34 ms·

The woes of Windows 10

165 points by hourislate 10y ago

webwielder2 10y ago
It's bizarre that people continue to think of Windows PCs as being predominantly owned by individuals or even individuals with a specific interest in technology.
- fetbaffe 10y ago
  Correct! Compare it to a group that care about their PC, i.e. gamers, 50% of Steam users run Windows 10. https://www.pcgamesn.com/steam-hardware-survey-windows-10-adoption-rate https://www.pcgamesn.com/steam-hardware-survey-windows-10-ad...
  - corin_ 10y ago
    Maybe I'm misreading your comment but I think you're implying that people who care (like gamers) are less likely to be using Windows 10, but it's the opposite - 50% is far higher than the total market share Windows 10 has. If I misunderstood your meaning, then this comment can just be a clarification instead of a correction :)
    - stock_toaster 10y ago
      Presumably gamers are after newer directx versions, which are only provided in windows10, no?
    - fetbaffe 10y ago
      You misunderstood. :-) Yes, gamers are above market share for Windows 10 because they care. They want the newest, the best.
  - tonyedgecombe 10y ago
    The figure includes xbox one users.
mmanfrin 10y ago
More than 700m of the world's 1.5bn or so computers continue to run on Windows 7, a piece of software three generations old Win 7, Win 8, Win 10; 2 generations old. Preeeetty easy to check, WSJ. If your lede carries such a glaring mistake, why do I trust anything in this article.
- sgift 10y ago
  They probably count 8.1 extra which was a pretty significant overhaul compared to 8.
  - boznz 10y ago
    significant in that they put the start menu back.
- reubenmorais 10y ago
  They are probably counting Windows 8.1.
- icehawk219 10y ago
  Maybe they're including Win 8.1? In that case it is 3 generations. Although Win 8.1 was an update to 8 so you could argue whether or not it should be included but lots of version lists list it separately.
- charlieegan3 10y ago
  I imagine they're counting 8.1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_8.1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_8.1
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- JackFr 10y ago
  > Preeeetty easy to check, WSJ. How can I trust your nit-picky, pedantic complaint when you believe the article is in the WSJ rather than the Economist?
- 10y ago
nul_byte 10y ago
I have a dual boot PC which is Arch Linux and Windows 7. The Windows 7 machine is only for gaming / steam, I never browse the internet on there and have pretty strict firewall ruleset. To be honest, I would consider upgrading it to 10, but I missed the free window, so I really don't fancy paying for it. My hope is that by the time that Windows 7 goes EOL, I can delete it and game just on Linux. Either that or I will get a console (as most of my gaming takes place in my living room anyhow, using a steam box).
- overcast 10y ago
  You didn't miss any free window, you can still just download the image from Microsoft and upgrade. Upgrade to Windows 10. Windows 7 is archaic, especially for gaming as its primary use.
  - aluhut 10y ago
    What are the advances of using 10 instead of 7 for gaming?
    - burkaman 10y ago
      You need Windows 10 to use DirectX 12, that's probably the biggest advance. The Windows Display Driver Model is also updated, I don't know if this actually matters for most games though.
      - aluhut 10y ago
        > You need Windows 10 to use DirectX 12, that's probably the biggest advance. More like a threat ;)
    - overcast 10y ago
      Modern drivers, DX12, native xbox one controller support, xbox one integration, background recording, game streaming, not going EOL, FREE.
    - deleted 10y ago
shmerl 10y ago
> But he has also dusted down his four-year-old Apple MacBook Pro and upgraded his Windows 7 desktop to the latest version of Linux Mint rather than Windows 10. <...> Despite their idiosyncrasies, Macintosh and Linux have never looked so attractive. Linux gets refugees both from Windows and MacOS because MS just keeps messing Windows up (seems to be happening every other version), and Apple simply lets MacOS rot by not giving it any attention.
- melling 10y ago
  You just made three subjective claims. I don't see Linux's market share growing by large numbers. Apple updates macOS every year. Which features do you want? I haven't used Windows in a while but Microsoft seems to be making faster progress in updating Windows, browser, etc.
  - shmerl 10y ago
    > don't see Linux's market share growing by large numbers. https://www.netmarketshare.com/report.aspx?qprid=9&qpcustom=Linux&qpcustomb=0&qpsp=192&qpnp=25&qptimeframe=M https://www.netmarketshare.com/report.aspx?qprid=9&qpcustom=... > Apple updates macOS every year. I hear complaints from MacOS users about the bit rot all the time. Where is OpenGL 4.5 for instance? And not just graphics. Many simply feel it's completely stagnated, because Apple are too busy with their mobile delirium, and don't care about desktop anymore.
    - ihattendorf 10y ago
      > large numbers
      - shmerl 10y ago
        Absolute numbers are large. I'm more interested in the trend here. Still, there should be more push for Linux on the desktop. This sick situation exited for way too long.
nxrabl 10y ago
> There is no question that Windows 10 is ... quite the most secure operating system ever devised. Telemetry aside, can anyone comment on this?
- drzaiusapelord 10y ago
  Well, the most secure OS is something that's going to be endlessly arguable, but its probably the most secure Windows considering how people use computers today and how many attack surfaces a modern OS has. A lot of security features found in the previously stand-alone EMET are slowly being ported over natively to Win10, for example. It comes with a built-in AV which is pretty good. Smartscreen is unusually good at warning about suspicious executables and I've seen it stop ransomware attacks. VBS makes it harder for hackers to modify system or protected files. Secureboot and bitlocker support are useful in some scenarios. Device guard is supposed to helpful but I'm not sure how it works. Windows hello can replace the traditional password with camera or fingerprint auth cooked-in, which is probably a step in the right direction, although I'd rather see passphrases become more common. Cameras and fingerprints seem gimmmicky and not all my computers have those things.
  - alexkavon 10y ago
    Windows Hello is the new platform for authentication. I imagine that all authentication APIs are grouped into Windows Hello, including traditional passphrases.
- marcoperaza 10y ago
  * Secure Boot * BitLocker: Hard-drive encryption backed by TPM & Secure Boot With the above two and DMA protection, physical access attacks become very difficult. * Virtual Secure Mode (VSM) - separate OS running on the hypervisor that can perform sensitive operations. Which enables: 1. Device Guard - Runs code integrity protection, i.e. only allowing signed code to run, from within the VSM. 2. Credential Guard - Runs user-mode security subsystem (LSA) inside VSM.
  - semi-extrinsic 10y ago
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
cwyers 10y ago
The thing is, people don't upgrade Windows, in the large. They use the version of Windows their computer came with until they replace it. Microsoft has done more work getting people to upgrade to 10 than any previous version of Windows. I don't see what more they can do.
akappa 10y ago
I think there's an obvious and more general question here to be answered: if a piece of software is good enough, namely, it "disappears" when you are trying to do your job, then why bother to change it? Yes, the new version might enable a more efficient workflow, or might be faster to boot-up. But people hate changes and you need to invest considerable time in upgrading a piece of software (the upgrade itself + learning to navigate the new system + solving whatever goes wrong during the process). And that this is not just limited to "novices": I've heard wonderful things about Arch Linux, but my Ubuntu system works well enough and I've been using it for forever, so the incentives are pretty low and the time to be invested pretty high.
- kodfodrasz 10y ago
  The users may perceive operation satisfying, yet it may not be so, eg. because of security issues, which on the other hand pose dangers to other users as well, so the it doesn't matter to me attitude doesn't stand. Given that the upgrade was free just as in the case of a linux upgrade the good enough point should consider these factors as well.
- izacus 10y ago
  Because developers want to make more money. This is why the app store format is so incredibly popular amongst the developer crowd - it forces people to keep paying you to upgrade app to follow breaking Apple/Google changes just to keep the functionality of the app the same and it appearing for users of new phones. 15 year old software that works well and you buy once does not bring a steady income.
  - Godel_unicode 10y ago
    I think that you're wrong about why developers love app stores. It's about someone else solving all of the problems which aren't "make your app". It handles updates, feedback, discoverability, CC info, password resets, etc. I've never had the experience you describe; which app(s) are you talking about which need to be bought repeatedly with no new functionality?
  - moosingin3space 10y ago
rwc 10y ago
> Chromebooks are now outselling MacBooks in the crucial education market, where long-term preferences tend to be established. Apple has historically held a dominant position in the education market, so how does one square the "long-term preferences tend to be established" portion of that sentence with the 8% marketshare MacOS commands?
- nix0n 10y ago
  Even if people would prefer macs and perceive them to be superior (regardless of whether this is true), most aren't willing to shell out the cash for one.
- trendia 10y ago
  Unfortunately, Chromebooks will struggle with the engineering crowd, where software like ANSYS, Matlab, AutoCAD, etc. are required.
  - protomyth 10y ago
    Plus the crowd who cannot have data go to external servers. I would love to use something like Chromebooks but the lack of a local storage server and user management kill it. I got to follow the rules after all. If I could get a group of Chromebooks that sync with an on-site server then do my backups to someone like Tarsnap, I would be happy and following the local rules.
  - bmon 10y ago
    My experience too. My chromebook has easily been the best value for money computer I've ever purchased, but it's just not the right device for development outside of the web browser. Maybe sometime soon browser based cad tools will become more widely adopted but there are some serious limitations imposed by web browsers that make that difficult to see happening anytime soon.
  - tonyedgecombe 10y ago
    Personally I'd be quite happy if the market for PC's bifurcated into thin clients on one side and powerful workstations on the other. The user experience for professionals has been compromised by the need to support 'normal' users on both Windows and OS/X.
frik 10y ago
No wonder that Win10 fails like Win8 - Microsoft doesn't care about users, they only care about their shareholders. Win8 and Win10 looks like designed by color blind designers with a bad taste the brutalism of UI design plus the phone-home spyware features that cannot be deactivated. Windows 7 is too good and the perfect OS, if you don't install some recent spyware updates it will last at least until 2020 - and who knows if Android/Fuchsia or whatever OS is a proper alternative than.
