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Fake Steve Jobs: Why I'm Switching to Android

175 points by recampbell 16y ago

raganwald 16y ago
This article is actually by Daniel Lyons. It's true that Daniel also writes parody articles as FSJ, but this is not one of them.
- ryandvm 16y ago
  Man, Fake Steve Jobs is going to be pissed about this article.
  - raganwald 16y ago
    To be perfectly honest, while there's nothing wrong with the article, after reading the title I was looking forward with a certain amount of evil glee to find out exactly what FSJ was going to say about switching to Android. Nothing against Daniel, but his reasons are far less entertaining than FSJ's would have been.
    - redrobot5050 16y ago
      Agreed. Speed Increase? More Multi-tasking? Better Web Browsing? iPhone OS 4.0 has all of that. And it's release date is likely to be announced June 7th. Now the dropped calls thing, I can't comment on. AT&T in my area is actually great. 3G rolled out EARLY where I'm at. And I've been tethering since December of 2009.
      - commandar 16y ago
        >More Multi-tasking? [...] iPhone OS 4.0 has all of that. If you mean an implementation that's still more hamstrung than Android's, sure.
        redrobot5050 16y ago
        As long as I don't have to worry about rogue background processes (like widgets) eating up my battery life, then yes.
- sabat 16y ago
  The use of FSJ's name in the title was just for convenience, I think. Many here would know who FSJ is, but many fewer would have heard of Daniel Lyons.
es3754 16y ago
If there's a 30 day backorder on the HTC Incredible you might as well check out the HTC EVO when it hits the streets on June 4th.
- runevault 16y ago
  Unless you don't want to be on Sprint of course. Some people really want to be on Verizon.
  - tptacek 16y ago
    I will never, ever do business with Sprint again, after I cancelled my phone service (twice!), threw out my phone, and they mysteriously re-activated the account a few months later, silently accrued an account balance with late fees, and then reported me to collections.
    - jrockway 16y ago
      I'm sure there's a story like this for every large company in existence.
      - ekanes 16y ago
        Absolutely, but the question is how frequent they happen. Are they business-as-usual, or a gross anomaly. When it happens to enough people, and those people tell their friends, the brand erodes.
    - aschobel 16y ago
      The Plural of Anecdote is Not Data
      - tptacek 16y ago
        Yes, But I'm Not Sure What Your Point Is.
        deleted 16y ago
junklight 16y ago
while all the commentators and media are wetting their pants about who has landed what blow on who I can't help feeling that the real winners are going to be us users. Apple will lose if they don't respond - and it would seem likely that they will be forced to add some of these features - streaming from my media library being one I would particularly like. Keep landing those killer blows guys and making your products better and better! (mind you I have horrible suspicion that I will end up with devices from both camps - if the production android pad is cool will almost certainly buy one as well as an ipad)
- roc 16y ago
  The competition is great for the users. The only bad thing is the war of words from either side that insults the intelligence of the readers.
  - s3graham 16y ago
    Agreed. The features and progress demonstrated in Android was great, but the continuous "open blah blah" and snide Apple-Flash-whatever 'jokes' were tiring and lame. Did they really think they wouldn't get media coverage pointing out the obvious comparisons if they just demo'd and explained rather than explicitly mocking?
- zmmmmm 16y ago
  I actually wonder how Apple will respond. Part of the reason for Steve Jobs' genius is that he single mindedly believes in his own vision of what users want and what the world should be like. And the problem with that is that although he's mostly right he's always at last partly wrong. So he'll try to respond by moving his platform closer to his own preconceived idea of perfection which is actually partly wrong. In other words, I wonder if one of Apple's fatal flaws is that they aren't capable of responding in a competitive firefight the way a company with less idealism would.
lukifer 16y ago
I'm getting really tired of reading hacky comparisons of iPhone vs Android to Mac vs Windows. For one thing, there is not a huge price discrepancy in the smartphone space the way there was on the desktop in the 80s and 90s, when Macs tended to carry a 2-3x markup. There isn't the problem of too few games on the platform; Apple currently has the advantage here, though obviously not forever. And despite Apple's willingness to piss off devs, I would say Apple is still providing more tools and support to developers than they ever did when the Mac was fighting for survival. Windows also had an advantage of a write-once, run-anywhere software ecosystem. Other than different screen sizes, or perhaps graphic cards for games, you could expect a consistent mouse-keyboard-screen interface. Android has to account for lots of little differences in hardware form factors and feature sets, and the onus is on Android devs to manage these, which was seldom an issue for Windows devs. Mac vs. Windows was last generation's technology battle, and it's long over. We're now in uncharted territory.
- netcan 16y ago
  Another difference that is not to be ignored is that Windows was the backbone of one of the best businesses of the decade, maybe the best. Android is like a side project. They aren't going to fight for it like Apple will.
  - jokermatt999 16y ago
    Good point on your first sentence, but I disagree with the second. From the keynote they put on yesterday, Google has made it clear that they'll put a ton of effort and innovation in. They basically called out Apple the entire time. Apple has dominance now because of their huge head start and loyal fan base, but it's looking like Google is quickly overtaking them in innovation and features. Apple will always retain a loyal fan base, but I think they're going to need to step up in adding new features to avoid losing more customers to Android, and that's without considering the factor of people getting annoyed at Apple's paternalist (or "draconian") philosophy.
