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People are missing this: "With the Alexa App, conversations and contacts go where you go. When you’re away from home, use the app to make a quick call or send

People are missing this: "With the Alexa App, conversations and contacts go where you go. When you’re away from home, use the app to make a quick call or send a message to your family’s Echo. Alexa calling and messaging is free—to get started download the Alexa App." Alexa is now in the messaging and communication game. https://techcrunch.com/2017/05/09/amazon-enables-free-calls-and-messages-on-all-echo-devices-with-alexa-calling/ https://techcrunch.com/2017/05/09/amazon-enables-free-calls-...

jaboutboul 9y ago
Well they are definitely pushing into that space with Amazon Chime, so it only makes sense. This is also absolutely going to kill Nucleus[1] which was the first device released with Alexa Voice Service integrated and was heavily hyped by Amazon at the time. [1]: https://nucleuslife.com/ https://nucleuslife.com/
- stingrae 9y ago
  I wonder what the Amazon strategy with this is, given they invested through the Alexa fund.
  - sushid 9y ago
    Probably just hedging their bets. But they definitely want their own horse to win the race.
- ribs 9y ago
  Damn that thing's almost $400! You're right, they'll be dead.
  - andrewaylett 9y ago
    In fairness, that's the cost for two -- they're $249 individually, so a bit cheaper than a Show. But that's not entirely obvious from the page.
- rdschouw 9y ago
  Yes, poor Nucleus. The Echo line of devices makes it even more versatile. You can call a cheap Echo Dot in the kids' bedroom from your expensive Echo Show in the kitchen. With Amazon's brand and market power, I am not sure how they're going survive. We reached an interesting point in time where the internet incumbents (Google, Facebook, Apple, Amazon) can copy and extend any interesting idea quickly. I remember those days when Microsoft and Intel were ruling the world.
- ksenzee 9y ago
  Indeed. I had just about hit the Buy button on a pair of Nucleus devices when I heard the Echo Show was coming. Now I don't need them.
  - dboreham 9y ago
    Nucleus as opposed to Pied Piper?
Nullabillity 9y ago
But... why? Presumably everyone who would even consider buying this already has a computer at home, which does that better anyway.
- pickthenimp2 9y ago
  hands free...one click answer on other end.
  - vthallam 9y ago
    for that they have facetime or duo? I mean if 2 users using this are out, why use amazon app to make calls?
- VLM 9y ago
  HN isn't really a kid friendly community, but this would work pretty well for kids age maybe 3 to 10 who just want to listen to music, maybe video call grandma. Sort of a post-iPad reaction to the failure of tablets.
  - cybernytrix 9y ago
    This looks like an iPad / tablet charging stand with speakers and better mic -- which there are plenty of in the market. You can get one of these for $20 (or $99 if Apple makes it!). Amazon is just hoping that the success of Echo will push this forward. This will be another Fire incident for Amazon.
    - j2bax 9y ago
      >This will be another Fire incident for Amazon. Disagree. This is entering a far less saturated somewhat new market. A very focused communication/consumption device where the tablet is trying to be a laptop.
- lsaferite 9y ago
  There is a large space between sitting at my computer and talking to my wife in the grocery store vs. sitting on the couch and talking to my wife in the grocery store.
mikeash 9y ago
Are we ever going to see unity between these services, or are we doomed to have little walled-off fiefdoms forever? A phone number works anywhere in the world, to anywhere in the world, with anyone who has a phone. All e-mail providers work with each other. I don't care who you're with, and I wouldn't even have to know except it's usually part of the address. SMS works no matter which provider we both have. It feels like we're taking huge steps backwards. Instead of sending a message to a phone number or e-mail address, I'll use iMessage or Google Hangouts or Skype or Slack or.... Video call? We can do FaceTime or Hangouts or Skype or.... Will these things start interoperating with each other eventually, or are we just doomed forever?
- tsunamifury 9y ago
  This isn't that complicated or sad. You can still call anyone in the world and still text anyone in the world. Its that the remaining spaces to compete in are feature based, and features don't move forward quickly on open standards. There are plenty of working open standards to do the basics, its if you want to do anything beyond the basics that you end up in a walled garden.
  - mikeash 9y ago
    Video calling and instant messaging have both been around for ages at this point, and remain stubbornly walled off. Both should qualify as "basics" by now. Sure, you can still SMS worldwide, as long as they have a cell phone. But non-phone devices are becoming very common. What if you want to send or receive messages on your tablet or computer. (This works OK in the Apple world, but only because they hack it by routing SMS through your phone.) Video calls don't even have that. E-mail, for example, was different. I started using online services when you had AOL, CompuServe, Prodigy, etc. all in their own little worlds. That didn't last very long before they all bridged their internal e-mail systems to the internet and everyone could talk to each other.
    - tsunamifury 9y ago
      Video Calling is a HARD problem that still has not been solved even remotely to the broader markets satisfaction. Everything from latency/compression techniques to hardware is in flux. It is a long ways away from a standard that can be easily and widely adopted and work in all scenarios.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
dkrich 9y ago
This feels forced and sort of flies in the face of how people have demonstrated that they prefer to communicate over the past 20 years or so. I already have a phone that I can pull out and send a text or make a call with to anybody, without regard to whether they have an Amazon device. My 79 year old mother, who is the last remaining person to not give into a smart phone, is most certainly never going to learn how to use an Echo. So I'm having a hard time understanding whom this would be targeted at.
- hrktb 9y ago
  I think amazon is trying to extend markets, so what happened during the past 20 years can't be their guide. Otherwise I'd see a use of this device for small kids (parents would protect them from generic chat apps, and they're not good at typing yet) and people who put their phone in random places in the house and only check when they actively want to do something on it.
  - dkrich 9y ago
    Otherwise I'd see a use of this device for small kids (parents would protect them from generic chat apps, and they're not good at typing yet) and people who put their phone in random places in the house and only check when they actively want to do something on it. This could pretty much describe the iPad as well. To me, Amazon is betting way too heavily on voice as the optimal way to interact with hardware. I know that it's cool because it hasn't ever been done well before, but in practice the utility just isn't there for the vast majority of use cases. When you think of all the different visual ways that a tablet enables a person to interact with the machine, and then compare that to an entirely voice-operated machine, it feels like taking a step backwards.
    - mgkimsal 9y ago
      > Amazon is betting way too heavily on voice as the optimal way to interact with hardware. I know that it's cool because it hasn't ever been done well before, but in practice the utility just isn't there for the vast majority of use cases. Beyond the issues with dialects and accents - those will eventually be solved with better learning/adaptation algorithms - I've always felt voice interfaces very... limited. Perhaps it will enable more 'social' experiences, but 3-5 people can be in a room and use their devices (laptop/tablet/etc) more or less as they do now. If/when devices with 'voice interactions' are the norm... how will I get any privacy from those around me? And simultaneous voices will present some ongoing problems (until, maybe, personal voice recognition, vs just 'voice', is achieved?)
kristianc 9y ago
jwz: 'Every program attempts to expand until it can read mail. Those programs which cannot so expand are replaced by ones which can.'
tw04 9y ago
How, in 2017, has Amazon not learned that messaging that doesn't extend to the PC is useless. Could you enter a more crowded market without any differentiation to speak of?
- ilyaeck 9y ago
  Echo is the new PC (for its target audience/use case).
  - tw04 9y ago
    Based on my admittedly small sample size: that couldn't be further from the truth. Every person I know who has an echo is a techie or their significant other is a techie. Those people all expect their communication platform of choice to span all of their devices. My mom doesn't have an echo, doesn't know what an echo is, and probably wouldn't ever spend the money on one even if she did. She's about the only person in my life that would EVER consider an Echo to be "the new PC". And quite frankly I can't imagine her giving up her laptop for one of these in a million years.