- Arizhel 10y ago
  Look, I don't like the flat-UI trend any more than you, but there's two simple facts here: 1) It's not just MS pushing the flat-UI trend. Apple and Google are too, along with every other Web/UI designer out there. Everyone's doing it. MS's version does seem to be the ugliest though, mainly because of the horrible color picks. 2) The users you seem concerned about like this stuff. They're all buying and using Windows, along with Macs, iOS, Android, etc. devices. There's simply no serious effort being put into any UI alternatives. There's some stuff going on in Linux-land that has a minuscule marketshare, but that's about it; even there, the most popular desktop is Gnome3, which is on the same bandwagon in many ways.
  - corin_ 10y ago
    Your second point doesn't really hold up - I'm a Windows 10 user, and I don't spend any time even considering Linux UI alternatives because you could show me one that I liked twice as much as Windows and I still wouldn't want to use Linux for my day to day stuff. I actually don't mind the Windows 10 UI as it happens, but if there were the variety of options for Windows that there are for Linux, I'd certainly see if I could find one I liked more.
    - Arizhel 10y ago
      If people actually cared about it that much, at the very least there'd be some 3rd-party program available for Windows that would improve the UI, and it'd be selling like hotcakes. I've never heard of any. Same goes for MacOS, iOS, and Android.
0xFFC 10y ago
Just fix fucking font rendering, I did use Windows machine as my workstation for 4 year (although being in love with linux), But I had to switch to Ubuntu, because of ridiculous font rendering. I don't have money to pay for new monitor every 2 year, and I am quite happy with my dual monitor 27 inch 1080p until windows 10 changed font rendering to DirectWrite. It is fucking disaster in low dpi monitor. As always Microsoft ignored their current users in pursue of new users. I haven't seen this attitude from any other company. I haven't seen apple make font rendering on old MacBook worse to force people to switch to new MacBooks. Or I haven't seen something similar from Google. This is fucking total disaster. As someone who reads text for whole day (programmer) I care about my eyes and it fucking hurts my eye to see font rendering in new UI (UWP) and Edge. p.s. Old/win32 application do use old rendering engine and are acceptable.
- alyandon 10y ago
  Yeah, I honestly thought I had a hardware issue on a computer I built for my son with a 24" 1080p monitor and it turned out to be Windows 10 font rendering changes. I use Ubuntu at work and my other Windows 10 machine has 1920x1200 monitors at a distance that makes the rendering regression not easily noticeable. It's great for small 1080p screens on laptops and 4k monitors though. :-/
  - 0xFFC 10y ago
    Exactly, That was my whole point, Microsoft tried vigorously to ignore me and you (their current users) to compete with apple and google. Do you see the irony? Microsoft does suffer from mismanagement. You should never ever mess with your current user experience to improve your imaginary users experience.
- TimJYoung 10y ago
  We're re-vamping some of our Windows products this year to support high-DPI usage under Windows 10, so if you could be so kind, I would be curious as to what exactly you're seeing that is causing your issue: is it that older Windows applications look blurry because they aren't high-DPI-aware and Windows 10 auto-scales them, or is it that you don't like the high-DPI look because it's too sharp/jagged, looks weird on older monitors, etc. ? I don't want to piss off our customers by making their usage experience poorer under Windows 10, so I would really appreciate any input you can provide.
digi_owl 10y ago
Win10 fails for different reacons than Win8. While 8 tried to make tablet the priority use case, and thus breaking the muscle memory of many long term users, 10 abandons the notion of the owner of the hardware being in charge (sadly one that is increasingly taking root in FOSS circles as well). Thus you have things like updates being ramrodded through even if the user says no, and keep saying no. Damn it, i keep having to roll back the driver of my igpu because for some reason MS keep trying to update it along with the dgpu. This even though the support has been discontinued by AMD...
- eikenberry 10y ago
  > [..] (sadly one that is increasingly taking root in FOSS circles as well). What are you talking about? The modern prevalence of binary firmware blobs is the only concern I can think of in this area.
mdekkers 10y ago
It appears that I have reached some kind of "article limit"
- aq3cn 10y ago
  click on go to old version.
Unbeliever69 10y ago
I am a manager at a small architecture firm and Windows 10 has brought nothing but woe to my office. We have spent dozens of hours and thousands of dollars troubleshooting and fixing problems (many of which remain unresolved) that occurred as a result of this draconian forced upgrade (and updates that followed). So what if we got the upgrade for free. I've paid for it many times over in labor!
- diminoten 10y ago
  When I hear complaints like this, basically any complaint about a major technology in use around the world, I am always baffled that the people who have trouble end up blaming the technology, rather than their policies and implementation. This technology works (almost) flawlessly for hundreds of thousands of people and organizations, the idea that the issues you're experiencing are legitimately the fault of the technology feels... unlikely. I get that the best technology adapts perfectly to your individual needs, but the idea that you don't have to change a single thing about your business to use a technology just feels, on its face, absurd.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
- rjbwork 10y ago
  In light of so many hundreds of millions of people still using 7, how was it forced?
  - sounds 10y ago
    http://www.pcworld.com/article/3088755/windows/a-lawsuit-over-an-unwanted-windows-10-upgrade-just-cost-microsoft-10000.html http://www.pcworld.com/article/3088755/windows/a-lawsuit-ove... https://www.extremetech.com/computing/232599-microsoft-slapped-with-class-action-lawsuits-over-windows-10-upgrade-practices https://www.extremetech.com/computing/232599-microsoft-slapp... https://www.cnet.com/news/microsoft-pays-woman-10000-over-forced-windows-10-install/ https://www.cnet.com/news/microsoft-pays-woman-10000-over-fo... http://lmgtfy.com/?q=windows+10+forced+upgrade http://lmgtfy.com/?q=windows+10+forced+upgrade
yokohummer7 10y ago
IMO the success of Windows 7 was an exception, not the norm. Comparing the adoption rate of Windows 10 to that of Windows 7 might be a little harsh. 24% isn't actually that bad, considering Windows 7 is still good enough.
nyolfen 10y ago
i must give windows10 credit for one thing -- it finally convinced me to dive into linux
pdog 10y ago
Windows 10 is a great operating system, but if you have an existing business-critical workflow, why would you update your major version? Stick with what works unless you have a reason to update. It's why some multinational companies are still running COBOL programs after nearly sixty years.
mark-r 10y ago
Microsoft is their own worst enemy. My wife can't transition fully from XP to the Windows 7 PC I built for her, because it doesn't have Outlook Express or any reasonable substitute. We can't upgrade the living room PC because Windows 10 doesn't include Media Center. I'm also not fond of the way Windows 10 updates are so aggressive, you'll essentially be replacing your OS every so often without any say-so. If I had any faith that this would be painless I might be tempted to try it, but see above. Windows 7 is darn near perfect, you can pry it from my cold dead hands.
- jimmaswell 10y ago
  You can disable the Windows Update service.
  - boznz 10y ago
    I'm sure theres a hack but this is not possible in Windows 10 home.
    - Filligree 10y ago
      And a good thing, too. I'm tired of fighting botnets.
    - jimmaswell 10y ago
      Are you sure it doesn't let you just turn the service off in services.msc? I can't find any references online to the Home edition having that behavior.
      - boznz 10y ago
        Love to be corrected on this, but everything I have seen involves a registry hack
- ZeroClickOk 10y ago
  Media Center? Why dont you use Kodi (former XBMC)?
testUser69 10y ago
>The business world has been even more recalcitrant. In a recent study by Softchoice, an info-tech consultancy, corporate computers were found to be running a whole gamut of legacy versions of Windows. Fewer than 1% of them had been upgraded to Windows 10. One thing I've learned over the years: you don't need a high IQ to run a successful business. Without a lot of smarts you're never going to compete with google, but you don't need to compete with google to make a living running your own business. >Chromebooks are now outselling MacBooks in the crucial education market, where long-term preferences tend to be established. It's unfortunate that proprietary software ever came to dominate schooling. Hopefully ChromeOS will open things up just enough so that cross platform tools become the norm. Schools using both Windows and Chrome will be more aware of proprietary/incompatible software and file formats and choose to use open formats. >It is impossible to retrofit older Windows versions with the sort of defense-in-depth that has been built into Windows 10. Nor would Microsoft do so even if it could. If anything, it is about to do the opposite. Windows 7 users will soon lose access to a stand-alone toolkit for mitigating zero-day exploits. Another reason why Windows is a joke OS for serious tech enthusiasts. >A word of warning, though: such upgrades do not necessarily go without a hitch. A Windows 10 tablet your correspondent relied upon for much of his mobile computing was broken irreparably when a recent update corrupted the display driver, rendering the touchscreen useless. ......... makes you wonder why they lock these things down, are tech enthusiasts even designing them? >But he has also dusted down his four-year-old Apple MacBook Pro and upgraded his Windows 7 desktop to the latest version of Linux Mint rather than Windows 10. Yes I prefer Linux to Windows in most cases too. I never have good long term experiences with Windows. >It used to be that only free software came with advertising; users paid a fee, if they chose to do so, to get the software free of advertising. Microsoft charges top dollar for Windows 10 ($120 or $200, depending on the edition) and now wants to bombard users with sales pitches to boot—without so much as by your leave, let alone the option to turn the nuisance off. Despite their idiosyncrasies, Macintosh and Linux have never looked so attractive. Yeah these days pretty much the only people who are using Windows are people who don't know any better. Most people aren't even exposed to Linux except those of us in the tech sector, and it seems to be just as popular as windows and OS X at the shops I've worked at.
- newplagiarist 10y ago
ZeroClickOk 10y ago
I dont know why name Windows 10 a fail, when the bigger competitors of Windows are... Windows! Mac and Linux mostly are used for niche users (as us). I'm really really happy we CAN upgrade for a new Windows version easily, just compare with Android. More: the reason to most people dont upgrade isn't why "Windows 7 is better than Windows 10", but the actual reason is they are comfortable with Win7 and dont want/can take time to "learn" a new OS. Even Win7 being an awesome OS, took years to take most of XP users (even today there are a lot of loyal XP users out there...)
