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Ford moving all production of small cars from U.S. to Mexico
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- 6stringmerc 10y agoI think it's funny to see the "all" term be thrown about so much - yes, I'm sure volume wise it's significant but across the model lines, it's really just - wait for it - two models. Oh wow, the Fiesta! Look, I'm being glib but until Ford decides to move its true cash-cows like the F-150 out of the country, I'm more inclined to deal with the nature of globalization in manufacturing in rational ways. Calling the move "inherently bad" is not my perspective. I remember when it seemed like Ford couldn't design and build their way out of the dark ages, and then, lo and behold, their European operations provided some much needed quality and design and production guidance and it stabilized a large section of their global footprint. Global companies have global concerns!
- mywittyname 10y agoWell, three: C-Max, Focus, and Fiesta.
- aboonaboo 10y agoNot like anyone buys those right
- mc32 10y agoWonder if US auto workers took a page from French workers would US mfgs move production so glibly.
- ap3 10y agoWhat page is that?
- vkou 10y agoGeneral strikes, riots, car-burning. American blue-collar workers would rather be dismantled one bit at a time, then act collectively.
- api 10y agoAmerican blue-collar workers tend to care more about "culture war" issues than their economic well being.
- jimbokun 10y agoThe rise of Trump seems at odds with this assessment, he has little to say about traditional Republican "culture war" issues.
- api 10y agoThat's precisely why he is "disruptive." I'm not personally a supporter (for unrelated reasons) but I think he still has a chance in the election. IMHO if Trump were to openly and directly attack the culture war (and ditch the crypto-racism) he could win in a landslide. A line like "last year X million gay Americans lost their jobs for the same reason Y million straight Americans lost their jobs..." would basically nuke the entire American electoral landscape into glass. Unfortunately he's a conservative xenophobe at heart, so he's not the droid we're looking for.
- imron 10y agoI'm not a supporter either, and I'm neither a US citizen nor someone living in the US, so I have no horse in this race, but this comment struck me as strange > Unfortunately he's a conservative xenophobe at heart If you look in to it, throughout his life he's been rather liberal/progressive. In fact even now, he falls to the left of Hillary on a number of topics. He also has a decades of history not being xenophobic. I wonder what you attribute such a sudden change in attitude of a 70 year old man to?
- icebraining 10y agoJust for reference, Ford has been hiring thousands of workers per year in the US, and they signed a new deal with the union last year: http://www.mlive.com/auto/index.ssf/2015/11/uaw-ford_deal_includes_9_billi.html http://www.mlive.com/auto/index.ssf/2015/11/uaw-ford_deal_in... Also, the US factory will be getting new models, not closing down. There's nothing "glib" about this move.
- jackhack 10y agoI fail to see how this is technology or startup related, and therefore appropriate to HN. Seems more political/financial so not a good choice for HN (especially frontpage). (edit: for the downvoters... https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html "If they'd cover it on TV news, it's probably off-topic." but do what you must.)
- hkmurakami 10y agoSupply chain is certainly part of technology.
- mywittyname 10y agoThis agreement was made back in 2015, so it's not really news. http://www.autonews.com/article/20150709/OEM01/150709864/ford-to-move-production-of-focus-c-max-from-michigan-assembly http://www.autonews.com/article/20150709/OEM01/150709864/for... The posted article fails to mention Ford will be producing two brand new vehicles in this plant: the Ranger and a compact SUV, the Bronco.
- riboflava 10y agoThe return of the Ranger will be very welcome to me, if they don't screw it up...
- douche 10y agoI never got a good explanation of why they stopped building them. They were good little trucks, not quite Tacoma-grade, but pretty capable.
- mikeyouse 10y agoThe best explanation is that they were starting to impinge on sales of the F-150 -- which is probably the most profitable vehicle ever produced by humans.
- alistairSH 10y agoExactly. Producing small trucks with the options/amenities American consumers expect was less profitable than shifting that consumption to full-size trucks. In the same time span, full-size trucks have grown a fair bit, so it appears it's now possible to market a mid-size truck (the Canyon and Tacoma are quite a bit larger than the old S-10 or Ranger). Nobody is actually selling compact trucks in the US any more, nor does anybody plan to do so (that I've seen).