    - bonaldi 16y ago
      "but it's looking like Google is quickly overtaking them in innovation and features" Such as? The announcements yesterday looked as though they'd finally caught up to iPhone 3.0, including the huge cheer for "Update All".
edw519 16y ago
1980: CPM on your choice of hardware or lock into Apple hardware & software at a higher price. 1990: DOS on your choice of hardware or lock into Apple hardware & software at a higher price. 2000: Windows on your choice of hardware or lock into Apple hardware & software at a higher price. 2010: Android on your choice of hardware or lock into Apple hardware & software at a higher price.
- macrael 16y ago
  The hardware lock in is the much less interesting of the two lock ins you mention. Regardless of which platform you use, you are locking yourself to the software much more than to the hardware.
  - wwortiz 16y ago
    I think it is more of a case of the software locking you to the hardware for apples case which is rather interesting now that the hardware, at least for Macs, is now pretty much standard hardware with regards to processors and such.
    - siglesias 16y ago
      Uh, battey tech? Trackpad? Everywhere you look on Apple products (if you are discerning) you'll see them utilizing the crap out of their hardware control. If I'm not mistaken we're about to see Apple turn up the heat on further hardware differentiation on notebooks to take advantage of their multi-touch gesture patent portfolio, perhaps by elongating the glass trackpad. On the iPhone front I'm guessing that Apple's custom silicon will allow them to get raw graphics performance while simultaneously preserving battery life. Logically this is kind of technology that Google, without control over hardware, is powerless to compete against.
      - wwortiz 16y ago
        Does apple not support their older notebooks with new OS upgrades like tiger to leopard? If they do support them then I see no real reason why hardware cannot innovate with respect to android in a similar way and still provide support to older hardware styles just as new OS versions do.
byrneseyeview 16y ago
Here's Daniel Lyons on why the Zune has a shot (in early 2008): http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2008/0128/053.html http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2008/0128/053.html
- notauser 16y ago
  He also thought SCO would win, with such prophetic headlines as "What SCO Wants, SCO Gets." I'm pretty confident in the future of Android, but a positive prediction from Lyons is one of the few things that could cause me to reconsider my opinion! ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Lyons http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Lyons )
- hyperbovine 16y ago
  I guess am in the minority here of people who have actually used a Zune (HD, completely by accident, woke up on the floor of a Zune product manager's sweet apt in downtown Seattle while visiting a friend, long story.) I've got to say, I was impressed. Screen looked amazing, device is smaller and more responsive than an iPhone. The browser was sort of lame but you could just put Opera on it, no? Anyways, it's true that Zune is getting trounced, but if Apple continues to piss people off and there are alternatives that are actually a pleasure to use, that may change.
  - commandar 16y ago
    The Zune is a great device. The biggest problem is that the Zune desktop software is pretty much nothing more than a skin over WMP, and can't even begin to compete with iTunes for library management. I say this as somebody that's owned both iPods and Zunes. The actual hardware experience was better with the Zune, in my book, but the iPod blows it away on the software side.
- wisty 16y ago
  He didn't really say the Zune had a shot. He just said that the new Zune was a good alternative, and didn't suck like the previous generation. He noted that most iPod owners were already locked-in by their libraries. His closing line: "Microsoft, you've got your work cut out for you."
rimantas 16y ago
It would be interesting to see how he will write about coming back to iPhone when he realizes there are things more important than Flash. Comments how Apple is chasing Google because of something Android will do is also amusing.
- buster 16y ago
  Now, you are in denial ;)
  - rimantas 16y ago
    Yes, I am in denial that Flash is essential feature: I have flashblock extension on my Chrome and Click2flash on Safari.
    - buster 16y ago
      so you still have it installed, right? strange!
      - rimantas 16y ago
        There is a news for you: it comes preinstalled on OS X.
        buster 16y ago
        that's even funnier
        not_an_alien 16y ago
        Here's some news: you've chosen to install something that selectively blocks the plugin (thus allowing you to still use it) instead of uninstalling it, something you can do. That's because you like choice; the freedom to run Flash when you want, something you don't have in the iDevices.
        16y ago
noelchurchill 16y ago
Does this also mean that Android is destined to be as disliked as Windows, with all the problems that come along with being compatible with some many devices from so many different manufacturers?
- phernandez 16y ago
  I think a better comparison, is to linux - since it really is a linux kernel underneath, and it is open source. Linux has plenty of flaws, especially with hardware, but anyone can take the code and try and improve it, then contribute back to the main code base. The cyanogenmod is an example of this.
- wwortiz 16y ago
  I think it will be okay as long as updates are continually released and those updates are supported by the carriers because phones have a rather fast rate of adoption considering many people do the two year contract and phone upgrade cycle.
  - noelchurchill 16y ago
    That's true. Windows is burdened by the fleets of corporate computers running all kinds of proprietary business software, and it must maintain backwards compatibility. Phones get replaced every two years or so, so there won't be much legacy support issues.
    - cpr 16y ago
      Once people load up their phones with dozens of apps, especially business-critical ones, there'll be a lot of pressure to only buy a new phone that will still run those apps.
