9 ms·

Let's just note that giving the guy a 1st class ticket or even a private jet to his destination would have been less expensive. And could even have enhanced UA'

Let's just note that giving the guy a 1st class ticket or even a private jet to his destination would have been less expensive. And could even have enhanced UA's image and business.

ScottBurson 9y ago
They could just as easily have flown their employees to Louisville on a private jet. I have even seen it suggested that the employees could even have gone by taxi, though I don't know if that was really practical. Anyway, seems to me the best solution would have been to simply keep raising their offer for compensation until they got enough volunteers. Whatever they had to pay would have been far less than the $1.6B hit they took to their stock price. (I actually like Delta's solution the best: they ask you when you check in how much you would accept to get bumped. It's fair and efficient.)
- gt565k 9y ago
  I had a flight get delayed twice for a few hours and then a smaller plane arrived, so people had to get bumped. I waited for a bit and then talked to the Delta rep at the counter, explaining that I really needed to get to my destination soon as my friend was waiting to pick me up, and if they had a flight available in the coming hour or two, I'd volunteer to be bumped. Received a $400 voucher, and got placed in 1st class on a flight which departed 30 minutes after my delayed flight. It was a win-win. I pounded 3 heinekens and had a jolly time.
- jenamety 9y ago
  >I have even seen it suggested that the employees could even have gone by taxi, though I don't know if that was really practical. I have a feeling the contract with the Pilot and FA unions squashes that idea rather quickly.
  - chimeracoder 9y ago
    > I have a feeling the contract with the Pilot and FA unions squashes that idea rather quickly. Correct, the pilot and FA unions would both have forbidden using a taxi to deadhead in this scenario. Source: friends who are flight attendants, and I've actually also gotten bitten myself by this rule personally (though obviously with far less serious consequences than this doctor).
- Eric_WVGG 9y ago
  re: Delta's solution, last week my mother effectively got her summer vacation flight to NYC paid for this way.
- Alupis 9y ago
  Well, if we're comparing their stock price hit vs. paying for alternative transportation for the 4 employees; United could have sent all 4 employees to the ISS and back for far less[1] than the $1.6 billion market cap loss. [1] http://www.space.com/20897-nasa-russia-astronaut-launches-2017.html http://www.space.com/20897-nasa-russia-astronaut-launches-20...
  - maxerickson 9y ago
    An unrealized change in the stock price doesn't really mean anything. Especially over the short term.
    - Alupis 9y ago
      > An unrealized change in the stock price doesn't really mean anything I think we all understood that already. It's merely comparing, and accentuating, the market cap loss vs. options that would have been less costly, even if those losses aren't "real". To that endeavor, putting these employees on a rocket ship, launching them into space, docking with the ISS, then finally returning sometime later... just for fun... all would have "hurt" less than trying to evict customers from their seats in this case.
      - maxerickson 9y ago
        "hurt" That's just the point. A short term stock move doesn't hurt (or help) a company much at all.
        adwi 9y ago
        Not to belabor this, but I believe it's a valid point to illustrate the scale of the potential financial repercussions for United. The damage to their brand could in fact cost far more than the short term $1.6B change in market cap.
- leopoldo 9y ago
  I actually agree that it is what they should have done. OR at least go up to the $1,350 that the regulation stipulates. However I find it difficult to believe that the Airline (or the flight attendants manager) would have allowed a $5,000 compensation for the seat. Because they had no way of knowing how this was gonna unravel. / > Why the hell did you give this customer $5,000 for his seat, are you CRAZY? >> M'am, I just prevented the biggest PR shitstorm in our company's history > You're fired, and we'll make you pay those 5 grand / :)
  - ScottBurson 9y ago
    By the point where they were about to have an airport police officer beat the crap out of the passenger (which they did, BTW -- he suffered a concussion and two lost teeth!) it should have become clear that this wasn't going to go well. So once it was clear that Dao wasn't going to leave his seat voluntarily, they should have brought in a higher-up with the authority to offer more compensation to get another volunteer -- or simply pick another person to involuntarily deplane. (They could also have publicly threatened Dao with a civil lawsuit, figuring that even if that didn't change his mind, it would deter the next person they picked from doing the same thing he did.)
    - differentView 9y ago
      Saw on TV news this morning, those weren't even real cops. They were private security hired by United. They were even told to stop wearing jackets that said "POLICE" months ago, but kept wearing them.
      - joezydeco 9y ago
        They were Chicago Department of Aviation police. They're hired by the City Aviation department and usually have police training, but are not allowed to arrest citizens or carry guns (although they have been asking). http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/April-2017/3-Things-to-Know-About-the-Officers-in-the-United-Airlines-Fiasco/ http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/April-2017/3-Things-to-K... tldr: They're rent-a-cops hired by the airport, not United.
