7 ms·

Reading through it. The gist is you can get 30 months of parole from USCIS if you are a startup entrepreneur that has raised investment. Seems like the threshol

by Finbarr 10y ago

Reading through it. The gist is you can get 30 months of parole from USCIS if you are a startup entrepreneur that has raised investment. Seems like the threshold is $250k and it can support up to 3 founders. You must own at least 10% to be considered a founder. Looks like you can also get an additional 30 months by raising a further $500k, or having at least $500k ARR with 20% annual growth, or employing 5 US persons full time. You need to maintain a 5% stake and continue to serve a central role in operations in order to qualify for the additional 30 months. The investment has to be raised from investors with a track record of investing in high growth startups. This will come into force from July 17 2017.

gigatexal 10y ago
A similar scheme works for Canadian immigration.
- fapjacks 10y ago
  But... Does it work?
  - mysterypie 10y ago
    Typical case went like this: Immigrant investor to Canada spent $300K (Canadian) to buy a pizza joint, hired 5 minimum wage workers, operated business for 3.5 years, then sold it or closed it. Minimum investments and required duration of the business have varied over the years, and by province as well. The typical immigrant investor was not starting Google, a genomics lab, a 3D printing business, or anything even vaguely innovative.
    - nopinsight 10y ago
      What happens to them afterward? Do they get a permanent residency just from operating that venture for 3.5 years? (Do they need to pass the point-based qualification as well to get the visa in the first place?) For the US, small business investor-entrepreneurs typically use an E-2 visa but it is non-immigrant and they need to leave the country when the business stops operating.
    - emilyfm 10y ago
      That was the "investor" visa ("owner-operator"). The US International Entrepreneur Rule is more like the "Start Up Visa" [1] that was introduced in Canada a few years ago, which allows entry for founders of a business supported by local venture capital or incubators (subject to certain monetary amounts and conditions). A major difference: the Canadian start-up visa gives immediate permanent residence, rather than a number of years of temporary status with no guaranteed route forward. [1] http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/business/start-up/ http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/business/start-up/
goodcjw2 10y ago
The threshold feels low, especially when compared the the new H1B threshold at 100K. As mentioned earlier, this could be easily gamed.
- xenadu02 10y ago
  It's explicitly designed for people who get into YC: you get 2.5 years to prove your startup can make it to the next stage, the 2.5 more years to turn it into a real business (after which there are far more options like K-1, O-1, and various E investor visas). Depending on the situation it might be a formality... if your startup has grown to medium size with 100 employees and $20m revenue my guess is DHS will find any excuse to give you general public-benefit parole or an O-1. You are also free to apply for other visas while in the US without affecting your parole.
- stale2002 10y ago
  I know right! Company "invests" 250k into a "startup" who's only job is to "consult" with the parent investor company. BAM! You've just hired 3 engineers right there, who have completely skipped the greencard line.
  - cperciva 10y ago
    I'd assume this is why they have qualification requirements on the investors.
- chrisper 10y ago
  Is the 100k cap official or is it just an idea so far?
- uiri 10y ago
  especially when compared the the new H1B threshold at 100K What on Earth are you talking about? That $100K threshold is designed to target body shops. There are a class of employers which are H-1B dependent; generally, those with at least 15% of their employees on the visa. Currently, H-1Bs with a salary of at least $60K are not counted toward that 15%. The bill will change this to $100K salary. It is possible to hire a H-1B for $50k under the current laws if that is market rate for the relevant position.
cma 10y ago
One thing that will let you in is if you are invested in from > investors with established records of successful investments The rich get richer. Established investors get cheap labor, while upstart competitive investors get buried behind an artificial government wall. I wonder if any established investment firms lobbied for that?
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- icantdrive55 10y ago
  I think they want to prevent foreign rich parents from scamming the program? They want honest entrepreneurs? Not just the rich kids, with crafty parents? (Personally, I don't like these programs, except in extreme cases, like letting in accomplished scientists--for a limited time. And only from countries that reciprocate.)
- chulk90 10y ago
  Don't you think you're making too much assumption here? If a large firm lobbied to create an "artificial ... wall," they would write a pre-defined amount, such as "firms who have $100MM AUM," rather than making it vague. "Successful investments" can be validated with a reasonable argument, so it actually opens door for younger VCs.
  - cma 10y ago
    Or maybe by making it vague they will get even more protection, especially if they have ins with the regulators who will interpret it. Seems more likely for established players than for upstarts. But maybe not. Just throwing it out there.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- orasis 10y ago
  So your investment thesis is "cheaper is better."?
mnglkhn2 10y ago
Who's going to stop an investor from pushing you out from a central role in operations and hence kick you out of the country? All this after 2.5yrs put in the company, working your best for those years.
- Finbarr 10y ago
  Given the amounts we're talking about, it's likely the founders would still have complete control of the board.
fovc 10y ago
What exactly does parole mean in an immigration context? Would it threaten future visa/immigration options if you fail to renew?
- neom 10y ago
  https://www.federalregister.gov/d/2017-00481/p-389 https://www.federalregister.gov/d/2017-00481/p-389
  - fovc 10y ago
    Thanks. That led me to: > The Attorney General may, except as provided in subparagraph (B) or in section 1184(f) of this title, in his discretion parole into the United States temporarily under such conditions as he may prescribe only on a case-by-case basis for urgent humanitarian reasons or significant public benefit any alien applying for admission to the United States, but such parole of such alien shall not be regarded as an admission of the alien and when the purposes of such parole shall, in the opinion of the Attorney General, have been served the alien shall forthwith return or be returned to the custody from which he was paroled and thereafter his case shall continue to be dealt with in the same manner as that of any other applicant for admission to the United States. [0]: https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2015-title8/html/USCODE-2015-title8-chap12-subchapII-partII-sec1182.htm https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2015-title8/html/USCODE...
nopinsight 10y ago
Does anyone know how the process is supposed to work once one gets the Parole? Would the Parole allow one to travel freely in and out of the States, like a Green Card holder, during the its valid period? E-2 visa for some nationals requires the person to reapply for the visa if one travels outside the US and wants to get back in, which is a major pain point. (There is a period, for example 6 months or 1 year, when the re-entry is permitted without re-application. This varies with the country.)
- gotrecruit 10y ago
  about the E-2 thing you said, it's only true if you applied within the US. if you applied and got an E-2 outside of US, you can freely leave and enter on it anytime.
  - nopinsight 10y ago
    I talked with an immigration lawyer last year. She told me that the period of free re-entry was only within 6 months of the visa issuance. I did check and found a list of varying periods for different countries on some website (I can't find it now.) However, I just found this paragraph on www.uscis.gov: "An E-2 nonimmigrant who travels abroad may generally be granted an automatic two-year period of readmission when returning to the United States. It is generally not necessary to file a new Form I-129 with USCIS in this situation." So I guess one may want to re-check to be very sure if one wants to get an E-2. I'm going to apply for the Entrepreneur Parole since it fits my situation much better.
    - Xixi 10y ago
      I have an E-2 visa, valid for 5 years. The way it works is exactly as you read on www.uscis.gov: upon entry in the US there is a 2 year reentry permission: it is renewed each time the border is crossed. In practice it means that I need to go out of the US at least once every two years to keep the ability to travel freely. Conclusion: the E-2 visa is great if you intend to travel abroad often, otherwise another visa is probably better. The durations may vary depending on the country the visa is issued from (due to the underlying treaty), and the status associated to it: in my case France as an essential employee (NOT as an investor).