- barake 16y ago
  Handset makers such as HTC and Motorola check that Android works as it should, and fix anything broken before releasing updates to users. Carriers may also be involved in this process. Also there are much fewer hardware combos to support. Windows PCs would work better if Dell (or whoever) made sure every update worked 100% and you couldn't install new components after purchase. As things stand now it is impossible to test Windows updates on even a fraction of the hardware configurations out there.
Ionic_Walrus 16y ago
Why do you want to use your phone as a wifi hotspot ? It'll drain the battery. The telco's in the US are the worst of the lot. Android and iPhone are 2 great platforms, Im happy that both are here.
- doki_pen 16y ago
  I tether it via usb. It charges as it tethers.
  - redrobot5050 16y ago
    Then why not use the USB connection as the data connection like you can do with an iPhone? Or use Bluetooth?
- jonknee 16y ago
  > Why do you want to use your phone as a wifi hotspot? It'll drain the battery. To have internet access on your laptop when no other source is available... 3G isn't the fastest, but it's secure and available pretty much wherever you are. As for the battery just plug it into the laptop or because you're using an Android phone, pop in your spare battery after you've gotten your work done.
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]
- hboon 16y ago
  I'd love to tether my phone, which I have a data plan for to my iPad (wifi-only). I don't bring my iPad out that much, that long, but when I do, occasionally, it will be great to have internet access when I want to. If I wasn't an iPhone app developer, I would mostly likely switch to an Android phone in a blink of an eye. And I have an Android G1 dev phone.
- SoftwareMaven 16y ago
  I do it all the time on my iPhone (though usually I use blue tooth). It allows my laptop and my daughter's iPod Touch to get connected when they otherwise couldn't.
tyohn 16y ago
You know what I kind of like about this post? - before such a post on YC would have been bashed by Apple fan boys... but now after Apple's policy pigeon holed and alienated developers - I'm starting to see a real conversation about some of Apple's issues...
- tvon 16y ago
  I'm glad enough people agree with you that you don't feel the need to play the fanboy card.
  - tyohn 16y ago
    Feeling a little touchy? :)
    - raganwald 16y ago
      If I were to write "Ad Hominum much?" how would you feel? Annoyed at me? Certain labels and ways of phrasing things tend to provoke people and lower the quality of discourse.
      - tyohn 16y ago
        I agree with you - I didn't add much to the quality of discourse. I just feel like I need to walk on pins and needles here (YC) when I want to voice my opinion about Steve Jobs and Apple. It's almost like I'm drawing a picture of Muhammad...
kylemathews 16y ago
Wow, the backlash is in full swing.
- elblanco 16y ago
  Love easily turns into hate.
Qz 16y ago
The article picture, sadly, pushes me towards iPhone (not that I would ever buy one). The iPhone screen seems crisper, the colors are brighter, and the interface looks spiffier. Obviously there are other factors at play, but first impressions count for a lot.
- sandipc 16y ago
  check out the nexus one or droid incredible screens for a good iphone comparison...
  - deleted 16y ago
    [deleted]
  - Qz 16y ago
    I mean I believe there are better screens on other phones, but if the title of the article is 'Why I'm switching to Android', then the picture damn well better make me want to switch too, otherwise the credibility of the whole article is shot before I even read a word.
nlanier 16y ago
I just want to take this opportunity to say that I love my Nexus One. I don't care if Google "failed" as a marketer/distributor of the device. When I put it side by side with an iPhone I can't even fathom wanting an iPhone. In fact, you couldn't pay me to switch. Kudos, Google. Kudos.
nanexcool 16y ago
I'd buy an Android phone if they were available in Mexico. In the meantime, I have an iPhone and I like it.
ethan 16y ago
>Froyo also will let you buy songs over the air and download them directly to your phone. Nice, now if only Android could make a decent music player...
- theBobMcCormick 16y ago
  Part of the beauty of Android is that you're not stuck using the music play that comes with your phone. There are many, many music players to choose from in the Android Market. I'm currently fond of MixZing (http://www.appbrain.com/app/com.mixzing.basic http://www.appbrain.com/app/com.mixzing.basic), but Cubed (http://www.appbrain.com/app/org.abrantix.rockon.rockonnggl http://www.appbrain.com/app/org.abrantix.rockon.rockonnggl) seems to be rising rapidly in popularity. There's even btunes (http://www.appbrain.com/app/com.bmayers.bTunesRelease http://www.appbrain.com/app/com.bmayers.bTunesRelease) for all the ex-iphone users out there. :-) Not to mention of course all the streaming apps like Pandora, LastFM, GrooveShark etc.
  - raganwald 16y ago
    > Part of the beauty of Android is that you're not stuck using the music play that comes with your phone. Apropos of nothing at all, this reminds me of the argument for there being so many incompatible flavours (ahem) of Lisp.
    - theBobMcCormick 16y ago
      I think this is a little different. There's a huge advantage to developing a common ecosystem around a programming language. For a music player application... hmm not so much.
  - joubert 16y ago
    With what do all these apps sync with on your laptop?
    - jarek 16y ago
      Doubletwist?
ynniv 16y ago
Why is Lyons so bitter? His arguments revolve around Android having more "features" and otherwise being an iPhone knockoff. The features debate is old and boring - maybe he cares, but I don't and I suspect that most iPhone buyers don't either. And as developers, why should we be excited at a knockoff? Do we need to punish Apple for being successful? Unlike Microsoft, Apple has not tried to force people to run its OS. And if Apple stops innovating the phone market, I don't see Google stepping up as a replacement. Much as Microsoft did, I expect large market share to result in years of the same old crap. I understand that some people don't like the situation they are in, and I'm okay with that. But can we stop pretending that Apple is the evil empire? They make a great product, and you bought it. That's what companies are supposed to do.
