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Apple's Tim Cook: We really care about pro users

46 points by gerosan 10y ago

vile 10y ago
Any man who must say "I am the King", is no true King at all.
megablast 10y ago
Why is it so easy for everyone else to see an issue, and not any decision makers inside Apple. Is it just too huge of a task to keep these machines updated, and Apple are deploying staff in other areas they see as more important?
- TillE 10y ago
  I really can't think of a single good reason why they don't do a simple hardware refresh of the Mac Pro every year. It's the easiest thing in the world, and would fix about 80% of the frustration. Apple just seems completely allergic to doing an upgrade without some major new design and a flashy rollout.
  - ethbro 10y ago
    Because the concept of hardware specs is alien to most designers? Why would people buy a new thing that performed better if it still looked the same?
    - bfred_it 10y ago
      What are you talking about? Apple has been doing exactly that since the iPhone 3GS pretty successfully.
      - ethbro 10y ago
        The iPhone is the last Apple product I'd use to prove that point, given that they've tinkered with the exterior design every generation (and sometimes even within generations)? http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/9/6125849/iphone-history-pictures http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/9/6125849/iphone-history-pict...
tedivm 10y ago
> "You will see us do more in the pro area. The pro area is very important to us. The creative area is very important to us in particular. Don't think that something we've done or something we're doing that isn't visible yet is a signal that our priorities are elsewhere. It's very, very important to us." Cook has been hanging around with Trump too much, as he's actually starting to sound like him.
- jlarocco 10y ago
  Haha, I hate to make a comment like this, but once you pointed it out, I can't read it without reading it in Trump's voice. More on topic, I think Apple is already losing a lot of "pro" users just by not doing anything exciting with their MBPs and desktops. The current lineup is overpriced and under powered, and if I needed a new machine right now, I wouldn't go with Apple. Maybe that will change before I need to replace my 2013 MBP, but I'm not holding my breath.
  - pirocks 10y ago
    To be fair there lineup has always been overpriced and under-powered from specs to price perspective.
    - Jtsummers 10y ago
      Not always, at least from 2006-2010 there were few Windows laptops that were comparable on both specs and price (could get the specs for more, or the price with reduced specs). I stopped comparing them after that though, these days I'm inclined to agree but I'm pretty much sold on the platform thanks to a few pieces of software I don't want to give up yet.
    - gurkendoktor 10y ago
      Not if you consider size, battery life etc. part of the spec. The Mac Mini was competitive in 2011/2012, especially if you let an authorised repair shop install a second drive on the cheap.
- aanm1988 10y ago
baobrain 10y ago
If they really cared about pro users, then the mac pro would not have been sitting for years without a refresh. Edit: accuracy
jonjenk 10y ago
This is a joke. The latest MacBook Pro redesign is an affront to pro users. At our hardware/software startup the new MacBooks are unusable due to the limitations of the USB-C ports. Our engineers refuse to engage in the dongle shenanigans necessary to get these computers to work with the displays and the other peripherals necessary to do their jobs. We just purchased several of the old MacBook Pros to make sure we have enough for new hires and interns arriving this summer. Apple cares about Pros? Heh.
- zimzam 10y ago
  Your engineers are unwilling to use a dongle to connect to a monitor? Something that is so trivial to set up once and never deal with again sounds more like an attitude problem than a technical one.
  - strict9 10y ago
    "set up once and never deal with again ..." maybe you bought a laptop that stays in the exact same position and location for the foreseeable future. for those who use it in more than one place, it's more than a minor annoyance.
    - scentedmeat 10y ago
      The monitor doesn't go anywhere. Just leave the dongle.
      - robert_foss 10y ago
        Yes, get a dongle for every possible monitor you'll ever connect to.
        salesguy222 10y ago
        hey this sounds like a great way to increase revenue AND profit! thanks!! i'm taking this nugget of an idea to Daddy Warren!!
meesterdude 10y ago
I'll believe it when I see it, but it's been trending for the last few years away from the pro users; I won't hold my breath.
GiorgioG 10y ago
Too late. I'm back to a PC for my day-to-day dev and I don't plan on looking back.
- digitalsushi 10y ago
  I went back to a PC this past December after a 16 year, 4 apple laptop stint. But in another four years, I will check back in and maybe try it again. I'm not gonna disown them cause they didn't make the fenders flare out enough this year.
GreaterFool 10y ago
There's nothing Pro about new Macbook Pro, but I like it. I only write code so all I need is browser and terminal. I don't mind sacrificing some built-in battery life for an option to use external battery via USB-C. Overall I think it's pretty good for programming. That said, I don't care about the touch bar. It hasn't made my life substantially worse but I find it quite useless. I wish there was a 15" model without the touch bar. But yeah, there's nothing Pro about Apple anymore.
- brokenmachine 10y ago
  Yes, no escape key and no function keys clearly demonstrates that the Macbook Pro is not a Pro laptop.
mcphage 10y ago
To quote the old storytelling maxim, "Show, don't tell".
- halostatue 10y ago
  Which is what Apple does: they are having to tell something because their practice is to only show when they are ready. They are getting enough pressure from impatient people that simply showing when ready is insufficient. Apple doesn’t do vapourware launches (for the most part).
  - brokenmachine 10y ago
    This story is about Apple telling, not showing.
    - halostatue 10y ago
      Which is what I said. Apple is having to tell because there are people, including investors, who are impatient enough to force Apple’s hand, which would be to show later this year.
      - brokenmachine 10y ago
        ...So they are not following the old storytelling maxim of "Show, don't tell". They are telling with no showing (yet).
awalton 10y ago
...then act like it? Update your desktop Macs, e.g.
einarvollset 10y ago
Bigly
nice_byte 10y ago
Lies. If they did, OS X window management wouldn't be in the shape it is in today.
schuke 10y ago
Maybe it's just me. But this sounds like Trump.
yeskia 10y ago
They missed April 1st by a month.
mastazi 10y ago
I know it is a wild dream but if they just made a lineup of motherboards it would be so awesome for people in the Workstation/HPC[1] space. Imagine being able to mount your 4X Teslas onto your shiny new Apple dual-Xeon motherboard. Oh, and RGB fans ;-) [1](HPC = high performance computing)
- dragonshed 10y ago
  I sincerely applaud your dream here, but 'wild' just isn't adequate. Having looked at setting up Hackintoshes, I can tell you Apple is nowhere near where it would need to be to enable/support an enthusiast market.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- lykron 10y ago
  Nothing you describe hasn't already been done by others.
mdotk 10y ago
Well he's hardly going to say they don't.
eyko 10y ago
And like anyone who's lying, he finished his sentence with an unconvincing "Trust me." Cook should know that pro users don't care about talk, we care about action. This comes across like a Trump speech ("nobody cares more about pro users than us, believe me")
- dang 10y ago
  > And like anyone who's lying Please don't sling inflammatory accusations without evidence—it degrades discussion. Your being unconvinced is not evidence.
- johnsmith21006 10y ago
  Totally agree on the comparison to Trump. Thought this for a while and never said it. Interesting see the same. Listen to an earnings call. But the biggest was when TC went on CNBC Cramer and insisted China was going great to find out China was a disaster. The other was during quiet time he ended up taking a tour of the trading floor right next to were CNBC was broadcasting live. They were like Tim why are here? He said he was talking a tour with his nephew. Tim went on and on how the AirPods are the biggest product Apple has ever had.