- gshulegaard 9y ago
  > I actually like Delta's solution the best: they ask you when you check in how much you would accept to get bumped. It's fair and efficient. This is kind of like a recruiter asking you what your current and expected salary is. I wouldn't call it fair and it is only efficient for the airline which can then use that information to bump customers with the lowest thresholds, maximizing producer (the airline) surplus.
  - svachalek 9y ago
    The typical way to do it is to more or less hold an auction, increasing the offer until enough people take it. Either way the people with the lowest thresholds end up getting bumped. These are the people with the least urgency and/or most need so I don't really see what's unfair about it.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - Qworg 9y ago
      Hold a reverse auction instead - start high and lower it until you get just enough takers.
      - mistermann 9y ago
        Why would you start high, that's going to maximize your cost not minimize.
        koenigdavidmj 9y ago
        Because people are selfish and might volunteer to get 800 for themselves rather than let some other guy get 1200 (even if 1200 is the legal maximum).
        FabHK 9y ago
        No, if you start low, people might basically implicitly "conspire" to keep their hands down, and when the first "breaks" the cartel at some high price, all hands will shoot up. Better to reverse auction until only 4 hands are left. It should end up cheaper (and fairer, incidentally, as it will closer to true preferences)
- ufmace 9y ago
  > they ask you when you check in how much you would accept to get bumped I don't like the sound of that much - how many people actually know or are prepared to think straight about how much money they would accept to get bumped when they're checking in? I'd rather the system be that, if they need to bump someone, they start with a public offer of a modest amount, then keep increasing it until either somebody accepts or it gets so high that it's cheaper to do something else.
  - ghobs91 9y ago
    Keep in mind many people check in at home the day before. I flew recently and Delta offered me the option and I declined because I had to arrive at a certain time.
  - michaelt 9y ago
    I agree that would be a fair system as everyone, even the bumped passengers, would leave happy under that arrangement. It would certainly work well if all the passengers were already on the plane, as they'd all be there to participate in the auction. However, if people were being bumped at check-in, or between check-in and boarding,
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - ScottBurson 9y ago
    The other advantage of Delta's system is efficiency. These auctions take time, delaying flights. Delta knows when they start boarding who is getting bumped.
- AnimalMuppet 9y ago
  > I have even seen it suggested that the employees could even have gone by taxi, though I don't know if that was really practical. It would have taken five hours. By itself, that's fine. But according to FAA rules, what is their status during those five hours? If they're on duty, they either need eight hours off duty once they get to Louisville, or they have a limited amount of time they can be on duty once they get there. (If that time doesn't count as on duty, of course, no problem.)
  - dingaling 9y ago
    As I understand it the transfer time would count as duty time because they were being moved from their report-to-work location, Chicago, to an alternative work location due to the crewing contingency. Incidentally they were actually from another airline, Trans States Airlines of Missouri, which also flies for United and American. So they were using their status as to-become-United Express crew to make must-ride space on a Republic Airways aircraft.
- JshWright 9y ago
  American Airlines once put me in a cab from Baltimore to Philadelphia after my flight out of Baltimore got cancelled (and the only viable alternative flight was later that day in Philly). Chicago -> Louisville is a little further than Baltimore -> Philly, but it still seems manageable. The only question is, would the crew have been "on the clock" (counting against their hourly limits).
  - yardie 9y ago
    That depends on what on the clock means. My spouse used to work for an airline and they had various clocks. * 1000hour flight time clock which they couldn't exceed (cosmic radiation or something). * They had the flight clock which is how they were compensated ie. 14 hour LHR-HKG. * They had the break clock in flight. So crew could sleep 1-2 hours during a 12-18 hour flight. * Rapid response standby (15 minute) was a 12 hour standby shift in the terminal. Because the work times are so extreme cabin crew is given certain latitude in off time. Like, they may work 3 12-hour shifts and then take 3-4 days off. Everything I've read so far has not been clear about why the crew needed to be there on a flight that was already closed (when the last seat is filled the gate is closed). There were many better options, including driving, that were available. Unloading a passenger is a logistical nightmare and most ground crew are reluctant to do it. It messes up their performance metrics but in an airline like United maybe they just don't care.
- kelnos 9y ago
