obvious answer "money" I don't really see why Apple feel the need to compete in the autonomous car market. Is it because Samsung makes cars?

votepaunchy 9y ago
Automation is much more than just cars.
- stupidcar 9y ago
  Why does Apple need to get into automation of any sort? As I see it, Apple is about making devices that consume your time, whereas automation is about making devices that free up your time. More automation benefits Apple inasmuch as the less time people spend on tasks like driving, the more time they have to spend using their iPhone/iPad/Mac. But they are still very different problem domains, and it's not clear to me how most of Apple's strengths in creating consumer-friendly electronics will help it in automation, when the whole point is to eliminate human interaction. It seems like Apple would be better off just investing some of its cash pile into a plethora of automation startups. Let those startups concentrate on automating everything, while Apple concentrates on capturing all the free time it opens up for people.
  - boardwaalk 9y ago
    For manufacturing their own products, perhaps. Apple has a history of bringing things in-house (see P.A. Semi and the A* chips).
heavymark 9y ago
Imagine it's the other way around. I'm sure Apple has been working on car tech for far long than Samsung, but Samsung has been working on it because Apple is. While Cook is mentioning it officially today, as you know they have been hiring countless people from the auto industry for many many years as they work on the tech. AI is integratal to Apple across all their product lines so makes sense to also do AI for autonomous systems such as a car. Apple isn't saying they will build their own car necessarily, they are saying they would build the underling tech for the car, that they would then presumably license to luxury car makers.

KKKKkkkk1 9y ago

If the interview took place June 5th, why has Bloomberg been sitting on it until now?

accountyaccount 9y ago
filler for a slow news day?
johnbellone 9y ago
Perhaps an embargo?
sparkling 9y ago
1. Wait for a big AAPL stock dip, like in the last week 2. Buy high-leveraged CFDs on AAPL 3. Release the news 4. Profit
- jetti 9y ago
  Wouldn't that count as insider trading as they would have information that wasn't yet released, AFAIK, to the public?
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]

amelius 9y ago

JumpCrisscross 9y ago
> Cars will be a service...and that clashes with what Apple stands for Someone should get a memo over to the App Store, Apple Music, Apple Pay, iTunes, iCloud and other services teams. They only brought in like $7 billion of revenues last quarter [1]. [1] https://www.macrumors.com/2017/05/02/app-store-revenue-up-40-percent/ https://www.macrumors.com/2017/05/02/app-store-revenue-up-40...
- Eridrus 9y ago
  But how much of a premium would an Apple car be able to command in this scenario? All those services only really make money due to ecosystem lock in. Unless you expect some iOS-centric reason to order an Apple car with a higher price, I can't imagine why this would be good for Apple.
  - tachyonbeam 9y ago
    Apple is a luxury brand. They would likely be making a luxury car. People would buy it, among other things, for trendiness, prestige and social standing.
    - intoverflow2 9y ago
      >Apple is a luxury brand is it? Doesn't look that way when you think about the iPhone and iPad market shares.
      - JumpCrisscross 9y ago
        They're around 1/3 to 2/5 of smartphones in the United States [1] and about 1/5 worldwide [2]. (About 2/5 of people, worldwide, own a smartphone [3].) Meanwhile, Apple captures something like 90% of global smartphone profits [4]. High-end margin leaders sell luxury products. [1] http://fortune.com/2017/01/18/apple-iphone-market-share-2/ http://fortune.com/2017/01/18/apple-iphone-market-share-2/ [2] https://www.strategyanalytics.com/strategy-analytics/blogs/devices/smartphones/smart-phones/2017/01/31/global-smartphone-shipments-hit-a-record-1.5-billion-units-in-2016 https://www.strategyanalytics.com/strategy-analytics/blogs/d... [3] http://www.pewglobal.org/2016/02/22/smartphone-ownership-rates-skyrocket-in-many-emerging-economies-but-digital-divide-remains/ http://www.pewglobal.org/2016/02/22/smartphone-ownership-rat... [4] http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/23/apple-captures-record-91-percent-of-global-smartphone-profits-research.html http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/23/apple-captures-record-91-perc...

cx1000 9y ago

After reading all the speculation about Apple's car project for so long, I'm actually a little underwhelmed hearing their plans. I'm not surprised at what they're doing, but there has been so much secrecy over nothing. I wonder why they kept it so close to their chest.

pulse7 9y ago
Maybe because a few years ago this seemed unreachable, huge, special... (therefore secrecy). Today everybody knows it is reachable and near...
dustinarmstrong 9y ago
Investors. Don't want to be seen as straying too far from the path or doing anything risky.
- johnsmith21006 9y ago
  Think investors want the opposite. Apple to get in there and innovate again and do something. No 4k or HDR or VR or AI or 2 in 1s, etc.
mattnewton 9y ago
The article says this plan to do just the kit is a deviation from the original plan of project Titan, which was to do the whole kit and caboodle.

