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Using Windows 10? Microsoft is watching
- zubairsaif007 11y agohttp://googler700.blogspot.com/2015/04/blog-post.html http://googler700.blogspot.com/2015/04/blog-post.html
- fru2013 11y agoNon paywalled: https://archive.is/xlu7p https://archive.is/xlu7p
- Dylan16807 11y agoThanks. It was insisting I had 'used up' free articles despite having not visited the site in months.
- rffn 11y agoDid the same for me. Incognito mode in Chrome fixed that though.
- LoSboccacc 11y agoare we gonna run one of these every day?
- static_noise 11y agoIf it helps to improve the situation someday I'm all for it.
- orionblastar 11y agoIn order to make Windows 10 upgrades free, the customer is now the product. Most AI stuff collects data like that anyway. Anything you say to Siri in iOS goes to Apple. Ubuntu has Amazon adware in it. Most operating systems these days have some way to collect data on the user and monetize it or whatever. This is the only way to get your privacy back: https://prism-break.org/ https://prism-break.org/
- hessenwolf 11y agoHow is the largest worldwide software roll-out, that happens to be the most important (debatable) operating system, not interesting on a daily basis?
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- Maarten88 11y agoThis is a terrible article, it only repeats and speculates on articles that appeared previous days, with some random tweets as further "evidence". Also, it feels rather disingenuous to accuse Microsoft of spying on a webpage fully loaded with 3rd party trackers and ads. Unlike Microsoft, Newsweek did not ask me for permission to spy on me when I was reading this article. And I certainly could not turn it off.
- amag 11y agoGhostery...
- static_noise 11y agoWe can't even be sure what they're really doing because we cannot audit the software nor can we audit the encrypted communications.
- moloch 11y agoIt's not difficult to intercept this type of encrypted communication, since it's coming from your computer you can just hook the functions responsible for sending the data, or for encrypting it in the first place. Many times it's as simple as adding your own CA to the trusted certificate store.
- static_noise 11y agoInteresting idea! Did someone actually do such a thing for the older versions of Windows? Was it possible to meaningfully decode all of the outgoing data?
- pdkl95 11y agoThat works now, but one the Intel SGX instructions are commonplace it is going to be next to impossible to modify "secured" code or read their RAM.
- mtgx 11y agoThey announced some cool security technologies for Windows 10, but in my eyes their recent privacy invasions not only cancel all that out (I actually believe some of them are to make NSA/FBI's jobs easier, even as they "strengthen" the security of the OS), but makes everything worse in the end.
- zatkin 11y agoA lot of this can be disabled. For example, using a local account and not a Microsoft account. I'm guessing that's where the author got his notion of "contact details, passwords, demographic data and credit card specifics". Also, if you go to the Privacy settings, you can disable things like Cortana and other services.
- static_noise 11y agoa) Can you be sure they really stop collecting that data when you flip some switch? b) Judging from past experience I fear that some features will randomly "auto-enable" themselves when some future updates are installed.
- Dylan16807 11y agoBut it's too vague on what is still allowed when you disable what you can, and even opt-out there are certain things that should not be tolerated.
- tdicola 11y agoIf you disable all those features (Cortana, not logging in with MS account disables the Windows Store, etc.) then why even run Windows 10?
- rational-future 11y agoDirectX 10, HTTP/2, kernel improvements, etc.
- PythonicAlpha 11y agoI thought, HTTP/2 is something that the browser must support. Did you recognize, that there are some different browsers out there?
- rational-future 11y agoDo you recognize that someone needs to develop the sites that you consume? The web server that comes with Windows 10 - IIS 10 is the first version of IIS to support HTTP/2.
- zatkin 11y agoOn a tangental remark, data is an enormous asset in a company these days. What if they released Windows 10 for free because the data is already worth enough compared to the typical cost of the operating system ($100)?
- joeyspn 11y agoIf you are not paying for the product... you are the product
- Dylan16807 11y agoYou pay for windows when you buy a computer. One free update does not invite that stupid cliche. Hint: a lot of companies treat you equally terribly even though you're paying
- PythonicAlpha 11y agoEven when other companies are doing it also, does it make it better? At least until now, you could use a computer and OS without being sold (just don't use some free services and avoid paid products where your data is also sold). But when the OS is also selling your data, you just have no hiding place any more!
- Dylan16807 11y agoI'm not defending Microsoft with that, I'm just attacking the cliche. "Being a product" is mostly unrelated to whether you're paying. Companies are jerks.
- PythonicAlpha 11y agoOk, thanks for the clarification! > Companies are jerks I fully agree with that! Also with your assertion, that using paid services will automatically help is totally correct, of course.
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- mtgx 11y agoThe "new" Microsoft seems to have changed its tune from the "Gmail man" and "Scroogle" days.
- 9872 11y agoBecause those ads didn't work. All they did was prove that the vast majority of people don't care about digital privacy.
- lbruder 11y agoMaybe Windows 10 is the best thing that ever happened to Linux...
- agumonkey 11y agoBut I'm sure Mr Stallman is feeling a great disturbance in the force. As if a million soul have been coerced into non-privacy.
- dirtshell 11y agoI am thinking the same thing right now... maybe people will eventually get tired of the privacy invasions and start running an OS that doesn't spy on you
- iscrewyou 11y agoI was excited for the new Windows at first. Given that I haven't heard about a single groundbreaking improvement Win 10 brings but only privacy violations, I'll no longer be supporting Microsoft. I removed my bootcamp partition Win 8.1(that I wanted to upgrade to Win 10) last night. Only using Mac version of excel. I'll make sure we never(or hold off for as long as possible) move on to Win 10 at the office, just like we did for Win 8. As a consumer, the only power I have is that I'll put my money where my mouth is. And it is no longer Microsoft. Yes, Apple has it's issues. But I clearly see where they want to be and they have 100% of my support. Microsoft, no longer. edit: grammar
- notNow 11y agoThanks for the infomercial.