- cowardlydragon 10y ago
  Android and iOS have probably surpassed windows in number of consumer installations. The PC will be invaded by Android at some point, and it will be like a blitzkreig when it happens. Google would make all their money back shortly off of appstore sales.
  - Infinitesimus 10y ago
    > The PC will be invaded by Android at some point As much as I enjoy using Android on mobile, Google's horrible track record with security updates means I'll be appalled if after all the noise people have made about Win 10's privacy, they accept Android with Google everywhere + security updates EOL after 3 years...
  - computerex 10y ago
    That's already happened, PC sales have already declined in favor of mobile years ago. And contrary to what people may think, appstore sales are also not really on the rise, and most users don't install any new apps in their phone monthly.
boznz 10y ago
Forget any other reason, for $150 a licence (NZ$199) my other computers will never ever see windows 10.. ever
- jjcm 10y ago
  Is $150 that crazy? The original prices for 7 were: Windows 7 Home Premium (Upgrade) $119.99 Windows 7 Home Premium (Full) $199.99 Windows 7 Family Pack (Upgrade, retail only) $149.99 Windows 7 Professional (Upgrade) $199.99 Windows 7 Professional (Full) $299.99 Windows 7 Ultimate (Upgrade) $219.99 Windows 7 Ultimate (Full) $319.99 $150 seems completely in line with pricing of previous windows versions.
  - boznz 10y ago
    Fine if that's their strategy, my argument still stands.
k__ 10y ago
I installed it yesterday for the first time and it still seems to have problems. Somehow Chrome always freezes every few minutes. Didn't do this on Win8.1 or Win7 :/
arca_vorago 10y ago
I also don't think you can have this discussion without talking about the influence the NSA and OGA's are having on big tech companies products. If game developers really pulled their shit together and started doing AAA/AA titles on linux you would quickly see the piss taken out of the likes of M$.
epx 10y ago
I miss Windows 7. It did work just like Windows 95. It was just downhill from that.
rkapsoro 10y ago
I'm normally very fond of The Economist, but this is one of their "blog posts", which seem to not receive quite the same careful, nuanced care that their other articles for their weekly edition do. Part of the challenge of Windows 10 was the transformation of Windows from a large-release product into a trickle-release service with much faster cycle times with an incremental and continuously-learned approach to ongoing product changes. At it's core, that's a valid and (I think) mostly welcome change, but Microsoft's solution to the impedance mismatch between the two categories of offering was to force it down and ask for forgiveness later. :/
ajmurmann 10y ago
Do users actually desire changes to the actual user experience of modern operating systems. I would be totally fine with the OS experience itself I had on Windows 2000 or OS X from 2010. Software that runs on top of the OS and support of it is a different issue. Of course also security and driver support. To me OS user experience is a solved problem and most changed to what I'm used to just make things different without providing value, but require me to retrain muscle memory. I do upgrade regularly because security. If that wasn't an issue I would never upgrade.
idobai 10y ago
Just ditch win and m$ and get freedom with linux. You're all just giving up your rights for privacy and your freedom to get locked to a company doing malicious shit for decades in exchange for a few exclusive apps. Unreasonable...
youdontknowtho 10y ago
In which the economist finally succumbs to clickbait. WEAK.
dmalvarado 10y ago
Well that was weird. tldr; Windows has 92% OS share. Windows 10 only accounts for 24% (maybe). Windows 10 is so, so secure. How to make people upgrade? Windows 10 new update will have advertising. Other OS's sure look good now. I feel like this section of the Economist doesn't get much editorial review.
- acqq 10y ago
  > Windows 10 new update will have advertising. And I don't see anybody blinks here on HN about that. Why? https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/85341/microsoft-cheapens-windows-10-ads https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/85341/microsoft-... "So Windows 10 pops-up little advertising windows—sorry, tips—on the Edge icon in the taskbar, or in the Action Center UI, or in the Settings interface where you can change your defaults, because it really, really, really doesn’t want you to exercise free will and make a better decision for yourself." "For the next version of Windows 10, Microsoft is even experimenting with ads—sorry, tips—that will appear in File Explorer. You don’t get any more “in the OS user interface” than that, folks, unless Microsoft starts displaying ads in event logs next. Don’t laugh. So repeat after me: There are ads all over Windows. And it’s just getting worse."
  - Infinitesimus 10y ago
    > And I don't see anybody blinks here on HN about that. Why? People did complain about start menu ads a lot when it first came out. I don't see their "Edge is faster/more battery friendly" ads as entirely bad though 1. Edge is more battery friendly on Windows laptops 2. Google does the same thing by prompting you to install Chrome does it not? Difference is OS vs website but google.com is the default "internet" for an awful lot of people...
  - tonyedgecombe 10y ago
    This was the final straw for me, as soon as I started seeing ads (on the pro version) I decided to switch.
mschuster91 10y ago
Well, the reason why corporate users are holding on to W7 is easy: training costs. With XP and even W7, you could at least switch the majority of the GUI to look and feel like good old W95/98/ME... no way to do so with W10. Also many companies don't want the legal risk associated with telemetry (you never know what data leaves your premises and heads towards MS), and small-ish businesses are afraid of the non-disableable automatic updates - I certainly wouldn't want to get into the office and $essential_program has stopped working over night due to an update gone bad.
hfsktr 10y ago
I must be in the huge minority. I haven't had a single issue with Windows 10 (if we disregard privacy). Literally everything has just worked. I will say thinking about it that my computer used for 99.99% gaming/internet/text documents. I keep anticipating that something is going to go horribly wrong but so far it's been great. I hate the menu and store that it shows so almost everything I tend to open has a shortcut on the desktop or is pinned to the toolbar. Having a functional toolbar on both monitors. That right there was all I wished windows 7 would do but otherwise I can barely tell that the OS is different. I never used windows 8 so I don't have a comparison to that but I've seen Windows ME...
- distantsounds 10y ago
  You can remove just about all the tiles and extra bloat from the Start Menu, bringing on a more familiar return of what it used to be. Just right-click and 'remove' every tile until there's nothing left.
  - Pica_soO 10y ago
    If i wanted to work to customize my OS, i would have Nuxed it.
    - freehunter 10y ago
      If you don't want to work to customize your OS, you accept the defaults. Those are your two options, and you've already ruled out one of them.
      - khedoros1 10y ago
        Option 3: Use an OS (or at least OS version) that offers better defaults, while still running the software that you need.
        freehunter 10y ago
        Well then the OS that you're complaining about isn't exactly "your OS" is it? It's now someone else's OS and you're just complaining about something you don't even use.
bayeslives 10y ago
I've been using both Windows (work) and Linux (home) on the desktop for many years. I far prefer Linux (I tried many distros, settled on Arch and Mint now). Package management and window management is way better in Linux. To name just a few. To me, Windows10 is not better than Windows7. The package management is still a mess. Forced updates, no rollbacks, reboots, you name it. Permissions are also strange: why are admin rights needed to install some fonts? We still have this "Registry" with its voodoo. We still miss tools like dmesg. When thing go wrong, Windows gives some sort of simple log file, of course not in txt-form but in some proprietary format that needs it's own reader (to read some flat text, for crying out loud). The file manager ("Explorer") is still confusing. Microsoft seems hellbent in obfuscating where files are stored. Going to the terminal, the difference is even clearer. Linux offers first rate terminals; Windows look like an afterthought. Is it even possible to use a terminal full screen in Windows, nowadays? Tab completion, a decent history, pipes? The funny thing is that Ranger, my favorite file manager, is able to give previews of files in MS formats (such as .docx) where Windows Explorer is unable to do so.... ???? Two big steps back are privacy and font rendering. It's bad enough that apps spy on me, I don't want my OS to"phone home". The font rendering is optimized for the few Windows on mobile devices users, at the expense of the bulk of the users (like me) who use it on the desktop and are now confronted with blurry fonts. My OS must help me with my personal computer tasks. Personal means a) I want to customize the hell out of it, and b) my data is _mine_. Also, I'd like a nice readable font on my screen. Sadly, Windows10 does not meet those requirements.
- tdkl 10y ago
  >The package management is still a mess. If you mean for system updates I'd agree, but software package management is a shit show on Linux and it shows why less people bother writing software with & why Electron is popular there. What's more easier then clicking an .exe ?
  - oldsj 10y ago
    And (although I don't think its Win10 specific) but there's chocolatey now too which is great
  - 10y ago
jacquesc 10y ago
I got a Windows 10 laptop (Razer) for Christmas for gaming / media / browsing purposes (been a Mac user for 10+ yrs). It's buggy as hell. The shortcut icons on the desktop and taskbar kept going away (replacing all the icons with a "not found" placeholder), forcing me to reinstall the OS. Now none of the search functions work (e.g. windows key -> search for app.. no results). Whatever, I just use 2 apps anyways (Chrome and Steam). Windows settings panels have at least 2 diff ways to configure anything, the "old" and the "new". Graphics settings have 4 places to change stuff (Intel, Nvidia, built in old and new). It's just a jumbled mess. Bluetooth never recognizes device names (it's a guessing game as to which "Unknown Device" is the one I want). The trackpad is mediocre, and the config panel from Synaptics probably hasn't changed since Windows 95. With the tech press in love with Windows 10, I was definitely expecting more. Feels like people just want to love every other version of Windows (7 "good", 8 "bad", 10 "good again).
- tw04 10y ago