Shivetya 9y ago

Going to be interesting to see how the final regulations are written and which company benefits the most. By this I mean this whole area is will pretty much the Wild West. There are initial regulations governing the requirements of such work but they are by no means final. An example of how favoritism towards manufacturers works in this area is the 7500 tax rebate for battery equipped cars. It was practically carved out to meet the requirements GM had for the first generation Volt. GM also played a big factor in how DRLs were regulated, they wanted to save money on the the voltage converter so a higher limit was allowed.

lovemenot 9y ago

How is this going to play out for Apple? Ideally, they'd want to make all the hardware, software and services. Just one model at first. Yet that was too much of a stretch. So they are focusing on autonomous driving systems which would have to integrate with third parties' dumb cars. I could see Google or Microsoft executing such a strategy. Not Apple though. They'd need to control all the parts. Only Tesla can make the car that Apple would be proud of, but couldn't make on their own. So I predict that Apple acquires Tesla for its brand, products and heir-apparent.

Eridrus 9y ago
Tesla's current market cap is 61B, compared to Ford's 45B. There's a lot of growth expectation baked into that price already. No matter how much money they burned on trying to make a car, it will pale in comparison to trying to buy Tesla.
- mattnewton 9y ago
  I agree. Assuming a car maker like ford would sell it would be a much better buy - realistically one of the smaller ones would.
- skybrian 9y ago
  Yes, that sounds like a great reason to wait for a cheaper price. (Imagine the discount if they screwed up the Model 3 launch.)
  - throwaway-1209 9y ago
    Imagine the lost opportunity if they don't screw it up, too, while you're at it. Although historically stock usually does drop on such momentous occasions, even if everything goes well.
  - alasdair_ 9y ago
    Then again, imagine you are Walmart right at the point that Amazon was moving from selling books to selling everything. The same logic could easily apply.

ebbv 9y ago

I'm convinced one of the issues with Tim Cook era Apple is failure to focus. Trying to do too many things at once is what leads companies to be mediocre at all of them.

scj 9y ago
"... it comes from saying no to 1,000 things to make sure we don't get on the wrong track or try to do too much. We're always thinking about new markets we could enter, but it's only by saying no that you can concentrate on the things that are really important." - Steve Jobs

tomkinstinch 9y ago

Interestingly, I saw a white "Apple Maps" branded van in my city recently, with four (Velodyne?) LiDAR heads on the roof, one on each corner, along with cameras in the center. Such a system would produce way more LiDAR data than they need for routine mapping, but perhaps enough to build a database for autonomous driving. I live far from Silicon Valley, so they must be confident that data will be useful eventually—enough so to justify the cost of driving around the country and storing an immense volume of LiDAR data.

michaelt 9y ago
Quite a few mapping companies have some LIDAR on their vehicles these days. Tele Atlas: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Tele_Atlas_camera_automobile_2008-02-29_1.jpg https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Tele_Atlas_camera_au... TomTom: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Mapping_van_tomtom_with_five_lidars.jpg https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Mapping_van_tomtom_w... and of course Google: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Google_Maps_Car_at_Googleplex.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Google_M... While detailed LIDAR data is valuable for self-driving vehicles, you can also put it to more mundane uses. For example detecting where the kerbs are relative to the mapping vehicle; and detecting whether that featureless concrete-coloured thing the cameras captured was a barrier or not.
deleted 9y ago
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desireco42 9y ago

I think Apple is seriously in need of direction and good vision. I never believed that Jobs had such immense impact, I thought that he as a excellent leader was providing vision and guidance but also using a lot of other smart people like Jonathan Ive and Cook to create excellent products. To me, it seems that without him others are lost and just doing 'what is right' is hard for them. Wish them the best, but they need to get their core business right (said he who types this on 6 yrs old Macbook Air)

chrismealy 9y ago

Apple's genius will be to get people to pay luxury car prices for something built by brutalized Chinese labor.

intoverflow2 9y ago

Bothers me that Apple invests it's time on this. Honestly if Apple disappeared tomorrow someone else would manage to fill this car gap just fine. But if Apple disappeared tomorrow who would fill the gap their computer hardware and OS left? Windows is getting slowly better but I don't think it will ever truly manage to be as slick as OS X. Especially when the passionate Windows insist on using an 8 year old OS and devs insist on writing software using the same systems and libraries they were using 15+ years ago. To me Apple is only valuable as a computer company, an Apple car would just be a toy for the super rich. I do wonder if this project came about as a way to keep talent in the building?