  I read somewhere (unverified) that they couldn't send the crew to their destination via taxi/limo due to union regs. Wasn't aware of that feature of Delta's check-in; that's actually really smart. I'd be in favor of a system where involuntary bumps are banned, and the airline just takes (cash) bids for people who might volunteer, and is required to take the N lowest bids. I'd be ok with something like allowing the compensation to be vouchers if the airline is willing to make the voucher amount 2x (or something) of the cash amount.
  - an_account 9y ago
    At some point someone can't get on the plane. If there was no maximum amount then people could game the system and get tens of thousands of dollars. Maybe the legal maximum should be higher though.
- AdamJacobMuller 9y ago
  > keep raising their offer for compensation That's backwards from a psychological point of view, that will entice people to hold out for a larger offer later. How they should handle it is very simple. Pick a very large number, lets say 10k, tell everyone on the plane to raise their hand if they're willing to get off the plane for 10k. Obviously a lot (probably way more than half) will raise their hands. Now, tell everyone "keep your hand up if you're willing to get off for 7500," rinse, repeat until you get to only four people with their hands up. I bet united could have gotten four passengers off that plane for LESS than the $800/each that they offered at the beginning, probably a LOT less and the four passengers would have been happy about it, too.
  - srtjstjsj 9y ago
    That's way to complicated and confusing to execute in an airport departure lounge or on an airplane
  - FabHK 9y ago
    Agreed, reverse auction appropriate here, and not really that complicated.
- FabHK 9y ago
  That "just as easy" option with a private jet or Uber is an assumption. There a crew resting hour regulations that might have prevented the crew from operating the next flight had they driven, and union contracts that stipulate how deadheading crew can be transported. Again, all of those might be renegotiated at some point, but that doesn't mean there is an easy obvious alternative at hand now every time a pax refuses to deplane.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
yourapostasy 9y ago
The ceiling on compensation to pax is $10,850, based upon a quick quote I got from executivejetmanagement.com for booking a 7 pax small jet in the next 3 hours, ORD-SDF. They quoted me a range $7,590 - $10,850, so this is the worst-case scenario. So UA's policy is possibly based upon a "stay below some non-market-related amount" internal goal versus recognizing that they were throwing away perfectly useful pricing signals every time they enacted these kinds of policies. If they reached $2712.50 per seat for those four deadheading crew members in the auction with no takers (highly unlikely), then that is not just signaling it is cheaper to charter a private jet, but also signals pricing information to inform their route planning and marketing teams. I see this all the time in business when helping clients implement their policies into software. There are often policies set for what amounts to someone with policy making power within the organization trying to game the metrics they are compensated by, and it ends up blinding the company to valuable market information that they then turn around to spend a minor fortune upon obtaining a very low-fidelity equivalent in lengthy, futile sales and marketing efforts.
koenigdavidmj 9y ago
Up until a week ago, four times the fare plus your hotel if necessary was sufficient remedy for this sort of event. It's a new thing for grown adults to throw temper tantrums and then get nearly-universal public support for their cause. It's only now that companies need to be proactive in knowing how to handle this of all things.
- tigershark 9y ago
  Ah ok. So let's say that you are getting married the next morning and you are removed from a flight that you boarded (that is illegal and in breach of the contract). I guess that you'll be happy to miss your wedding for 4 times the fare and a night in the hotel. As far as I remember this is the first time that I've seen such an abuse, with a company removing a boarded passenger on a whim. But apparently you can always find people that are ready to justify such abuses. I'd be curious to hear your opinion in case the hypothetical scenario that I presented happened to you.
  - koenigdavidmj 9y ago
    Flights get canceled entirely for much more mundane reasons, such as storms or maintenance issues. If you truly need to be somewhere tomorrow, you need to plan for those cases, which are quite a bit more frequent than this one. As for your scenario, ask for a volunteer to get bumped instead, and incentivize them as necessary.
    - s73ver 9y ago
      Why should I have to do the airlines work for them?
    - tigershark 9y ago
      Ah so now it's up to the passenger to solve the problem for united finding a volunteer. I propose also that you should give them your a*se in case they ask for it. As for the cancellation if instead of the wedding there was a funeral you would ask the deceased to schedule better his own death I guess. It's really astonishing how there are people perfectly willing to give away all their rights while thanking for it with a smile.
mbesto 9y ago
Except it's not. You've just set a precedent that would invariably become way more expensive in aggregate.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
mkhpalm 9y ago
Lets also not forget to note that United's way of handling the situation after it went viral was to dig up dirt and defame Dao. I couldn't believe what I was hearing regarding unrelated personal past issues Dao had that were suddenly being broadcast by main stream media.

