4 ms·

As I understand it he was well-armed and well-armored, such that getting into a position to take him down non-lethally wasn't an option. The robot/bomb solutio

As I understand it he was well-armed and well-armored, such that getting into a position to take him down non-lethally wasn't an option. The robot/bomb solution does seem crude. How far off are we from robots who can get close enough to deploy some non-lethal method of disabling someone similarly armed.

techthroway443 10y ago
You mean like the Terminator?
- mixmastamyk 10y ago
  Robocop.
falcolas 10y ago
If they had a robot capable of taking in a bomb, could they have not used some other gas grenade option? To me, a bomb seems too likely to cause collateral damage (barring all other ethical concerns).
- nradov 10y ago
  What sort of "gas grenade option"? Tear gas is only marginally effective. In reality there is no such thing as safe and effective knock out gas like you see in the movies.
  - dTal 10y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_hostage_crisis_chemical_agent https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_hostage_crisis_chemical... "Safe", no. Better than a bomb, absolutely.
    - pandaman 10y ago
      Moscow's was a special forces (think Delta/SEAL Team 6 level) operation. City police departments, even in Russia, do not have equipment nor training to wage chemical warfare on short notice.
  - falcolas 10y ago
    Flash bang, smoke, Capsicum?
  - Zigurd 10y ago
    If he didn't have gas mask, a teargas grenade would cause a lot of discomfort and probably end a standoff.
duaneb 10y ago
Why didn't they use the robot to eg administer Thorazine?
- pbhjpbhj 10y ago
  Presumably the threat of using a trigger: exploding him and any electronic trigger he had probably amounted to the lowest risk according to their analysis. e.g. relatively low-tech assailant, some conviction they've actually planted IEDs. Perhaps they'd bluffed using a phone as a trigger.
hga 10y ago
I doubt he had hard armor plates that would stop a rifle bullet, and they're heavy, so their coverage is pretty small. More likely there just wasn't a good shot to take of him, the only question is why not wait him out, and the threats of bombs and the fog of war (and this was much closer to war than any incident in recent memory, it's reminding me of the cultural '60s and those who wouldn't let it go into the cultural '70s) made it reasonable to take a more serious although not necessarily deadly methods (it's not like they used a fragmentation grenade) to stop the threat he potentially still posed. And given his was a lot better at close quarters combat than his opponents in general (http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/07/08/video-suggests-cop-killing-dallas-terrorists-rank-amatuers/ http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/07/08/video-suggests-cop-k...), storming is position is not something I'd ask anyone to do.
IndianAstronaut 10y ago
Russia used an opium gas to disable terrorists in the 2002 theater raid.
- oxide 10y ago
  It was a fentanyl analogue, and it killed several people, including hostages IIRC.

techthroway443 10y ago

You mean like the Terminator?

mixmastamyk 10y ago
Robocop.

falcolas 10y ago

If they had a robot capable of taking in a bomb, could they have not used some other gas grenade option? To me, a bomb seems too likely to cause collateral damage (barring all other ethical concerns).

nradov 10y ago
What sort of "gas grenade option"? Tear gas is only marginally effective. In reality there is no such thing as safe and effective knock out gas like you see in the movies.
- dTal 10y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_hostage_crisis_chemical_agent https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moscow_hostage_crisis_chemical... "Safe", no. Better than a bomb, absolutely.
  - pandaman 10y ago
    Moscow's was a special forces (think Delta/SEAL Team 6 level) operation. City police departments, even in Russia, do not have equipment nor training to wage chemical warfare on short notice.
- falcolas 10y ago
  Flash bang, smoke, Capsicum?
- Zigurd 10y ago
  If he didn't have gas mask, a teargas grenade would cause a lot of discomfort and probably end a standoff.

duaneb 10y ago

Why didn't they use the robot to eg administer Thorazine?

pbhjpbhj 10y ago
Presumably the threat of using a trigger: exploding him and any electronic trigger he had probably amounted to the lowest risk according to their analysis. e.g. relatively low-tech assailant, some conviction they've actually planted IEDs. Perhaps they'd bluffed using a phone as a trigger.

hga 10y ago

I doubt he had hard armor plates that would stop a rifle bullet, and they're heavy, so their coverage is pretty small. More likely there just wasn't a good shot to take of him, the only question is why not wait him out, and the threats of bombs and the fog of war (and this was much closer to war than any incident in recent memory, it's reminding me of the cultural '60s and those who wouldn't let it go into the cultural '70s) made it reasonable to take a more serious although not necessarily deadly methods (it's not like they used a fragmentation grenade) to stop the threat he potentially still posed. And given his was a lot better at close quarters combat than his opponents in general (http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/07/08/video-suggests-cop-killing-dallas-terrorists-rank-amatuers/ http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/07/08/video-suggests-cop-k...), storming is position is not something I'd ask anyone to do.

IndianAstronaut 10y ago

Russia used an opium gas to disable terrorists in the 2002 theater raid.

oxide 10y ago
It was a fentanyl analogue, and it killed several people, including hostages IIRC.