5 ms·

I agree, I live in Toronto and I have been working exclusively for US based companies because of this. Good Canadian companies offer a maximum of 120k CAD entr

I agree, I live in Toronto and I have been working exclusively for US based companies because of this. Good Canadian companies offer a maximum of 120k CAD entry salary if you are very experienced, that is 90k USD and taxes are pretty high in Canada. It makes no sense for me to accept work here, thankfully I know a couple of uncommon and old school languages that have kept me employed as a remote developer.

huangc10 10y ago
Interesting... Can you elaborate on said old school languages?
- latenightcoding 10y ago
  Ok here it goes... Perl. I am on my early 20s, but most of my co-workers are hardcore unix hackers in their 40s or 50s, so the pay is definitely good. And no I'm not working on hacky codebases from the 90s, I mostly work for companies that use "Modern Perl".
  - huangc10 10y ago
    dude awesome! I love Perl. I use to do a lot of scripting in Perl for my old job. Good to know this information. Question, are you guys at Perl 6 or not yet?
    - latenightcoding 10y ago
      Not yet!
dgudkov 10y ago
For the full picture it's worth mentioning that weak CAD also means less expenses when converted to USD. Also basic health insurance is already paid with taxes. But it still doesn't compensate the difference.
- aanm1988 10y ago
  > CAD also means less expenses when converted to USD Many things are more expensive because of the weak dollar.
  - RandomInteger4 10y ago
    I don't think you understand how outrageously overpriced our medical system is in the United States.
    - eigenvector 10y ago
      I don't think you understand that Canadians pay out of pocket for many non-emergency medical services that are 100% covered by the gold-plated health plans offered by Google, Facebook, etc. Dental, prescriptions, eye tests, rehabilitation and physical therapy, hell even an ambulance ride - all NOT covered by the Canadian "universal" medical system.
      - pkaye 10y ago
        Don't employers in Canada give out some kind of supplemental insurance plans to cover these benefits?
        jat850 10y ago
        With accompanying payment structures and caps, yes.
        eigenvector 10y ago
        Most do. But companies that are stingy with compensation are stingy with all forms of compensation. Supplemental medical benefits at low-paying Toronto tech jobs don't match the top companies in Silicon Valley, so a Toronto tech worker could easily spend more out of pocket for medical than one in San Francisco.
      - TurningCanadian 10y ago
Clobbersmith 10y ago
Taxes in California are comparable to taxes in Ontario.
- Naritai 10y ago
  State/Provincial income tax appear to be similar, yes. But Canadian federal tax is higher, and Ontario sales tax (HST) is a gag-inducing 13%. If you think Ontarioans are ok with that sales tax, just check out any outlet mall in Buffalo on a Saturday. A more useful comparison would be the 'effective tax rate', which of course varies by individual situation but can be done for some archetypes. This would allow you to consider additional deductions such as the mortgage interest deduction, which shouldn't be underestimated.
- amscanne 10y ago
  Not at all. At ~170k USD (220k CAD) in Ontario, you'll be hitting the combined top marginal rate of 54%. It's true that California+Federal will be within a couple points of that at their top marginal rate, but that's 1m+ in California and 400k+ federally. So you won't even be within spitting distance until 400k+. In California at ~170k USD you'll only be paying a combined marginal rate of ~37%, which is a huge difference. The brackets are lower all the way up, so you pay way less overall even if you do hit 1m+. And although payroll taxes are a bit more in the US AFAIK, Canada has higher sales taxes and lots of other hidden costs (e.g. much higher gas tax, more expensive consumer goods due to import duties, etc.).
  - flamedoge 9y ago
    you'd have better argument with effective tax rate.
    - amscanne 9y ago
      The effective rate is much lower, and I indicated as much: > The brackets are lower all the way up, so you pay way less overall even if you do hit 1m+. I'm not going to do the math for a specific example though, people should do that themselves.

huangc10 10y ago

Interesting... Can you elaborate on said old school languages?

latenightcoding 10y ago
Ok here it goes... Perl. I am on my early 20s, but most of my co-workers are hardcore unix hackers in their 40s or 50s, so the pay is definitely good. And no I'm not working on hacky codebases from the 90s, I mostly work for companies that use "Modern Perl".
- huangc10 10y ago
  dude awesome! I love Perl. I use to do a lot of scripting in Perl for my old job. Good to know this information. Question, are you guys at Perl 6 or not yet?
  - latenightcoding 10y ago
    Not yet!

dgudkov 10y ago

For the full picture it's worth mentioning that weak CAD also means less expenses when converted to USD. Also basic health insurance is already paid with taxes. But it still doesn't compensate the difference.

aanm1988 10y ago
> CAD also means less expenses when converted to USD Many things are more expensive because of the weak dollar.
- RandomInteger4 10y ago
  I don't think you understand how outrageously overpriced our medical system is in the United States.
  - eigenvector 10y ago
    I don't think you understand that Canadians pay out of pocket for many non-emergency medical services that are 100% covered by the gold-plated health plans offered by Google, Facebook, etc. Dental, prescriptions, eye tests, rehabilitation and physical therapy, hell even an ambulance ride - all NOT covered by the Canadian "universal" medical system.
    - pkaye 10y ago
      Don't employers in Canada give out some kind of supplemental insurance plans to cover these benefits?
      - jat850 10y ago
        With accompanying payment structures and caps, yes.
      - eigenvector 10y ago
        Most do. But companies that are stingy with compensation are stingy with all forms of compensation. Supplemental medical benefits at low-paying Toronto tech jobs don't match the top companies in Silicon Valley, so a Toronto tech worker could easily spend more out of pocket for medical than one in San Francisco.
    - TurningCanadian 10y ago

Clobbersmith 10y ago

Taxes in California are comparable to taxes in Ontario.

Naritai 10y ago
State/Provincial income tax appear to be similar, yes. But Canadian federal tax is higher, and Ontario sales tax (HST) is a gag-inducing 13%. If you think Ontarioans are ok with that sales tax, just check out any outlet mall in Buffalo on a Saturday. A more useful comparison would be the 'effective tax rate', which of course varies by individual situation but can be done for some archetypes. This would allow you to consider additional deductions such as the mortgage interest deduction, which shouldn't be underestimated.
amscanne 10y ago
Not at all. At ~170k USD (220k CAD) in Ontario, you'll be hitting the combined top marginal rate of 54%. It's true that California+Federal will be within a couple points of that at their top marginal rate, but that's 1m+ in California and 400k+ federally. So you won't even be within spitting distance until 400k+. In California at ~170k USD you'll only be paying a combined marginal rate of ~37%, which is a huge difference. The brackets are lower all the way up, so you pay way less overall even if you do hit 1m+. And although payroll taxes are a bit more in the US AFAIK, Canada has higher sales taxes and lots of other hidden costs (e.g. much higher gas tax, more expensive consumer goods due to import duties, etc.).
- flamedoge 9y ago
  you'd have better argument with effective tax rate.
  - amscanne 9y ago
    The effective rate is much lower, and I indicated as much: > The brackets are lower all the way up, so you pay way less overall even if you do hit 1m+. I'm not going to do the math for a specific example though, people should do that themselves.