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I don't know how to feel about this. On one hand I'm against censorship, on the other I'm against internet bullying. /r/FatPeopleHate was engaging in both. In

by zxcvcxz 11y ago

I don't know how to feel about this. On one hand I'm against censorship, on the other I'm against internet bullying. /r/FatPeopleHate was engaging in both. In the end reddit is a private site that can do what it wants. Wikipedia removes things all the time and sites like 4chan remove all sorts of extremely offensive material. I'm glad the mods of the hate oriented subreddits have been shadow banned, I actually think this shit storm is wonderful and I hope the reddit admins literally pull the plug and shut down. The FPH spammers are complete idiots, buying thousands of guilds and donating money directly to reddit and hurting their cause by vote brigading at the same time. They're sealing their fate. This whole fiasco has shown the true face of reddit, just a whole bunch of (slightly below) average kids who don't deserve my attention. I can't wait until reddit dies, but I have no idea where I'll go. I want something like reddit, but more open and transparent, and with a way for users to somehow remove mods.

deleted 11y ago
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- deleted 11y ago
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GauntletWizard 11y ago
Wikipedia has a stated goal, a public management team engaged in discussion and debate with their users, and something resembling accountability. Reddit has the Silicon Valley's most notorious gender-baiting troll as it's head, virtually zero interactions between the corporate side and the unpaid community managers, and no clear rules on what it does and doesn't allow. Honestly, the writing should have been obviously on the wall when r/jailbait was banned. I think they could have made up reasonings that would have placated the userbase, but they failed to, and they handled the resulting outrage very poorly. I was sorta surprised that wasn't reddit's 'digg moment', but I thought that the HDCP controversy was Digg's, so maybe I'm just ahead of the wave.
- __david__ 11y ago
  > Reddit has the Silicon Valley's most notorious gender-baiting troll as it's head… What does "gender-baiting troll" mean?
  - freebsdgirl 11y ago
    It means that GW is a white male gamer (this is not supposition, hi GW!) that disagreed with Pao's discrimination lawsuit.
    - feybay 11y ago
      What does being white or a gamer have to do with this?
      - brymaster 11y ago
        > What does being white or a gamer have to do with this? Absolutely nothing, in reality. In terms of Randi Harper though, she is a misandrist using a convenient boogeyman to push her own agenda.
scrollaway 11y ago
Reddit has replaced RSS for me. HN is nice but hyper-curated and very specialized; though I prefer the HN voting system and algorithms over reddit's. Reddit also has a massive advantage when it comes to companies/games/etc communicating with their fan-communities. It's an excellent medium for it as the type of vote-curation that happens there is great to sort topics of importance and the threaded comments are far better than what you would find on bulletin boards. Overall, reddit has had a fantastic impact on the internet when it comes to communication, IMO. I hope that sticks.
adamnemecek 11y ago
> On one hand I'm against censorship, I feel like censorship isn't the right word for this but I can't think of a better one.
- scrollaway 11y ago
  Curated speech.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
    - sarciszewski 11y ago
      https://scott.arciszewski.me/blog/2014/08/free-speech-zones https://scott.arciszewski.me/blog/2014/08/free-speech-zones
      - evgen 11y ago
        http://xkcd.com/1357/ http://xkcd.com/1357/
        sarciszewski 11y ago
        Yeah, I know. Free speech zones is what the blog post was in response to.
- sarciszewski 11y ago
  I don't think there is one. I'm pretty sure censorship has a pretty specific connotation, but it's the only term in the ballpark of what is being accused.
- fleitz 11y ago
  It's censorship, in the context of reddit they have appointed officers who censor objectionable speech. This precisely fits the common definition of censorship (not the legal one)
EC1 11y ago
Internet bullying? What? Just don't visit places like r/fatpeoplehate if you are fat. Just turn it off.
- UnoriginalGuy 11y ago
  You don't have to visit to get bullied. They were literally posting people's Facebook pages, images posted in other subs, and original photos they took themselves. There are numerous incidents of harassment against other users on Reddit, and even off of Reddit. The admins said themselves they received numerous complaints.
  - EC1 11y ago
    You can turn off messages + friend requests and make your entire FB page private. You can also change the URL. It takes all of 30 seconds.
    - UnoriginalGuy 11y ago
      Are you seriously trying to blame the victims of the bullying and suggest they disconnect from the internet..? I literally cannot comprehend where you're coming from.
      - EC1 11y ago
        This isn't real life. It's access via a screen. In real life, my argument wouldn't stand. On the internet, you are given tools to weather the storm. Shitty people will always exist. Everyone else now has to suffer as casualties of the wide net cast in hopes of eliminating a vitriolic idiots because of a few victims.
        freebsdgirl 11y ago
        Internet hate can often turn into real life hate. Witness: SWATing, emails to employers, ordering pizzas as a "joke". Not to mention, the number of death threats and threats of sexual violence is climbing at an alarming rate, especially for women and PoC. I have no idea why people think it's socially acceptable to say things on the internet to people that you wouldn't say to them IRL in front of a police officer.
chisleu 11y ago
Yep. I would post from time to time to point out incorrect "facts" they posted. It doesn't matter how well researched and reasoned your argument is. If you aren't towing the line, you are moderated and banned. They auto moderate and message any user who is voted down by the self-proclaimed shitlords. It is a pretty disgusting place.
infinitone 11y ago
Just like the great Digg v3 Migration to Reddit happened years ago... its happening again from Reddit to Voat.
- obstinate 11y ago
  I think you mean "I hope it will happen", because there is no evidence that it is actually happening.
  - bjterry 11y ago
    I had never heard of voat.co until just now, but their site appears to be down, which is some evidence that they probably are receiving a ton of traffic from somewhere. Edit: For the record, I don't think voat.co will become more popular than reddit in the way reddit became more popular than digg. The subreddit system is much more resilient than digg's system was. As others have said, I barely noticed that this was occurring.
- MBCook 11y ago
  If the people leaving are the obnoxious hate monger, bandwagoners, and other general trolls that's fine with me. If Reddit wants to get some of the amazingly creepy stuff under control, I'm all for it.
  - my-bullshit-job 11y ago
    >If Reddit wants to get some of the amazingly creepy stuff under control, I'm all for it. But they're not actually doing that, because they're leaving plenty of subreddits that are arguably much worse.
    - MBCook 11y ago
      Agreed. Because they've taken so little action (and because of the way the admins were defending it in the announcement thread) instead of a real step forward this looks like someone pushed them forward 2mm and they're trying to claim victory. But if some of the worst elements of the site want to take this as an opportunity to abandon the site, I'll feel better about it.
eertami 11y ago
>/r/FatPeopleHate was engaging in both. Blatant lies such as this do not help your side of the argument. FPH was not engaging in harassment or bullying whatsoever, any instances of this were entirely attempts at false flagging. FPH is not about hate, it is not discriminatory, it is not prejudice, and it most certainly didn't violate any of reddits rules.
- wj 11y ago
  What was it about then?
redml 11y ago
If the problem is "bullying", there's plenty of subreddits that exist solely to bully other subreddits. The administration are showing bias and bending around their own rules, but that's not really surprising for a site that shadowbans its users.