by Finbarr 10y ago

gigatexal 10y ago

A similar scheme works for Canadian immigration.

fapjacks 10y ago
But... Does it work?
- mysterypie 10y ago
  Typical case went like this: Immigrant investor to Canada spent $300K (Canadian) to buy a pizza joint, hired 5 minimum wage workers, operated business for 3.5 years, then sold it or closed it. Minimum investments and required duration of the business have varied over the years, and by province as well. The typical immigrant investor was not starting Google, a genomics lab, a 3D printing business, or anything even vaguely innovative.
  - nopinsight 10y ago
    What happens to them afterward? Do they get a permanent residency just from operating that venture for 3.5 years? (Do they need to pass the point-based qualification as well to get the visa in the first place?) For the US, small business investor-entrepreneurs typically use an E-2 visa but it is non-immigrant and they need to leave the country when the business stops operating.
  - emilyfm 10y ago
    That was the "investor" visa ("owner-operator"). The US International Entrepreneur Rule is more like the "Start Up Visa" [1] that was introduced in Canada a few years ago, which allows entry for founders of a business supported by local venture capital or incubators (subject to certain monetary amounts and conditions). A major difference: the Canadian start-up visa gives immediate permanent residence, rather than a number of years of temporary status with no guaranteed route forward. [1] http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/business/start-up/ http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/immigrate/business/start-up/

goodcjw2 10y ago

The threshold feels low, especially when compared the the new H1B threshold at 100K. As mentioned earlier, this could be easily gamed.

