4 ms·

I guess you and I just disagree which is okay :) I guess it depends on why you are angry and punched that person in the face, did they spit on you, hit your wi

I guess you and I just disagree which is okay :) I guess it depends on why you are angry and punched that person in the face, did they spit on you, hit your wife, etc? Your analogy here isn't very good. It isn't an employees job to understand what every other employee does and honestly management trying to justify every salary to every other employee would be a bit ridiculous. Maybe Jeff (or lets say Sarah) has a good salary because they bring in 10x the business as the next best sales person. That is easily quantifiable but lets say Jeff/Sarah brings in only the average income but you can see the growth with their customers. That isn't easily quantifiable and honestly doesn't need to be broadcasted to the whole employee base (especially since employees leave and go to other competitors and would then have a good list to work off of). Employees routinely keep information confidential from each other because it makes sense to do so. This isn't a bad thing like you make it out to be, companies shouldn't be some open society where everyone gets to know each others business.

ectoplasm 11y ago
Well, if it's legitimacy you're after, it's illegal to prevent salary sharing in the US.
fleitz 11y ago
Hahah no one would trade on the stock market if you didn't have an idea of the order book, it's essential that pricing is disclosed so that FMV can be reached. Negotiating your salary with out knowing what everyone else was making is stupid. If you're a star performer the goal is to get everyone making what you're making so you can ask for a raise on top of that. (In companies with huge amounts of cash on hand).
- nullrouted 11y ago
  You are mistaking the premise. I'm not saying you should not have an idea of what the "market" is paying and ask that from a potential employer. But knowing what the person next to you makes is an entirely different situation. I know there are employees next to me that make more/less than I do. I honestly don't care as long as I feel I'm making a fair salary for the work I perform. You can always get an idea of what the market is paying by talking to fellow employees outside the company or the recruiters that hit you up.
  - Retra 11y ago
    You don't know what a fair salary is, because you don't know what your peers are earning. I mean, if you can find out what your competitors are paying their employees, surely their own employees can figure that out. So if you can figure it out, it's not a secret to anybody! The problem with your approach is that it is very easy to manipulate people when you permit a power/information differential like that. You end up saying "the slave is happy with the food we give him; why should we offer freedom?" -- when he's only happy with the food because you've been beating him for so long he's been conditioned into helpless appreciation of your scraps. You feel you're making a fair salary? Well then what is the harm of knowing your neighbor's salary? Are you going to learn a new meaning of 'fair?' What's the harm in that? That's just updating your priors and giving you the ability to make better decisions with more information. (That anyone would choose to reject relevant information when making decisions is the height of absurdity.)
    - Dylan16807 11y ago
      A statistical summary of salary for the job is almost as good as knowing everyone's salary, and better than knowing the exact salary of your direct peers but not more. So in such a situation there's little upside. You already know you're not getting scraps. But there's a painful downside in knowing exactly who the company thinks does worse work than their direct peers.
      - woah 11y ago
        What are you talking about? Salary for equivalent positions is only tenuously connected to performance. The only people who benefit from salary secrecy are employers, and they benefit greatly.
        Dylan16807 11y ago
        >Salary for equivalent positions is only tenuously connected to performance. But it's often supposed to be, and so salary differences can hurt feelings just as much as if the correlation was perfect. Or they can hurt feelings because the actual reason for the difference is unfair. >The only people who benefit from salary secrecy are employers, and they benefit greatly. Is that always the case? Remember, in this scenario we have a detailed knowledge of equivalent position salary, we just don't know which of those thousands of numbers belong to our coworkers. How does that remaining ignorance hurt me in any notable way?
- mianos 11y ago
  Actually you are mistaken with this analogy. One of the most important characteristics of a stock exchange is standard contracts. One Google stock is the same as any other. This is not true of talent. That said, a book of similar talent, if possible, would lead to a more liquid market, more accurate pricing and faster price discovery, like a normal market, but people are different. Bumma.

ectoplasm 11y ago

Well, if it's legitimacy you're after, it's illegal to prevent salary sharing in the US.

fleitz 11y ago

Hahah no one would trade on the stock market if you didn't have an idea of the order book, it's essential that pricing is disclosed so that FMV can be reached. Negotiating your salary with out knowing what everyone else was making is stupid. If you're a star performer the goal is to get everyone making what you're making so you can ask for a raise on top of that. (In companies with huge amounts of cash on hand).

nullrouted 11y ago
You are mistaking the premise. I'm not saying you should not have an idea of what the "market" is paying and ask that from a potential employer. But knowing what the person next to you makes is an entirely different situation. I know there are employees next to me that make more/less than I do. I honestly don't care as long as I feel I'm making a fair salary for the work I perform. You can always get an idea of what the market is paying by talking to fellow employees outside the company or the recruiters that hit you up.
- Retra 11y ago
  You don't know what a fair salary is, because you don't know what your peers are earning. I mean, if you can find out what your competitors are paying their employees, surely their own employees can figure that out. So if you can figure it out, it's not a secret to anybody! The problem with your approach is that it is very easy to manipulate people when you permit a power/information differential like that. You end up saying "the slave is happy with the food we give him; why should we offer freedom?" -- when he's only happy with the food because you've been beating him for so long he's been conditioned into helpless appreciation of your scraps. You feel you're making a fair salary? Well then what is the harm of knowing your neighbor's salary? Are you going to learn a new meaning of 'fair?' What's the harm in that? That's just updating your priors and giving you the ability to make better decisions with more information. (That anyone would choose to reject relevant information when making decisions is the height of absurdity.)
  - Dylan16807 11y ago
    A statistical summary of salary for the job is almost as good as knowing everyone's salary, and better than knowing the exact salary of your direct peers but not more. So in such a situation there's little upside. You already know you're not getting scraps. But there's a painful downside in knowing exactly who the company thinks does worse work than their direct peers.
    - woah 11y ago
      What are you talking about? Salary for equivalent positions is only tenuously connected to performance. The only people who benefit from salary secrecy are employers, and they benefit greatly.
      - Dylan16807 11y ago
        >Salary for equivalent positions is only tenuously connected to performance. But it's often supposed to be, and so salary differences can hurt feelings just as much as if the correlation was perfect. Or they can hurt feelings because the actual reason for the difference is unfair. >The only people who benefit from salary secrecy are employers, and they benefit greatly. Is that always the case? Remember, in this scenario we have a detailed knowledge of equivalent position salary, we just don't know which of those thousands of numbers belong to our coworkers. How does that remaining ignorance hurt me in any notable way?
mianos 11y ago
Actually you are mistaken with this analogy. One of the most important characteristics of a stock exchange is standard contracts. One Google stock is the same as any other. This is not true of talent. That said, a book of similar talent, if possible, would lead to a more liquid market, more accurate pricing and faster price discovery, like a normal market, but people are different. Bumma.