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> This year, the firm expects to clock $10.84 billion in revenue which — calculating the 20 percent commission that it takes — should bring in around $2 billion

by brohee 11y ago

> This year, the firm expects to clock $10.84 billion in revenue which — calculating the 20 percent commission that it takes — should bring in around $2 billion in revenue for the year. Its projection for next year comes in at $26.12 billion, which could generate over $5 billion in take-home money. So, is it eleven or is two billions in revenue... Techcrunch...

GauntletWizard 11y ago
I'm guessing those are "Gross" vs "Net", or "Revenue" vs "Profit", depending on how you define your terms.
- brohee 11y ago
  So do I, but this is extremely sloppy writing. Profit is talked about a bit later in the article, there is likely none. I find it all very ironic with "financial mistatement" being on the front page.
- rajivtiru 11y ago
  Definitely not $2B "Profit" since they would have to subtract all other overhead costs like salaries etc. I think the article mentions that actual profit might be negative.
  - GauntletWizard 11y ago
    A business can report one business unit (The bit that hires drivers and sends them out) is 'profitable', and also have an overall in-the-red because other business units aren't. I've not read the presentation, but it may be that Uber is trying to show their engineering costs and operations costs as two business units to better represent how the business scales (Engineering costs go up only logarithmically, while operations go 1:1 with revenue).
  - pbreit 11y ago
    If Uber normalized its growth investing, it would continue to grow and be radically profitable.
- bpicolo 11y ago
  I'm pretty sure that's money paid by users (i.e., 80% which goes to drivers) then 20% to uber
rajivtiru 11y ago
This tripped me up too, but I would guess the author meant to say $10.84B gross revenue and $2B net revenue. http://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/102714/what-are-difference-between-gross-revenue-reporting-and-net-revenue-reporting.asp http://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/102714/what-are-diff...
deleted 11y ago
[deleted]
adventured 11y ago
It's $10.84b in total bookings (or taxi rental fees, whatever you want to call it), of which they keep 20%, so $2x billion in revenue for Uber. Next year bookings are projected at $26 billion and they'll keep $5.x billion of that as revenue for Uber Corp.
pbreit 11y ago
Good timing: http://blog.samaltman.com/financial-misstatements http://blog.samaltman.com/financial-misstatements
- fweespeech 11y ago
  Yeah but the media isn't held to that.
bedhead 11y ago
It's $2 billion. Groupon tried this during its IPO preparation and the SEC smacked them down and made them use net rather than gross for their gaap revenue. (Note that the SEC actually made Groupon change a bunch of stuff)
paulcole 11y ago
They're talking about 11B in pass-through revenue and 2B in revenue to Uber. The 11B is the value of transactions they're facilitating through bookings that customers make, which pass through Uber and end up with the drivers, less the commission, which is the 2B in Uber revenue.
gamblor956 11y ago
$2 billion. Uber is never entitled to the full 100% they collect from passengers, so under Generally Accepted Accounting Principles (GAAP), it is inappropriate for them to record the full $10.84b as revenue. From a GAAP perspective, pretty much every financial term is used incorrectly in the TC article, though presumably under Unicorn Accounting they make sense as used. Uber's gross revenue under GAAP is roughly $2 billion; net revenue is gross revenue less the costs directly associated with earning that revenue (generally meaning costs that can be determined on a per unit basis). Net profit is net revenue less non-directly-allocated expenses (like marketing, legal, rent, etc.). Based on previous leaks this summer, Uber is not currently profitable on either a GAAP or Unicorn Accounting basis. Companies publicly traded in the US are required to use GAAP for their financial statements. Companies that are not publicly traded are free to use Unicorn Accounting, on the presumption that investors in privately held companies should know to perform their own due diligence.
- discodave 11y ago
  Where are the Unicorn Accounting Principles (UAP) documented?
  - jerf 11y ago
    In the souls of eager entrepreneurs who are still children at heart... in the wind wafting through the foggy streets of San Francisco... pounded into the soul of the ground and streets around San Jose... in the clickety-clack of ping-pong games played just down the hall from the accounting office... when you have Employee Incentive Stock Options from a Unicorn, then you, too, will know the Accounting Principles, you will celebrate the Accounting Principles, you will be one with the Accounting Principles, and you will know they are Good, and you will laugh with elvish glee long into the night, singing praises to the mighty accountants who with ever-careful attention to the Unicorn Accounting Principles bring wealth and happiness to all. (And darken not their spirits with tales of the Coming of the Second Great Pop.)
    - brianwawok 11y ago
      I prefer 10x accounting principles.
dthal 11y ago
It seems like they should really call that top-line, $10 bn, number 'bookings' and the second, $2 bn, number 'revenue'.