- kenjackson 16y ago
  How can the features debate be old and boring when Froyo was just officially unveiled yesterday? It's a very relevant debate. And lets not give Apple too much credit. While the iPhone was best of breed it wasn't nearly the innovation that the GUI was or even WSIWYG word processing. It really felt like an evolution of the smart phone. A very well engineered product, but not the revolution that a lot of people seem think it was.
  - ynniv 16y ago
    How can the features debate be old and boring when Froyo was just officially unveiled yesterday? It's a very relevant debate. There's always something new... how does that make the discussion of "features" versus "execution" debate change? A very well engineered product, but not the revolution that a lot of people seem think it was. Precisely. The iPhone has been successful because they only included the good features. Competitors always talk about new features, or fewer dollars. To the average consumer, neither of those are as important as execution. Google will only make a better phone when they make a better phone.
- ergo98 16y ago
  >Why is Lyons so bitter? People who say that other people are bitter are usually just bitter. The guy is a technology columnist and he talks about technology. What a huge surprise. >And as developers, why should we be excited at a knockoff? Humorously just yesterday Daring Fireball and other Apple apologists were pointing out that Google bought Android long before Steve Jobs had his iPhone epiphany. But yes, the iPhone is a knockoff of Windows Mobile, and numerous other phones that came before. > Unlike Microsoft, Apple has not tried to force people to run its OS. What. A. Load. Of. Shit. Apple saw that they had a hit with the iPod and they hung onto "Mac only" for as long as they could, and remarkably it was fairly successful. It isn't accidental that iPhone development is Mac only. Apple does cross promotions with large brands to make iPhone applications, trying to build a world where not having an iPhone means a second tier world. Adobe's cross compiler was a huge threat to that. Apple is worse than Microsoft ever dreamed of being. They got by with it because they were cute and tiny, but that time has passed. They don't get the free pass any more. >I understand that some people don't like the situation they are in Sounds like you're the one that doesn't like the situation he's in. But I'm sure you'll come into all of these discussions to set people straight.
jsz0 16y ago
I love the competition but if I can present an alternative view: Why I'm sticking with the iPhone: I plug it into iTunes and it automatically syncs everything and backs up the device automatically. All my accessories work with the dock connector including my car. I can still get software updates for my 3 year old iPhone 2G. Music & media players are superior to Android in my opinion along with it simply being easier to sync content. I can play my Audible books on my iPhone. Couldn't live without those. It's easier to buy an iPhone. There's basically just one model or the hold-over model from last year. With Android phones I feel like there's always something better right around the corner. I feel compelled to research CPU speed, RAM/ROM size, and evaluate the differences in software. I don't care for the physical buttons on Android phones. I think it's jarring to switch between the touch-screen and menu/home/search/back buttons which incidentally seem to be arranged differently on most Android handsets. I think the iPhone still has a pretty big app advantage especially for games and multimedia.
- dannyr 16y ago
  " It's easier to buy an iPhone. There's basically just one model or the hold-over model from last year. With Android phones I feel like there's always something better right around the corner." Can't believe that lack of choice can ever be a good thing. It's like saying "It's easier to pick a job if the government is the only company to work for. If there are private companies/startups, I feel like I can work for another company that is better."
  - jasonwocky 16y ago
    "Can't believe that lack of choice can ever be a good thing." Google Tech Talk on the Paradox of Choice: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6127548813950043200# http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6127548813950043200#
  - ugh 16y ago
    I’m actually quite happy that I don’t have to decide how to assemble my pants. You rely on a myriad of choices other people make for you every day and I would guess you are quite happy that you don’t have to make all those choices by yourself. There is the architect who decided how the buildings you use every day should work and look. There is the designer who decided which line height the articles you are reading in your favorite magazine should have. Too much choice can be a very bad thing. It can be suffocating.
tomlin 16y ago
"It also will support Flash, something Apple refuses to do, mostly out of spite." Oh, so we're being honest about it now?
CamperBob 16y ago
He's looking more and more like Howard Hughes... I'm amazed more people aren't drawing that parallel. Any day now I expect Jobs to announce the construction of an unusually large and magical aircraft, made from the finest Chinese spruce.
starkfist 16y ago
He's kidding himself if he thinks Google with Android has better intentions than Apple. The guys who started Android did so with the sole intention of selling the company to Google. They did and cleaned up. As soon as he could, the CEO of Android removed himself from the project and now runs Google's venture arm. The founder of the original android company doesn't really give a shit about the product, and Google only cares about it because they want all the mobile ad money. It is a project with no soul. Fake Steve is wrong when he implies that Jobs is insincere about creating beautiful products and is just trying to lock people in. Even if the edicts and decrees often go haywire, if nothing else, Jobs and Apple believe their own bullshit.

