9 ms·
A family converts a decommissioned school into a home and bed-and-breakfast
- deleted 11y ago[deleted]
- scrumper 11y agoThis looks great, and their kids will look back and feel very lucky to have grown up here. As a US resident, I can't help but wonder whether: - Property taxes (it's huge) - Building code - Zoning Would prevent something like that happening here.
- wk_end 11y agoWe have all of those things in Canada.
- logfromblammo 11y agoAmericans just assume that in Canada, taxes are slightly higher, corruption in local government less prevalent, and land use restrictions less severe. Of course, some of us may also believe that Canadian taxes may be paid in maple syrup, Molson lager, or ketchup chips, and that the revenue agency is required to sincerely apologize for every remittance accepted. As a national aggregate, we don't get out much, even to visit the neighbors.
- scrumper 11y agoMy question was based on the opposite actually: I had an assumption that US property tax would be higher, building code more strict, and zoning laws less permissive. I just felt like buying a gigantic old school and living in it would be a massive administrative pain in the backside in the US, but sort of a nicely achievable bit of whimsy in Canada. (I'm British, but own property in the US, and I'm staggered by the size of my property tax bills here vs. the UK, and more so by the sheer number of permits I have to get for doing trivial work I'd tackle myself in the UK).
- logfromblammo 11y agoAmericans love burdensome zoning laws. They appeal to our inner racist. Unfortunately for them, buildings like schools, fire stations, and police stations are usually in residential zones anyway. The major problem in the US is that there's just no way you would be able to set up a bed and breakfast as easily as the article implied. Our property taxes vary wildly in the US. One place, you might pay 3% of the fair market value, and in another, only 0.25%. Or maybe the assessment value is restricted by some formula. Maybe it's reassessed annually, or maybe every 3 years. There's really very little consistency, because property taxes are usually assessed locally and the major service provided from them is the local public schools. Building codes between Canada and the US are pretty much the same. In either place, there's a "model code", but each locality has to adopt it explicitly for it to be in effect. Some places adopt it without modification, and others amend it heavily. A Canadian town could adopt the American model code (called the international building code, of course) if it wanted to, or vice versa. But for the most part, they have nearly identical intent, even if the implementations are far apart. As long as you hire local contractors for the work, you shouldn't need to know the particular variances in the building codes. Either way, you won't be allowed to do anything serious without a work permit, and someone will inspect the heck out of it. (Of course, the permits and inspections are often ignored for DIY work.) I doubt you would even be able to buy an old public school building in many places in the US. Perhaps in Detroit. Most local governments would rather board it up or use it for administrative offices than sell. You would have better luck finding an old church.
- guyzero 11y agoI suspect it's more of an urban/rural split than a Canadian/US split. I assume you don't own property in a rural area of the US.
- guyzero 11y agoThe headline says "Toronto family" but the school itself is pretty rural and not that near Toronto. I expect taxes are lower than their urban house and zoning is pretty relaxed. https://www.google.com/maps/place/Milford,+ON+K0K,+Canada/@43.9351176,-77.6512341,9z/data=!4m2!3m1!1s0x89d7b86348a84699:0xb01b729c26d910b4 https://www.google.com/maps/place/Milford,+ON+K0K,+Canada/@4... They can nearly see Mexico from their house! (Mexico, NY that is)
- jbob2000 11y agoThat's a 1.5 hour drive from Toronto, not even considered the Greater Toronto Area. I am sure the Globe is putting them under the Toronto umbrella to get views; who the hell could afford to do this in Toronto... oh wait it's not Toronto, but you already gave them your traffic.
- gtk40 11y agoSee my comment to your parent. I don't think it's about getting more views, when talking about a transition from city to country. In the second paragraph: "They had been ruminating for years, however, about leaving Toronto for a more free-spirited life in the country with their three young daughters."
- gtk40 11y agoThe headline is "Toronto family ditches the city for old school fixer-upper in country" (at least in the <title>) and the tagline says "the obstacles they overcame in moving to the country." It seems quite clearly to be talking about a family who moved from Toronto, the city, to the country, not that their endpoint is in the city.
- dsp1234 11y agoFor $400k in Oregon, you can do that now. https://www.redfin.com/OR/Beavercreek/23931-S-Schuebel-School-Rd-97004/home/25742576 https://www.redfin.com/OR/Beavercreek/23931-S-Schuebel-Schoo... Just have to get an occupancy permit. Taxes were $5k for 2014.
- clock_tower 11y agoYou could also buy a houseplane: http://www.columbiapacificaviation.com/trainingsalesetc/aircraftforsale.html http://www.columbiapacificaviation.com/trainingsalesetc/airc...
- qahs_user 11y agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Anne_High_School,_Seattle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_Anne_High_School,_Seattl...