jaboutboul 9y ago

Well they are definitely pushing into that space with Amazon Chime, so it only makes sense. This is also absolutely going to kill Nucleus[1] which was the first device released with Alexa Voice Service integrated and was heavily hyped by Amazon at the time. [1]: https://nucleuslife.com/ https://nucleuslife.com/

stingrae 9y ago
I wonder what the Amazon strategy with this is, given they invested through the Alexa fund.
- sushid 9y ago
  Probably just hedging their bets. But they definitely want their own horse to win the race.
ribs 9y ago
Damn that thing's almost $400! You're right, they'll be dead.
- andrewaylett 9y ago
  In fairness, that's the cost for two -- they're $249 individually, so a bit cheaper than a Show. But that's not entirely obvious from the page.
rdschouw 9y ago
Yes, poor Nucleus. The Echo line of devices makes it even more versatile. You can call a cheap Echo Dot in the kids' bedroom from your expensive Echo Show in the kitchen. With Amazon's brand and market power, I am not sure how they're going survive. We reached an interesting point in time where the internet incumbents (Google, Facebook, Apple, Amazon) can copy and extend any interesting idea quickly. I remember those days when Microsoft and Intel were ruling the world.
ksenzee 9y ago
Indeed. I had just about hit the Buy button on a pair of Nucleus devices when I heard the Echo Show was coming. Now I don't need them.
- dboreham 9y ago
  Nucleus as opposed to Pied Piper?

