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Although your comment is extreme, many people moved there to make lots of money and live like kings. Which they did. Edit: Not sure why I'm being downmodded; a

by gms 17y ago

Although your comment is extreme, many people moved there to make lots of money and live like kings. Which they did. Edit: Not sure why I'm being downmodded; all I did was answer the parent's question.

yesimahuman 17y ago
My comment wasn't extreme. The fact that that kind of stuff happened at all is what's extreme.
brown9-2 17y ago
They moved to Dubai to participate (willingly or unwillingly) in a bubble, basically.
- gms 17y ago
  Is that a bad thing (on a per-person level)? Again, many people made out great.
  - brown9-2 17y ago
    Well I guess that comes down to a moral choice. Would you be okay with "making out great" and becoming rich if it meant that other people had to work in 130 degree heat for 18 hours a day in order to build the buildings you live and work in, and had their wages withheld and passport confiscated by their employer? Would you think that you had made a bad choice?
    - gms 17y ago
      That is exactly the question I am asking. If someone gave you (and I don't mean you in particular) the chance to make all this money with minimal effort on your part, are you so sure you'd turn it down? To answer this question regarding myself, I don't know. For example, I wear clothes and shoes that are obviously made using horrible labour in third-world countries. Also, what are the people who already live there supposed to do? Halt their lives and livelihoods and move out? All I'm calling for with my comments is more restraint when it comes to the 'holier than thou' comments. It's too easy to express casual outrage and condemnation on the internet.
      - pyre 17y ago
        No offense, but the conditions that these workers are in seem a lot worse than anything you could have inside a factory in China.
      - deleted 17y ago
        [deleted]
    - pbhjpbhj 17y ago
      As I read in a previous expose the workers are often tricked into acquiring the position they are shipped from poorer areas, they effectively buy the job which turns out to be effectively slavery - they don't even have the decency to give them good water to drink, it's poorly desalinated. Basically the people directly in charge have no respect for the lives of these workers.
  - deleted 17y ago
    [deleted]
- gnosis 17y ago
  It wasn't just that they were participating in a bubble. As this article makes clear, they were participating in a system built on slavery and oppression.
  - jhancock 17y ago
    While I certainly would not want to live/work in Dubai, its very difficult to _not_ participate in a system built on slavery/oppression. Have you ever been to the factory cities in Asia where a good bit of your things are made? Have you bought a tank of gas and thought about what percent of your money is going to oppressive regimes? If you're a U.S. citizen, do you pay taxes which support a global military hegemony (do you know how may have died in Iraq over the last 8 years)? Its real hard to not be a part of the system. I do understand your point and it does feel better to be further removed from the bad behavior. But most of us are participants.
    - gnosis 17y ago
      The question is, where are you going to draw the line? In my eyes, the more direct and deliberate your involvement, the more culpable you are. It's one thing to be forced to pay taxes, some of which may go towards a war you're against, and quite another to go and get rich off the slaves of Dubai (especially if you do it knowingly), or go to Dubai specifically to exploit the slaves (as some of the people interviewed in this article admitted to doing).
    - potatolicious 17y ago
      As someone who grew up in one of these manufacturing-centric Asian countries full of child labor and such, I disagree. Dubai had (and maybe still has) widespread problems with slavery and indentured servitude - both are problems not widespread in any of the major manufacturing centers in East Asia. Where the worker in Dubai is hit with a litany of hidden fees upon arrival, the worker in China is not. Where the worker in Dubai has his passport held until false debts are repaid, the Chinese worker does not. Working in a Chinese factory is almost utopian compared to the conditions that have apparently been exposed in Dubai.

by gms 17y ago

yesimahuman 17y ago

My comment wasn't extreme. The fact that that kind of stuff happened at all is what's extreme.

brown9-2 17y ago

They moved to Dubai to participate (willingly or unwillingly) in a bubble, basically.

gms 17y ago
Is that a bad thing (on a per-person level)? Again, many people made out great.
- brown9-2 17y ago
  Well I guess that comes down to a moral choice. Would you be okay with "making out great" and becoming rich if it meant that other people had to work in 130 degree heat for 18 hours a day in order to build the buildings you live and work in, and had their wages withheld and passport confiscated by their employer? Would you think that you had made a bad choice?
  - gms 17y ago
    That is exactly the question I am asking. If someone gave you (and I don't mean you in particular) the chance to make all this money with minimal effort on your part, are you so sure you'd turn it down? To answer this question regarding myself, I don't know. For example, I wear clothes and shoes that are obviously made using horrible labour in third-world countries. Also, what are the people who already live there supposed to do? Halt their lives and livelihoods and move out? All I'm calling for with my comments is more restraint when it comes to the 'holier than thou' comments. It's too easy to express casual outrage and condemnation on the internet.
    - pyre 17y ago
      No offense, but the conditions that these workers are in seem a lot worse than anything you could have inside a factory in China.
    - deleted 17y ago
      [deleted]
  - pbhjpbhj 17y ago
    As I read in a previous expose the workers are often tricked into acquiring the position they are shipped from poorer areas, they effectively buy the job which turns out to be effectively slavery - they don't even have the decency to give them good water to drink, it's poorly desalinated. Basically the people directly in charge have no respect for the lives of these workers.
- deleted 17y ago
  [deleted]
gnosis 17y ago
It wasn't just that they were participating in a bubble. As this article makes clear, they were participating in a system built on slavery and oppression.
- jhancock 17y ago
  While I certainly would not want to live/work in Dubai, its very difficult to _not_ participate in a system built on slavery/oppression. Have you ever been to the factory cities in Asia where a good bit of your things are made? Have you bought a tank of gas and thought about what percent of your money is going to oppressive regimes? If you're a U.S. citizen, do you pay taxes which support a global military hegemony (do you know how may have died in Iraq over the last 8 years)? Its real hard to not be a part of the system. I do understand your point and it does feel better to be further removed from the bad behavior. But most of us are participants.
  - gnosis 17y ago
    The question is, where are you going to draw the line? In my eyes, the more direct and deliberate your involvement, the more culpable you are. It's one thing to be forced to pay taxes, some of which may go towards a war you're against, and quite another to go and get rich off the slaves of Dubai (especially if you do it knowingly), or go to Dubai specifically to exploit the slaves (as some of the people interviewed in this article admitted to doing).
  - potatolicious 17y ago
    As someone who grew up in one of these manufacturing-centric Asian countries full of child labor and such, I disagree. Dubai had (and maybe still has) widespread problems with slavery and indentured servitude - both are problems not widespread in any of the major manufacturing centers in East Asia. Where the worker in Dubai is hit with a litany of hidden fees upon arrival, the worker in China is not. Where the worker in Dubai has his passport held until false debts are repaid, the Chinese worker does not. Working in a Chinese factory is almost utopian compared to the conditions that have apparently been exposed in Dubai.