6 ms·

> But Ms. Pao says that the most virulent detractors on the site are a vocal minority, and that the vast majority of Reddit users are uninterested in what unfol

> But Ms. Pao says that the most virulent detractors on the site are a vocal minority, and that the vast majority of Reddit users are uninterested in what unfolded over the past 48 hours. This is an incredible simplification. If we follow the 90-9-1 model: 1% of reddit's user base contributes new content, 9% interacts with that content, and 90% are lurkers and consumers. The 'vocal minority' are the content creators and contributors. Reddit has hardly changed in its existence. Things like a search that works or reasonable moderator tools have been promised for years to no avail. Reddit has never had any decent product leadership, but their attempt to reign in control of content has been disastrous. Moderating content outside of removing illegal content is a really slippery slope. It's incredibly difficult to get content standards right. Reddit, as it becomes more mainstream, seems like its trying to get content standards under control, but the cost is immense and might eventually end up alienating its userbase.

mreiland 11y ago
Where to begin. > The 'vocal minority' are the content creators and contributors. That term, content creator. That's a bit disingenuous in this case. It's rare for anyone to create content specifically for reddit, the vast majority of this content you're talking about is re-posted to reddit from other sources. > Reddit, as it becomes more mainstream Reddit is one of the largest sites on the internet, how much more mainstream does it need to get before you stop characterizing it as "becoming mainstream"? The truth is, the company made a decision and the moderators got ansty and threw the users under the bus in an attempt to make a power play. The most virulent detractors were a vocal minority, they were the mods of a few large subreddits.
- adevine 11y ago
  I call BS. One of the things that convinced me this (that is, how reddit treats and responds to its mods) was a real problem, and not just some "angsty mods", was the reaction from /r/AskScience. AskScience is one of the best subreddits, largely because its moderation is so good. The fact that the AskScience mods stood up in agreement with what was going on, and pointed out how non-responsive admins had been, made me believe this is much more than a "power play".
  - hoopd 11y ago
    That r/askscience stood up shows there is mistreatment happening and it's probably widespread. That r/shitredditsays is celebrating shows that mistreatment has not been happening to them.
  - mcphage 11y ago
    > The fact that the AskScience mods stood up in agreement with what was going on, and pointed out how non-responsive admins had been r/AskScience also has a lot of AMAs, and so was directly affected by Victoria's firing in a way that most other subs were not.
    - adevine 11y ago
      While Victoria's firing may have been the impetus, it sound like general unresponsiveness from the admins, as well as a lack of investment in moderator tools, was the bigger complaint: https://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/comments/3by2nk/a_message_to_our_users/ https://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/comments/3by2nk/a_messag... . It sounds like any well-moderated, decently large subreddit would have reason to be pissed.
- pbreit 11y ago
  Reddit is 99.999% user generated content. It's a high-traffic site, sure, but I wouldn't call it mainstream. I would consider much lower trafficked sites like Expedia, Zappos and Huffington Post more "mainstream".
  - mreiland 11y ago
    I... what?
    - ObviousScience 11y ago
      I think the charitable interpretation is that the listed websites get more yearly unique visitors from influential segments of society, regardless of the fact that their raw traffic numbers are much lower, and hence are more in the "mainstream" mind in terms of websites visited.
