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Basho Relaunches to Deliver a Cohesive Big Data Platform

73 points by mihailovi4 11y ago

rch 11y ago
Looks like a nice product, but I can't seem to find details on the internal message routing... Is it built on Redis pub/sub, Riak itself, or something else altogether? And I wish the branding was toned down. As it is, I'm reluctant to direct coworkers or friends to the site despite my interest.
- arthursilva 11y ago
  It's Riak Core.
- siculars 11y ago
  The value add on riak is riak_core[0][1][2] which handles data distribution/replication and the like. [0] https://github.com/basho/riak_core https://github.com/basho/riak_core [1] http://basho.com/understanding-riak_core-handoff/ http://basho.com/understanding-riak_core-handoff/ [2] http://basho.com/understanding-riak_core-building-handoff/ http://basho.com/understanding-riak_core-building-handoff/ (I work for basho)
tptacek 11y ago
Do I understand correctly that Basho is now a platform-as-service company, like Compose or Heroku, rather than an enterprise database product company?
- rch 11y ago
  Doesn't seem that way to me. I see it as a way of taking some elaborate service integration work and wrapping it up as a platform one might deploy in house.
  - siculars 11y ago
    What @rch said. (I work for basho)
- siculars 11y ago
  Think data model capabilities like k/v (original riak) and document (riak 2.x integration with solr) soon to include redis and spark capabilities. But you run this in your own datacenter or cloud like aws or containers like docker. We don't offer a hosted solution (although a ton of people ask for it...) (I work for basho)
samwgoldman 11y ago
Basho has experienced some MAJOR brain drain in the last year. I wonder if this re-positioning is related to that.
- wlesieutre 11y ago
  New CEO and CTO a year ago are a likely source of repositioning: http://basho.com/basho-names-new-ceo-and-cto/ http://basho.com/basho-names-new-ceo-and-cto/ I can't speculate on how that all relates to brain drain.
  - InvisibleCities 11y ago
    Given tweets like this one (https://twitter.com/jtuple/status/598230043093897216 https://twitter.com/jtuple/status/598230043093897216), there doesn't seem to be much to speculate about.
    - wlesieutre 11y ago
      I've heard a bit from a friend there, so what I really mean is "I think I'll stay out of this one" :P But yeah, @jtuple, @Roach_B_me, and others have some choice tweets on the matter. Off topic- your name is a fantastic book!
    - defen 11y ago
      "Data gravity" ?
      - wlesieutre 11y ago
        It's why data wants to be together! http://datagravity.org/ http://datagravity.org/
      - e12e 11y ago
        Sounds like Terry Pratchett's idea of L-Space translated to Enterpriselish: "L-space, short for library-space, is the ultimate portrayal of Pratchett's concept that the written word has powerful magical properties on the Discworld, and that in large quantities all books warp space and time around them. The principle of L-space revolves around a seemingly logical equation; it is an extension of the 'Knowledge is Power': Books = Knowledge = Power = (Force x Distance^2) ÷ Time" http://wiki.lspace.org/mediawiki/L-space http://wiki.lspace.org/mediawiki/L-space
sirstompsalot 11y ago
Biggest thing I can't stand about the new overhaul is the barrier for the open source version - I want to evaluate for my purposes, not give you my email. Been following Riak for some time now, and I'm hopeful this will do good things for Basho.
- siculars 11y ago
  Pull the source from github[0]... [0] https://github.com/basho/riak https://github.com/basho/riak (I work for basho)
schmichael 11y ago
Orchestrate was founded by ex-Basho people, built this product as a service, and have already been acquired. This is a pretty slow "fast follow." edit: (Although I think Orchestrate used HBase behind the scenes instead of Riak, which is probably a more appealing stack for Enterprises since Hadoop is more accepted than Riak.)
bra-ket 11y ago
no performance benchmarks in sight
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
paulsutter 11y ago
Is anyone able to parse the explanation below for "Data Gravity"? Even with a great product like Riak, it's difficult to build a hypergrowth standalone business. So apparently they got Cloudera-envy, and decided to.. uh.. synergize new paradigms, and reintermediate plug-and-play partnerships, or something. > Data gravity describes the effect that as data accumulates, there is a greater likelihood that additional services and applications will be attracted to this data, essentially having the same effect gravity has on objects around a planet. As the mass and density increases, so does the strength of the gravitational pull and as things get closer to the mass, they accelerate towards it at increasing velocity. Although services and applications have their own gravity, data is the most massive and dense, meaning it has the most gravity. If data becomes large enough it can become virtually impossible to move. Usually as services and applications interact with data, they cause even more rapid growth of the data itself, creating a continuous cycle of data growth.
robdimsdale 11y ago
I'm really excited by RiakCS (now rebranded as RiakS2) because when it works, it offers a powerful on-premise version of S3. I've been integrating it with Cloud Foundry for about a year now, repackaging it to deploy with BOSH, but it's been a constant source of frustration. From an operator perspective it's incredibly hard to install and configure - the onboarding process to create a cluster from scratch is terrible and the outputted logs are often little more than erlang stack dumps. As an example, I've already spent days trying to get riak-cs 2.0 running on a stock ubuntu 14.04 machine. It should not be this difficult to stand up a product out of the box. Basho's support engineers are generally well intentioned but often their response is "run the following erlang command, and reply to us with the response (also in erlang)". As an operator, I have no idea what effect the provided commands have on my system, now what the output should tell me. Similarly, it took months for their support/engineering team to answer a support ticket about garbage collection - eventually providing us some defaults such that RiakCS would perform garbage collection out of the box. They could not tell us why these settings would work, nor any side-effects of changing low-level parameters. From a product perspective, Basho do not appear willing or able to support the open-source community around their products - typically every answer we've received boils down to "it depends on your use case" and effectively "it should work, I don't believe you are seeing the issues you are raising". I really hope this 're-positioning' results in more support for operators and the community in general. RiakS2 has a lot of potential and I hope Basho are able to realize this.