by zxcvcxz 11y ago

deleted 11y ago

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deleted 11y ago

[deleted]

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

GauntletWizard 11y ago

Wikipedia has a stated goal, a public management team engaged in discussion and debate with their users, and something resembling accountability. Reddit has the Silicon Valley's most notorious gender-baiting troll as it's head, virtually zero interactions between the corporate side and the unpaid community managers, and no clear rules on what it does and doesn't allow. Honestly, the writing should have been obviously on the wall when r/jailbait was banned. I think they could have made up reasonings that would have placated the userbase, but they failed to, and they handled the resulting outrage very poorly. I was sorta surprised that wasn't reddit's 'digg moment', but I thought that the HDCP controversy was Digg's, so maybe I'm just ahead of the wave.

__david__ 11y ago
> Reddit has the Silicon Valley's most notorious gender-baiting troll as it's head… What does "gender-baiting troll" mean?
- freebsdgirl 11y ago
  It means that GW is a white male gamer (this is not supposition, hi GW!) that disagreed with Pao's discrimination lawsuit.
  - feybay 11y ago
    What does being white or a gamer have to do with this?
    - brymaster 11y ago
      > What does being white or a gamer have to do with this? Absolutely nothing, in reality. In terms of Randi Harper though, she is a misandrist using a convenient boogeyman to push her own agenda.

scrollaway 11y ago

Reddit has replaced RSS for me. HN is nice but hyper-curated and very specialized; though I prefer the HN voting system and algorithms over reddit's. Reddit also has a massive advantage when it comes to companies/games/etc communicating with their fan-communities. It's an excellent medium for it as the type of vote-curation that happens there is great to sort topics of importance and the threaded comments are far better than what you would find on bulletin boards. Overall, reddit has had a fantastic impact on the internet when it comes to communication, IMO. I hope that sticks.