175 points by recampbell 16y ago

This article is actually by Daniel Lyons. It's true that Daniel also writes parody articles as FSJ, but this is not one of them.

ryandvm 16y ago
Man, Fake Steve Jobs is going to be pissed about this article.
- raganwald 16y ago
  To be perfectly honest, while there's nothing wrong with the article, after reading the title I was looking forward with a certain amount of evil glee to find out exactly what FSJ was going to say about switching to Android. Nothing against Daniel, but his reasons are far less entertaining than FSJ's would have been.
  - redrobot5050 16y ago
    Agreed. Speed Increase? More Multi-tasking? Better Web Browsing? iPhone OS 4.0 has all of that. And it's release date is likely to be announced June 7th. Now the dropped calls thing, I can't comment on. AT&T in my area is actually great. 3G rolled out EARLY where I'm at. And I've been tethering since December of 2009.
    - commandar 16y ago
      >More Multi-tasking? [...] iPhone OS 4.0 has all of that. If you mean an implementation that's still more hamstrung than Android's, sure.
      - redrobot5050 16y ago
        As long as I don't have to worry about rogue background processes (like widgets) eating up my battery life, then yes.
sabat 16y ago
The use of FSJ's name in the title was just for convenience, I think. Many here would know who FSJ is, but many fewer would have heard of Daniel Lyons.

es3754 16y ago

If there's a 30 day backorder on the HTC Incredible you might as well check out the HTC EVO when it hits the streets on June 4th.

runevault 16y ago
Unless you don't want to be on Sprint of course. Some people really want to be on Verizon.
- tptacek 16y ago
  I will never, ever do business with Sprint again, after I cancelled my phone service (twice!), threw out my phone, and they mysteriously re-activated the account a few months later, silently accrued an account balance with late fees, and then reported me to collections.
  - jrockway 16y ago
    I'm sure there's a story like this for every large company in existence.
    - ekanes 16y ago
      Absolutely, but the question is how frequent they happen. Are they business-as-usual, or a gross anomaly. When it happens to enough people, and those people tell their friends, the brand erodes.
  - aschobel 16y ago
    The Plural of Anecdote is Not Data
    - tptacek 16y ago
      Yes, But I'm Not Sure What Your Point Is.
      - deleted 16y ago

junklight 16y ago

while all the commentators and media are wetting their pants about who has landed what blow on who I can't help feeling that the real winners are going to be us users. Apple will lose if they don't respond - and it would seem likely that they will be forced to add some of these features - streaming from my media library being one I would particularly like. Keep landing those killer blows guys and making your products better and better! (mind you I have horrible suspicion that I will end up with devices from both camps - if the production android pad is cool will almost certainly buy one as well as an ipad)

roc 16y ago
The competition is great for the users. The only bad thing is the war of words from either side that insults the intelligence of the readers.
- s3graham 16y ago
  Agreed. The features and progress demonstrated in Android was great, but the continuous "open blah blah" and snide Apple-Flash-whatever 'jokes' were tiring and lame. Did they really think they wouldn't get media coverage pointing out the obvious comparisons if they just demo'd and explained rather than explicitly mocking?
zmmmmm 16y ago
I actually wonder how Apple will respond. Part of the reason for Steve Jobs' genius is that he single mindedly believes in his own vision of what users want and what the world should be like. And the problem with that is that although he's mostly right he's always at last partly wrong. So he'll try to respond by moving his platform closer to his own preconceived idea of perfection which is actually partly wrong. In other words, I wonder if one of Apple's fatal flaws is that they aren't capable of responding in a competitive firefight the way a company with less idealism would.

lukifer 16y ago

I'm getting really tired of reading hacky comparisons of iPhone vs Android to Mac vs Windows. For one thing, there is not a huge price discrepancy in the smartphone space the way there was on the desktop in the 80s and 90s, when Macs tended to carry a 2-3x markup. There isn't the problem of too few games on the platform; Apple currently has the advantage here, though obviously not forever. And despite Apple's willingness to piss off devs, I would say Apple is still providing more tools and support to developers than they ever did when the Mac was fighting for survival. Windows also had an advantage of a write-once, run-anywhere software ecosystem. Other than different screen sizes, or perhaps graphic cards for games, you could expect a consistent mouse-keyboard-screen interface. Android has to account for lots of little differences in hardware form factors and feature sets, and the onus is on Android devs to manage these, which was seldom an issue for Windows devs. Mac vs. Windows was last generation's technology battle, and it's long over. We're now in uncharted territory.

netcan 16y ago
Another difference that is not to be ignored is that Windows was the backbone of one of the best businesses of the decade, maybe the best. Android is like a side project. They aren't going to fight for it like Apple will.
- jokermatt999 16y ago
  Good point on your first sentence, but I disagree with the second. From the keynote they put on yesterday, Google has made it clear that they'll put a ton of effort and innovation in. They basically called out Apple the entire time. Apple has dominance now because of their huge head start and loyal fan base, but it's looking like Google is quickly overtaking them in innovation and features. Apple will always retain a loyal fan base, but I think they're going to need to step up in adding new features to avoid losing more customers to Android, and that's without considering the factor of people getting annoyed at Apple's paternalist (or "draconian") philosophy.
  - bonaldi 16y ago
    "but it's looking like Google is quickly overtaking them in innovation and features" Such as? The announcements yesterday looked as though they'd finally caught up to iPhone 3.0, including the huge cheer for "Update All".