  >Windows settings panels have at least 2 diff ways to configure anything, the "old" and the "new". Graphics settings have 4 places to change stuff (Intel, Nvidia, built in old and new). It's just a jumbled mess. They're well aware of that, and if you follow the insider previews, every new build is moving more of the features into the "new" way of doing things. Is it annoying there are two places? Absolutely... but the alternative is not changing anything and waiting 5 years while everything gets rolle dup. >Bluetooth never recognizes device names (it's a guessing game as to which "Unknown Device" is the one I want). The trackpad is mediocre, and the config panel from Synaptics probably hasn't changed since Windows 95. Not sure what to tell you there other than a buggy driver on your laptop. All of my bluetooth devices tell me exactly what they are before and after adding them. The trackpad thing isn't Windows, it's the trackpad razer chose to use, or the driver. One of the reasons that MS finally said f-it and introduced precision touchpad. If you still have the old-school synaptics panel, then Razer chose not to participate.
  - wtallis 10y ago
    > but the alternative is not changing anything and waiting 5 years while everything gets rolle dup. Windows 7 was released 7.5 years ago, and Windows 8 was released 4.5 years ago. Whether or not they make interim releases, Microsoft clearly cannot pull off a user interface overhaul in any reasonable span of time.
Animats 10y ago
The basic problem with Windows 10 is that it was intended for tablets/mobile first. On a desktop, there's just not much need for it.
dcdevito 10y ago
Windows 10 gets a lot of flak, but it's honestly the best OS I have ever used. It's fast, stable, reliable and secure. Oh, and I should mention I'm a developer, and WSL is getting better with every release. Is it perfect? Heck no, but it's sure a lot better than Linux on the desktop and Macs are just not worth my money anymore.
- vacri 10y ago
  I don't really count a forced reboot "now or in 15 minutes, no delays" as reliable. There are people who've had this happen in the middle of presentations at meetings. Similarly, I've had these forced updates happen, and on relogin "click here to see what was updated" -> nothing listed.
  - dcdevito 10y ago
    I don't understand this whole "forced updates" FUD. Just configure the times you want your machine to be updated and it gets out of the way.
    - aninhumer 10y ago
      Except that the configuration options force you to choose at least a 12 hour contiguous period in which updates are allowed. If I could tell it to reboot at 4am when I'm definitely asleep that would be fine, but apparently that's not an option.
  - chrisper 10y ago
    I believe that behavior is going to change with the new big update.
casparz 10y ago
Stopped reading at: "There is no question that Windows 10 is an impressive piece of software, and quite the most secure operating system ever devised."
- oldsj 10y ago
  Yea that was really strange to see. I had to look up and double check what website I was on when I saw that
elorant 10y ago
I had a rather odd problem with Win10 and that is it hurt my eyes. I don't know whether they changed something with ClearType or for some other reason but after two days I reverted back to Win7. Other than that, I really didn't like the UI. To change colors in menus you have to use a hack because the preselected list of colors is just dreadful, the start menu once again is all over the place and various other mishaps that give the impression that it's not a finished product. They try to build a unified OS for all devices when all I want is a simple desktop OS.
- ino 10y ago
  They don't care. Even the default background has big JPEG artifacts.
mysterydip 10y ago
You don't really realize just how much win10 is doing in the background until you try it (preinstalled) on a cheap low-end notebook. It was literally unusable out of the box (which I suspect is why I was able to get mine as an "open box" discount). Minutes of freezes and waiting for anything to open or run. I installed win8.1 on it and everything runs smooth by comparison.
stevebmark 10y ago
I'm someone who stuck with Windows 7. The history of Windows has been so shaky, and the general software quality of Microsoft is so low, that the only rational strategy with Windows is "if it ain't broken, don't fix it." I have both Windows and Mac hardware, and I prefer to update my Mac OS as soon as updates are available. On reflection, I suppose it's because the software quality is always high, and I know the core linux-based OS won't have any major changes. Upgrading, except for the occasional "I guess networking doesn't work now," is a pleasant and expected process. There are also rarely, at least for me, compatibility issues with existing software and newer Mac OS versions. It seems like major versions of Windows are completely different operating systems, with "improvements" built on top of original hacks and poor code, and news reports of zero day crippling flaws in every new version. And of course, Windows 10 looks visually terrible. Flat design in general looks bad, but Windows 10 seems to have done something especially colorblind with it.
- Laforet 10y ago
  As someone stuck with Windows Vista (no sarcasm intended, although I shall be upgrading later this year when patches stop coming) I beg to differ. There is a continued degree of improvement since the Windows 9x days and in the meantime Windows have displaced Mac OS and Linux in certain market segments because of its code quality not despite of it. It is impressive that they have maintained great legacy support alongside it. The current tirade against Windows 10 is not really that different to the period after Windows XP came out just because it is radically different to its predecessor, yet the latter eventually became the most long lived MS product ever. A similar torrent of FUD did kill Vista's reputation, but as we all know Windows 7 is just minor upgrade but this rebranding is enough to pacify the most vocal critics. Make me wonder if Jobs was right that users really have no idea whats the best for them.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
jest3r1 10y ago
We've got a bunch of Win 8 computers at work, but we missed the free upgrade. So were stuck. Would be nice to get the free upgrade back.
- windows10rules 10y ago
  >Would be nice to get the free upgrade back. You're not missing as much as you think :)
anneBarcelona 10y ago
this is good news for having only to test for <10 but bad for my Node.JS projects with native bindings which have been only fixable in recent versions due to node gyp.
valine 10y ago
> There is no question that Windows 10 is an impressive piece of software, and quite the most secure operating system ever devised. This is simply not true. Windows is in no way the most secure operating system ever devised. Microsoft has support pages devoted to removing malware from Windows 10, while there has never been a major malware outbreak on iOS. For the average user iOS is by far the most secure OS. Now obviously a lot of iOS's security can be attributed to Apple's walled garden approach to apps. If you limit the question to desktop operating systems I supose it's slightly less cut and dry, but I'd still rank macOS significantly higher than windows in terms of overall security. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/instantanswers/eed4ec56-375f-4e6d-9813-e504e9ddf7de/how-to-remove-malware-or-viruses-from-my-windows-10-pc https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/instantanswers/eed4ec56-...
- kogepathic 10y ago
  > There is no question that Windows 10 is an impressive piece of software, and quite the most secure operating system ever devised. I think the author should have said "the most secure version of Windows sever devised" instead, as it would be much harder to disagree with.
microcolonel 10y ago
>...and quite the most secure operating system ever devised. What are they smoking over there at the economist? Perhaps they meant "the most secure iteration of Windows yet".
myrandomcomment 10y ago
"There is no question that Windows 10 is an impressive piece of software, and quite the most secure operating system ever devised." What? Sorry had to have a bit of a chuckle. That being said it is the most secure version of Windows, well with the expection of collecting tons of your personal habits.
Twisell 10y ago
What bother me is that they use net application data only... However I tend to question that source as we have now reached a strange situation where MacOS market share is around 6% according to netapplication (netmarketshare) and around 11% with globalstatscounter. They can't be both right and that is a huge divergence. https://www.netmarketshare.com/report.aspx?qprid=9&qptimeframe=M&qpsp=206&qpnp=11&qpch=350&qpdisplay=111111111111110&qpdt=1&qpct=4&qpcustomb=0&qpcid=fw215634&qpf=1 https://www.netmarketshare.com/report.aspx?qprid=9&qptimefra... http://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/#monthly-201701-201701-bar http://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/...
Jaruzel 10y ago
I'm not a a massive fan of Windows 10, so I'm certainly not trying to sell it, but here are some takeaways: 1. After holding out until December 2016, and only really using Windows 10 on dev machines/VMs , I finally threw caution to the wind an attempted to upgrade my very heavily loaded (software wise) main Windows 7 machine to Windows 10. Upgrade went fine, absolutely zero issues, and everything still worked 100% afterwards. No-one was more surprised than I was about this. I actually think it's because the hardware is a brand name (HP) desktop, and not a self build. 2. I've turned everything off I don't wont, all the privacy snoops; Cortana is gone completely; and the OneDrive icon does nothing. 3. Since early Windows 7, I switched to a menu bar type launcher that sits on-top at the top edge of the screen, it's populated with links to everything I use. I never click on the start menu, so it's bad behavior and stupid tiles don't really bother me. Screenshot: https://www.weegeeks.com/upload/ApplicationBar-2014-09-29.png https://www.weegeeks.com/upload/ApplicationBar-2014-09-29.pn... 4. The forced updates really irritate me. It's my PC why am I being dictated to on this? 5. VB6 apps still work without issue! (LOL!) 6. By comparison, whose bright idea was it not to include .NET runtime 2.0-3.5 by default? This leaves a schism for older apps - Run fine on Windows 7 and 8.1, but needs the runtime to (try) and auto install on Windows 10, or recompile the app targeting .NET 4.0+ and run fine on Windows 10, but completely fail on Windows 7/8.1 with a dialog saying the runtime is missing. Arrrgh. Overall, I'm living with it, mainly because I've banished all the bad bits, so now it's doing what a good OS should - support me, but also not get in my way. I'm not sure I could use Windows 10 in it's default state though, which is why I'm slowly moving towards a completely customised shell (once I find/write one I like). Edit: Forgot to mention - if you can lay your hands on it, have a look at 'Windows 10 2016 LTSB' edition - it's designed for corporates who don't want all the consumer crap, so a lot of the stupid stuff is not installed by default. It also ONLY accepts security updates, and refuses any updated that are 'feature updates'. Downside, it needs a KMS keyserver for activation.
todd8 10y ago
I am surprised by how hard it is to find reliable information about Window issues. Most pages I find look like thinly veiled pitches to get me to buy some stupid utility or online service. Its easy to find authoritative information on Mac OS or Linux issues, but I can't trust most of what I read about solving any Windows issue. I would like to swap out my system dive and replace it with an SSD. Every discussion on the web I come across wants me to download some third party backup/restore or cloning software. Isn't there anything in Windows or that comes from Microsoft for me to do it?
AstralStorm 10y ago
I stopped reading at "quite the most secure operating system ever devised".