46 points by gerosan 10y ago

vile 10y ago

Any man who must say "I am the King", is no true King at all.

Why is it so easy for everyone else to see an issue, and not any decision makers inside Apple. Is it just too huge of a task to keep these machines updated, and Apple are deploying staff in other areas they see as more important?

TillE 10y ago
I really can't think of a single good reason why they don't do a simple hardware refresh of the Mac Pro every year. It's the easiest thing in the world, and would fix about 80% of the frustration. Apple just seems completely allergic to doing an upgrade without some major new design and a flashy rollout.
- ethbro 10y ago
  Because the concept of hardware specs is alien to most designers? Why would people buy a new thing that performed better if it still looked the same?
  - bfred_it 10y ago
    What are you talking about? Apple has been doing exactly that since the iPhone 3GS pretty successfully.
    - ethbro 10y ago
      The iPhone is the last Apple product I'd use to prove that point, given that they've tinkered with the exterior design every generation (and sometimes even within generations)? http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/9/6125849/iphone-history-pictures http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/9/6125849/iphone-history-pict...

tedivm 10y ago

> "You will see us do more in the pro area. The pro area is very important to us. The creative area is very important to us in particular. Don't think that something we've done or something we're doing that isn't visible yet is a signal that our priorities are elsewhere. It's very, very important to us." Cook has been hanging around with Trump too much, as he's actually starting to sound like him.

jlarocco 10y ago
Haha, I hate to make a comment like this, but once you pointed it out, I can't read it without reading it in Trump's voice. More on topic, I think Apple is already losing a lot of "pro" users just by not doing anything exciting with their MBPs and desktops. The current lineup is overpriced and under powered, and if I needed a new machine right now, I wouldn't go with Apple. Maybe that will change before I need to replace my 2013 MBP, but I'm not holding my breath.
- pirocks 10y ago
  To be fair there lineup has always been overpriced and under-powered from specs to price perspective.
  - Jtsummers 10y ago
    Not always, at least from 2006-2010 there were few Windows laptops that were comparable on both specs and price (could get the specs for more, or the price with reduced specs). I stopped comparing them after that though, these days I'm inclined to agree but I'm pretty much sold on the platform thanks to a few pieces of software I don't want to give up yet.
  - gurkendoktor 10y ago
    Not if you consider size, battery life etc. part of the spec. The Mac Mini was competitive in 2011/2012, especially if you let an authorised repair shop install a second drive on the cheap.
aanm1988 10y ago

baobrain 10y ago

If they really cared about pro users, then the mac pro would not have been sitting for years without a refresh. Edit: accuracy

jonjenk 10y ago

This is a joke. The latest MacBook Pro redesign is an affront to pro users. At our hardware/software startup the new MacBooks are unusable due to the limitations of the USB-C ports. Our engineers refuse to engage in the dongle shenanigans necessary to get these computers to work with the displays and the other peripherals necessary to do their jobs. We just purchased several of the old MacBook Pros to make sure we have enough for new hires and interns arriving this summer. Apple cares about Pros? Heh.