by brohee 11y ago

GauntletWizard 11y ago

I'm guessing those are "Gross" vs "Net", or "Revenue" vs "Profit", depending on how you define your terms.

brohee 11y ago
So do I, but this is extremely sloppy writing. Profit is talked about a bit later in the article, there is likely none. I find it all very ironic with "financial mistatement" being on the front page.
rajivtiru 11y ago
Definitely not $2B "Profit" since they would have to subtract all other overhead costs like salaries etc. I think the article mentions that actual profit might be negative.
- GauntletWizard 11y ago
  A business can report one business unit (The bit that hires drivers and sends them out) is 'profitable', and also have an overall in-the-red because other business units aren't. I've not read the presentation, but it may be that Uber is trying to show their engineering costs and operations costs as two business units to better represent how the business scales (Engineering costs go up only logarithmically, while operations go 1:1 with revenue).
- pbreit 11y ago
  If Uber normalized its growth investing, it would continue to grow and be radically profitable.
bpicolo 11y ago
I'm pretty sure that's money paid by users (i.e., 80% which goes to drivers) then 20% to uber

rajivtiru 11y ago

This tripped me up too, but I would guess the author meant to say $10.84B gross revenue and $2B net revenue. http://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/102714/what-are-difference-between-gross-revenue-reporting-and-net-revenue-reporting.asp http://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/102714/what-are-diff...

deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

adventured 11y ago

It's $10.84b in total bookings (or taxi rental fees, whatever you want to call it), of which they keep 20%, so $2x billion in revenue for Uber. Next year bookings are projected at $26 billion and they'll keep $5.x billion of that as revenue for Uber Corp.

pbreit 11y ago

Good timing: http://blog.samaltman.com/financial-misstatements http://blog.samaltman.com/financial-misstatements

fweespeech 11y ago
Yeah but the media isn't held to that.

bedhead 11y ago

It's $2 billion. Groupon tried this during its IPO preparation and the SEC smacked them down and made them use net rather than gross for their gaap revenue. (Note that the SEC actually made Groupon change a bunch of stuff)

paulcole 11y ago

They're talking about 11B in pass-through revenue and 2B in revenue to Uber. The 11B is the value of transactions they're facilitating through bookings that customers make, which pass through Uber and end up with the drivers, less the commission, which is the 2B in Uber revenue.

gamblor956 11y ago

$2 billion. Uber is never entitled to the full 100% they collect from passengers, so under Generally Accepted Accounting Principles (GAAP), it is inappropriate for them to record the full $10.84b as revenue. From a GAAP perspective, pretty much every financial term is used incorrectly in the TC article, though presumably under Unicorn Accounting they make sense as used. Uber's gross revenue under GAAP is roughly $2 billion; net revenue is gross revenue less the costs directly associated with earning that revenue (generally meaning costs that can be determined on a per unit basis). Net profit is net revenue less non-directly-allocated expenses (like marketing, legal, rent, etc.). Based on previous leaks this summer, Uber is not currently profitable on either a GAAP or Unicorn Accounting basis. Companies publicly traded in the US are required to use GAAP for their financial statements. Companies that are not publicly traded are free to use Unicorn Accounting, on the presumption that investors in privately held companies should know to perform their own due diligence.

discodave 11y ago
Where are the Unicorn Accounting Principles (UAP) documented?
- jerf 11y ago
  In the souls of eager entrepreneurs who are still children at heart... in the wind wafting through the foggy streets of San Francisco... pounded into the soul of the ground and streets around San Jose... in the clickety-clack of ping-pong games played just down the hall from the accounting office... when you have Employee Incentive Stock Options from a Unicorn, then you, too, will know the Accounting Principles, you will celebrate the Accounting Principles, you will be one with the Accounting Principles, and you will know they are Good, and you will laugh with elvish glee long into the night, singing praises to the mighty accountants who with ever-careful attention to the Unicorn Accounting Principles bring wealth and happiness to all. (And darken not their spirits with tales of the Coming of the Second Great Pop.)
  - brianwawok 11y ago
    I prefer 10x accounting principles.

dthal 11y ago

It seems like they should really call that top-line, $10 bn, number 'bookings' and the second, $2 bn, number 'revenue'.