73 points by mihailovi4 11y ago

rch 11y ago

Looks like a nice product, but I can't seem to find details on the internal message routing... Is it built on Redis pub/sub, Riak itself, or something else altogether? And I wish the branding was toned down. As it is, I'm reluctant to direct coworkers or friends to the site despite my interest.

arthursilva 11y ago
It's Riak Core.
siculars 11y ago
The value add on riak is riak_core[0][1][2] which handles data distribution/replication and the like. [0] https://github.com/basho/riak_core https://github.com/basho/riak_core [1] http://basho.com/understanding-riak_core-handoff/ http://basho.com/understanding-riak_core-handoff/ [2] http://basho.com/understanding-riak_core-building-handoff/ http://basho.com/understanding-riak_core-building-handoff/ (I work for basho)

tptacek 11y ago

Do I understand correctly that Basho is now a platform-as-service company, like Compose or Heroku, rather than an enterprise database product company?

rch 11y ago
Doesn't seem that way to me. I see it as a way of taking some elaborate service integration work and wrapping it up as a platform one might deploy in house.
- siculars 11y ago
  What @rch said. (I work for basho)
siculars 11y ago
Think data model capabilities like k/v (original riak) and document (riak 2.x integration with solr) soon to include redis and spark capabilities. But you run this in your own datacenter or cloud like aws or containers like docker. We don't offer a hosted solution (although a ton of people ask for it...) (I work for basho)

samwgoldman 11y ago

Basho has experienced some MAJOR brain drain in the last year. I wonder if this re-positioning is related to that.