askafriend 9y ago
Yeah I agree with you, Apple is only valuable as a computer company - they should have just stuck to computers. They should have never wandered off into making mp3 players and cell phones which are just toys for the rich. /s
- leggomylibro 9y ago
  "Just stick to computers" is exactly what they did; they just put a new interface on them to make the smartphone. A CPU is an application processor is a CPU. Apple's pioneering innovations have always been with regards to design, not really technology.
- intoverflow2 9y ago
  Think your privilege is showing that you're equating a three figure purchase to a six figure.
  - askafriend 9y ago
    Focusing on Autonomous and straight up building and selling a car are completely different things. Everyone here is assuming the latter with no evidence to support it.

yodon 9y ago

This seems completely backwards. In terms of its products, Apple is already essentially a luxury automobile manufacturer today, it just happens to be a luxury auto manufacturer that makes laptops rather than cars. They make expensive, high grade physical products whose quality and status help people of means define their personal brands and lives in ways that bring joy and function. That's indistinguishable from the role of a BMW or Audi or etc. Google, Amazon, and Microsoft are all much better equipped and positioned to build amazing AI. It's that Jony Ives chassis, exterior, and interior that that would set the automotive industry on fire.

amelius 9y ago
> It's that Jony Ives chassis, exterior, and interior that that would set the automotive industry on fire. If his car design is anything like his watch designs, then I doubt it.
- yodon 9y ago
  Good point (normally I'd just upvote you but that doesn't do as good a job of communicating you'd influenced the opinion of the person you were responding to)

deleted 9y ago

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skc 9y ago

This is fantastic if only for the competition and innovation such an announcement will bring. I feel autonomous cars going mainstream could be more transformative than many realize.

pakl 9y ago

In the interview, Tim Cook says nothing about working on cars. He recognizes that a new core technology is needed for autonomous systems, but doesn't say anything to imply they're working on a car. Along with Cook recently saying humans should be involved in decision-making, there are some very interesting AI-related statements coming out of Apple these days.

ruffrey 9y ago

How about focusing on putting 32 GB of memory in a laptop.

PayForPeenus 9y ago

Apple, like Tesla, share the same valley space in Southern San Fran. Elon Musk has eluded to this as well, as a reality in the very near future. To be perfectly frank, it's a natural fit for these two to be on the same vector and with the OS developer cycles with Apple after iterations with Darwin / Unix - which oh ya BTW runs some of the NASA space junk we have floating around - is the natural fit for Tesla. Maybe .. just maybe we see the Apple OS running Tesla cars in this fashion. I mean, it's almost obvious that these two are dating. I think the rest of the world maybe ignores it, but to me .. it's damn near obvious what the collaboration is, possibly already.

MarkMc 9y ago

I can't see any sustainable competitive advantage in autonomous car tech. The iPhone has strong network effects and a luxury brand. But auto driving tech is strictly a commodity - if the next Ford Focus comes with a "Powered by Apple" label nobody will pay more than if the label read "Powered by Google".

dep_b 9y ago
I would pay less for a car labeled "Powered by Google", I don't know if that counts? If I'm going to be datamined while it works and left stranded with a device that I can use for 20 years yet only gets 3 years of updates, then I want that car maker to pay me to use it, not the other way around. But powered by Apple? Meh. For many people it still means "but I'm not using anything by Apple".

deegles 9y ago

I have a theory that the drop in Apple's software quality over the last few years can be attributed to the 'top' internal talent moving to this project. It would be a great career builder and since it requires a big investment there would be demand from up high to have the best talent in place, even at the expense of other projects.

photojosh 9y ago
Drop? I updated from 10.10 to 10.12 on my 13" MBP only recently, and it is worlds better. Likewise I've found iOS 10 to be the most stable ever, even as I do more and more on it. I have experienced some recent bugs (couldn't download any apps for a while), but they got resolved fairly quickly. Yes, you have people arguing there's been a drop in software quality, it seems to have been a great click-bait topic in 2016 particularly. I think this article accurately describes the situation: https://medium.com/@AlexandraMint/apple-s-elephant-in-the-room-5383a43dc413#.54i4rzaqs https://medium.com/@AlexandraMint/apple-s-elephant-in-the-ro...

skyzyx 9y ago

You realize that he didn’t mention anything about cars, right?