Let's just note that giving the guy a 1st class ticket or even a private jet to his destination would have been less expensive. And could even have enhanced UA's image and business.

ScottBurson 9y ago

They could just as easily have flown their employees to Louisville on a private jet. I have even seen it suggested that the employees could even have gone by taxi, though I don't know if that was really practical. Anyway, seems to me the best solution would have been to simply keep raising their offer for compensation until they got enough volunteers. Whatever they had to pay would have been far less than the $1.6B hit they took to their stock price. (I actually like Delta's solution the best: they ask you when you check in how much you would accept to get bumped. It's fair and efficient.)

gt565k 9y ago
I had a flight get delayed twice for a few hours and then a smaller plane arrived, so people had to get bumped. I waited for a bit and then talked to the Delta rep at the counter, explaining that I really needed to get to my destination soon as my friend was waiting to pick me up, and if they had a flight available in the coming hour or two, I'd volunteer to be bumped. Received a $400 voucher, and got placed in 1st class on a flight which departed 30 minutes after my delayed flight. It was a win-win. I pounded 3 heinekens and had a jolly time.
jenamety 9y ago
>I have even seen it suggested that the employees could even have gone by taxi, though I don't know if that was really practical. I have a feeling the contract with the Pilot and FA unions squashes that idea rather quickly.
- chimeracoder 9y ago
  > I have a feeling the contract with the Pilot and FA unions squashes that idea rather quickly. Correct, the pilot and FA unions would both have forbidden using a taxi to deadhead in this scenario. Source: friends who are flight attendants, and I've actually also gotten bitten myself by this rule personally (though obviously with far less serious consequences than this doctor).
Eric_WVGG 9y ago
re: Delta's solution, last week my mother effectively got her summer vacation flight to NYC paid for this way.
Alupis 9y ago
Well, if we're comparing their stock price hit vs. paying for alternative transportation for the 4 employees; United could have sent all 4 employees to the ISS and back for far less[1] than the $1.6 billion market cap loss. [1] http://www.space.com/20897-nasa-russia-astronaut-launches-2017.html http://www.space.com/20897-nasa-russia-astronaut-launches-20...
- maxerickson 9y ago
  An unrealized change in the stock price doesn't really mean anything. Especially over the short term.
  - Alupis 9y ago
    > An unrealized change in the stock price doesn't really mean anything I think we all understood that already. It's merely comparing, and accentuating, the market cap loss vs. options that would have been less costly, even if those losses aren't "real". To that endeavor, putting these employees on a rocket ship, launching them into space, docking with the ISS, then finally returning sometime later... just for fun... all would have "hurt" less than trying to evict customers from their seats in this case.
    - maxerickson 9y ago
      "hurt" That's just the point. A short term stock move doesn't hurt (or help) a company much at all.
      - adwi 9y ago
        Not to belabor this, but I believe it's a valid point to illustrate the scale of the potential financial repercussions for United. The damage to their brand could in fact cost far more than the short term $1.6B change in market cap.
leopoldo 9y ago
I actually agree that it is what they should have done. OR at least go up to the $1,350 that the regulation stipulates. However I find it difficult to believe that the Airline (or the flight attendants manager) would have allowed a $5,000 compensation for the seat. Because they had no way of knowing how this was gonna unravel. / > Why the hell did you give this customer $5,000 for his seat, are you CRAZY? >> M'am, I just prevented the biggest PR shitstorm in our company's history > You're fired, and we'll make you pay those 5 grand / :)
- ScottBurson 9y ago
  By the point where they were about to have an airport police officer beat the crap out of the passenger (which they did, BTW -- he suffered a concussion and two lost teeth!) it should have become clear that this wasn't going to go well. So once it was clear that Dao wasn't going to leave his seat voluntarily, they should have brought in a higher-up with the authority to offer more compensation to get another volunteer -- or simply pick another person to involuntarily deplane. (They could also have publicly threatened Dao with a civil lawsuit, figuring that even if that didn't change his mind, it would deter the next person they picked from doing the same thing he did.)
  - differentView 9y ago
    Saw on TV news this morning, those weren't even real cops. They were private security hired by United. They were even told to stop wearing jackets that said "POLICE" months ago, but kept wearing them.
    - joezydeco 9y ago
      They were Chicago Department of Aviation police. They're hired by the City Aviation department and usually have police training, but are not allowed to arrest citizens or carry guns (although they have been asking). http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/April-2017/3-Things-to-Know-About-the-Officers-in-the-United-Airlines-Fiasco/ http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/April-2017/3-Things-to-K... tldr: They're rent-a-cops hired by the airport, not United.
gshulegaard 9y ago
> I actually like Delta's solution the best: they ask you when you check in how much you would accept to get bumped. It's fair and efficient. This is kind of like a recruiter asking you what your current and expected salary is. I wouldn't call it fair and it is only efficient for the airline which can then use that information to bump customers with the lowest thresholds, maximizing producer (the airline) surplus.
- svachalek 9y ago
  The typical way to do it is to more or less hold an auction, increasing the offer until enough people take it. Either way the people with the lowest thresholds end up getting bumped. These are the people with the least urgency and/or most need so I don't really see what's unfair about it.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - Qworg 9y ago
    Hold a reverse auction instead - start high and lower it until you get just enough takers.
    - mistermann 9y ago
      Why would you start high, that's going to maximize your cost not minimize.
