5 ms·

You'll still have to endure the definition-stretching phase. I'm going to start really paying attention when pedaless cars are declared.

ars 10y ago
> when pedaless cars are declared. That won't happen till General AI. How would you do something as simple as drive the car onto a lift to change the oil without pedals and a steering wheel? Or there is a concert and you need to drive onto the grass to park?
- TillE 10y ago
  Solving a couple tiny problems really doesn't require human-level general intelligence. At the very worst you'd have a touchscreen with simple overrides. People talk as if there's some infinite number of unique edge cases when driving a dang car, but there simply isn't that much you actually do with a vehicle. Real deal no-drivers-license-required automated vehicles are coming pretty soon; maybe not in 5 years, but definitely within 20.
  - Piskvorrr 10y ago
    Been hearing that line, verbatim, since I was a kid. "Cars will be self-driving long before you'd ever need to learn driving. You won't need that skill, just like we never needed horse-riding." Well, I've had a driving license for decades, but apparently the marketing slogan still manages to impress people. P.T.Barnum would be proud.
    - marcosdumay 10y ago
      I remember hearing this as a kid. But it was mostly speculation, it would be insane to believe it to the extent that one even starts to plan for it. We are in a completely different situation today.
- ema 10y ago
  You plan the path on a high resolution map on the center console. When decision speed is a non issue this is a quite nice interface because you can double check the entire path before the wheels turn.
  - Piskvorrr 10y ago
    "(6) It is easier to move a problem around (...) than it is to solve it." In other words, now you need a hi-res, current map to show. Where does the data for that come from? (Oh wait, don't tell me: Magic!)
    - ema 10y ago
      The cameras of the self driving car of course. I assume converting these inputs into maps that are usable enough for this purpose is much easier than driving a car in city conditions. So _if_ we get self driving cars we also get live updated maps of the surrounding circle with a radius ~20m.
      - Piskvorrr 10y ago
        Which can now see behind corners, underground and over terrain. Magic, I say, pure magic!
        apk17 10y ago
        Not that people actually driving cars off the road are capable of this now. I'd often wish for a remote control when parking in constricted spaces.
        Piskvorrr 10y ago
        They are not - but then you're back to driving, although using the touchscreen. Completely different from the original proposition "tell the car where to go, it will do the rest". You're just exposing a different control API to the human controlling the car (a.k.a. driver), that's hardly driverless. TL;DR: "remote control" != "self-driving"
- VMG 10y ago
  My guess is people will change their expectations of what they can do with a car. Maybe it will not work on unusual terrain anymore. Maintenance procedures might also change and involve remote controls or other specialized types of control.
  - cdubzzz 10y ago
    I have a lot of trouble envisioning that. I definitely would not want a car that I can't take off road as needed. At least half the people on the street where I live have one truck among other cars and many cars are parked in lawns. How quickly do you think perceptions about this could change? The only thing I can think that would sell me on the idea is a really low price point, e.g. sub-$10k to get a new, driverless, road-only vehicle. But I would only want that in addition to a "real" car.
    - chx 10y ago
      Noone will have cars any more. Especially not just parking around in a residential street. It's just so inefficient. You haul one via your app and that's it.
      - apk17 10y ago
        I doubt that. Cars are, besides being a transportation means, also a moving trunk, and that makes them non-interchangable to a degree.
  - nradov 10y ago
    The vast majority of car users take their vehicles at least slightly off road. I don't mean running a jeep through the Rubicon Trail, just simple common stuff like parking in a snow-covered lot at a ski resort with a human attendant pointing you where to park. How is a self-driving car ever going to handle that short of AGI?
- ableal 10y ago
  > drive the car onto a lift There will be an app for that? Hey, James Bond was driving from the backseat with a Nokia 9000 (?) a few movies ago.

ars 10y ago

> when pedaless cars are declared. That won't happen till General AI. How would you do something as simple as drive the car onto a lift to change the oil without pedals and a steering wheel? Or there is a concert and you need to drive onto the grass to park?

TillE 10y ago
Solving a couple tiny problems really doesn't require human-level general intelligence. At the very worst you'd have a touchscreen with simple overrides. People talk as if there's some infinite number of unique edge cases when driving a dang car, but there simply isn't that much you actually do with a vehicle. Real deal no-drivers-license-required automated vehicles are coming pretty soon; maybe not in 5 years, but definitely within 20.
- Piskvorrr 10y ago
  Been hearing that line, verbatim, since I was a kid. "Cars will be self-driving long before you'd ever need to learn driving. You won't need that skill, just like we never needed horse-riding." Well, I've had a driving license for decades, but apparently the marketing slogan still manages to impress people. P.T.Barnum would be proud.
  - marcosdumay 10y ago
    I remember hearing this as a kid. But it was mostly speculation, it would be insane to believe it to the extent that one even starts to plan for it. We are in a completely different situation today.
ema 10y ago
You plan the path on a high resolution map on the center console. When decision speed is a non issue this is a quite nice interface because you can double check the entire path before the wheels turn.
- Piskvorrr 10y ago
  "(6) It is easier to move a problem around (...) than it is to solve it." In other words, now you need a hi-res, current map to show. Where does the data for that come from? (Oh wait, don't tell me: Magic!)
  - ema 10y ago
    The cameras of the self driving car of course. I assume converting these inputs into maps that are usable enough for this purpose is much easier than driving a car in city conditions. So _if_ we get self driving cars we also get live updated maps of the surrounding circle with a radius ~20m.
    - Piskvorrr 10y ago
      Which can now see behind corners, underground and over terrain. Magic, I say, pure magic!
      - apk17 10y ago
        Not that people actually driving cars off the road are capable of this now. I'd often wish for a remote control when parking in constricted spaces.
        Piskvorrr 10y ago
        They are not - but then you're back to driving, although using the touchscreen. Completely different from the original proposition "tell the car where to go, it will do the rest". You're just exposing a different control API to the human controlling the car (a.k.a. driver), that's hardly driverless. TL;DR: "remote control" != "self-driving"
VMG 10y ago
My guess is people will change their expectations of what they can do with a car. Maybe it will not work on unusual terrain anymore. Maintenance procedures might also change and involve remote controls or other specialized types of control.
- cdubzzz 10y ago
  I have a lot of trouble envisioning that. I definitely would not want a car that I can't take off road as needed. At least half the people on the street where I live have one truck among other cars and many cars are parked in lawns. How quickly do you think perceptions about this could change? The only thing I can think that would sell me on the idea is a really low price point, e.g. sub-$10k to get a new, driverless, road-only vehicle. But I would only want that in addition to a "real" car.
  - chx 10y ago
    Noone will have cars any more. Especially not just parking around in a residential street. It's just so inefficient. You haul one via your app and that's it.
    - apk17 10y ago
      I doubt that. Cars are, besides being a transportation means, also a moving trunk, and that makes them non-interchangable to a degree.
- nradov 10y ago
  The vast majority of car users take their vehicles at least slightly off road. I don't mean running a jeep through the Rubicon Trail, just simple common stuff like parking in a snow-covered lot at a ski resort with a human attendant pointing you where to park. How is a self-driving car ever going to handle that short of AGI?
ableal 10y ago
> drive the car onto a lift There will be an app for that? Hey, James Bond was driving from the backseat with a Nokia 9000 (?) a few movies ago.