edw519 16y ago

1980: CPM on your choice of hardware or lock into Apple hardware & software at a higher price. 1990: DOS on your choice of hardware or lock into Apple hardware & software at a higher price. 2000: Windows on your choice of hardware or lock into Apple hardware & software at a higher price. 2010: Android on your choice of hardware or lock into Apple hardware & software at a higher price.

macrael 16y ago
The hardware lock in is the much less interesting of the two lock ins you mention. Regardless of which platform you use, you are locking yourself to the software much more than to the hardware.
- wwortiz 16y ago
  I think it is more of a case of the software locking you to the hardware for apples case which is rather interesting now that the hardware, at least for Macs, is now pretty much standard hardware with regards to processors and such.
  - siglesias 16y ago
    Uh, battey tech? Trackpad? Everywhere you look on Apple products (if you are discerning) you'll see them utilizing the crap out of their hardware control. If I'm not mistaken we're about to see Apple turn up the heat on further hardware differentiation on notebooks to take advantage of their multi-touch gesture patent portfolio, perhaps by elongating the glass trackpad. On the iPhone front I'm guessing that Apple's custom silicon will allow them to get raw graphics performance while simultaneously preserving battery life. Logically this is kind of technology that Google, without control over hardware, is powerless to compete against.
    - wwortiz 16y ago
      Does apple not support their older notebooks with new OS upgrades like tiger to leopard? If they do support them then I see no real reason why hardware cannot innovate with respect to android in a similar way and still provide support to older hardware styles just as new OS versions do.

byrneseyeview 16y ago

Here's Daniel Lyons on why the Zune has a shot (in early 2008): http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2008/0128/053.html http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2008/0128/053.html

notauser 16y ago
He also thought SCO would win, with such prophetic headlines as "What SCO Wants, SCO Gets." I'm pretty confident in the future of Android, but a positive prediction from Lyons is one of the few things that could cause me to reconsider my opinion! ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Lyons http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Lyons )
hyperbovine 16y ago
I guess am in the minority here of people who have actually used a Zune (HD, completely by accident, woke up on the floor of a Zune product manager's sweet apt in downtown Seattle while visiting a friend, long story.) I've got to say, I was impressed. Screen looked amazing, device is smaller and more responsive than an iPhone. The browser was sort of lame but you could just put Opera on it, no? Anyways, it's true that Zune is getting trounced, but if Apple continues to piss people off and there are alternatives that are actually a pleasure to use, that may change.
- commandar 16y ago
  The Zune is a great device. The biggest problem is that the Zune desktop software is pretty much nothing more than a skin over WMP, and can't even begin to compete with iTunes for library management. I say this as somebody that's owned both iPods and Zunes. The actual hardware experience was better with the Zune, in my book, but the iPod blows it away on the software side.
wisty 16y ago
He didn't really say the Zune had a shot. He just said that the new Zune was a good alternative, and didn't suck like the previous generation. He noted that most iPod owners were already locked-in by their libraries. His closing line: "Microsoft, you've got your work cut out for you."

rimantas 16y ago

It would be interesting to see how he will write about coming back to iPhone when he realizes there are things more important than Flash. Comments how Apple is chasing Google because of something Android will do is also amusing.

buster 16y ago
Now, you are in denial ;)
- rimantas 16y ago
  Yes, I am in denial that Flash is essential feature: I have flashblock extension on my Chrome and Click2flash on Safari.
  - buster 16y ago
    so you still have it installed, right? strange!
    - rimantas 16y ago
      There is a news for you: it comes preinstalled on OS X.
      - buster 16y ago
        that's even funnier
      - not_an_alien 16y ago
        Here's some news: you've chosen to install something that selectively blocks the plugin (thus allowing you to still use it) instead of uninstalling it, something you can do. That's because you like choice; the freedom to run Flash when you want, something you don't have in the iDevices.
        16y ago

noelchurchill 16y ago

Does this also mean that Android is destined to be as disliked as Windows, with all the problems that come along with being compatible with some many devices from so many different manufacturers?

phernandez 16y ago
I think a better comparison, is to linux - since it really is a linux kernel underneath, and it is open source. Linux has plenty of flaws, especially with hardware, but anyone can take the code and try and improve it, then contribute back to the main code base. The cyanogenmod is an example of this.
wwortiz 16y ago
I think it will be okay as long as updates are continually released and those updates are supported by the carriers because phones have a rather fast rate of adoption considering many people do the two year contract and phone upgrade cycle.
- noelchurchill 16y ago
  That's true. Windows is burdened by the fleets of corporate computers running all kinds of proprietary business software, and it must maintain backwards compatibility. Phones get replaced every two years or so, so there won't be much legacy support issues.
  - cpr 16y ago
    Once people load up their phones with dozens of apps, especially business-critical ones, there'll be a lot of pressure to only buy a new phone that will still run those apps.
barake 16y ago
Handset makers such as HTC and Motorola check that Android works as it should, and fix anything broken before releasing updates to users. Carriers may also be involved in this process. Also there are much fewer hardware combos to support. Windows PCs would work better if Dell (or whoever) made sure every update worked 100% and you couldn't install new components after purchase. As things stand now it is impossible to test Windows updates on even a fraction of the hardware configurations out there.