      - koenigdavidmj 9y ago
        Because people are selfish and might volunteer to get 800 for themselves rather than let some other guy get 1200 (even if 1200 is the legal maximum).
      - FabHK 9y ago
        No, if you start low, people might basically implicitly "conspire" to keep their hands down, and when the first "breaks" the cartel at some high price, all hands will shoot up. Better to reverse auction until only 4 hands are left. It should end up cheaper (and fairer, incidentally, as it will closer to true preferences)
ufmace 9y ago
> they ask you when you check in how much you would accept to get bumped I don't like the sound of that much - how many people actually know or are prepared to think straight about how much money they would accept to get bumped when they're checking in? I'd rather the system be that, if they need to bump someone, they start with a public offer of a modest amount, then keep increasing it until either somebody accepts or it gets so high that it's cheaper to do something else.
- ghobs91 9y ago
  Keep in mind many people check in at home the day before. I flew recently and Delta offered me the option and I declined because I had to arrive at a certain time.
- michaelt 9y ago
  I agree that would be a fair system as everyone, even the bumped passengers, would leave happy under that arrangement. It would certainly work well if all the passengers were already on the plane, as they'd all be there to participate in the auction. However, if people were being bumped at check-in, or between check-in and boarding,
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- ScottBurson 9y ago
  The other advantage of Delta's system is efficiency. These auctions take time, delaying flights. Delta knows when they start boarding who is getting bumped.
AnimalMuppet 9y ago
> I have even seen it suggested that the employees could even have gone by taxi, though I don't know if that was really practical. It would have taken five hours. By itself, that's fine. But according to FAA rules, what is their status during those five hours? If they're on duty, they either need eight hours off duty once they get to Louisville, or they have a limited amount of time they can be on duty once they get there. (If that time doesn't count as on duty, of course, no problem.)
- dingaling 9y ago
  As I understand it the transfer time would count as duty time because they were being moved from their report-to-work location, Chicago, to an alternative work location due to the crewing contingency. Incidentally they were actually from another airline, Trans States Airlines of Missouri, which also flies for United and American. So they were using their status as to-become-United Express crew to make must-ride space on a Republic Airways aircraft.
JshWright 9y ago
American Airlines once put me in a cab from Baltimore to Philadelphia after my flight out of Baltimore got cancelled (and the only viable alternative flight was later that day in Philly). Chicago -> Louisville is a little further than Baltimore -> Philly, but it still seems manageable. The only question is, would the crew have been "on the clock" (counting against their hourly limits).
- yardie 9y ago
  That depends on what on the clock means. My spouse used to work for an airline and they had various clocks. * 1000hour flight time clock which they couldn't exceed (cosmic radiation or something). * They had the flight clock which is how they were compensated ie. 14 hour LHR-HKG. * They had the break clock in flight. So crew could sleep 1-2 hours during a 12-18 hour flight. * Rapid response standby (15 minute) was a 12 hour standby shift in the terminal. Because the work times are so extreme cabin crew is given certain latitude in off time. Like, they may work 3 12-hour shifts and then take 3-4 days off. Everything I've read so far has not been clear about why the crew needed to be there on a flight that was already closed (when the last seat is filled the gate is closed). There were many better options, including driving, that were available. Unloading a passenger is a logistical nightmare and most ground crew are reluctant to do it. It messes up their performance metrics but in an airline like United maybe they just don't care.
kelnos 9y ago
I read somewhere (unverified) that they couldn't send the crew to their destination via taxi/limo due to union regs. Wasn't aware of that feature of Delta's check-in; that's actually really smart. I'd be in favor of a system where involuntary bumps are banned, and the airline just takes (cash) bids for people who might volunteer, and is required to take the N lowest bids. I'd be ok with something like allowing the compensation to be vouchers if the airline is willing to make the voucher amount 2x (or something) of the cash amount.
- an_account 9y ago
  At some point someone can't get on the plane. If there was no maximum amount then people could game the system and get tens of thousands of dollars. Maybe the legal maximum should be higher though.
AdamJacobMuller 9y ago
> keep raising their offer for compensation That's backwards from a psychological point of view, that will entice people to hold out for a larger offer later. How they should handle it is very simple. Pick a very large number, lets say 10k, tell everyone on the plane to raise their hand if they're willing to get off the plane for 10k. Obviously a lot (probably way more than half) will raise their hands. Now, tell everyone "keep your hand up if you're willing to get off for 7500," rinse, repeat until you get to only four people with their hands up. I bet united could have gotten four passengers off that plane for LESS than the $800/each that they offered at the beginning, probably a LOT less and the four passengers would have been happy about it, too.
- srtjstjsj 9y ago
  That's way to complicated and confusing to execute in an airport departure lounge or on an airplane
- FabHK 9y ago
  Agreed, reverse auction appropriate here, and not really that complicated.
FabHK 9y ago
That "just as easy" option with a private jet or Uber is an assumption. There a crew resting hour regulations that might have prevented the crew from operating the next flight had they driven, and union contracts that stipulate how deadheading crew can be transported. Again, all of those might be renegotiated at some point, but that doesn't mean there is an easy obvious alternative at hand now every time a pax refuses to deplane.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