Nullabillity 9y ago

But... why? Presumably everyone who would even consider buying this already has a computer at home, which does that better anyway.

pickthenimp2 9y ago
hands free...one click answer on other end.
- vthallam 9y ago
  for that they have facetime or duo? I mean if 2 users using this are out, why use amazon app to make calls?
VLM 9y ago
HN isn't really a kid friendly community, but this would work pretty well for kids age maybe 3 to 10 who just want to listen to music, maybe video call grandma. Sort of a post-iPad reaction to the failure of tablets.
- cybernytrix 9y ago
  This looks like an iPad / tablet charging stand with speakers and better mic -- which there are plenty of in the market. You can get one of these for $20 (or $99 if Apple makes it!). Amazon is just hoping that the success of Echo will push this forward. This will be another Fire incident for Amazon.
  - j2bax 9y ago
    >This will be another Fire incident for Amazon. Disagree. This is entering a far less saturated somewhat new market. A very focused communication/consumption device where the tablet is trying to be a laptop.
lsaferite 9y ago
There is a large space between sitting at my computer and talking to my wife in the grocery store vs. sitting on the couch and talking to my wife in the grocery store.

mikeash 9y ago

Are we ever going to see unity between these services, or are we doomed to have little walled-off fiefdoms forever? A phone number works anywhere in the world, to anywhere in the world, with anyone who has a phone. All e-mail providers work with each other. I don't care who you're with, and I wouldn't even have to know except it's usually part of the address. SMS works no matter which provider we both have. It feels like we're taking huge steps backwards. Instead of sending a message to a phone number or e-mail address, I'll use iMessage or Google Hangouts or Skype or Slack or.... Video call? We can do FaceTime or Hangouts or Skype or.... Will these things start interoperating with each other eventually, or are we just doomed forever?

tsunamifury 9y ago
This isn't that complicated or sad. You can still call anyone in the world and still text anyone in the world. Its that the remaining spaces to compete in are feature based, and features don't move forward quickly on open standards. There are plenty of working open standards to do the basics, its if you want to do anything beyond the basics that you end up in a walled garden.
- mikeash 9y ago
  Video calling and instant messaging have both been around for ages at this point, and remain stubbornly walled off. Both should qualify as "basics" by now. Sure, you can still SMS worldwide, as long as they have a cell phone. But non-phone devices are becoming very common. What if you want to send or receive messages on your tablet or computer. (This works OK in the Apple world, but only because they hack it by routing SMS through your phone.) Video calls don't even have that. E-mail, for example, was different. I started using online services when you had AOL, CompuServe, Prodigy, etc. all in their own little worlds. That didn't last very long before they all bridged their internal e-mail systems to the internet and everyone could talk to each other.
  - tsunamifury 9y ago
    Video Calling is a HARD problem that still has not been solved even remotely to the broader markets satisfaction. Everything from latency/compression techniques to hardware is in flux. It is a long ways away from a standard that can be easily and widely adopted and work in all scenarios.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

dkrich 9y ago

This feels forced and sort of flies in the face of how people have demonstrated that they prefer to communicate over the past 20 years or so. I already have a phone that I can pull out and send a text or make a call with to anybody, without regard to whether they have an Amazon device. My 79 year old mother, who is the last remaining person to not give into a smart phone, is most certainly never going to learn how to use an Echo. So I'm having a hard time understanding whom this would be targeted at.

hrktb 9y ago
I think amazon is trying to extend markets, so what happened during the past 20 years can't be their guide. Otherwise I'd see a use of this device for small kids (parents would protect them from generic chat apps, and they're not good at typing yet) and people who put their phone in random places in the house and only check when they actively want to do something on it.
- dkrich 9y ago
  Otherwise I'd see a use of this device for small kids (parents would protect them from generic chat apps, and they're not good at typing yet) and people who put their phone in random places in the house and only check when they actively want to do something on it. This could pretty much describe the iPad as well. To me, Amazon is betting way too heavily on voice as the optimal way to interact with hardware. I know that it's cool because it hasn't ever been done well before, but in practice the utility just isn't there for the vast majority of use cases. When you think of all the different visual ways that a tablet enables a person to interact with the machine, and then compare that to an entirely voice-operated machine, it feels like taking a step backwards.
  - mgkimsal 9y ago
    > Amazon is betting way too heavily on voice as the optimal way to interact with hardware. I know that it's cool because it hasn't ever been done well before, but in practice the utility just isn't there for the vast majority of use cases. Beyond the issues with dialects and accents - those will eventually be solved with better learning/adaptation algorithms - I've always felt voice interfaces very... limited. Perhaps it will enable more 'social' experiences, but 3-5 people can be in a room and use their devices (laptop/tablet/etc) more or less as they do now. If/when devices with 'voice interactions' are the norm... how will I get any privacy from those around me? And simultaneous voices will present some ongoing problems (until, maybe, personal voice recognition, vs just 'voice', is achieved?)

kristianc 9y ago

jwz: 'Every program attempts to expand until it can read mail. Those programs which cannot so expand are replaced by ones which can.'

tw04 9y ago

How, in 2017, has Amazon not learned that messaging that doesn't extend to the PC is useless. Could you enter a more crowded market without any differentiation to speak of?

ilyaeck 9y ago
Echo is the new PC (for its target audience/use case).
- tw04 9y ago
  Based on my admittedly small sample size: that couldn't be further from the truth. Every person I know who has an echo is a techie or their significant other is a techie. Those people all expect their communication platform of choice to span all of their devices. My mom doesn't have an echo, doesn't know what an echo is, and probably wouldn't ever spend the money on one even if she did. She's about the only person in my life that would EVER consider an Echo to be "the new PC". And quite frankly I can't imagine her giving up her laptop for one of these in a million years.