- ctdonath 11y agoBravo on the out-of-the-box thinking. Nice to see someone make such an opportunity happen, showing others that status quo need not be adhered to. I once seriously considered buying a defunct health club for the same domestic purpose. Adapting the locker rooms seemed the most daunting aspect, but the 3-lane full-length indoor pool was awful tempting. Notice how far out the family had to go to make it work: fully insulating walls, wood heat, and a large garden among other factors.
- slantyyz 11y ago>> Notice how far out the family had to go to make it work: fully insulating walls, wood heat, and a large garden among other factors. On the plus side, I'm guessing that the sale of their Toronto home left them with a lot of budget to do that work though. IIRC, the average selling price of a home in Toronto is floating around $1M these days, and the school cost "only" $190K.
- the_unknown 11y agoAnd not just any part of Toronto - High Park. They were pretty well off to start with going with that as the base. Good for them on using their money to fund a great learning/growing experience for their kids.
- pyre 11y agoYou're both assuming that their mortgage was paid off or that they owned the house outright.
- jacquesm 11y agoI lived two streets down from there. High Park has both very posh houses and not-so-posh (as in: derelict) ones, it's very much a mixed bag there, especially on the North-East side.
- giarc 11y agoI hope the wood splitting picture was staged. Those girls are a few feet from a man swinging an axe splitting wood. That's an accident waiting to happen.
- rubidium 11y agoThey're 7+ feet away. He's facing them and can see swing zone well. They're not dumb and know not to get too close. They'll be fine.
- protomyth 11y agoYep, the girls are fine, but I'm more worried about his posture. Either they took that picture at the exact wrong time or he is doing it wrong. Looking at the girls, the oldest could probably start chopping wood herself. Not, much, but she looks close to big enough.
- emmelaich 11y agoThat's my thought too. Looks like terrible technique. Hands together on the end far too early in the swing. And standing square on. Where did he swing it from?!
- protomyth 11y agoYeah, its like he learned his technique from cartoons about people hitting the high striker (strongman) at a carnival.
- Someone 11y agoIt could also be the net effect of the photographer directing them so that he could get what he wanted to show in one shot. The axe is moving, but it could be moving up. Shutter time might tell us something of its speed.
- giarc 11y agoI would argue she is much closer than 7 feet. She is likely 4 feet tall and it appears as if she laid down, she would be a few inches away. Considering that when splitting wood you should at a minimum be wearing safety glasses, I'm pretty sure this can all be done much safer.
- nobody_nowhere 11y ago"In the last year of its operation, the heating oil bill for the school was $38,000 and the electricity was another $10,000. They needed a better system."
- danans 11y agoI think this is a great example of a growing societal acceptance of people experimenting and choosing alternative styles of housing and also city organization, especially ones that involve reclaiming/re-purposing space. The article's particular example focuses on redefinition and reuse of an existing structure in a very sparsely populated area. In dense areas, other ways of re-purposing space are happening. Everyone has seen former industrial facilities converted into multi-unit housing. But these ideas are even creeping into traditional neighborhoods. In my case, I would love to convert my second parking spot into additional living space. The idea is, with urban neighborhood land values so high (at least in booming areas), it's hard to justify providing housing for a second car). Of course, this isn't even a new idea. For decades people have been kicking their cars to the curb so they can use their garages for other purposes (gym, workshop, playroom,...). In the coming decades, as people move more towards uber/lyft style services for transportation, I can see a lot of prime space formerly occupied by cars being freed up for creative re-use.
- jerf 11y agoWho do you think is, I don't even know what, harrumphing at the idea of people buying old things and repurposing them? I live in the midwest and have a pretty good idea of what the stodgiest old-fogiest ideas about housing could be, and all I can think of even the retired guys around here thinking is "Hmm, that would be an interesting challenge." Repurposing barns is a cottage industry around here. (From what I gather, the farms are doing fine, but improved logistics has rendered a lot of storage excess to requirements.) Repurposing space is basically what happens to space.
- roel_v 11y agoRenovating is more expensive than rebuilding. Renovated nice old buildings are a luxury, not a savings measure (I live in one, which we renovated ourselves - would've been cheaper and better to knock down and rebuild)
- danjayh 11y agoDepends on the building. We bought a house from the 40's on the small side (1500sf) that needed plumbing, electric service, all flooring surfaces replaced, kitchen guttend/replaced, both baths guttened/replaced, all appliances, and significant mechanical (furnace, water softener+filter), addition of closets, replaced deck, and probably stuff that I'm forgetting. Had a good roof, which was critical, because water damage would have sunk it (har har har). We did a lot of the work ourselves, saves a bundle. Contracted for about $40k of it up front to get it livable quickly. Somewhat related to the story - I bought a pellet boiler off craigslist for $2800 and did 100% of the installation myself (electrical, plumbing [heat + water heater], control) all-in was about $3900, and I'm already in the black on it after 3 years use (vs. propane). I decided to burn lpg this year because it was 'only' $1.70/gal, and it turns out that even at that low price (compared to the last three years) I'd probably have been better off on pellets, but probably not better off enough to make up for all of the labor that it takes. I set it up to automatically switch between the propane furnace and the boiler (I have a water/air hx) based on the boiler's temperature to make it seamless for my wife to use :). It's a Central Boiler Maxim M175 ... cranked all the way up, it might be able to heat his school (just barely) -- I run it at its lowest setting. Burns very clean, no smoke, happy neighbors. Renovation can be done for a reasonable financial cost with an investment of time. Our house isn't super-luxury now, but it's perfectly serviceable and now we have a house on 11 acres that we couldn't have touched if it hadn't been a dump when we bought it.