- jasonlotito 11y ago> Yes, Apple has it's issues. What's interesting is the ease of which I can replace Microsoft with Apple here. "From the moment an account is created, Apple begins watching. The company saves customers’ basic information—name, contact details, passwords, demographic data and credit card specifics —but it also digs a bit deeper. Other information Apple saves includes search queries and conversations with the new digital personal assistant Siri; contents of private communications such as email; websites and apps visited (including features accessed and length of time used); and contents of private folders." The article makes it clear this isn't just Microsoft: "“Both Siri and Google Now require access to the user’s personal information to personalise responses, while both Apple and Google offer developers the ability to deliver personalised ads to users based on information such as app installs.” I guess what this means is if you are earnest in your concern for privacy and security, neither Apple nor Microsoft are in any way possible solutions for you.
- notNow 11y agoWhen did downvoting actually prevent you from seeing or reading "unfavorable" or "heretic" comments here? Your downvoting won't stop me or any other dissident here from speaking our mind and exposing the hypocrisy or ridiculousness of this type of cheap advertorials here. Keep downvoting me, it's a badge of honor to wear on my chest :)
- 0xffffabcd 11y agoPrevious discussions: * https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9976298 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9976298 * https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9978497 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9978497 * https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9989189 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9989189 * https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9983071 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9983071 * https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9975695 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9975695 And these are just the ones about privacy... it get old, especially since nothing has changed since the release yet.
- static_noise 11y ago> it gets old and yet it still is an urgent issue that we should not silently accept because it's "getting old" and "nothing will change".
- forthefuture 11y agoExcept when the same information is posted by 6 websites and all 6 of those articles have made the front page, you start to alienate people in the middle who understand all of the current information and are now unhappy with the one sided coverage and angry internet mob of people who already weren't using Windows.
- integraton 11y agoThose are different articles. Your comment is analogous to linking to old Docker article discussions when a new article is posted in order to try to discourage discussion of Docker in general.
- 0xffffabcd 11y agoThey are different articles about the same issue and I'm not trying to discourage discussion about it. It just gets old seeing the same thing on the front page but that's just my opinion and you don't have to agree with it.
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- hoodoof 11y agoI thought Microsoft provided clear information on this and options to turn it all off when installing.
- morganvachon 11y agoThey did, and they do. It's the usual scaremongering that happens when any large software company has a new release.
- PhasmaFelis 11y agoThat's largely meaningless when the default settings are abusive. They know that most users won't be aware of the issues, and will choose "Express Install" rather than looking at the "advanced" options, so MS can still exploit them without their knowledge.
- hoodoof 11y agoMicrosoft is a business. Why would it serve their interests to make all this opt-out by default?
- PhasmaFelis 11y agoAre you saying that it's hopeless to expect businesses not to be jerks, or that it's morally acceptable to be a jerk as long as the shareholders see a return on it?
- forthefuture 11y agoIt's more that a business can't be a jerk because it's not a person. It doesn't matter if it's morally acceptable as long as it's legal. Morality is something you make up to tell other people that what you believe in is right.
- PythonicAlpha 11y agoThe line is crossed. When we don't stop it now, this will be the end of privacy for every computer user -- at least of commercial OSs. Even with the possibility to deactivate all this, the user consented to the "privacy terms" -- so the OS can even collect data "by error" -- and they will come away with it. To trust such a company again, there would be a second set of privacy terms needed, that would be used for everybody that rejects the data collection. But I don't think, that there will be a second set of terms at all (for that to happen, a majority of people must start to think about their privacy).
- Systemic33 11y agoHonestly, this is getting a bit tiresome. The world has displayed a lack of interest in privacy with regards to digital systems. Therefore Microsoft has chosen to enable features required for making the computer more personalized by default, but still allow users to opt-out. Most other vendors don't even give this oppertunity when installing, but can only be done later via some deep-down config change. If you are paranoid about your data privacy, please just use one of the many privacy focused OS's. In the end you will always be forced to trust something, or you might as well go off the grid in a third world country. Because thats really the only place complete privacy is realistic.
- pdkl95 11y ago> displayed a lack of interest in privacy The tech industry really needs to stop confusing "lack of interest" with "total ignorance". Very few people have any idea that this kind of data collection happens at all (because the tech industry hides a lot of it), and even fewer understand the consequences of permanent retention of data and what machine learning can do to it. > If you are paranoid about your data privacy http://harpers.org/archive/1964/11/the-paranoid-style-in-american-politics/ http://harpers.org/archive/1964/11/the-paranoid-style-in-ame...
- mark_l_watson 11y agoIt seems like a lot of journalists have jumped on the 'bash Microsoft for privacy' bandwagon this week. Seems lazy. Can't they think of something else to write about? I am a 'privacy nut' to some small degree. I use 3 Linux laptops that are locked down privacy-wise. But I also use Google, Microsoft, and Apple services. I set my privacy setting for Windows 10 to not report back much data to Cortana. The thing is, when I talk with non-tech friends and family, most of them don't seem to care about privacy. They put lots of personal information on Facebook and generally want the best user experience for the devices they buy. For most people, the default Windows 10 settings are probably what they want. If a non-tech friend wants a secure system I point them to a Chromebook and if they want privacy I point them to an iPad (with the best privacy settings like not using permanent cookies, even if they need to login to web sites they use).