Ionic_Walrus 16y ago

Why do you want to use your phone as a wifi hotspot ? It'll drain the battery. The telco's in the US are the worst of the lot. Android and iPhone are 2 great platforms, Im happy that both are here.

doki_pen 16y ago
I tether it via usb. It charges as it tethers.
- redrobot5050 16y ago
  Then why not use the USB connection as the data connection like you can do with an iPhone? Or use Bluetooth?
jonknee 16y ago
> Why do you want to use your phone as a wifi hotspot? It'll drain the battery. To have internet access on your laptop when no other source is available... 3G isn't the fastest, but it's secure and available pretty much wherever you are. As for the battery just plug it into the laptop or because you're using an Android phone, pop in your spare battery after you've gotten your work done.
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
hboon 16y ago
I'd love to tether my phone, which I have a data plan for to my iPad (wifi-only). I don't bring my iPad out that much, that long, but when I do, occasionally, it will be great to have internet access when I want to. If I wasn't an iPhone app developer, I would mostly likely switch to an Android phone in a blink of an eye. And I have an Android G1 dev phone.
SoftwareMaven 16y ago
I do it all the time on my iPhone (though usually I use blue tooth). It allows my laptop and my daughter's iPod Touch to get connected when they otherwise couldn't.

tyohn 16y ago

You know what I kind of like about this post? - before such a post on YC would have been bashed by Apple fan boys... but now after Apple's policy pigeon holed and alienated developers - I'm starting to see a real conversation about some of Apple's issues...

tvon 16y ago
I'm glad enough people agree with you that you don't feel the need to play the fanboy card.
- tyohn 16y ago
  Feeling a little touchy? :)
  - raganwald 16y ago
    If I were to write "Ad Hominum much?" how would you feel? Annoyed at me? Certain labels and ways of phrasing things tend to provoke people and lower the quality of discourse.
    - tyohn 16y ago
      I agree with you - I didn't add much to the quality of discourse. I just feel like I need to walk on pins and needles here (YC) when I want to voice my opinion about Steve Jobs and Apple. It's almost like I'm drawing a picture of Muhammad...

kylemathews 16y ago

Wow, the backlash is in full swing.

elblanco 16y ago
Love easily turns into hate.

Qz 16y ago

The article picture, sadly, pushes me towards iPhone (not that I would ever buy one). The iPhone screen seems crisper, the colors are brighter, and the interface looks spiffier. Obviously there are other factors at play, but first impressions count for a lot.

sandipc 16y ago
check out the nexus one or droid incredible screens for a good iphone comparison...
- deleted 16y ago
  [deleted]
- Qz 16y ago
  I mean I believe there are better screens on other phones, but if the title of the article is 'Why I'm switching to Android', then the picture damn well better make me want to switch too, otherwise the credibility of the whole article is shot before I even read a word.

nlanier 16y ago

I just want to take this opportunity to say that I love my Nexus One. I don't care if Google "failed" as a marketer/distributor of the device. When I put it side by side with an iPhone I can't even fathom wanting an iPhone. In fact, you couldn't pay me to switch. Kudos, Google. Kudos.

nanexcool 16y ago

I'd buy an Android phone if they were available in Mexico. In the meantime, I have an iPhone and I like it.

ethan 16y ago

>Froyo also will let you buy songs over the air and download them directly to your phone. Nice, now if only Android could make a decent music player...

theBobMcCormick 16y ago
Part of the beauty of Android is that you're not stuck using the music play that comes with your phone. There are many, many music players to choose from in the Android Market. I'm currently fond of MixZing (http://www.appbrain.com/app/com.mixzing.basic http://www.appbrain.com/app/com.mixzing.basic), but Cubed (http://www.appbrain.com/app/org.abrantix.rockon.rockonnggl http://www.appbrain.com/app/org.abrantix.rockon.rockonnggl) seems to be rising rapidly in popularity. There's even btunes (http://www.appbrain.com/app/com.bmayers.bTunesRelease http://www.appbrain.com/app/com.bmayers.bTunesRelease) for all the ex-iphone users out there. :-) Not to mention of course all the streaming apps like Pandora, LastFM, GrooveShark etc.
- raganwald 16y ago
  > Part of the beauty of Android is that you're not stuck using the music play that comes with your phone. Apropos of nothing at all, this reminds me of the argument for there being so many incompatible flavours (ahem) of Lisp.
  - theBobMcCormick 16y ago
    I think this is a little different. There's a huge advantage to developing a common ecosystem around a programming language. For a music player application... hmm not so much.
- joubert 16y ago
  With what do all these apps sync with on your laptop?
  - jarek 16y ago
    Doubletwist?