adamnemecek 11y ago

> On one hand I'm against censorship, I feel like censorship isn't the right word for this but I can't think of a better one.

scrollaway 11y ago
Curated speech.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
  - sarciszewski 11y ago
    https://scott.arciszewski.me/blog/2014/08/free-speech-zones https://scott.arciszewski.me/blog/2014/08/free-speech-zones
    - evgen 11y ago
      http://xkcd.com/1357/ http://xkcd.com/1357/
      - sarciszewski 11y ago
        Yeah, I know. Free speech zones is what the blog post was in response to.
sarciszewski 11y ago
I don't think there is one. I'm pretty sure censorship has a pretty specific connotation, but it's the only term in the ballpark of what is being accused.
fleitz 11y ago
It's censorship, in the context of reddit they have appointed officers who censor objectionable speech. This precisely fits the common definition of censorship (not the legal one)

EC1 11y ago

Internet bullying? What? Just don't visit places like r/fatpeoplehate if you are fat. Just turn it off.

UnoriginalGuy 11y ago
You don't have to visit to get bullied. They were literally posting people's Facebook pages, images posted in other subs, and original photos they took themselves. There are numerous incidents of harassment against other users on Reddit, and even off of Reddit. The admins said themselves they received numerous complaints.
- EC1 11y ago
  You can turn off messages + friend requests and make your entire FB page private. You can also change the URL. It takes all of 30 seconds.
  - UnoriginalGuy 11y ago
    Are you seriously trying to blame the victims of the bullying and suggest they disconnect from the internet..? I literally cannot comprehend where you're coming from.
    - EC1 11y ago
      This isn't real life. It's access via a screen. In real life, my argument wouldn't stand. On the internet, you are given tools to weather the storm. Shitty people will always exist. Everyone else now has to suffer as casualties of the wide net cast in hopes of eliminating a vitriolic idiots because of a few victims.
      - freebsdgirl 11y ago
        Internet hate can often turn into real life hate. Witness: SWATing, emails to employers, ordering pizzas as a "joke". Not to mention, the number of death threats and threats of sexual violence is climbing at an alarming rate, especially for women and PoC. I have no idea why people think it's socially acceptable to say things on the internet to people that you wouldn't say to them IRL in front of a police officer.

chisleu 11y ago

Yep. I would post from time to time to point out incorrect "facts" they posted. It doesn't matter how well researched and reasoned your argument is. If you aren't towing the line, you are moderated and banned. They auto moderate and message any user who is voted down by the self-proclaimed shitlords. It is a pretty disgusting place.

infinitone 11y ago

Just like the great Digg v3 Migration to Reddit happened years ago... its happening again from Reddit to Voat.

obstinate 11y ago
I think you mean "I hope it will happen", because there is no evidence that it is actually happening.
- bjterry 11y ago
  I had never heard of voat.co until just now, but their site appears to be down, which is some evidence that they probably are receiving a ton of traffic from somewhere. Edit: For the record, I don't think voat.co will become more popular than reddit in the way reddit became more popular than digg. The subreddit system is much more resilient than digg's system was. As others have said, I barely noticed that this was occurring.
MBCook 11y ago
If the people leaving are the obnoxious hate monger, bandwagoners, and other general trolls that's fine with me. If Reddit wants to get some of the amazingly creepy stuff under control, I'm all for it.
- my-bullshit-job 11y ago
  >If Reddit wants to get some of the amazingly creepy stuff under control, I'm all for it. But they're not actually doing that, because they're leaving plenty of subreddits that are arguably much worse.
  - MBCook 11y ago
    Agreed. Because they've taken so little action (and because of the way the admins were defending it in the announcement thread) instead of a real step forward this looks like someone pushed them forward 2mm and they're trying to claim victory. But if some of the worst elements of the site want to take this as an opportunity to abandon the site, I'll feel better about it.

eertami 11y ago

>/r/FatPeopleHate was engaging in both. Blatant lies such as this do not help your side of the argument. FPH was not engaging in harassment or bullying whatsoever, any instances of this were entirely attempts at false flagging. FPH is not about hate, it is not discriminatory, it is not prejudice, and it most certainly didn't violate any of reddits rules.

wj 11y ago
What was it about then?

redml 11y ago

If the problem is "bullying", there's plenty of subreddits that exist solely to bully other subreddits. The administration are showing bias and bending around their own rules, but that's not really surprising for a site that shadowbans its users.