8 ms·

Money doesn't motivate people past, oh, a half million or so a year, maybe.

by beat 10y ago

_yosefk 10y ago
What also amazes me is that the same heterodox crowd critiquing capitalism goes on to say "money doesn't make you happy", citing surveys of millionaires and billionaires who all say they'd be happy with 2x-3x their current net worth! I mean, not necessarily the same people say it, but the same press outlets for sure. But if it doesn't make you happy and you always want more, that desire must motivate you, right? Make up your mind!
- beat 10y ago
  Talk to some serial entrepreneurs. Many of them are already rich, and don't need to work, but they do it anyway. They're motivated by the challenge, not the money.
  - st3v3r 10y ago
    I'm sure, but the money definitely helps. If only because it enables them to do what they do.
  - maverick_iceman 10y ago
    Do they give away all their money to charity?
  - citizens 10y ago
    Well, are they working for themselves or for someone else? That has to come into play regarding motivation.
  - TuringNYC 10y ago
    "Many of them are already rich" -- I think lots of behaviors change once someone is rich. You can choose what to work on, you can walk away from bad situations. I dont think the behaviors of the rich apply to the non-rich.
- eeZah7Ux 10y ago
  You confuse happiness with motivation.
phaus 10y ago
Assuming you are correct, which I suspect you are, that means the group of people that aren't really motivated by money make up a tiny percentage of the work force. Therefore anyone running a business can safely disregard any idiot making the claim that money isn't a motivator, except on the rare occasions which they find themselves hiring executives that make north of $500k. For normal people, its infuriating to hear businesses complain about turnover and a lack of loyalty when their "performance" raises amount to a cost of living increase, and their promotion raises don't bring them in line with the salaries that people getting hired at the more senior position make coming through the door. Money isn't the only reason I work, but it is one of the reasons. Its more about the principle. A company that wants loyalty should show loyalty and not attempt to nickel and dime the talent. Tech companies are usually responsible for creating the turnover they complain about.
- beat 10y ago
  I was strongly influenced in my thinking by Jason Cohen's "Rich vs King" article, he talks about the S-curve of wealth utilization. Once you hit a few million in the bank, you have enough money to fund a reasonably lavish lifestyle, without working, for the rest of your life. At that point, how do you motivate someone?
  - phaus 10y ago
    I make low 6 figures doing network security. If I hit 200k, literally the only thing you could do to motivate me would be to treat me well and give me interesting things to do. Fortunately, my employer already does both of those. I just wish it wasn't almost a requirement to leave in order to get a decent raise. Note: I'm not expecting to make $200k in a technical role as a security analyst any time soon, its just hypothetical.
    - softawre 10y ago
      It is also interesting to think your number, 200k, is strictly based on how much you make now. What would your 18yo self said about 100k? What do you think about a Netflix engineer making 300k? They'd probably be happy with 500k (though, cost of living, derailment ahead..).
enraged_camel 10y ago
Yes it does, actually. Not because it leads to any noticeable quality of life improvement, but because at those levels it becomes a pissing contest with other high-earners. Some rich people care a LOT about making more than other rich people in their social/work circle.
- milliondollar 10y ago
  Yes but if you have the intestinal fortitude to check out of those pissing contests you can really create your own life. That is, if you are lucky enough to be at level to start. I did note that many of my peers where COMPLETELY freaked out by my decision that I mentioned above. My choice to step back from the game freaked them out. No over aggression but a mix of outright confusion as well as somewhat confused jealousy.
  - st3v3r 10y ago
    At the same time, it still sounds like you're making a huge ton of money. More than most of us.
- at-fates-hands 10y ago
  To your point, I remember 50cent (the rapper) talking shortly after he made $400 million on his Vitamin water investment. He said he ran into some Coca-Cola executives after they purchased the company and he was sort of crowing about all the money they had just made him. I guess two of the executives were like, "Huh, $400 million, not a bad start Curtis. Let us know once you get in the $800 million or even the billion dollar range." He said it made him a little more humble, but at the same time, he said there's a sort of pissing game when you're at those income levels with people like that.
  - jimbokun 10y ago
    Meh, he could have replied "let me know when you have a stadium full of people screaming your name."
milliondollar 10y ago
Exactly yes. I used to make over a million a year as a big 3 partner in management consulting. I dialed back to half time and am UNBELIEVABLY happy!
- TeMPOraL 10y ago
  > I dialed back to half time and am UNBELIEVABLY happy! You live my dream life.
- _yosefk 10y ago
  Having dialed back to 3 days/week, I believe that "how much time I'm willing to spend working" is a somewhat orthogonal question to "what motivates me during the time when I'm working." Not entirely orthogonal but also very far from the same question.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- jimbokun 10y ago
  Is that because you saved enough making a million a year you can now afford to work only half time and absorb the pay cut?
vacri 10y ago
Wasn't there a talk show host that was complaining on air about how it was so hard to live in Washington DC on 'only' $500k?
sametmax 10y ago
You are confusing 2 meaning of motivations: - the one meaning "the stuff that will get you involved"; - the one meaning "the stuff that you'll want to get". The first one will drive you enthusiasm to work, your professionalism, the quality of what your produce and your loyalty. It's a "motor" kind of motivation, and money can't buy it. Only a sense of purpose can. The second one is just bound to the reality of life : you need money for food, shelter, logistic, health, hobbies, then a growing family, and an evolving lifestyle. This will make you choose something. It's more a "motive" kind of motivation. You can get a lot of people with only the second one. You can get some people for some time with only the first one. But to get the best, and for them to stay, you need a balance of both.
maverick_iceman 10y ago
I can't tell for others but it'll absolutely motivate me to be able to buy my own plane or yacht.
nihonde 10y ago
Anecdotal, but when I left my last big law firm (to start my own company), I was making around 3/4 million dollars per year. None of my peers who left ever went to jobs that paid more--they all went "in house" for a lot less money and maybe some moonshot equity, but mainly they sought a less horrible lifestyle.
frobozz 10y ago
Interestingly, the remuneration model used by most big companies seems to be based on the opposite of that. The rank and file tend to be told that we're not motivated by money, so we shouldn't expect any, whilst c-level salaries have to be "competitive to attract the best talent".