- soneil 11y ago
  You might want to take a look at some of the top AMAs reddit has seen - https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/search?q=ama&sort=top&restrict_sr=on https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/search?q=ama&sort=top&restrict... Worf, Buzz Aldrin, Obama, Bill Gates, Elon Musk .. The people who "revolting" this time were the people who brought us these. I don't think it's fair to write them off as re-posters; they've put huge, huge amounts of time and effort into curating some of the most engaging original content reddit has ever seen.
clamprecht 11y ago
I have to disagree with your point about reddit's search. Search has been working for several years now - give it a try. The thing it doesn't do is search through all user comments (it only searches through the main posting title and comments). To implement the last part would be much more expensive. I agree with the main point, though, that you shouldn't fuck with the reddit community. *Edit: I'm a redditor in the 9 year club.
- bjterry 11y ago
  The lack of comment searching is pretty bad though. I'd say that when I want to search reddit it's for comments more than 50% of the time. For example, if you're looking for product information the answer is more likely to be in a comment than in a post title. Google is able to do a decent job of this though with the right query.
glogla 11y ago
> But Ms. Pao says that the most virulent detractors on the site are a vocal minority, and that the vast majority of Reddit users are uninterested in what unfolded over the past 48 hours. I think she is trying to paint the "blackout" as the same as the fatpeoplehate banning, which created similar, but different shitstrom. Some people even believe that. But this is different - the fatpeoplehate incident was about hateful people no longer being able to feely practice their hate and harassment. Blackout is about people realizing they are on the ship, and the captain has no idea what she's doing, and the ship has quite a few icebergs in the way.
- kybernetyk 11y ago
  >Blackout is about people realizing they are on the ship, and the captain has no idea what she's doing, and the ship has quite a few icebergs in the way. Luckily there's many other ships you can jump off to if the iceberg gets too close. People migrated from Digg to Reddit. People will migrate from Reddit to whatever will come next if the need should arise.
  - iaw 11y ago
    I was just discussing the phenomenon the other day. A question arose about what value Reddit (the company/site) provides vs. it's community. I think we've all be on the internet long enough to see vibrant communities (usenet, forums, MUDs, myspace, etc.) bloom and wilt away. If Reddit cannot provide a high level of value to the people that generate content within the community they will migrate away to an environment that does.
    - jimhefferon 11y ago
      One of the things it provides is that it is like Usenet in that you can find an area of interest (or passion), or two or three, and not really have much to do with the rest of the site. Unlike Usenet, though, it provides simple editing, pictures, video, and some other things people want. But search sucks.
  - pbhjpbhj 11y ago
ForEnglandJames 11y ago
She's not counting the loyal lurkers such as myself that have cut ourselves off completely. I have blocked reddit on all of my devices as a result of this ordeal. I'm curious if there are many others like me.
- Retra 11y ago
  She's not counting loyal lurkers as 'virulent detractors?'
- mcphage 11y ago
  > the loyal lurkers such as myself that have cut ourselves off completely. I have blocked reddit on all of my devices as a result of this ordeal. I'm curious what you mean by "loyal", then.

