16 ms·

Good Storytellers Are Happier in Life and in Love

136 points by pepy 10y ago

dexwiz 10y ago
"Psychologists believe this is because the man is showing that he knows how to connect, to share emotions and, possibly, to be vulnerable. He also is indicating that he is interesting and articulate and can gain resources and provide support." Why this disconnect? Isn't storytelling the act of connecting, sharing emotions, and being vulnerable? The article makes it sound like storytelling is peacocking. Doing one thing to display a related ability. Like flexing to show strength. But this is the real act. Of course people who are better at interpersonal communication are happier because of it.
- amelius 10y ago
  To me it sounds more like the man is indicating he needs other people to provide support (and motivates them by the story telling techniques he developed). Most introvert men would probably be able to provide for things themselves.
shenanigoat 10y ago
"The men didn’t care whether the women were good storytellers, the research showed."
- curiousgal 10y ago
  Men generally have lower standards. A while ago, I ran two Tinder bots connected to CleverBot; one with a female account and the other with a male account (Both with attractive pictures). Female matches did not tolerate the male bot talking gibberish, while male matches went out of their way to try and make sense of what the female bot was saying. Hilarious as it was, I had to cut it because it was immoral.
  - a_small_island 10y ago
    How did you account for a woman having many more times the matches of a man? Wouldn't this influence whether they would be willing to "spend" time on the match?
    - curiousgal 10y ago
      I thought about that and the only thing I could do to address it was by making the male account really attractive. Couldn't think of a better solution.
  - amelius 10y ago
    You should write a blog post about that.
  - nxzero 10y ago
    I've automated dating chats too and able to confirm that guys are less picky, though they're also more likely to move on too. Girls are more picky, but if the bot tricks them into believing they're real, they'll stick around longer.
  - internaut 10y ago
    > Hilarious as it was, I had to cut it because it was immoral. But you were really doing science! Take inspiration from Dr Herbert West. http://www.ourfaircity.com/2012/02/really-doing-science/ http://www.ourfaircity.com/2012/02/really-doing-science/
- shitgoose 10y ago
  "women need reason to have sex, men need a place"
  - shitgoose 10y ago
    Jeez, guys, this is Billy Crystal:)
Axsuul 10y ago
So how does one become a good storyteller? Obviously it takes experience but is there a book that anyone can recommend to get an edge?
- kleer001 10y ago
  Book? I got nuthin'. Podcast however, there's "Writing Excuses". I've been listening for years. Totally amazing depth and breadth, hundreds of episodes covering all aspects of storytelling and authorship.
- curiousgal 10y ago
  https://www.reddit.com/r/LifeProTips/comments/2y13rm/lpt_request_how_to_be_better_storyteller/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LifeProTips/comments/2y13rm/lpt_req...
- jackarbitrage 10y ago
  I've been interviewed/kept a personal video diary since the 3rd grade (over 15 years) and I can attest to the benefits mentioned in the article. A friend and I started a company that helps make it easy to tell your own story and prompts to with questions to get started. It's called "Emberall" and is on the iOS App Store if you want to try it out.
- AlexCoventry 10y ago
  This is at least a good read, and on-topic. Whether it gives you an edge, I can't say. https://www.amazon.com/Narrative-Design-Working-Imagination-Craft/dp/0393320219/ https://www.amazon.com/Narrative-Design-Working-Imagination-...
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- Theodores 10y ago
  Storytelling is learned as a child, think about it - every day child comes home and tells mummy all about their day. In this circumstance mummy can say 'very good, now play over there!' or they can ask questions about the story, e.g. ask for details to be explained or parts told again. It is this storytelling ability learned as a child rather than anything that can be done as an adult. You could learn and master everything this guy says about writing a good story: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_McKee https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_McKee But it is not about that, it is about simple stories. A lot of people travel to very nice places on holiday, some people don't get to do that. But have you noticed people that you work with go somewhere fantastic and then have nothing to say about it? Bad storytelling!!! Meanwhile, a good storyteller will be able to walk into town, or maybe just take their dog for a walk and be able to come back with a story. The story could be anecdotal, something seen along the way, or it could be about some other dog and owner met. Bungie jumping in Borneo might not be something that really helps conversation, people don't relate to it, no matter how outer-worldly it is. However, meeting a sweet dog and lovely owner, a story can come out of that, one that can be related to. Going back to childhood, there are other opportunities - the formal dinner setting where adults are willing to listen to a child's story. For a child to hold their own and maybe get laughs, that all has to be learned. If the child has a reputation for disruption then the invite to the top table will not be a thing and the opportunity to tell stories in a way that works with an audience is not there. If a child is brought up without love then there is no chance for that child to learn how to tell stories in a social setting, i.e. relevant (beginning, middle, end), with audience engaged, true rather than fanciful, with consideration for others that are different and so on. The ability to tell stories that people want to hear should be an innate thing, developed with