Money doesn't motivate people past, oh, a half million or so a year, maybe.

by beat 10y ago

Money doesn't motivate people past, oh, a half million or so a year, maybe.

What also amazes me is that the same heterodox crowd critiquing capitalism goes on to say "money doesn't make you happy", citing surveys of millionaires and billionaires who all say they'd be happy with 2x-3x their current net worth! I mean, not necessarily the same people say it, but the same press outlets for sure. But if it doesn't make you happy and you always want more, that desire must motivate you, right? Make up your mind!

beat 10y ago
Talk to some serial entrepreneurs. Many of them are already rich, and don't need to work, but they do it anyway. They're motivated by the challenge, not the money.
- st3v3r 10y ago
  I'm sure, but the money definitely helps. If only because it enables them to do what they do.
- maverick_iceman 10y ago
  Do they give away all their money to charity?
- citizens 10y ago
  Well, are they working for themselves or for someone else? That has to come into play regarding motivation.
- TuringNYC 10y ago
  "Many of them are already rich" -- I think lots of behaviors change once someone is rich. You can choose what to work on, you can walk away from bad situations. I dont think the behaviors of the rich apply to the non-rich.
eeZah7Ux 10y ago
You confuse happiness with motivation.

phaus 10y ago

Assuming you are correct, which I suspect you are, that means the group of people that aren't really motivated by money make up a tiny percentage of the work force. Therefore anyone running a business can safely disregard any idiot making the claim that money isn't a motivator, except on the rare occasions which they find themselves hiring executives that make north of $500k. For normal people, its infuriating to hear businesses complain about turnover and a lack of loyalty when their "performance" raises amount to a cost of living increase, and their promotion raises don't bring them in line with the salaries that people getting hired at the more senior position make coming through the door. Money isn't the only reason I work, but it is one of the reasons. Its more about the principle. A company that wants loyalty should show loyalty and not attempt to nickel and dime the talent. Tech companies are usually responsible for creating the turnover they complain about.