mreiland 11y ago

Where to begin. > The 'vocal minority' are the content creators and contributors. That term, content creator. That's a bit disingenuous in this case. It's rare for anyone to create content specifically for reddit, the vast majority of this content you're talking about is re-posted to reddit from other sources. > Reddit, as it becomes more mainstream Reddit is one of the largest sites on the internet, how much more mainstream does it need to get before you stop characterizing it as "becoming mainstream"? The truth is, the company made a decision and the moderators got ansty and threw the users under the bus in an attempt to make a power play. The most virulent detractors were a vocal minority, they were the mods of a few large subreddits.

adevine 11y ago
I call BS. One of the things that convinced me this (that is, how reddit treats and responds to its mods) was a real problem, and not just some "angsty mods", was the reaction from /r/AskScience. AskScience is one of the best subreddits, largely because its moderation is so good. The fact that the AskScience mods stood up in agreement with what was going on, and pointed out how non-responsive admins had been, made me believe this is much more than a "power play".
- hoopd 11y ago
  That r/askscience stood up shows there is mistreatment happening and it's probably widespread. That r/shitredditsays is celebrating shows that mistreatment has not been happening to them.
- mcphage 11y ago
  > The fact that the AskScience mods stood up in agreement with what was going on, and pointed out how non-responsive admins had been r/AskScience also has a lot of AMAs, and so was directly affected by Victoria's firing in a way that most other subs were not.
  - adevine 11y ago
    While Victoria's firing may have been the impetus, it sound like general unresponsiveness from the admins, as well as a lack of investment in moderator tools, was the bigger complaint: https://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/comments/3by2nk/a_message_to_our_users/ https://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/comments/3by2nk/a_messag... . It sounds like any well-moderated, decently large subreddit would have reason to be pissed.
pbreit 11y ago
Reddit is 99.999% user generated content. It's a high-traffic site, sure, but I wouldn't call it mainstream. I would consider much lower trafficked sites like Expedia, Zappos and Huffington Post more "mainstream".
- mreiland 11y ago
  I... what?
  - ObviousScience 11y ago
    I think the charitable interpretation is that the listed websites get more yearly unique visitors from influential segments of society, regardless of the fact that their raw traffic numbers are much lower, and hence are more in the "mainstream" mind in terms of websites visited.
soneil 11y ago
You might want to take a look at some of the top AMAs reddit has seen - https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/search?q=ama&sort=top&restrict_sr=on https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/search?q=ama&sort=top&restrict... Worf, Buzz Aldrin, Obama, Bill Gates, Elon Musk .. The people who "revolting" this time were the people who brought us these. I don't think it's fair to write them off as re-posters; they've put huge, huge amounts of time and effort into curating some of the most engaging original content reddit has ever seen.

clamprecht 11y ago

I have to disagree with your point about reddit's search. Search has been working for several years now - give it a try. The thing it doesn't do is search through all user comments (it only searches through the main posting title and comments). To implement the last part would be much more expensive. I agree with the main point, though, that you shouldn't fuck with the reddit community. *Edit: I'm a redditor in the 9 year club.

bjterry 11y ago
The lack of comment searching is pretty bad though. I'd say that when I want to search reddit it's for comments more than 50% of the time. For example, if you're looking for product information the answer is more likely to be in a comment than in a post title. Google is able to do a decent job of this though with the right query.

glogla 11y ago

> But Ms. Pao says that the most virulent detractors on the site are a vocal minority, and that the vast majority of Reddit users are uninterested in what unfolded over the past 48 hours. I think she is trying to paint the "blackout" as the same as the fatpeoplehate banning, which created similar, but different shitstrom. Some people even believe that. But this is different - the fatpeoplehate incident was about hateful people no longer being able to feely practice their hate and harassment. Blackout is about people realizing they are on the ship, and the captain has no idea what she's doing, and the ship has quite a few icebergs in the way.

kybernetyk 11y ago
>Blackout is about people realizing they are on the ship, and the captain has no idea what she's doing, and the ship has quite a few icebergs in the way. Luckily there's many other ships you can jump off to if the iceberg gets too close. People migrated from Digg to Reddit. People will migrate from Reddit to whatever will come next if the need should arise.
- iaw 11y ago
  I was just discussing the phenomenon the other day. A question arose about what value Reddit (the company/site) provides vs. it's community. I think we've all be on the internet long enough to see vibrant communities (usenet, forums, MUDs, myspace, etc.) bloom and wilt away. If Reddit cannot provide a high level of value to the people that generate content within the community they will migrate away to an environment that does.
  - jimhefferon 11y ago
    One of the things it provides is that it is like Usenet in that you can find an area of interest (or passion), or two or three, and not really have much to do with the rest of the site. Unlike Usenet, though, it provides simple editing, pictures, video, and some other things people want. But search sucks.
- pbhjpbhj 11y ago

ForEnglandJames 11y ago

She's not counting the loyal lurkers such as myself that have cut ourselves off completely. I have blocked reddit on all of my devices as a result of this ordeal. I'm curious if there are many others like me.

Retra 11y ago
She's not counting loyal lurkers as 'virulent detractors?'
mcphage 11y ago
> the loyal lurkers such as myself that have cut ourselves off completely. I have blocked reddit on all of my devices as a result of this ordeal. I'm curious what you mean by "loyal", then.