language. But some kids are not loved and therefore do not have that social engagement where stories are shared. These kids grow up in their own world so they do have stories but they only make sense in their world, not some broader happy society context. Hence not good story tellers. The motivation and the innate ability is not there. Therefore I suspect that there are reasons why being a good storyteller is a signifier. Would you want someone that does not do stories to be parenting your child? No. For men this is not thought of as such a big deal, but why is this? Men do not have maternal instincts and it is the 'mother's tongue' that gets learned for a good reason. Women know they can get a more loving partner by rating the story telling ability of men, men don't always care about that. It is possible to help someone that is not a good storyteller become better at it. This involves treating them a little bit like how you might have a conversation with an 8 year old child, asking lots of basic questions to get them comfortable sharing the story. I have yet to meet a human being that does not like talking, even if shy. Just through listening and questions one can get someone able to do things like stick to the plot and not go rambling off. Then through normal friendship you can get them to want to share stories. So far everything is all about them... But, listen, ask the right questions. Then, as time goes by you can start to get to talk about other stories, e.g. one's own or the world at large, or involving a shared interest. This sort of therapy is not available on the NHS, however, people do make friends at work and those that don't have the childhood wiring for good storytelling can be brought into the fold, gossip coaxed out of them on tea breaks. Clearly the internet has created new opportunities for storytelling. If you are not from that broken home/foster home background where things like storytelling just do not get learned, then what to do? Write!!! If you get good feedback on your writing then you will be encouraged to further develop your storytelling ability. Although there are big books that can tell you how to do it better, practice is the true teacher. With respect to the article, I see storytelling as something very much tied into child development and I don't see how that aspect can't be gone into properly.
dominotw 10y ago
You know its going to be pure garbage when the title is 'Doing X makes you happy!! '. Fuck these studies that can never be reproduced even under the exact circumstances. These charlatans continue to be allocated funds instead of going to jail; despite being exposed as frauds countless times. Just because reading stuff like this gives us good vibes doesn't mean we should continue wasting money on these "studies". Time to say enough is enough and put these "professors" behind bars for wasting public money. This pointless scientific approach to human behavior and society has distracted us from any genuine discussion about our own internal and external conflicts . A Human being to these people is a machine which when given input X produces output Y. Why do we continue to accept this?
- themartorana 10y ago
  Ya know, if you would just learn to be a better story teller...
- dcposch 10y ago
  I think "jail the professors" is too extreme. There needs to be a more constructive solution. I completely agree with your assessment of the problem.
  - bambax 10y ago
    The better solution is to stop funding them, although I wouldn't know how to locate the source.
  - nxzero 10y ago
    (Careful, heard this "story" about dcposch, he might send you to jail too.) On more factual note, it's a known issue that as you move from hard to soft sciences that positive results increase: http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0010068 http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.... Fields studying topics like "happiness" tend to validate their hypothesis over 90% of the time; which means something fishy is going on.
    - 10y ago
bambax 10y ago
Why do marriages have to be saved, and why are marriage counselors presented as respectable good guys instead of odious charlatans that prey on the weak and miserable???
- Ma8ee 10y ago
  Because marriage isn't always easy, and some couples are actually helped by the counselor, even if it's only because the couple are forced to sit down and talk to each other in normal voices.
- coldtea 10y ago
  Because marriage, like anything worth its while, is not just instant gratification, and it often takes effort to make good again. Or, to answer in another way, because people in falling marriages feel like it's something worth saving, that they try to find help with achieving that. Who are you to tell them otherwise, and generalize that to all marriage counselors and people wanting to save their marriage?
Kluny 10y ago
I fully agree that storytelling is an important skill, but boy howdy is that experiment ridiculous. Every time I read about one of these ridiculous studies I wish someone would start an organization for reproducing and debunking bad studies.
- Wilduck 10y ago
  The Open Science Framework has Reproducibility Projects for a number of different fields. Like this one for Psychology: https://osf.io/ezcuj/wiki/home/ https://osf.io/ezcuj/wiki/home/ and are generally trying to make science more open and reproducible.
likeastone 10y ago
I know a guy who's an excellent story teller. He's also a pathological liar who never intends to keep any of his promises.
vonnik 10y ago
Matthew Dicks is a great story teller with some good tips: http://www.matthewdicks.com/new-page-5/ http://www.matthewdicks.com/new-page-5/ https://themoth.org/storytellers/matthew-dicks https://themoth.org/storytellers/matthew-dicks
hackaflocka 10y ago
Whenever you're not sure whether something is a cause or an effect, look up Taleb on "Narrative Fallacy."
londonfilmgeek 10y ago
Storytellers are more able to contextualise their misery within an aspirational framework.