- baddox 10y agoI thought the death of the compact truck was more due to the fact that full sized trucks now get good enough fuel economy that's it's just not worth having a smaller truck.
- MrFoof 10y agoDecided to go to goodcarbadcar.net to get US sales numbers (they have Canada as well) to see how much of this volume it represents. In 2015 the Ford Brand sold ~2.502M vehicles in the US. For the cars being moved over to Mexico... * C-MAX - 21,768 * Fiesta - 64,458 * Focus - 202,478 * Total - 288,704 About 11.5% of units sold in the US, and I think all the vehicles they sell in the US on their B3 (Fiesta) platform. Interestingly, not all C1 platform cars are moving over, as the Edge (124,000 units) and Transit Connect (52,000 units) will continue to be built in the US, again, because they offer better front-end margin.
- alistairSH 10y agoI wonder if that's because of the chicken tax? The Transit Connect would fall into that category for sure (at least in cargo/work van trims). Not sure about the Edge (it's passenger only, so the tax might not apply).
- brohoolio 10y agoTransit connect is made in turkey and Spain I believe. They tried to get around the chicken tax but ended up losing to customs.
- alistairSH 10y agoYeah, I think they were importing them as passenger vans, then de-optioning at port in Baltimore.
- DKnoll 10y agoThe Ford Edge is built in Oakville, Ontario, Canada... not the US.
- fredgrott 10y agoAs US auto makers adjust their manufacturing chains to squeeze more profits out..I wonder if there is not a stock play on US suppliers vs Mexico Suppliers?
- PhantomGremlin 10y agoNAFTA makes this possible. But it's hard for me to see (in this case) the advantage of NAFTA for the USA. There are now 675,000 auto jobs in Mexico. The majority of that production is exported to the USA. How does that help the USA? Do we really make it up in the goods we export to Mexico?
- samlevine 10y ago> How does that help the USA? Do we really make it up in the goods we export to Mexico? We run a trade deficit with Mexico, which can be looked at as arbitrage of the USD as a reserve currency. We pay an IOU and get cars, they give us cars and get a means of parking their money safely. This being said, comparative advantage is a simplistic but not terrible way of looking at international trade in general. Though US workers are more productive at making cars than Mexican workers, they're also more productive at other things and you end up with more net production at some form of equilibrium when the workers that were making cars do something else. Now, the funny thing about auto manufacturing is that the job losses we've seen are all due to automation. We keep making just as many cars, and it's unlikely that we'll ever employ as many people making cars as we used to, because people can only use so many cars at once. Mexico could fall into the ocean and this trend would not change.
- sqeaky 10y agoWe can already buy Ford Focuses super cheap. With the amount of competition in the small car market it will only get cheaper. By having the lower priced Mexican labor build the vehicles these can keep getting cheaper without major investment in technology that is unlikely to pay for itself and without reduction in American worker's wages. This also allows American Factories to make higher profits by focusing on making higher margin models without Ford having to give up a market segment. Also, Security is generally better at American plants so by allowing the foreign factories to only build the crap models they are unlikely to compete on the unauthorized manufacturing market. Also, This does put some money and infrastructure into Mexico so we can benefit as their country has slightly fewer people try to cross the border illegally. This is simple division of labor. It lets Americans focus on more profitable things, there is no way this is bad for Americans.
- alexdgg 10y agohttps://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Ford https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Ford biggest Nazi sympethyzer in America. go and drive your Nazi car
- alexdgg 10y agohttps://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Ford https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henry_Ford Ford supported the Nazis and american anti semitism very public knowledge.
- vinay427 10y agoIn case you didn't realize, he's no longer alive, so I'm not sure how this is relevant. Besides, he donated most of his wealth to create what was then one of the largest humanitarian foundations in the world.
- racecar789 10y agoWe are going thru a transition now, moving an assembly operation to Mexico. It is a royal PITA. Customs paperwork is insane. The culture also, hard to get a blunt honest answer about how it is "really going" at the factory. The key to a successful move is to have a native US person embedded in the Mexico plant. They can keep operations running and put out fires. NAFTA requires lots of paperwork and reconciliation. If one can navigate the paperwork requirements, then yes it is free trade. If not, have to pay an assist to move goods back and forth.
- gjolund 10y agoIt helps if you speak spanish.