wlesieutre 11y ago
New CEO and CTO a year ago are a likely source of repositioning: http://basho.com/basho-names-new-ceo-and-cto/ http://basho.com/basho-names-new-ceo-and-cto/ I can't speculate on how that all relates to brain drain.
- InvisibleCities 11y ago
  Given tweets like this one (https://twitter.com/jtuple/status/598230043093897216 https://twitter.com/jtuple/status/598230043093897216), there doesn't seem to be much to speculate about.
  - wlesieutre 11y ago
    I've heard a bit from a friend there, so what I really mean is "I think I'll stay out of this one" :P But yeah, @jtuple, @Roach_B_me, and others have some choice tweets on the matter. Off topic- your name is a fantastic book!
  - defen 11y ago
    "Data gravity" ?
    - wlesieutre 11y ago
      It's why data wants to be together! http://datagravity.org/ http://datagravity.org/
    - e12e 11y ago
      Sounds like Terry Pratchett's idea of L-Space translated to Enterpriselish: "L-space, short for library-space, is the ultimate portrayal of Pratchett's concept that the written word has powerful magical properties on the Discworld, and that in large quantities all books warp space and time around them. The principle of L-space revolves around a seemingly logical equation; it is an extension of the 'Knowledge is Power': Books = Knowledge = Power = (Force x Distance^2) ÷ Time" http://wiki.lspace.org/mediawiki/L-space http://wiki.lspace.org/mediawiki/L-space

sirstompsalot 11y ago

Biggest thing I can't stand about the new overhaul is the barrier for the open source version - I want to evaluate for my purposes, not give you my email. Been following Riak for some time now, and I'm hopeful this will do good things for Basho.

siculars 11y ago
Pull the source from github[0]... [0] https://github.com/basho/riak https://github.com/basho/riak (I work for basho)

schmichael 11y ago

Orchestrate was founded by ex-Basho people, built this product as a service, and have already been acquired. This is a pretty slow "fast follow." edit: (Although I think Orchestrate used HBase behind the scenes instead of Riak, which is probably a more appealing stack for Enterprises since Hadoop is more accepted than Riak.)

bra-ket 11y ago

no performance benchmarks in sight

deleted 11y ago
[deleted]

paulsutter 11y ago

Is anyone able to parse the explanation below for "Data Gravity"? Even with a great product like Riak, it's difficult to build a hypergrowth standalone business. So apparently they got Cloudera-envy, and decided to.. uh.. synergize new paradigms, and reintermediate plug-and-play partnerships, or something. > Data gravity describes the effect that as data accumulates, there is a greater likelihood that additional services and applications will be attracted to this data, essentially having the same effect gravity has on objects around a planet. As the mass and density increases, so does the strength of the gravitational pull and as things get closer to the mass, they accelerate towards it at increasing velocity. Although services and applications have their own gravity, data is the most massive and dense, meaning it has the most gravity. If data becomes large enough it can become virtually impossible to move. Usually as services and applications interact with data, they cause even more rapid growth of the data itself, creating a continuous cycle of data growth.

robdimsdale 11y ago

I'm really excited by RiakCS (now rebranded as RiakS2) because when it works, it offers a powerful on-premise version of S3. I've been integrating it with Cloud Foundry for about a year now, repackaging it to deploy with BOSH, but it's been a constant source of frustration. From an operator perspective it's incredibly hard to install and configure - the onboarding process to create a cluster from scratch is terrible and the outputted logs are often little more than erlang stack dumps. As an example, I've already spent days trying to get riak-cs 2.0 running on a stock ubuntu 14.04 machine. It should not be this difficult to stand up a product out of the box. Basho's support engineers are generally well intentioned but often their response is "run the following erlang command, and reply to us with the response (also in erlang)". As an operator, I have no idea what effect the provided commands have on my system, now what the output should tell me. Similarly, it took months for their support/engineering team to answer a support ticket about garbage collection - eventually providing us some defaults such that RiakCS would perform garbage collection out of the box. They could not tell us why these settings would work, nor any side-effects of changing low-level parameters. From a product perspective, Basho do not appear willing or able to support the open-source community around their products - typically every answer we've received boils down to "it depends on your use case" and effectively "it should work, I don't believe you are seeing the issues you are raising". I really hope this 're-positioning' results in more support for operators and the community in general. RiakS2 has a lot of potential and I hope Basho are able to realize this.