ynniv 16y ago

Why is Lyons so bitter? His arguments revolve around Android having more "features" and otherwise being an iPhone knockoff. The features debate is old and boring - maybe he cares, but I don't and I suspect that most iPhone buyers don't either. And as developers, why should we be excited at a knockoff? Do we need to punish Apple for being successful? Unlike Microsoft, Apple has not tried to force people to run its OS. And if Apple stops innovating the phone market, I don't see Google stepping up as a replacement. Much as Microsoft did, I expect large market share to result in years of the same old crap. I understand that some people don't like the situation they are in, and I'm okay with that. But can we stop pretending that Apple is the evil empire? They make a great product, and you bought it. That's what companies are supposed to do.

kenjackson 16y ago
How can the features debate be old and boring when Froyo was just officially unveiled yesterday? It's a very relevant debate. And lets not give Apple too much credit. While the iPhone was best of breed it wasn't nearly the innovation that the GUI was or even WSIWYG word processing. It really felt like an evolution of the smart phone. A very well engineered product, but not the revolution that a lot of people seem think it was.
- ynniv 16y ago
  How can the features debate be old and boring when Froyo was just officially unveiled yesterday? It's a very relevant debate. There's always something new... how does that make the discussion of "features" versus "execution" debate change? A very well engineered product, but not the revolution that a lot of people seem think it was. Precisely. The iPhone has been successful because they only included the good features. Competitors always talk about new features, or fewer dollars. To the average consumer, neither of those are as important as execution. Google will only make a better phone when they make a better phone.
ergo98 16y ago
>Why is Lyons so bitter? People who say that other people are bitter are usually just bitter. The guy is a technology columnist and he talks about technology. What a huge surprise. >And as developers, why should we be excited at a knockoff? Humorously just yesterday Daring Fireball and other Apple apologists were pointing out that Google bought Android long before Steve Jobs had his iPhone epiphany. But yes, the iPhone is a knockoff of Windows Mobile, and numerous other phones that came before. > Unlike Microsoft, Apple has not tried to force people to run its OS. What. A. Load. Of. Shit. Apple saw that they had a hit with the iPod and they hung onto "Mac only" for as long as they could, and remarkably it was fairly successful. It isn't accidental that iPhone development is Mac only. Apple does cross promotions with large brands to make iPhone applications, trying to build a world where not having an iPhone means a second tier world. Adobe's cross compiler was a huge threat to that. Apple is worse than Microsoft ever dreamed of being. They got by with it because they were cute and tiny, but that time has passed. They don't get the free pass any more. >I understand that some people don't like the situation they are in Sounds like you're the one that doesn't like the situation he's in. But I'm sure you'll come into all of these discussions to set people straight.

jsz0 16y ago

I love the competition but if I can present an alternative view: Why I'm sticking with the iPhone: I plug it into iTunes and it automatically syncs everything and backs up the device automatically. All my accessories work with the dock connector including my car. I can still get software updates for my 3 year old iPhone 2G. Music & media players are superior to Android in my opinion along with it simply being easier to sync content. I can play my Audible books on my iPhone. Couldn't live without those. It's easier to buy an iPhone. There's basically just one model or the hold-over model from last year. With Android phones I feel like there's always something better right around the corner. I feel compelled to research CPU speed, RAM/ROM size, and evaluate the differences in software. I don't care for the physical buttons on Android phones. I think it's jarring to switch between the touch-screen and menu/home/search/back buttons which incidentally seem to be arranged differently on most Android handsets. I think the iPhone still has a pretty big app advantage especially for games and multimedia.

dannyr 16y ago
" It's easier to buy an iPhone. There's basically just one model or the hold-over model from last year. With Android phones I feel like there's always something better right around the corner." Can't believe that lack of choice can ever be a good thing. It's like saying "It's easier to pick a job if the government is the only company to work for. If there are private companies/startups, I feel like I can work for another company that is better."
- jasonwocky 16y ago
  "Can't believe that lack of choice can ever be a good thing." Google Tech Talk on the Paradox of Choice: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6127548813950043200# http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6127548813950043200#
- ugh 16y ago
  I’m actually quite happy that I don’t have to decide how to assemble my pants. You rely on a myriad of choices other people make for you every day and I would guess you are quite happy that you don’t have to make all those choices by yourself. There is the architect who decided how the buildings you use every day should work and look. There is the designer who decided which line height the articles you are reading in your favorite magazine should have. Too much choice can be a very bad thing. It can be suffocating.

tomlin 16y ago

"It also will support Flash, something Apple refuses to do, mostly out of spite." Oh, so we're being honest about it now?

CamperBob 16y ago

He's looking more and more like Howard Hughes... I'm amazed more people aren't drawing that parallel. Any day now I expect Jobs to announce the construction of an unusually large and magical aircraft, made from the finest Chinese spruce.

starkfist 16y ago

He's kidding himself if he thinks Google with Android has better intentions than Apple. The guys who started Android did so with the sole intention of selling the company to Google. They did and cleaned up. As soon as he could, the CEO of Android removed himself from the project and now runs Google's venture arm. The founder of the original android company doesn't really give a shit about the product, and Google only cares about it because they want all the mobile ad money. It is a project with no soul. Fake Steve is wrong when he implies that Jobs is insincere about creating beautiful products and is just trying to lock people in. Even if the edicts and decrees often go haywire, if nothing else, Jobs and Apple believe their own bullshit.