165 points by hourislate 10y ago

It's bizarre that people continue to think of Windows PCs as being predominantly owned by individuals or even individuals with a specific interest in technology.

fetbaffe 10y ago
Correct! Compare it to a group that care about their PC, i.e. gamers, 50% of Steam users run Windows 10. https://www.pcgamesn.com/steam-hardware-survey-windows-10-adoption-rate https://www.pcgamesn.com/steam-hardware-survey-windows-10-ad...
- corin_ 10y ago
  Maybe I'm misreading your comment but I think you're implying that people who care (like gamers) are less likely to be using Windows 10, but it's the opposite - 50% is far higher than the total market share Windows 10 has. If I misunderstood your meaning, then this comment can just be a clarification instead of a correction :)
  - stock_toaster 10y ago
    Presumably gamers are after newer directx versions, which are only provided in windows10, no?
  - fetbaffe 10y ago
    You misunderstood. :-) Yes, gamers are above market share for Windows 10 because they care. They want the newest, the best.
- tonyedgecombe 10y ago
  The figure includes xbox one users.

mmanfrin 10y ago

More than 700m of the world's 1.5bn or so computers continue to run on Windows 7, a piece of software three generations old Win 7, Win 8, Win 10; 2 generations old. Preeeetty easy to check, WSJ. If your lede carries such a glaring mistake, why do I trust anything in this article.

sgift 10y ago
They probably count 8.1 extra which was a pretty significant overhaul compared to 8.
- boznz 10y ago
  significant in that they put the start menu back.
reubenmorais 10y ago
They are probably counting Windows 8.1.
icehawk219 10y ago
Maybe they're including Win 8.1? In that case it is 3 generations. Although Win 8.1 was an update to 8 so you could argue whether or not it should be included but lots of version lists list it separately.
charlieegan3 10y ago
I imagine they're counting 8.1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_8.1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_8.1
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
JackFr 10y ago
> Preeeetty easy to check, WSJ. How can I trust your nit-picky, pedantic complaint when you believe the article is in the WSJ rather than the Economist?
10y ago

nul_byte 10y ago

I have a dual boot PC which is Arch Linux and Windows 7. The Windows 7 machine is only for gaming / steam, I never browse the internet on there and have pretty strict firewall ruleset. To be honest, I would consider upgrading it to 10, but I missed the free window, so I really don't fancy paying for it. My hope is that by the time that Windows 7 goes EOL, I can delete it and game just on Linux. Either that or I will get a console (as most of my gaming takes place in my living room anyhow, using a steam box).

overcast 10y ago
You didn't miss any free window, you can still just download the image from Microsoft and upgrade. Upgrade to Windows 10. Windows 7 is archaic, especially for gaming as its primary use.
- aluhut 10y ago
  What are the advances of using 10 instead of 7 for gaming?
  - burkaman 10y ago
    You need Windows 10 to use DirectX 12, that's probably the biggest advance. The Windows Display Driver Model is also updated, I don't know if this actually matters for most games though.
    - aluhut 10y ago
      > You need Windows 10 to use DirectX 12, that's probably the biggest advance. More like a threat ;)
  - overcast 10y ago
    Modern drivers, DX12, native xbox one controller support, xbox one integration, background recording, game streaming, not going EOL, FREE.
  - deleted 10y ago

shmerl 10y ago

> But he has also dusted down his four-year-old Apple MacBook Pro and upgraded his Windows 7 desktop to the latest version of Linux Mint rather than Windows 10. <...> Despite their idiosyncrasies, Macintosh and Linux have never looked so attractive. Linux gets refugees both from Windows and MacOS because MS just keeps messing Windows up (seems to be happening every other version), and Apple simply lets MacOS rot by not giving it any attention.

melling 10y ago
You just made three subjective claims. I don't see Linux's market share growing by large numbers. Apple updates macOS every year. Which features do you want? I haven't used Windows in a while but Microsoft seems to be making faster progress in updating Windows, browser, etc.
- shmerl 10y ago
  > don't see Linux's market share growing by large numbers. https://www.netmarketshare.com/report.aspx?qprid=9&qpcustom=Linux&qpcustomb=0&qpsp=192&qpnp=25&qptimeframe=M https://www.netmarketshare.com/report.aspx?qprid=9&qpcustom=... > Apple updates macOS every year. I hear complaints from MacOS users about the bit rot all the time. Where is OpenGL 4.5 for instance? And not just graphics. Many simply feel it's completely stagnated, because Apple are too busy with their mobile delirium, and don't care about desktop anymore.
  - ihattendorf 10y ago
    > large numbers
    - shmerl 10y ago
      Absolute numbers are large. I'm more interested in the trend here. Still, there should be more push for Linux on the desktop. This sick situation exited for way too long.

nxrabl 10y ago

> There is no question that Windows 10 is ... quite the most secure operating system ever devised. Telemetry aside, can anyone comment on this?

drzaiusapelord 10y ago
Well, the most secure OS is something that's going to be endlessly arguable, but its probably the most secure Windows considering how people use computers today and how many attack surfaces a modern OS has. A lot of security features found in the previously stand-alone EMET are slowly being ported over natively to Win10, for example. It comes with a built-in AV which is pretty good. Smartscreen is unusually good at warning about suspicious executables and I've seen it stop ransomware attacks. VBS makes it harder for hackers to modify system or protected files. Secureboot and bitlocker support are useful in some scenarios. Device guard is supposed to helpful but I'm not sure how it works. Windows hello can replace the traditional password with camera or fingerprint auth cooked-in, which is probably a step in the right direction, although I'd rather see passphrases become more common. Cameras and fingerprints seem gimmmicky and not all my computers have those things.
- alexkavon 10y ago
  Windows Hello is the new platform for authentication. I imagine that all authentication APIs are grouped into Windows Hello, including traditional passphrases.
marcoperaza 10y ago
* Secure Boot * BitLocker: Hard-drive encryption backed by TPM & Secure Boot With the above two and DMA protection, physical access attacks become very difficult. * Virtual Secure Mode (VSM) - separate OS running on the hypervisor that can perform sensitive operations. Which enables: 1. Device Guard - Runs code integrity protection, i.e. only allowing signed code to run, from within the VSM. 2. Credential Guard - Runs user-mode security subsystem (LSA) inside VSM.
- semi-extrinsic 10y ago

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

cwyers 10y ago

The thing is, people don't upgrade Windows, in the large. They use the version of Windows their computer came with until they replace it. Microsoft has done more work getting people to upgrade to 10 than any previous version of Windows. I don't see what more they can do.

akappa 10y ago

I think there's an obvious and more general question here to be answered: if a piece of software is good enough, namely, it "disappears" when you are trying to do your job, then why bother to change it? Yes, the new version might enable a more efficient workflow, or might be faster to boot-up. But people hate changes and you need to invest considerable time in upgrading a piece of software (the upgrade itself + learning to navigate the new system + solving whatever goes wrong during the process). And that this is not just limited to "novices": I've heard wonderful things about Arch Linux, but my Ubuntu system works well enough and I've been using it for forever, so the incentives are pretty low and the time to be invested pretty high.

kodfodrasz 10y ago
The users may perceive operation satisfying, yet it may not be so, eg. because of security issues, which on the other hand pose dangers to other users as well, so the it doesn't matter to me attitude doesn't stand. Given that the upgrade was free just as in the case of a linux upgrade the good enough point should consider these factors as well.
izacus 10y ago
Because developers want to make more money. This is why the app store format is so incredibly popular amongst the developer crowd - it forces people to keep paying you to upgrade app to follow breaking Apple/Google changes just to keep the functionality of the app the same and it appearing for users of new phones. 15 year old software that works well and you buy once does not bring a steady income.
- Godel_unicode 10y ago
  I think that you're wrong about why developers love app stores. It's about someone else solving all of the problems which aren't "make your app". It handles updates, feedback, discoverability, CC info, password resets, etc. I've never had the experience you describe; which app(s) are you talking about which need to be bought repeatedly with no new functionality?
- moosingin3space 10y ago

rwc 10y ago

> Chromebooks are now outselling MacBooks in the crucial education market, where long-term preferences tend to be established. Apple has historically held a dominant position in the education market, so how does one square the "long-term preferences tend to be established" portion of that sentence with the 8% marketshare MacOS commands?

nix0n 10y ago
Even if people would prefer macs and perceive them to be superior (regardless of whether this is true), most aren't willing to shell out the cash for one.
trendia 10y ago
Unfortunately, Chromebooks will struggle with the engineering crowd, where software like ANSYS, Matlab, AutoCAD, etc. are required.
- protomyth 10y ago
  Plus the crowd who cannot have data go to external servers. I would love to use something like Chromebooks but the lack of a local storage server and user management kill it. I got to follow the rules after all. If I could get a group of Chromebooks that sync with an on-site server then do my backups to someone like Tarsnap, I would be happy and following the local rules.
- bmon 10y ago
  My experience too. My chromebook has easily been the best value for money computer I've ever purchased, but it's just not the right device for development outside of the web browser. Maybe sometime soon browser based cad tools will become more widely adopted but there are some serious limitations imposed by web browsers that make that difficult to see happening anytime soon.
- tonyedgecombe 10y ago
  Personally I'd be quite happy if the market for PC's bifurcated into thin clients on one side and powerful workstations on the other. The user experience for professionals has been compromised by the need to support 'normal' users on both Windows and OS/X.

frik 10y ago

No wonder that Win10 fails like Win8 - Microsoft doesn't care about users, they only care about their shareholders. Win8 and Win10 looks like designed by color blind designers with a bad taste the brutalism of UI design plus the phone-home spyware features that cannot be deactivated. Windows 7 is too good and the perfect OS, if you don't install some recent spyware updates it will last at least until 2020 - and who knows if Android/Fuchsia or whatever OS is a proper alternative than.

