7 ms·

What page is that?

• vkou 10y ago
  General strikes, riots, car-burning. American blue-collar workers would rather be dismantled one bit at a time, then act collectively.
  • api 10y ago
    American blue-collar workers tend to care more about "culture war" issues than their economic well being.
    • jimbokun 10y ago
      The rise of Trump seems at odds with this assessment, he has little to say about traditional Republican "culture war" issues.
      • api 10y ago
        That's precisely why he is "disruptive." I'm not personally a supporter (for unrelated reasons) but I think he still has a chance in the election. IMHO if Trump were to openly and directly attack the culture war (and ditch the crypto-racism) he could win in a landslide. A line like "last year X million gay Americans lost their jobs for the same reason Y million straight Americans lost their jobs..." would basically nuke the entire American electoral landscape into glass. Unfortunately he's a conservative xenophobe at heart, so he's not the droid we're looking for.
        • imron 10y ago
          I'm not a supporter either, and I'm neither a US citizen nor someone living in the US, so I have no horse in this race, but this comment struck me as strange > Unfortunately he's a conservative xenophobe at heart If you look in to it, throughout his life he's been rather liberal/progressive. In fact even now, he falls to the left of Hillary on a number of topics. He also has a decades of history not being xenophobic. I wonder what you attribute such a sudden change in attitude of a 70 year old man to?
          • api 10y ago
            Maybe he's just pandering to what he thinks is a 'base' he can mobilize. But that counts against him as far as I'm concerned.
            • imron 10y ago
              Scott Adams of Dilbert fame frames it as a persuasion tactic called pacing and leading. First you get people on your side by making them think you're just like them (pacing) and once there you can take them in whatever direction you like (leading) because they believe you're on their side. Before this week, would you have ever thought that so many of the Republican base would be in favor of a maternity leave policy like the one Trump just proposed? These are the same people who have previously been complaining and campaigning against handouts and government overreach, yet now are cheering for a 'pro-family' maternity leave policy (rationalising after the fact because it's their guy proposing it). The Dems are already there on that sort of policy so to get it implemented you need to get the GOP to come to the party. Trump is doing that. I highly doubt that if Hillary had proposed an identical policy that so many of the Republican base would be so enthusiastic about it, and that's how you make policy work. And it's only just the beginning, the pacing is mostly done and he just needs to follow through on the leading.
              • r_smart 10y ago
                For those who aren't aware, Scott Adams recently appeared on The Rubin Report and talked about this stuff[0]. It was a really interesting interview, and Dave Rubin's show is awesome. [0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AMV6SLT9KI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AMV6SLT9KI
      • wfo 10y ago
        His stance on immigration, his war on PC culture, the racism, sexism, his war against Islam, even his slogan "make American great again" is exactly the definition of culture war. His subslogan "take our country back" is the definitive culture war anthem and has been for all of human history. His entire attitude -- an assault on Washington and media elites who consider themselves "serious" and "sensible" which is working so well is a striking clash of cultures. He is THE culture warrior candidate of the past I don't know how many decades. Nobody cares about his economic policies: pundits harp on about how he doesn't have any and that makes him unqualified; the crucial point they are missing is it has nothing to do with economics or policy at all, it does not matter if they are present in him or not, it is entirely about culture and identity. He is just fighting on behalf of a different culture -- instead of the traditional Republican Christian right, he's grabbing at a different Republican constituency.
    • hiram112 10y ago
      It turns out white collar workers are the same. How many IT staff, engineers, accountants, legal workers, and dozens of other professions have watched, glass-eyed, while their whole departments have been shipped to India, Philippines, and Latin America. Only when they themselves get to train their own H1B replacements does it occur to them that maybe transgender bathroom usage and legal weed were not the issues they should have concentrated on.
  • skybrian 10y ago
    And while all that's going on, foreigners (at least) will switch from buying Fords to some other brand.
  • zeveb 10y ago
    I'm glad American workers are above general strikes, riots and car-burning. Those are the actions of children, not of adults.
    • vkou 10y ago
      They are the actions of adults who are about to have their means of survival taken away. Why are you against freedom of association (general strikes)? Should people be serfs, without the right to refuse to work, in protest of working conditions?
      • sqeaky 10y ago
        He isn't against freedom, he is against childish gestures, none of which actually change the general trend of the car sales in the market. If small economy cars must be built cheaply then protesting with fires and vandalism is more likely to get a factory shut down because of missed goals. Moving these low end models to Mexico with their cheap labor allows the Americans to build higher margin models and actually grow the company. No wonder France has about 1/3rd the car exports the US does or about 1/7th exports of Germany.
        • toomuchtodo 10y ago
          > No wonder France has about 1/3rd the car exports the US does or about 1/7th exports of Germany. Who cares which country has more exports or GDP? I care about quality of life, not which shareholders are reaping the most benefits.
          • sqeaky 10y ago
            One is a proxy for the other. The more your export the more money you probably have. In general the more money the higher your quality of life. Stated another way American factory worker's quality of life is good enough they have never needed to degenerate to setting fires. They have more effective systems in place.
  • vacri 10y ago
    The car-burning in European strikes always puzzles me. "I'm so angry at entity Foo, that I'm going to destroy my neighbour's property!"
    • icebraining 10y ago
      It depends on whether you see your "neighbor" as one of you. There are many social divisions, particularly in certain countries - by class, origin, region, etc.
    • wfo 10y ago
      Yes, the inscrutable puzzling Europeans riot when their way of life is being destroyed so wealthy shareholders can reap more profits, why can't they be sensible like us Americans and be silent in the above case, instead rioting after sporting events?
      • vacri 10y ago
        I dunno. I'm Australian, and we don't get many riots down our way.
  • rjsw 10y ago
    French workers tend to burn old tyres, the cars get burnt by other groups.