5 ms·

I actually think the Ouya was a very nice idea, and clearly so did a lot of people who backed it. The execution was awful on so many levels, but there will prob

I actually think the Ouya was a very nice idea, and clearly so did a lot of people who backed it. The execution was awful on so many levels, but there will probably be room in the market for something like this once the console market is done shifting => non-existent. I would guess it will be part of something like the Apple TV box though.

Scuds 11y ago
What could have been done besides throwing more money at it? How did Microsoft get the original xbox into a state of relevance?
- TylerE 11y ago
  Better engineering. One of the big issues is TERRIBLE (like.... >1/10th of a second) lag with the wireless controller.
  - jplur 11y ago
    My super hexagon score says otherwise.
- cwyers 11y ago
  > How did Microsoft get the original xbox into a state of relevance? Halo. I mean, there was a pile of other Xbox exclusive games at the time that probably helped -- Fable, Dead or Alive, Ninja Gaiden, Steel Battalion -- but the original Xbox pretty much made its name entirely on Halo and Halo 2.
- larrik 11y ago
  "How did Microsoft get the original xbox into a state of relevance?" By dumping an insane amount of money into it, and waiting until the 360 to actually make any profit whatsoever. Not easy to replicate.
  - cwyers 11y ago
    I have no idea why people are downvoting this, as it's pretty accurate. If anything it understates the difficulty. The original Xbox cost tons to develop, and Microsoft spent a lot more money getting games for the thing. In the process they created the canonical example of a console first-person shooter, the genre that now dominates game sales. (You could argue that Goldeneye and Perfect Dark on the N64 got there first, but Halo is the one that really moved the market to where it is now.) Then on top of that, they created Xbox Live, which has had at least as much impact on how we play games as Halo did. And you're absolutely right that they lost money in the process. So yeah, dumping an insane amount of money into creating two products that revolutionized the game industry and not recouping that investment until the the second-generation product launched is how they did it.
    - Falcon9 11y ago
      "Created" is a strong word for Microsoft's contribution to Halo, given the original debut of the game at MacWorld: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2RMHeMGDDU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2RMHeMGDDU
      - Narishma 11y ago
        Didn't it start as an RTS on the Mac, and only became an FPS when they moved it to Xbox?
      - cwyers 11y ago
        If we're playing the pedant game, what I said was: > In the process they created the canonical example of a console first-person shooter Whatever one thinks about Microsoft's involvement in Halo, it wasn't going to be a console game at all without them. And I don't think it's the game that changes the whole industry if it's not the game that brought PC's biggest genre to consoles in a way that made them feel like they belonged there.
  - swang 11y ago
    it's probably unlikely microsoft has made a profit at all with the xbox. keep in mind it lost a lot of money fixing the RROD problems (not enough thermal paste will cost you $$$!). then with R&D for 3 consoles, marketing, advertising, etc i'd be surprised if the entire thing has ever made money for them. they are just dumping money into in the hopes that they will not lose out as a competitor in the family entertainment system although they totally screwed that one up during the whole E3 XBox One fiasco.
- bobajeff 11y ago
  >What could have been done besides throwing more money at it? A physical media format. So that buying games has real meaning to the user. First-party games, instead of relying on third parties to supply the system sellers.
- munchbunny 11y ago
  They dumped a ton of money into it. They literally bought game developers to make sure Xbox would get good games. And then Xbox Live basically redefined online gaming. But the other thing is that Microsoft has a surprisingly strong hardware game for a software company. Most of the hardware they push out has solid fundamentals, even if the overarching idea or business model has flaws. Examples: - Keyboards (they're consistently good middle-tier, budget keyboards) - Mouses (again, nothing to write home about, but they'll last you many years) - Zune HD (amazing hardware, no traction) - Xbox (other than the controversial huuuuge controllers and then RROD problem on the 360) - Phones (again, solid hardware even if the software leaves something to be desired)
dogma1138 11y ago
"Nice idea" very bad implementation. It released with an outdated Android OS running on pretty lame hardware, it had tons of compatibility issues and you couldn't play allot of the Android games on it at the time even if you managed to get the store working. The store was also an issue they couldn't really figure out what they wanted, their own store, google play, amazon or any other 3rd party service. It was way to expensive for what it did, under powered and obsolete out of the gate considering that you could buy cheaper and better Android4TV setups from DX or any other Chinese dealer at the time. If you want a TV micro console done right look at the Shield TV from NVIDIA. Pretty much the best hardware on the market at least as it goes for CPU/GPU combo some X86 CPU's might be slightly faster than the A15's. Streaming capability from your PC (NVIDIA HW required) with pretty much no perceivable lag. Streaming from the NVIDIA game cloud (GRID) with very little to no lag with a decent (10-20mbit stable) internet connection. Tegra X1 specific game ports with quite a few games including HL2/Obox and Crysis 3 ports. 4K media support, including future 4K game streaming, the box can handle it it's about 2-3 times as powerful as the 360 in terms of pure GPU performance...
ChuckMcM 11y ago
What you have described is called 'under capitalized.' What that means is that the company had insufficient capital to achieve all the milestones necessary for success. There is a variable of course, which is that some teams execute against a plan better than other teams, but overall the goal they set out to achieve was basically a $50 - $75M budget item. Which they started with maybe $2M (the rest of their Kickstarter money is really funding the COGS of their box and controller). Its interesting to read the comments from the announcement here on HN and elsewhere which echoed a lot of the challenges. It is really too bad they weren't more successful than they ended up being.