Arizhel 10y ago
Look, I don't like the flat-UI trend any more than you, but there's two simple facts here: 1) It's not just MS pushing the flat-UI trend. Apple and Google are too, along with every other Web/UI designer out there. Everyone's doing it. MS's version does seem to be the ugliest though, mainly because of the horrible color picks. 2) The users you seem concerned about like this stuff. They're all buying and using Windows, along with Macs, iOS, Android, etc. devices. There's simply no serious effort being put into any UI alternatives. There's some stuff going on in Linux-land that has a minuscule marketshare, but that's about it; even there, the most popular desktop is Gnome3, which is on the same bandwagon in many ways.
- corin_ 10y ago
  Your second point doesn't really hold up - I'm a Windows 10 user, and I don't spend any time even considering Linux UI alternatives because you could show me one that I liked twice as much as Windows and I still wouldn't want to use Linux for my day to day stuff. I actually don't mind the Windows 10 UI as it happens, but if there were the variety of options for Windows that there are for Linux, I'd certainly see if I could find one I liked more.
  - Arizhel 10y ago
    If people actually cared about it that much, at the very least there'd be some 3rd-party program available for Windows that would improve the UI, and it'd be selling like hotcakes. I've never heard of any. Same goes for MacOS, iOS, and Android.

0xFFC 10y ago

Just fix fucking font rendering, I did use Windows machine as my workstation for 4 year (although being in love with linux), But I had to switch to Ubuntu, because of ridiculous font rendering. I don't have money to pay for new monitor every 2 year, and I am quite happy with my dual monitor 27 inch 1080p until windows 10 changed font rendering to DirectWrite. It is fucking disaster in low dpi monitor. As always Microsoft ignored their current users in pursue of new users. I haven't seen this attitude from any other company. I haven't seen apple make font rendering on old MacBook worse to force people to switch to new MacBooks. Or I haven't seen something similar from Google. This is fucking total disaster. As someone who reads text for whole day (programmer) I care about my eyes and it fucking hurts my eye to see font rendering in new UI (UWP) and Edge. p.s. Old/win32 application do use old rendering engine and are acceptable.

alyandon 10y ago
Yeah, I honestly thought I had a hardware issue on a computer I built for my son with a 24" 1080p monitor and it turned out to be Windows 10 font rendering changes. I use Ubuntu at work and my other Windows 10 machine has 1920x1200 monitors at a distance that makes the rendering regression not easily noticeable. It's great for small 1080p screens on laptops and 4k monitors though. :-/
- 0xFFC 10y ago
  Exactly, That was my whole point, Microsoft tried vigorously to ignore me and you (their current users) to compete with apple and google. Do you see the irony? Microsoft does suffer from mismanagement. You should never ever mess with your current user experience to improve your imaginary users experience.
TimJYoung 10y ago
We're re-vamping some of our Windows products this year to support high-DPI usage under Windows 10, so if you could be so kind, I would be curious as to what exactly you're seeing that is causing your issue: is it that older Windows applications look blurry because they aren't high-DPI-aware and Windows 10 auto-scales them, or is it that you don't like the high-DPI look because it's too sharp/jagged, looks weird on older monitors, etc. ? I don't want to piss off our customers by making their usage experience poorer under Windows 10, so I would really appreciate any input you can provide.

digi_owl 10y ago

Win10 fails for different reacons than Win8. While 8 tried to make tablet the priority use case, and thus breaking the muscle memory of many long term users, 10 abandons the notion of the owner of the hardware being in charge (sadly one that is increasingly taking root in FOSS circles as well). Thus you have things like updates being ramrodded through even if the user says no, and keep saying no. Damn it, i keep having to roll back the driver of my igpu because for some reason MS keep trying to update it along with the dgpu. This even though the support has been discontinued by AMD...

eikenberry 10y ago
> [..] (sadly one that is increasingly taking root in FOSS circles as well). What are you talking about? The modern prevalence of binary firmware blobs is the only concern I can think of in this area.

mdekkers 10y ago

It appears that I have reached some kind of "article limit"

aq3cn 10y ago
click on go to old version.

Unbeliever69 10y ago

I am a manager at a small architecture firm and Windows 10 has brought nothing but woe to my office. We have spent dozens of hours and thousands of dollars troubleshooting and fixing problems (many of which remain unresolved) that occurred as a result of this draconian forced upgrade (and updates that followed). So what if we got the upgrade for free. I've paid for it many times over in labor!

diminoten 10y ago
When I hear complaints like this, basically any complaint about a major technology in use around the world, I am always baffled that the people who have trouble end up blaming the technology, rather than their policies and implementation. This technology works (almost) flawlessly for hundreds of thousands of people and organizations, the idea that the issues you're experiencing are legitimately the fault of the technology feels... unlikely. I get that the best technology adapts perfectly to your individual needs, but the idea that you don't have to change a single thing about your business to use a technology just feels, on its face, absurd.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
rjbwork 10y ago
In light of so many hundreds of millions of people still using 7, how was it forced?
- sounds 10y ago
  http://www.pcworld.com/article/3088755/windows/a-lawsuit-over-an-unwanted-windows-10-upgrade-just-cost-microsoft-10000.html http://www.pcworld.com/article/3088755/windows/a-lawsuit-ove... https://www.extremetech.com/computing/232599-microsoft-slapped-with-class-action-lawsuits-over-windows-10-upgrade-practices https://www.extremetech.com/computing/232599-microsoft-slapp... https://www.cnet.com/news/microsoft-pays-woman-10000-over-forced-windows-10-install/ https://www.cnet.com/news/microsoft-pays-woman-10000-over-fo... http://lmgtfy.com/?q=windows+10+forced+upgrade http://lmgtfy.com/?q=windows+10+forced+upgrade

yokohummer7 10y ago

IMO the success of Windows 7 was an exception, not the norm. Comparing the adoption rate of Windows 10 to that of Windows 7 might be a little harsh. 24% isn't actually that bad, considering Windows 7 is still good enough.

nyolfen 10y ago

i must give windows10 credit for one thing -- it finally convinced me to dive into linux

pdog 10y ago

Windows 10 is a great operating system, but if you have an existing business-critical workflow, why would you update your major version? Stick with what works unless you have a reason to update. It's why some multinational companies are still running COBOL programs after nearly sixty years.

mark-r 10y ago

Microsoft is their own worst enemy. My wife can't transition fully from XP to the Windows 7 PC I built for her, because it doesn't have Outlook Express or any reasonable substitute. We can't upgrade the living room PC because Windows 10 doesn't include Media Center. I'm also not fond of the way Windows 10 updates are so aggressive, you'll essentially be replacing your OS every so often without any say-so. If I had any faith that this would be painless I might be tempted to try it, but see above. Windows 7 is darn near perfect, you can pry it from my cold dead hands.

jimmaswell 10y ago
You can disable the Windows Update service.
- boznz 10y ago
  I'm sure theres a hack but this is not possible in Windows 10 home.
  - Filligree 10y ago
    And a good thing, too. I'm tired of fighting botnets.
  - jimmaswell 10y ago
    Are you sure it doesn't let you just turn the service off in services.msc? I can't find any references online to the Home edition having that behavior.
    - boznz 10y ago
      Love to be corrected on this, but everything I have seen involves a registry hack
ZeroClickOk 10y ago
Media Center? Why dont you use Kodi (former XBMC)?

testUser69 10y ago

>The business world has been even more recalcitrant. In a recent study by Softchoice, an info-tech consultancy, corporate computers were found to be running a whole gamut of legacy versions of Windows. Fewer than 1% of them had been upgraded to Windows 10. One thing I've learned over the years: you don't need a high IQ to run a successful business. Without a lot of smarts you're never going to compete with google, but you don't need to compete with google to make a living running your own business. >Chromebooks are now outselling MacBooks in the crucial education market, where long-term preferences tend to be established. It's unfortunate that proprietary software ever came to dominate schooling. Hopefully ChromeOS will open things up just enough so that cross platform tools become the norm. Schools using both Windows and Chrome will be more aware of proprietary/incompatible software and file formats and choose to use open formats. >It is impossible to retrofit older Windows versions with the sort of defense-in-depth that has been built into Windows 10. Nor would Microsoft do so even if it could. If anything, it is about to do the opposite. Windows 7 users will soon lose access to a stand-alone toolkit for mitigating zero-day exploits. Another reason why Windows is a joke OS for serious tech enthusiasts. >A word of warning, though: such upgrades do not necessarily go without a hitch. A Windows 10 tablet your correspondent relied upon for much of his mobile computing was broken irreparably when a recent update corrupted the display driver, rendering the touchscreen useless. ......... makes you wonder why they lock these things down, are tech enthusiasts even designing them? >But he has also dusted down his four-year-old Apple MacBook Pro and upgraded his Windows 7 desktop to the latest version of Linux Mint rather than Windows 10. Yes I prefer Linux to Windows in most cases too. I never have good long term experiences with Windows. >It used to be that only free software came with advertising; users paid a fee, if they chose to do so, to get the software free of advertising. Microsoft charges top dollar for Windows 10 ($120 or $200, depending on the edition) and now wants to bombard users with sales pitches to boot—without so much as by your leave, let alone the option to turn the nuisance off. Despite their idiosyncrasies, Macintosh and Linux have never looked so attractive. Yeah these days pretty much the only people who are using Windows are people who don't know any better. Most people aren't even exposed to Linux except those of us in the tech sector, and it seems to be just as popular as windows and OS X at the shops I've worked at.

newplagiarist 10y ago

ZeroClickOk 10y ago

I dont know why name Windows 10 a fail, when the bigger competitors of Windows are... Windows! Mac and Linux mostly are used for niche users (as us). I'm really really happy we CAN upgrade for a new Windows version easily, just compare with Android. More: the reason to most people dont upgrade isn't why "Windows 7 is better than Windows 10", but the actual reason is they are comfortable with Win7 and dont want/can take time to "learn" a new OS. Even Win7 being an awesome OS, took years to take most of XP users (even today there are a lot of loyal XP users out there...)