yourapostasy 9y ago

The ceiling on compensation to pax is $10,850, based upon a quick quote I got from executivejetmanagement.com for booking a 7 pax small jet in the next 3 hours, ORD-SDF. They quoted me a range $7,590 - $10,850, so this is the worst-case scenario. So UA's policy is possibly based upon a "stay below some non-market-related amount" internal goal versus recognizing that they were throwing away perfectly useful pricing signals every time they enacted these kinds of policies. If they reached $2712.50 per seat for those four deadheading crew members in the auction with no takers (highly unlikely), then that is not just signaling it is cheaper to charter a private jet, but also signals pricing information to inform their route planning and marketing teams. I see this all the time in business when helping clients implement their policies into software. There are often policies set for what amounts to someone with policy making power within the organization trying to game the metrics they are compensated by, and it ends up blinding the company to valuable market information that they then turn around to spend a minor fortune upon obtaining a very low-fidelity equivalent in lengthy, futile sales and marketing efforts.

koenigdavidmj 9y ago

Up until a week ago, four times the fare plus your hotel if necessary was sufficient remedy for this sort of event. It's a new thing for grown adults to throw temper tantrums and then get nearly-universal public support for their cause. It's only now that companies need to be proactive in knowing how to handle this of all things.

tigershark 9y ago
Ah ok. So let's say that you are getting married the next morning and you are removed from a flight that you boarded (that is illegal and in breach of the contract). I guess that you'll be happy to miss your wedding for 4 times the fare and a night in the hotel. As far as I remember this is the first time that I've seen such an abuse, with a company removing a boarded passenger on a whim. But apparently you can always find people that are ready to justify such abuses. I'd be curious to hear your opinion in case the hypothetical scenario that I presented happened to you.
- koenigdavidmj 9y ago
  Flights get canceled entirely for much more mundane reasons, such as storms or maintenance issues. If you truly need to be somewhere tomorrow, you need to plan for those cases, which are quite a bit more frequent than this one. As for your scenario, ask for a volunteer to get bumped instead, and incentivize them as necessary.
  - s73ver 9y ago
    Why should I have to do the airlines work for them?
  - tigershark 9y ago
    Ah so now it's up to the passenger to solve the problem for united finding a volunteer. I propose also that you should give them your a*se in case they ask for it. As for the cancellation if instead of the wedding there was a funeral you would ask the deceased to schedule better his own death I guess. It's really astonishing how there are people perfectly willing to give away all their rights while thanking for it with a smile.

mbesto 9y ago

Except it's not. You've just set a precedent that would invariably become way more expensive in aggregate.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

mkhpalm 9y ago

Lets also not forget to note that United's way of handling the situation after it went viral was to dig up dirt and defame Dao. I couldn't believe what I was hearing regarding unrelated personal past issues Dao had that were suddenly being broadcast by main stream media.