zimzam 10y ago
Your engineers are unwilling to use a dongle to connect to a monitor? Something that is so trivial to set up once and never deal with again sounds more like an attitude problem than a technical one.
- strict9 10y ago
  "set up once and never deal with again ..." maybe you bought a laptop that stays in the exact same position and location for the foreseeable future. for those who use it in more than one place, it's more than a minor annoyance.
  - scentedmeat 10y ago
    The monitor doesn't go anywhere. Just leave the dongle.
    - robert_foss 10y ago
      Yes, get a dongle for every possible monitor you'll ever connect to.
      - salesguy222 10y ago
        hey this sounds like a great way to increase revenue AND profit! thanks!! i'm taking this nugget of an idea to Daddy Warren!!

meesterdude 10y ago

I'll believe it when I see it, but it's been trending for the last few years away from the pro users; I won't hold my breath.

GiorgioG 10y ago

Too late. I'm back to a PC for my day-to-day dev and I don't plan on looking back.

digitalsushi 10y ago
I went back to a PC this past December after a 16 year, 4 apple laptop stint. But in another four years, I will check back in and maybe try it again. I'm not gonna disown them cause they didn't make the fenders flare out enough this year.

GreaterFool 10y ago

There's nothing Pro about new Macbook Pro, but I like it. I only write code so all I need is browser and terminal. I don't mind sacrificing some built-in battery life for an option to use external battery via USB-C. Overall I think it's pretty good for programming. That said, I don't care about the touch bar. It hasn't made my life substantially worse but I find it quite useless. I wish there was a 15" model without the touch bar. But yeah, there's nothing Pro about Apple anymore.

brokenmachine 10y ago
Yes, no escape key and no function keys clearly demonstrates that the Macbook Pro is not a Pro laptop.

mcphage 10y ago

To quote the old storytelling maxim, "Show, don't tell".

halostatue 10y ago
Which is what Apple does: they are having to tell something because their practice is to only show when they are ready. They are getting enough pressure from impatient people that simply showing when ready is insufficient. Apple doesn’t do vapourware launches (for the most part).
- brokenmachine 10y ago
  This story is about Apple telling, not showing.
  - halostatue 10y ago
    Which is what I said. Apple is having to tell because there are people, including investors, who are impatient enough to force Apple’s hand, which would be to show later this year.
    - brokenmachine 10y ago
      ...So they are not following the old storytelling maxim of "Show, don't tell". They are telling with no showing (yet).

awalton 10y ago

...then act like it? Update your desktop Macs, e.g.

einarvollset 10y ago

Bigly

nice_byte 10y ago

Lies. If they did, OS X window management wouldn't be in the shape it is in today.

schuke 10y ago

Maybe it's just me. But this sounds like Trump.

yeskia 10y ago

They missed April 1st by a month.

mastazi 10y ago

I know it is a wild dream but if they just made a lineup of motherboards it would be so awesome for people in the Workstation/HPC[1] space. Imagine being able to mount your 4X Teslas onto your shiny new Apple dual-Xeon motherboard. Oh, and RGB fans ;-) [1](HPC = high performance computing)

dragonshed 10y ago
I sincerely applaud your dream here, but 'wild' just isn't adequate. Having looked at setting up Hackintoshes, I can tell you Apple is nowhere near where it would need to be to enable/support an enthusiast market.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
lykron 10y ago
Nothing you describe hasn't already been done by others.

mdotk 10y ago

Well he's hardly going to say they don't.

eyko 10y ago

And like anyone who's lying, he finished his sentence with an unconvincing "Trust me." Cook should know that pro users don't care about talk, we care about action. This comes across like a Trump speech ("nobody cares more about pro users than us, believe me")

dang 10y ago
> And like anyone who's lying Please don't sling inflammatory accusations without evidence—it degrades discussion. Your being unconvinced is not evidence.
johnsmith21006 10y ago
Totally agree on the comparison to Trump. Thought this for a while and never said it. Interesting see the same. Listen to an earnings call. But the biggest was when TC went on CNBC Cramer and insisted China was going great to find out China was a disaster. The other was during quiet time he ended up taking a tour of the trading floor right next to were CNBC was broadcasting live. They were like Tim why are here? He said he was talking a tour with his nephew. Tim went on and on how the AirPods are the biggest product Apple has ever had.