cowardlydragon 10y ago
Android and iOS have probably surpassed windows in number of consumer installations. The PC will be invaded by Android at some point, and it will be like a blitzkreig when it happens. Google would make all their money back shortly off of appstore sales.
- Infinitesimus 10y ago
  > The PC will be invaded by Android at some point As much as I enjoy using Android on mobile, Google's horrible track record with security updates means I'll be appalled if after all the noise people have made about Win 10's privacy, they accept Android with Google everywhere + security updates EOL after 3 years...
- computerex 10y ago
  That's already happened, PC sales have already declined in favor of mobile years ago. And contrary to what people may think, appstore sales are also not really on the rise, and most users don't install any new apps in their phone monthly.

boznz 10y ago

Forget any other reason, for $150 a licence (NZ$199) my other computers will never ever see windows 10.. ever

jjcm 10y ago
Is $150 that crazy? The original prices for 7 were: Windows 7 Home Premium (Upgrade) $119.99 Windows 7 Home Premium (Full) $199.99 Windows 7 Family Pack (Upgrade, retail only) $149.99 Windows 7 Professional (Upgrade) $199.99 Windows 7 Professional (Full) $299.99 Windows 7 Ultimate (Upgrade) $219.99 Windows 7 Ultimate (Full) $319.99 $150 seems completely in line with pricing of previous windows versions.
- boznz 10y ago
  Fine if that's their strategy, my argument still stands.

k__ 10y ago

I installed it yesterday for the first time and it still seems to have problems. Somehow Chrome always freezes every few minutes. Didn't do this on Win8.1 or Win7 :/

arca_vorago 10y ago

I also don't think you can have this discussion without talking about the influence the NSA and OGA's are having on big tech companies products. If game developers really pulled their shit together and started doing AAA/AA titles on linux you would quickly see the piss taken out of the likes of M$.

epx 10y ago

I miss Windows 7. It did work just like Windows 95. It was just downhill from that.

rkapsoro 10y ago

I'm normally very fond of The Economist, but this is one of their "blog posts", which seem to not receive quite the same careful, nuanced care that their other articles for their weekly edition do. Part of the challenge of Windows 10 was the transformation of Windows from a large-release product into a trickle-release service with much faster cycle times with an incremental and continuously-learned approach to ongoing product changes. At it's core, that's a valid and (I think) mostly welcome change, but Microsoft's solution to the impedance mismatch between the two categories of offering was to force it down and ask for forgiveness later. :/

ajmurmann 10y ago

Do users actually desire changes to the actual user experience of modern operating systems. I would be totally fine with the OS experience itself I had on Windows 2000 or OS X from 2010. Software that runs on top of the OS and support of it is a different issue. Of course also security and driver support. To me OS user experience is a solved problem and most changed to what I'm used to just make things different without providing value, but require me to retrain muscle memory. I do upgrade regularly because security. If that wasn't an issue I would never upgrade.

idobai 10y ago

Just ditch win and m$ and get freedom with linux. You're all just giving up your rights for privacy and your freedom to get locked to a company doing malicious shit for decades in exchange for a few exclusive apps. Unreasonable...

youdontknowtho 10y ago

In which the economist finally succumbs to clickbait. WEAK.

dmalvarado 10y ago

Well that was weird. tldr; Windows has 92% OS share. Windows 10 only accounts for 24% (maybe). Windows 10 is so, so secure. How to make people upgrade? Windows 10 new update will have advertising. Other OS's sure look good now. I feel like this section of the Economist doesn't get much editorial review.

acqq 10y ago
> Windows 10 new update will have advertising. And I don't see anybody blinks here on HN about that. Why? https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/85341/microsoft-cheapens-windows-10-ads https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/85341/microsoft-... "So Windows 10 pops-up little advertising windows—sorry, tips—on the Edge icon in the taskbar, or in the Action Center UI, or in the Settings interface where you can change your defaults, because it really, really, really doesn’t want you to exercise free will and make a better decision for yourself." "For the next version of Windows 10, Microsoft is even experimenting with ads—sorry, tips—that will appear in File Explorer. You don’t get any more “in the OS user interface” than that, folks, unless Microsoft starts displaying ads in event logs next. Don’t laugh. So repeat after me: There are ads all over Windows. And it’s just getting worse."
- Infinitesimus 10y ago
  > And I don't see anybody blinks here on HN about that. Why? People did complain about start menu ads a lot when it first came out. I don't see their "Edge is faster/more battery friendly" ads as entirely bad though 1. Edge is more battery friendly on Windows laptops 2. Google does the same thing by prompting you to install Chrome does it not? Difference is OS vs website but google.com is the default "internet" for an awful lot of people...
- tonyedgecombe 10y ago
  This was the final straw for me, as soon as I started seeing ads (on the pro version) I decided to switch.

mschuster91 10y ago

Well, the reason why corporate users are holding on to W7 is easy: training costs. With XP and even W7, you could at least switch the majority of the GUI to look and feel like good old W95/98/ME... no way to do so with W10. Also many companies don't want the legal risk associated with telemetry (you never know what data leaves your premises and heads towards MS), and small-ish businesses are afraid of the non-disableable automatic updates - I certainly wouldn't want to get into the office and $essential_program has stopped working over night due to an update gone bad.

hfsktr 10y ago

I must be in the huge minority. I haven't had a single issue with Windows 10 (if we disregard privacy). Literally everything has just worked. I will say thinking about it that my computer used for 99.99% gaming/internet/text documents. I keep anticipating that something is going to go horribly wrong but so far it's been great. I hate the menu and store that it shows so almost everything I tend to open has a shortcut on the desktop or is pinned to the toolbar. Having a functional toolbar on both monitors. That right there was all I wished windows 7 would do but otherwise I can barely tell that the OS is different. I never used windows 8 so I don't have a comparison to that but I've seen Windows ME...

distantsounds 10y ago
You can remove just about all the tiles and extra bloat from the Start Menu, bringing on a more familiar return of what it used to be. Just right-click and 'remove' every tile until there's nothing left.
- Pica_soO 10y ago
  If i wanted to work to customize my OS, i would have Nuxed it.
  - freehunter 10y ago
    If you don't want to work to customize your OS, you accept the defaults. Those are your two options, and you've already ruled out one of them.
    - khedoros1 10y ago
      Option 3: Use an OS (or at least OS version) that offers better defaults, while still running the software that you need.
      - freehunter 10y ago
        Well then the OS that you're complaining about isn't exactly "your OS" is it? It's now someone else's OS and you're just complaining about something you don't even use.

bayeslives 10y ago

I've been using both Windows (work) and Linux (home) on the desktop for many years. I far prefer Linux (I tried many distros, settled on Arch and Mint now). Package management and window management is way better in Linux. To name just a few. To me, Windows10 is not better than Windows7. The package management is still a mess. Forced updates, no rollbacks, reboots, you name it. Permissions are also strange: why are admin rights needed to install some fonts? We still have this "Registry" with its voodoo. We still miss tools like dmesg. When thing go wrong, Windows gives some sort of simple log file, of course not in txt-form but in some proprietary format that needs it's own reader (to read some flat text, for crying out loud). The file manager ("Explorer") is still confusing. Microsoft seems hellbent in obfuscating where files are stored. Going to the terminal, the difference is even clearer. Linux offers first rate terminals; Windows look like an afterthought. Is it even possible to use a terminal full screen in Windows, nowadays? Tab completion, a decent history, pipes? The funny thing is that Ranger, my favorite file manager, is able to give previews of files in MS formats (such as .docx) where Windows Explorer is unable to do so.... ???? Two big steps back are privacy and font rendering. It's bad enough that apps spy on me, I don't want my OS to"phone home". The font rendering is optimized for the few Windows on mobile devices users, at the expense of the bulk of the users (like me) who use it on the desktop and are now confronted with blurry fonts. My OS must help me with my personal computer tasks. Personal means a) I want to customize the hell out of it, and b) my data is _mine_. Also, I'd like a nice readable font on my screen. Sadly, Windows10 does not meet those requirements.

tdkl 10y ago
>The package management is still a mess. If you mean for system updates I'd agree, but software package management is a shit show on Linux and it shows why less people bother writing software with & why Electron is popular there. What's more easier then clicking an .exe ?
- oldsj 10y ago
  And (although I don't think its Win10 specific) but there's chocolatey now too which is great
- 10y ago

jacquesc 10y ago

I got a Windows 10 laptop (Razer) for Christmas for gaming / media / browsing purposes (been a Mac user for 10+ yrs). It's buggy as hell. The shortcut icons on the desktop and taskbar kept going away (replacing all the icons with a "not found" placeholder), forcing me to reinstall the OS. Now none of the search functions work (e.g. windows key -> search for app.. no results). Whatever, I just use 2 apps anyways (Chrome and Steam). Windows settings panels have at least 2 diff ways to configure anything, the "old" and the "new". Graphics settings have 4 places to change stuff (Intel, Nvidia, built in old and new). It's just a jumbled mess. Bluetooth never recognizes device names (it's a guessing game as to which "Unknown Device" is the one I want). The trackpad is mediocre, and the config panel from Synaptics probably hasn't changed since Windows 95. With the tech press in love with Windows 10, I was definitely expecting more. Feels like people just want to love every other version of Windows (7 "good", 8 "bad", 10 "good again).

tw04 10y ago
>Windows settings panels have at least 2 diff ways to configure anything, the "old" and the "new". Graphics settings have 4 places to change stuff (Intel, Nvidia, built in old and new). It's just a jumbled mess. They're well aware of that, and if you follow the insider previews, every new build is moving more of the features into the "new" way of doing things. Is it annoying there are two places? Absolutely... but the alternative is not changing anything and waiting 5 years while everything gets rolle dup. >Bluetooth never recognizes device names (it's a guessing game as to which "Unknown Device" is the one I want). The trackpad is mediocre, and the config panel from Synaptics probably hasn't changed since Windows 95. Not sure what to tell you there other than a buggy driver on your laptop. All of my bluetooth devices tell me exactly what they are before and after adding them. The trackpad thing isn't Windows, it's the trackpad razer chose to use, or the driver. One of the reasons that MS finally said f-it and introduced precision touchpad. If you still have the old-school synaptics panel, then Razer chose not to participate.
- wtallis 10y ago
  > but the alternative is not changing anything and waiting 5 years while everything gets rolle dup. Windows 7 was released 7.5 years ago, and Windows 8 was released 4.5 years ago. Whether or not they make interim releases, Microsoft clearly cannot pull off a user interface overhaul in any reasonable span of time.

