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That wasn't the case with Germany. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_Germany It seems to red

by Ygg2 11y ago

That wasn't the case with Germany. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prostitution_in_Germany It seems to reduce the violence against workers, but increases human trafficking, because Germany now acts as a safe haven for traffickers. Maybe trafficking would disappear, if all societies made prostitution illegal and not a looked down profession, but I somehow doubt it[1]. So if your goal is to reduce human trafficking, it might not be the most worthwhile of means. Also there is the silly issue, of woman losing her unemployment status because she didn't refused to work as a prostitute. [1] Even if all countries made prostitution legal, nothing stops a gangster from kidnapping a woman and dragging her from say Mexico to US to serve as sex worker. She could escape and there would be less stigma; but it sounds to me like those poor workers trapped in Dubai/Quatar and they had no reprieve. As someone mentioned, there is a supply/demand problem that can't be solved via prositutes.

a_bonobo 11y ago
I don't agree with your points - they echo the recent campaign by Spiegel Online; looking at your Wikipedia article, it seems more to be an issue with open borders and no passport control, and the fact that Germany is in the "middle" of Europe and a relatively rich country, which makes Germany a good target for trafficking. The numbers of yearly cases seem to be fairly low (about 700-800 cases per year in your Wiki-article), and pimps who force people into prostitution are arrested and jailed. If anything, I'd say that legality makes it much better for these forced prostitutes to escape - they don't have any fear of persecution. >Also there is the silly issue, of woman losing her unemployment status because she didn't refused to work as a prostitute. That was a single mistake - the Arbeitsagentur accidentally sent along a job offer which was from a brothel, and the media made it into a big case (see http://www.spiegel.de/karriere/berufsleben/arbeitsagentur-in-augsburg-wollte-19-jaehrige-an-bordell-vermitteln-a-881825.html http://www.spiegel.de/karriere/berufsleben/arbeitsagentur-in... ). Of course she didn't have to take the job, there have been rulings that you can't force unemployed to work as prostitutes (see same article).
- Ygg2 11y ago
  You do make a fine point that case regarding unemployment status. But, I think there is a difference between legalizing prostitution and preventing what's essentially human enslavement. I'm not saying legalizing prostitution won't help or shouldn't be done, I just don't think it will have as big impact as people claimed, and that it will have possible negative impact if other states don't adopt it. IMO it's akin to legalizing drugs, just legalizing it won't make drug problem disappear. For instance in cases where some states legalized drugs and most didn't; a state that legalized drugs can become safe haven for criminals from other countries, where drugs aren't legal.
- Nimitz14 11y ago
  Good to see somebody who's willing to look into things. Most of these comments in here are like the one you replied to, very superficial.
belorn 11y ago
Human trafficking seems by evidence to use prostitution as the way to generate money out of slaves, and anyone that wish to legalize sex work should also have a plan to address trafficking. I don't know the laws in Germany, but banks has a responsibility to combat money laundering so why not require brothels to implement some industry standards to counter trafficking? Signs of trafficking should then be followed up by police and slavers should be stopped and sentenced by the courts.
jordigh 11y ago
> Also there is the silly issue, of woman losing her unemployment status because she didn't refused to work as a prostitute. This did not happen. There was a sensationalised story in a paper that it could happen, but as far as I know, it was just that: sensationalised conjecturing. The persistent human trafficking problems are real, though. Proponents of legalised prostitution argue on the meaning of "trafficking" and say that the almost invariably foreign, poor, and immigrant women who are prostituted in Germany are doing so voluntarily.
- nostrebored 11y ago
  They have agency, jordigh, agency! They aren't in a new country, with typically no job skills, no hope of getting job skills from their current employment, coerced into taking sex work because they are desperate for money!

by Ygg2 11y ago

a_bonobo 11y ago

I don't agree with your points - they echo the recent campaign by Spiegel Online; looking at your Wikipedia article, it seems more to be an issue with open borders and no passport control, and the fact that Germany is in the "middle" of Europe and a relatively rich country, which makes Germany a good target for trafficking. The numbers of yearly cases seem to be fairly low (about 700-800 cases per year in your Wiki-article), and pimps who force people into prostitution are arrested and jailed. If anything, I'd say that legality makes it much better for these forced prostitutes to escape - they don't have any fear of persecution. >Also there is the silly issue, of woman losing her unemployment status because she didn't refused to work as a prostitute. That was a single mistake - the Arbeitsagentur accidentally sent along a job offer which was from a brothel, and the media made it into a big case (see http://www.spiegel.de/karriere/berufsleben/arbeitsagentur-in-augsburg-wollte-19-jaehrige-an-bordell-vermitteln-a-881825.html http://www.spiegel.de/karriere/berufsleben/arbeitsagentur-in... ). Of course she didn't have to take the job, there have been rulings that you can't force unemployed to work as prostitutes (see same article).

Ygg2 11y ago
You do make a fine point that case regarding unemployment status. But, I think there is a difference between legalizing prostitution and preventing what's essentially human enslavement. I'm not saying legalizing prostitution won't help or shouldn't be done, I just don't think it will have as big impact as people claimed, and that it will have possible negative impact if other states don't adopt it. IMO it's akin to legalizing drugs, just legalizing it won't make drug problem disappear. For instance in cases where some states legalized drugs and most didn't; a state that legalized drugs can become safe haven for criminals from other countries, where drugs aren't legal.
Nimitz14 11y ago
Good to see somebody who's willing to look into things. Most of these comments in here are like the one you replied to, very superficial.

belorn 11y ago

Human trafficking seems by evidence to use prostitution as the way to generate money out of slaves, and anyone that wish to legalize sex work should also have a plan to address trafficking. I don't know the laws in Germany, but banks has a responsibility to combat money laundering so why not require brothels to implement some industry standards to counter trafficking? Signs of trafficking should then be followed up by police and slavers should be stopped and sentenced by the courts.

jordigh 11y ago

> Also there is the silly issue, of woman losing her unemployment status because she didn't refused to work as a prostitute. This did not happen. There was a sensationalised story in a paper that it could happen, but as far as I know, it was just that: sensationalised conjecturing. The persistent human trafficking problems are real, though. Proponents of legalised prostitution argue on the meaning of "trafficking" and say that the almost invariably foreign, poor, and immigrant women who are prostituted in Germany are doing so voluntarily.

nostrebored 11y ago
They have agency, jordigh, agency! They aren't in a new country, with typically no job skills, no hope of getting job skills from their current employment, coerced into taking sex work because they are desperate for money!