136 points by pepy 10y ago

"Psychologists believe this is because the man is showing that he knows how to connect, to share emotions and, possibly, to be vulnerable. He also is indicating that he is interesting and articulate and can gain resources and provide support." Why this disconnect? Isn't storytelling the act of connecting, sharing emotions, and being vulnerable? The article makes it sound like storytelling is peacocking. Doing one thing to display a related ability. Like flexing to show strength. But this is the real act. Of course people who are better at interpersonal communication are happier because of it.

amelius 10y ago
To me it sounds more like the man is indicating he needs other people to provide support (and motivates them by the story telling techniques he developed). Most introvert men would probably be able to provide for things themselves.

shenanigoat 10y ago

"The men didn’t care whether the women were good storytellers, the research showed."

curiousgal 10y ago
Men generally have lower standards. A while ago, I ran two Tinder bots connected to CleverBot; one with a female account and the other with a male account (Both with attractive pictures). Female matches did not tolerate the male bot talking gibberish, while male matches went out of their way to try and make sense of what the female bot was saying. Hilarious as it was, I had to cut it because it was immoral.
- a_small_island 10y ago
  How did you account for a woman having many more times the matches of a man? Wouldn't this influence whether they would be willing to "spend" time on the match?
  - curiousgal 10y ago
    I thought about that and the only thing I could do to address it was by making the male account really attractive. Couldn't think of a better solution.
- amelius 10y ago
  You should write a blog post about that.
- nxzero 10y ago
  I've automated dating chats too and able to confirm that guys are less picky, though they're also more likely to move on too. Girls are more picky, but if the bot tricks them into believing they're real, they'll stick around longer.
- internaut 10y ago
  > Hilarious as it was, I had to cut it because it was immoral. But you were really doing science! Take inspiration from Dr Herbert West. http://www.ourfaircity.com/2012/02/really-doing-science/ http://www.ourfaircity.com/2012/02/really-doing-science/
shitgoose 10y ago
"women need reason to have sex, men need a place"
- shitgoose 10y ago
  Jeez, guys, this is Billy Crystal:)

Axsuul 10y ago

So how does one become a good storyteller? Obviously it takes experience but is there a book that anyone can recommend to get an edge?

kleer001 10y ago
Book? I got nuthin'. Podcast however, there's "Writing Excuses". I've been listening for years. Totally amazing depth and breadth, hundreds of episodes covering all aspects of storytelling and authorship.
curiousgal 10y ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/LifeProTips/comments/2y13rm/lpt_request_how_to_be_better_storyteller/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LifeProTips/comments/2y13rm/lpt_req...
jackarbitrage 10y ago
I've been interviewed/kept a personal video diary since the 3rd grade (over 15 years) and I can attest to the benefits mentioned in the article. A friend and I started a company that helps make it easy to tell your own story and prompts to with questions to get started. It's called "Emberall" and is on the iOS App Store if you want to try it out.
AlexCoventry 10y ago
This is at least a good read, and on-topic. Whether it gives you an edge, I can't say. https://www.amazon.com/Narrative-Design-Working-Imagination-Craft/dp/0393320219/ https://www.amazon.com/Narrative-Design-Working-Imagination-...
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
Theodores 10y ago
Storytelling is learned as a child, think about it - every day child comes home and tells mummy all about their day. In this circumstance mummy can say 'very good, now play over there!' or they can ask questions about the story, e.g. ask for details to be explained or parts told again. It is this storytelling ability learned as a child rather than anything that can be done as an adult. You could learn and master everything this guy says about writing a good story: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_McKee https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_McKee But it is not about that, it is about simple stories. A lot of people travel to very nice places on holiday, some people don't get to do that. But have you noticed people that you work with go somewhere fantastic and then have nothing to say about it? Bad storytelling!!! Meanwhile, a good storyteller will be able to walk into town, or maybe just take their dog for a walk and be able to come back with a story. The story could be anecdotal, something seen along the way, or it could be about some other dog and owner met. Bungie jumping in Borneo might not be something that really helps conversation, people don't relate to it, no matter how outer-worldly it is. However, meeting a sweet dog and lovely owner, a story can come out of that, one that can be related to. Going back to childhood, there are other opportunities - the formal dinner setting where adults are willing to listen to a child's story. For a child to hold their own and maybe get laughs, that all has to be learned. If the child has a reputation for disruption then the invite to the top table will not be a thing and the opportunity to tell stories in a way that works with an audience is not there. If a child is brought up without love then there is no chance for that child to learn how to tell stories in a social setting, i.e. relevant (beginning, middle, end), with audience engaged, true rather than fanciful, with consideration for others that are different and so on. The ability to tell stories that people want to hear should be an innate thing, developed with language. But some kids are not loved and therefore do not have that social engagement where stories are shared. These kids grow up in their own world so they do have stories but they only make sense in their world, not some broader happy society context. Hence not good story tellers. The motivation and the innate ability is not there. Therefore I suspect that there are reasons why being a good storyteller is a signifier. Would you want someone that does not do stories to be parenting your child? No. For men this is not thought of as such a big deal, but why is this? Men do not have maternal instincts and it is the 'mother's tongue' that gets learned for a good reason. Women know they can get a more loving partner by rating the story telling ability of men, men don't always care about that. It is possible to help someone that is not a good storyteller become better at it. This involves treating them a little bit like how you might have a conversation with an 8 year old child, asking lots of basic questions to get them comfortable sharing the story. I have yet to meet a human being that does not like talking, even if shy. Just through listening and questions one can get someone able to do things like stick to the plot and not go rambling off. Then through normal friendship you can get them to want to share stories. So far everything is all about them... But, listen, ask the right questions. Then, as time goes by you can start to get to talk about other stories, e.g. one's own or the world at large, or involving a shared interest. This sort of therapy is not available on the NHS, however, people do make friends at work and those that don't have the childhood wiring for good storytelling can be brought into the fold, gossip coaxed out of them on tea breaks. Clearly the internet has created new opportunities for storytelling. If you are not from that broken home/foster home background where things like storytelling just do not get learned, then what to do? Write!!! If you get good feedback on your writing then you will be encouraged to further develop your storytelling ability. Although there are big books that can tell you how to do it better, practice is the true teacher. With respect to the article, I see storytelling as something very much tied into child development and I don't see how that aspect can't be gone into properly.