Animats 10y ago

The basic problem with Windows 10 is that it was intended for tablets/mobile first. On a desktop, there's just not much need for it.

dcdevito 10y ago

Windows 10 gets a lot of flak, but it's honestly the best OS I have ever used. It's fast, stable, reliable and secure. Oh, and I should mention I'm a developer, and WSL is getting better with every release. Is it perfect? Heck no, but it's sure a lot better than Linux on the desktop and Macs are just not worth my money anymore.

vacri 10y ago
I don't really count a forced reboot "now or in 15 minutes, no delays" as reliable. There are people who've had this happen in the middle of presentations at meetings. Similarly, I've had these forced updates happen, and on relogin "click here to see what was updated" -> nothing listed.
- dcdevito 10y ago
  I don't understand this whole "forced updates" FUD. Just configure the times you want your machine to be updated and it gets out of the way.
  - aninhumer 10y ago
    Except that the configuration options force you to choose at least a 12 hour contiguous period in which updates are allowed. If I could tell it to reboot at 4am when I'm definitely asleep that would be fine, but apparently that's not an option.
- chrisper 10y ago
  I believe that behavior is going to change with the new big update.

casparz 10y ago

Stopped reading at: "There is no question that Windows 10 is an impressive piece of software, and quite the most secure operating system ever devised."

oldsj 10y ago
Yea that was really strange to see. I had to look up and double check what website I was on when I saw that

elorant 10y ago

I had a rather odd problem with Win10 and that is it hurt my eyes. I don't know whether they changed something with ClearType or for some other reason but after two days I reverted back to Win7. Other than that, I really didn't like the UI. To change colors in menus you have to use a hack because the preselected list of colors is just dreadful, the start menu once again is all over the place and various other mishaps that give the impression that it's not a finished product. They try to build a unified OS for all devices when all I want is a simple desktop OS.

ino 10y ago
They don't care. Even the default background has big JPEG artifacts.

mysterydip 10y ago

You don't really realize just how much win10 is doing in the background until you try it (preinstalled) on a cheap low-end notebook. It was literally unusable out of the box (which I suspect is why I was able to get mine as an "open box" discount). Minutes of freezes and waiting for anything to open or run. I installed win8.1 on it and everything runs smooth by comparison.

stevebmark 10y ago

I'm someone who stuck with Windows 7. The history of Windows has been so shaky, and the general software quality of Microsoft is so low, that the only rational strategy with Windows is "if it ain't broken, don't fix it." I have both Windows and Mac hardware, and I prefer to update my Mac OS as soon as updates are available. On reflection, I suppose it's because the software quality is always high, and I know the core linux-based OS won't have any major changes. Upgrading, except for the occasional "I guess networking doesn't work now," is a pleasant and expected process. There are also rarely, at least for me, compatibility issues with existing software and newer Mac OS versions. It seems like major versions of Windows are completely different operating systems, with "improvements" built on top of original hacks and poor code, and news reports of zero day crippling flaws in every new version. And of course, Windows 10 looks visually terrible. Flat design in general looks bad, but Windows 10 seems to have done something especially colorblind with it.

Laforet 10y ago
As someone stuck with Windows Vista (no sarcasm intended, although I shall be upgrading later this year when patches stop coming) I beg to differ. There is a continued degree of improvement since the Windows 9x days and in the meantime Windows have displaced Mac OS and Linux in certain market segments because of its code quality not despite of it. It is impressive that they have maintained great legacy support alongside it. The current tirade against Windows 10 is not really that different to the period after Windows XP came out just because it is radically different to its predecessor, yet the latter eventually became the most long lived MS product ever. A similar torrent of FUD did kill Vista's reputation, but as we all know Windows 7 is just minor upgrade but this rebranding is enough to pacify the most vocal critics. Make me wonder if Jobs was right that users really have no idea whats the best for them.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

jest3r1 10y ago

We've got a bunch of Win 8 computers at work, but we missed the free upgrade. So were stuck. Would be nice to get the free upgrade back.

windows10rules 10y ago
>Would be nice to get the free upgrade back. You're not missing as much as you think :)

anneBarcelona 10y ago

this is good news for having only to test for <10 but bad for my Node.JS projects with native bindings which have been only fixable in recent versions due to node gyp.

valine 10y ago

> There is no question that Windows 10 is an impressive piece of software, and quite the most secure operating system ever devised. This is simply not true. Windows is in no way the most secure operating system ever devised. Microsoft has support pages devoted to removing malware from Windows 10, while there has never been a major malware outbreak on iOS. For the average user iOS is by far the most secure OS. Now obviously a lot of iOS's security can be attributed to Apple's walled garden approach to apps. If you limit the question to desktop operating systems I supose it's slightly less cut and dry, but I'd still rank macOS significantly higher than windows in terms of overall security. https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/instantanswers/eed4ec56-375f-4e6d-9813-e504e9ddf7de/how-to-remove-malware-or-viruses-from-my-windows-10-pc https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/instantanswers/eed4ec56-...

kogepathic 10y ago
> There is no question that Windows 10 is an impressive piece of software, and quite the most secure operating system ever devised. I think the author should have said "the most secure version of Windows sever devised" instead, as it would be much harder to disagree with.

microcolonel 10y ago

>...and quite the most secure operating system ever devised. What are they smoking over there at the economist? Perhaps they meant "the most secure iteration of Windows yet".

myrandomcomment 10y ago

"There is no question that Windows 10 is an impressive piece of software, and quite the most secure operating system ever devised." What? Sorry had to have a bit of a chuckle. That being said it is the most secure version of Windows, well with the expection of collecting tons of your personal habits.

Twisell 10y ago

What bother me is that they use net application data only... However I tend to question that source as we have now reached a strange situation where MacOS market share is around 6% according to netapplication (netmarketshare) and around 11% with globalstatscounter. They can't be both right and that is a huge divergence. https://www.netmarketshare.com/report.aspx?qprid=9&qptimeframe=M&qpsp=206&qpnp=11&qpch=350&qpdisplay=111111111111110&qpdt=1&qpct=4&qpcustomb=0&qpcid=fw215634&qpf=1 https://www.netmarketshare.com/report.aspx?qprid=9&qptimefra... http://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/#monthly-201701-201701-bar http://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/desktop/worldwide/...

Jaruzel 10y ago

I'm not a a massive fan of Windows 10, so I'm certainly not trying to sell it, but here are some takeaways: 1. After holding out until December 2016, and only really using Windows 10 on dev machines/VMs , I finally threw caution to the wind an attempted to upgrade my very heavily loaded (software wise) main Windows 7 machine to Windows 10. Upgrade went fine, absolutely zero issues, and everything still worked 100% afterwards. No-one was more surprised than I was about this. I actually think it's because the hardware is a brand name (HP) desktop, and not a self build. 2. I've turned everything off I don't wont, all the privacy snoops; Cortana is gone completely; and the OneDrive icon does nothing. 3. Since early Windows 7, I switched to a menu bar type launcher that sits on-top at the top edge of the screen, it's populated with links to everything I use. I never click on the start menu, so it's bad behavior and stupid tiles don't really bother me. Screenshot: https://www.weegeeks.com/upload/ApplicationBar-2014-09-29.png https://www.weegeeks.com/upload/ApplicationBar-2014-09-29.pn... 4. The forced updates really irritate me. It's my PC why am I being dictated to on this? 5. VB6 apps still work without issue! (LOL!) 6. By comparison, whose bright idea was it not to include .NET runtime 2.0-3.5 by default? This leaves a schism for older apps - Run fine on Windows 7 and 8.1, but needs the runtime to (try) and auto install on Windows 10, or recompile the app targeting .NET 4.0+ and run fine on Windows 10, but completely fail on Windows 7/8.1 with a dialog saying the runtime is missing. Arrrgh. Overall, I'm living with it, mainly because I've banished all the bad bits, so now it's doing what a good OS should - support me, but also not get in my way. I'm not sure I could use Windows 10 in it's default state though, which is why I'm slowly moving towards a completely customised shell (once I find/write one I like). Edit: Forgot to mention - if you can lay your hands on it, have a look at 'Windows 10 2016 LTSB' edition - it's designed for corporates who don't want all the consumer crap, so a lot of the stupid stuff is not installed by default. It also ONLY accepts security updates, and refuses any updated that are 'feature updates'. Downside, it needs a KMS keyserver for activation.

todd8 10y ago

I am surprised by how hard it is to find reliable information about Window issues. Most pages I find look like thinly veiled pitches to get me to buy some stupid utility or online service. Its easy to find authoritative information on Mac OS or Linux issues, but I can't trust most of what I read about solving any Windows issue. I would like to swap out my system dive and replace it with an SSD. Every discussion on the web I come across wants me to download some third party backup/restore or cloning software. Isn't there anything in Windows or that comes from Microsoft for me to do it?

AstralStorm 10y ago

I stopped reading at "quite the most secure operating system ever devised".