xenadu02 10y ago
It's explicitly designed for people who get into YC: you get 2.5 years to prove your startup can make it to the next stage, the 2.5 more years to turn it into a real business (after which there are far more options like K-1, O-1, and various E investor visas). Depending on the situation it might be a formality... if your startup has grown to medium size with 100 employees and $20m revenue my guess is DHS will find any excuse to give you general public-benefit parole or an O-1. You are also free to apply for other visas while in the US without affecting your parole.
stale2002 10y ago
I know right! Company "invests" 250k into a "startup" who's only job is to "consult" with the parent investor company. BAM! You've just hired 3 engineers right there, who have completely skipped the greencard line.
- cperciva 10y ago
  I'd assume this is why they have qualification requirements on the investors.
chrisper 10y ago
Is the 100k cap official or is it just an idea so far?
uiri 10y ago
especially when compared the the new H1B threshold at 100K What on Earth are you talking about? That $100K threshold is designed to target body shops. There are a class of employers which are H-1B dependent; generally, those with at least 15% of their employees on the visa. Currently, H-1Bs with a salary of at least $60K are not counted toward that 15%. The bill will change this to $100K salary. It is possible to hire a H-1B for $50k under the current laws if that is market rate for the relevant position.

cma 10y ago

One thing that will let you in is if you are invested in from > investors with established records of successful investments The rich get richer. Established investors get cheap labor, while upstart competitive investors get buried behind an artificial government wall. I wonder if any established investment firms lobbied for that?

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
icantdrive55 10y ago
I think they want to prevent foreign rich parents from scamming the program? They want honest entrepreneurs? Not just the rich kids, with crafty parents? (Personally, I don't like these programs, except in extreme cases, like letting in accomplished scientists--for a limited time. And only from countries that reciprocate.)
chulk90 10y ago
Don't you think you're making too much assumption here? If a large firm lobbied to create an "artificial ... wall," they would write a pre-defined amount, such as "firms who have $100MM AUM," rather than making it vague. "Successful investments" can be validated with a reasonable argument, so it actually opens door for younger VCs.
- cma 10y ago
  Or maybe by making it vague they will get even more protection, especially if they have ins with the regulators who will interpret it. Seems more likely for established players than for upstarts. But maybe not. Just throwing it out there.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
orasis 10y ago
So your investment thesis is "cheaper is better."?

mnglkhn2 10y ago

Who's going to stop an investor from pushing you out from a central role in operations and hence kick you out of the country? All this after 2.5yrs put in the company, working your best for those years.

Finbarr 10y ago
Given the amounts we're talking about, it's likely the founders would still have complete control of the board.

fovc 10y ago

What exactly does parole mean in an immigration context? Would it threaten future visa/immigration options if you fail to renew?

neom 10y ago
https://www.federalregister.gov/d/2017-00481/p-389 https://www.federalregister.gov/d/2017-00481/p-389
- fovc 10y ago
  Thanks. That led me to: > The Attorney General may, except as provided in subparagraph (B) or in section 1184(f) of this title, in his discretion parole into the United States temporarily under such conditions as he may prescribe only on a case-by-case basis for urgent humanitarian reasons or significant public benefit any alien applying for admission to the United States, but such parole of such alien shall not be regarded as an admission of the alien and when the purposes of such parole shall, in the opinion of the Attorney General, have been served the alien shall forthwith return or be returned to the custody from which he was paroled and thereafter his case shall continue to be dealt with in the same manner as that of any other applicant for admission to the United States. [0]: https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2015-title8/html/USCODE-2015-title8-chap12-subchapII-partII-sec1182.htm https://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2015-title8/html/USCODE...

nopinsight 10y ago

Does anyone know how the process is supposed to work once one gets the Parole? Would the Parole allow one to travel freely in and out of the States, like a Green Card holder, during the its valid period? E-2 visa for some nationals requires the person to reapply for the visa if one travels outside the US and wants to get back in, which is a major pain point. (There is a period, for example 6 months or 1 year, when the re-entry is permitted without re-application. This varies with the country.)

gotrecruit 10y ago
about the E-2 thing you said, it's only true if you applied within the US. if you applied and got an E-2 outside of US, you can freely leave and enter on it anytime.
- nopinsight 10y ago
  I talked with an immigration lawyer last year. She told me that the period of free re-entry was only within 6 months of the visa issuance. I did check and found a list of varying periods for different countries on some website (I can't find it now.) However, I just found this paragraph on www.uscis.gov: "An E-2 nonimmigrant who travels abroad may generally be granted an automatic two-year period of readmission when returning to the United States. It is generally not necessary to file a new Form I-129 with USCIS in this situation." So I guess one may want to re-check to be very sure if one wants to get an E-2. I'm going to apply for the Entrepreneur Parole since it fits my situation much better.
  - Xixi 10y ago
    I have an E-2 visa, valid for 5 years. The way it works is exactly as you read on www.uscis.gov: upon entry in the US there is a 2 year reentry permission: it is renewed each time the border is crossed. In practice it means that I need to go out of the US at least once every two years to keep the ability to travel freely. Conclusion: the E-2 visa is great if you intend to travel abroad often, otherwise another visa is probably better. The durations may vary depending on the country the visa is issued from (due to the underlying treaty), and the status associated to it: in my case France as an essential employee (NOT as an investor).