dominotw 10y ago

You know its going to be pure garbage when the title is 'Doing X makes you happy!! '. Fuck these studies that can never be reproduced even under the exact circumstances. These charlatans continue to be allocated funds instead of going to jail; despite being exposed as frauds countless times. Just because reading stuff like this gives us good vibes doesn't mean we should continue wasting money on these "studies". Time to say enough is enough and put these "professors" behind bars for wasting public money. This pointless scientific approach to human behavior and society has distracted us from any genuine discussion about our own internal and external conflicts . A Human being to these people is a machine which when given input X produces output Y. Why do we continue to accept this?

themartorana 10y ago
Ya know, if you would just learn to be a better story teller...
dcposch 10y ago
I think "jail the professors" is too extreme. There needs to be a more constructive solution. I completely agree with your assessment of the problem.
- bambax 10y ago
  The better solution is to stop funding them, although I wouldn't know how to locate the source.
- nxzero 10y ago
  (Careful, heard this "story" about dcposch, he might send you to jail too.) On more factual note, it's a known issue that as you move from hard to soft sciences that positive results increase: http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0010068 http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.... Fields studying topics like "happiness" tend to validate their hypothesis over 90% of the time; which means something fishy is going on.
  - 10y ago

bambax 10y ago

Why do marriages have to be saved, and why are marriage counselors presented as respectable good guys instead of odious charlatans that prey on the weak and miserable???

Ma8ee 10y ago
Because marriage isn't always easy, and some couples are actually helped by the counselor, even if it's only because the couple are forced to sit down and talk to each other in normal voices.
coldtea 10y ago
Because marriage, like anything worth its while, is not just instant gratification, and it often takes effort to make good again. Or, to answer in another way, because people in falling marriages feel like it's something worth saving, that they try to find help with achieving that. Who are you to tell them otherwise, and generalize that to all marriage counselors and people wanting to save their marriage?

Kluny 10y ago

I fully agree that storytelling is an important skill, but boy howdy is that experiment ridiculous. Every time I read about one of these ridiculous studies I wish someone would start an organization for reproducing and debunking bad studies.

Wilduck 10y ago
The Open Science Framework has Reproducibility Projects for a number of different fields. Like this one for Psychology: https://osf.io/ezcuj/wiki/home/ https://osf.io/ezcuj/wiki/home/ and are generally trying to make science more open and reproducible.

likeastone 10y ago

I know a guy who's an excellent story teller. He's also a pathological liar who never intends to keep any of his promises.

vonnik 10y ago

Matthew Dicks is a great story teller with some good tips: http://www.matthewdicks.com/new-page-5/ http://www.matthewdicks.com/new-page-5/ https://themoth.org/storytellers/matthew-dicks https://themoth.org/storytellers/matthew-dicks

hackaflocka 10y ago

Whenever you're not sure whether something is a cause or an effect, look up Taleb on "Narrative Fallacy."

londonfilmgeek 10y ago

Storytellers are more able to contextualise their misery within an aspirational framework.