- sandworm101 11y agoNote the firewood. Lots and lots of firewood. Those high ceilings and cavernous rooms are a nightmare to heat. That wood stove must run 24/7. I'm all for re-purposing, but there is a point at which a building built for one purpose just isn't suitable for any other. Elementary school into residence/home might be that line.
- anon01292016 11y agoIt works for some (with means). The Human Genome Project's Eric Lander lives in a converted 10k ft^2 schoolhouse in Cambridge: http://connect.bostonmagazine.com/articles/?p=3392 http://connect.bostonmagazine.com/articles/?p=3392 Architect's photos: http://www.maryannthompson.com/projects/proj25.html http://www.maryannthompson.com/projects/proj25.html
- ZeroGravitas 11y agoMoving into a giant, expensive-to-heat home is one thing, claiming as they do in the article that it's part of a quest for sustainability is a little bizarre.
- utefan001 11y agoSimilar story. These Vegas transplants bought a small-town Nebraska schoolhouse and let their artistic flags fly. http://www.omaha.com/living/these-vegas-transplants-bought-a-small-town-nebraska-schoolhouse-and/article_c47a8a28-a2ad-5907-bbb5-fc5d878f0c9c.html http://www.omaha.com/living/these-vegas-transplants-bought-a...
- bane 11y agoI always like these kinds of stories, and then I wonder what the after-story is. A couple hundred thousand in repairs, renovation and remodeling, I'm guessing the occasional B&B guest doesn't provide a huge amount of income. What do people who do this (move out to extreme rural areas and buy enormous and expensive to maintain offbeat homes like schools, churches, power plants and missile silos) do for a living to afford this? I'd love to go out to random-rural-county and buy 20 acres of land and a school and turn it into a huge home, but then I'd be hours away from where I need to go to make the money to do that. There's always some other parts of the financial story that never seems to come through in these kinds of articles.
- ljk 11y agothis is just a guess - maybe they're not doing it for money, but as a form of a hobby
- mhurron 11y agoWell yes, but they still have to pay for it. For most people that means working, and that's time out of a day, most days a week. They included what it used to cost to heat and power the school for a year, but never mention what it is now. Details that are interesting to the story but probably take away from the 'feel good' type of article they were trying to make.
- scott_s 11y agoThat's fine, but that still doesn't answer bane's question: how does this family earn the income which they use to live?
- mey 11y agoMcMenamins did this in east Portland http://www.mcmenamins.com/427-kennedy-school-home http://www.mcmenamins.com/427-kennedy-school-home
- thenipper 11y agoIn an old job I worked for an affordable housing developer who did this with properties down in New Bedford, MA. We'd turn old schools into affordable housing units. Same with a hospital in Connecticut. It's a great way to increase the number of affordable units while using old buildings. EDIT: Here is an example: http://www.wihed.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Acushnet-Commons.pdf http://www.wihed.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Acushnet-Com...
- logn 11y agoChurch converted to condos: https://www.coldwellbankerhomes.com/ky/bellevue/320-poplar-street/pid_9936293/# https://www.coldwellbankerhomes.com/ky/bellevue/320-poplar-s...
- shirro 11y agoI would love to live in an unconventional house. There are schools closing in surrounding farming areas regularly but most are too much travelling time and poor Internet access. When there are some good ones with decent services not far from population, the government seems to have problems getting the schools on the market. By the time anyone can buy them they would be ruins.
- Scoundreller 11y agoChances are the nearest school for the 3 daughters could not be further away...
- dalke 11y agoNo more than 16km to the nearest public elementary school, according to https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Queen+Elizabeth+Public+School,+Picton,+Prince+Edward+County,+Ontario,+Canada/43.9350744,-77.1020501/@43.9551262,-77.1452028,10691m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m10!4m9!1m5!1m1!1s0x89d7ca551fce466f:0xd089bcae4057a3ce!2m2!1d-77.145692!2d44.009946!1m0!3e0!5i2 https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Queen+Elizabeth+Public+Schoo... . The secondary school is further, at about 50km to Belleville.
- c3534l 11y agoNow that I think about it, every old schoolhouse I've come across was turned into a bar.