Scuds 11y ago

What could have been done besides throwing more money at it? How did Microsoft get the original xbox into a state of relevance?

TylerE 11y ago
Better engineering. One of the big issues is TERRIBLE (like.... >1/10th of a second) lag with the wireless controller.
- jplur 11y ago
  My super hexagon score says otherwise.
cwyers 11y ago
> How did Microsoft get the original xbox into a state of relevance? Halo. I mean, there was a pile of other Xbox exclusive games at the time that probably helped -- Fable, Dead or Alive, Ninja Gaiden, Steel Battalion -- but the original Xbox pretty much made its name entirely on Halo and Halo 2.
larrik 11y ago
"How did Microsoft get the original xbox into a state of relevance?" By dumping an insane amount of money into it, and waiting until the 360 to actually make any profit whatsoever. Not easy to replicate.
- cwyers 11y ago
  I have no idea why people are downvoting this, as it's pretty accurate. If anything it understates the difficulty. The original Xbox cost tons to develop, and Microsoft spent a lot more money getting games for the thing. In the process they created the canonical example of a console first-person shooter, the genre that now dominates game sales. (You could argue that Goldeneye and Perfect Dark on the N64 got there first, but Halo is the one that really moved the market to where it is now.) Then on top of that, they created Xbox Live, which has had at least as much impact on how we play games as Halo did. And you're absolutely right that they lost money in the process. So yeah, dumping an insane amount of money into creating two products that revolutionized the game industry and not recouping that investment until the the second-generation product launched is how they did it.
  - Falcon9 11y ago
    "Created" is a strong word for Microsoft's contribution to Halo, given the original debut of the game at MacWorld: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2RMHeMGDDU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x2RMHeMGDDU
    - Narishma 11y ago
      Didn't it start as an RTS on the Mac, and only became an FPS when they moved it to Xbox?
    - cwyers 11y ago
      If we're playing the pedant game, what I said was: > In the process they created the canonical example of a console first-person shooter Whatever one thinks about Microsoft's involvement in Halo, it wasn't going to be a console game at all without them. And I don't think it's the game that changes the whole industry if it's not the game that brought PC's biggest genre to consoles in a way that made them feel like they belonged there.
- swang 11y ago
  it's probably unlikely microsoft has made a profit at all with the xbox. keep in mind it lost a lot of money fixing the RROD problems (not enough thermal paste will cost you $$$!). then with R&D for 3 consoles, marketing, advertising, etc i'd be surprised if the entire thing has ever made money for them. they are just dumping money into in the hopes that they will not lose out as a competitor in the family entertainment system although they totally screwed that one up during the whole E3 XBox One fiasco.
bobajeff 11y ago
>What could have been done besides throwing more money at it? A physical media format. So that buying games has real meaning to the user. First-party games, instead of relying on third parties to supply the system sellers.
munchbunny 11y ago
They dumped a ton of money into it. They literally bought game developers to make sure Xbox would get good games. And then Xbox Live basically redefined online gaming. But the other thing is that Microsoft has a surprisingly strong hardware game for a software company. Most of the hardware they push out has solid fundamentals, even if the overarching idea or business model has flaws. Examples: - Keyboards (they're consistently good middle-tier, budget keyboards) - Mouses (again, nothing to write home about, but they'll last you many years) - Zune HD (amazing hardware, no traction) - Xbox (other than the controversial huuuuge controllers and then RROD problem on the 360) - Phones (again, solid hardware even if the software leaves something to be desired)

dogma1138 11y ago

"Nice idea" very bad implementation. It released with an outdated Android OS running on pretty lame hardware, it had tons of compatibility issues and you couldn't play allot of the Android games on it at the time even if you managed to get the store working. The store was also an issue they couldn't really figure out what they wanted, their own store, google play, amazon or any other 3rd party service. It was way to expensive for what it did, under powered and obsolete out of the gate considering that you could buy cheaper and better Android4TV setups from DX or any other Chinese dealer at the time. If you want a TV micro console done right look at the Shield TV from NVIDIA. Pretty much the best hardware on the market at least as it goes for CPU/GPU combo some X86 CPU's might be slightly faster than the A15's. Streaming capability from your PC (NVIDIA HW required) with pretty much no perceivable lag. Streaming from the NVIDIA game cloud (GRID) with very little to no lag with a decent (10-20mbit stable) internet connection. Tegra X1 specific game ports with quite a few games including HL2/Obox and Crysis 3 ports. 4K media support, including future 4K game streaming, the box can handle it it's about 2-3 times as powerful as the 360 in terms of pure GPU performance...

ChuckMcM 11y ago

What you have described is called 'under capitalized.' What that means is that the company had insufficient capital to achieve all the milestones necessary for success. There is a variable of course, which is that some teams execute against a plan better than other teams, but overall the goal they set out to achieve was basically a $50 - $75M budget item. Which they started with maybe $2M (the rest of their Kickstarter money is really funding the COGS of their box and controller). Its interesting to read the comments from the announcement here on HN and elsewhere which echoed a lot of the challenges. It is really too bad they weren't more successful than they ended up being.