beat 10y ago
I was strongly influenced in my thinking by Jason Cohen's "Rich vs King" article, he talks about the S-curve of wealth utilization. Once you hit a few million in the bank, you have enough money to fund a reasonably lavish lifestyle, without working, for the rest of your life. At that point, how do you motivate someone?
- phaus 10y ago
  I make low 6 figures doing network security. If I hit 200k, literally the only thing you could do to motivate me would be to treat me well and give me interesting things to do. Fortunately, my employer already does both of those. I just wish it wasn't almost a requirement to leave in order to get a decent raise. Note: I'm not expecting to make $200k in a technical role as a security analyst any time soon, its just hypothetical.
  - softawre 10y ago
    It is also interesting to think your number, 200k, is strictly based on how much you make now. What would your 18yo self said about 100k? What do you think about a Netflix engineer making 300k? They'd probably be happy with 500k (though, cost of living, derailment ahead..).

enraged_camel 10y ago

Yes it does, actually. Not because it leads to any noticeable quality of life improvement, but because at those levels it becomes a pissing contest with other high-earners. Some rich people care a LOT about making more than other rich people in their social/work circle.

milliondollar 10y ago
Yes but if you have the intestinal fortitude to check out of those pissing contests you can really create your own life. That is, if you are lucky enough to be at level to start. I did note that many of my peers where COMPLETELY freaked out by my decision that I mentioned above. My choice to step back from the game freaked them out. No over aggression but a mix of outright confusion as well as somewhat confused jealousy.
- st3v3r 10y ago
  At the same time, it still sounds like you're making a huge ton of money. More than most of us.
at-fates-hands 10y ago
To your point, I remember 50cent (the rapper) talking shortly after he made $400 million on his Vitamin water investment. He said he ran into some Coca-Cola executives after they purchased the company and he was sort of crowing about all the money they had just made him. I guess two of the executives were like, "Huh, $400 million, not a bad start Curtis. Let us know once you get in the $800 million or even the billion dollar range." He said it made him a little more humble, but at the same time, he said there's a sort of pissing game when you're at those income levels with people like that.
- jimbokun 10y ago
  Meh, he could have replied "let me know when you have a stadium full of people screaming your name."

milliondollar 10y ago

Exactly yes. I used to make over a million a year as a big 3 partner in management consulting. I dialed back to half time and am UNBELIEVABLY happy!

TeMPOraL 10y ago
> I dialed back to half time and am UNBELIEVABLY happy! You live my dream life.
_yosefk 10y ago
Having dialed back to 3 days/week, I believe that "how much time I'm willing to spend working" is a somewhat orthogonal question to "what motivates me during the time when I'm working." Not entirely orthogonal but also very far from the same question.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
jimbokun 10y ago
Is that because you saved enough making a million a year you can now afford to work only half time and absorb the pay cut?

vacri 10y ago

Wasn't there a talk show host that was complaining on air about how it was so hard to live in Washington DC on 'only' $500k?

sametmax 10y ago

You are confusing 2 meaning of motivations: - the one meaning "the stuff that will get you involved"; - the one meaning "the stuff that you'll want to get". The first one will drive you enthusiasm to work, your professionalism, the quality of what your produce and your loyalty. It's a "motor" kind of motivation, and money can't buy it. Only a sense of purpose can. The second one is just bound to the reality of life : you need money for food, shelter, logistic, health, hobbies, then a growing family, and an evolving lifestyle. This will make you choose something. It's more a "motive" kind of motivation. You can get a lot of people with only the second one. You can get some people for some time with only the first one. But to get the best, and for them to stay, you need a balance of both.

maverick_iceman 10y ago

I can't tell for others but it'll absolutely motivate me to be able to buy my own plane or yacht.

nihonde 10y ago

Anecdotal, but when I left my last big law firm (to start my own company), I was making around 3/4 million dollars per year. None of my peers who left ever went to jobs that paid more--they all went "in house" for a lot less money and maybe some moonshot equity, but mainly they sought a less horrible lifestyle.

frobozz 10y ago

Interestingly, the remuneration model used by most big companies seems to be based on the opposite of that. The rank and file tend to be told that we're not motivated by money, so we shouldn't expect any, whilst c-level salaries have to be "competitive to attract the best talent".