5 ms·

China’s Internet Boom Starts to Fade

26 points by shahocean 12y ago

haosdent 12y ago
I don't think so.
jhancock 12y ago
This article is mostly about stock market numbers. Ok, its from Bloomberg. I don't think its useful to use words like boom and fade when your writing about companies that have been doing well for 10+ years: Alibaba, Sina/Weibo, Tencent, Baidu, Tudou. Hard to say what kind of future Sina/Weibo and video streaming companies Youku Tudou could have...I guess similar to Twitter and Youtube. Alibaba and Tencent could have a good shot at being world leading banks over the next 10 years among the things they already do well. The stock market may not see its fair shake on these deals, but users in and out of China are getting benefits. China's Internet companies are growing fine from my perspective as a consumer of online services and as a person building companies here. Software development and management gets better year over year. In the IT space, there seems to be organic evolution of treating employees better. More people are practicing taking risk in creating companies.
- seanmcdirmid 12y ago
  Bloomberg is blocked in China, so it has to be credible (otherwise, why would the Chinese government block it?). Most of these internet properties are practically restricted to operating in the sheltered mainland China market, so they'll have a different future from the more international Twitter and Youtube. The Chinese market is cut throat, and all the clones that operate here have super small margins as a result. WeChat announced just this week that they were giving up on international expansion. The question is: can these services exist in China alone, without the more stable revenue streams that come with a more diverse international market? > China's Internet companies are growing fine from my perspective as a consumer of online services and as a person building companies here. Software development and management gets better year over year. In the IT space, there seems to be organic evolution of treating employees better. More people are practicing taking risk in creating companies. I agree. Gone are the days of making your software developers clock in with time cards and mandatory Saturday work days...well, at least at most companies.
  - ttflee 12y ago
    > why would the Chinese government block it So far as I remember, Bloomberg reported some taboos about corruption scandal of The First Family of China. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/04/us-china-censorship-bloomberg-idUSBRE86306820120704 http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/04/us-china-censorshi...
    - seanmcdirmid 12y ago
      Exactly. A news sources that isn't intimidated by the Chinese government is the best source for news about China.
    - deleted 12y ago
      [deleted]
    - chkuendig 12y ago
      That's not completely true. They actually also pulled a very big story to not endanger their financial data business in the country: - http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2014/03/bloomberg-editor-quits-over-china-story-185626.html http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2014/03/bloomberg-editor... http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/d121fd70-49f2-11e3-9a21-00144feabdc0.html?siteedition=intl#axzz2wtsffALG http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/d121fd70-49f2-11e3-9a21-00144... They lost a lot of credibility when covering on Chinese matters due to this incident.
      - seanmcdirmid 12y ago
        Well, to be fair, only CNN isn't blocked now. Everyone else just aren't harmonious enough.
        LiweiZ 12y ago
        Harmony has been replaced by Dream of China already. lol
        ttflee 12y ago
GreaterFool 12y ago
"The Shanghai Composite rose 0.7 percent to 3,641.83 at 9:48 a.m. local time, heading for a ninth day of gains, the longest winning streak since 2007." I like the use of the term "winning streak". No need to pretend it's more than gambling* I hate articles that perpetuate the notion that share price is the ultimate raison d'etre. *this is not supposed to be an absolute statement. it is to be taken with a pinch of salt!
- seanmcdirmid 12y ago
  Supposedly, they are finally cracking down on inside trading and the market will become more of a reliable place to make money without guangxi. So it is more like gambling with fair odds vs. having the cards all stacked against you.
  - notsurewhat2 12y ago
    >Cracking down on insider trading, no longer needing guangxi Wumaos are on HN now?
    - hobs 12y ago
      Calling a contribution astroturfing is a fairly serious accusation, and signing up a new account to do it shows that I doubt you believe that.
    - seanmcdirmid 12y ago
      Never was accused of being a wumao before. I did say supposedly, I'm not sure if its really true or not. I'm not putting my money into the SH stock market yet even though I have plenty of RMB in the bank uninvested.
- Gustomaximus 12y ago
  Further, it's unhealthy how the news reports the days stock movement like it's almost the daily health of the ecomomy. It feels like it creates this incredibly short term thinking over a fairly a arbitary number.
contingencies 12y ago
Wechat is literally used by everyone in remotely major Chinese cities (say all cities with a population of 3+ million) these days. People that meet ask "Do you have wechat?" instead of "What's your phone number?". Sure, it might not generate any money, but suggesting they are fading is absolutely patently false in my experience: they have virtually achieved total market dominance.
- seanmcdirmid 12y ago
  > they have virtually achieved total market dominance. Of the PRC market. http://www.scmp.com/lifestyle/technology/enterprises/article/1741792/tencent-scraps-wechat-global-expansion-plans http://www.scmp.com/lifestyle/technology/enterprises/article...
- siscia 12y ago
  I would say it without "virtually"
notastartup 12y ago
I think there is another boom that is fading, a potentially more serious one that is China's housing market. It is flooded with supply. Capital flight to the West, with property developers defaulting on debt, li kai shing (richest HK dude) dumping all his assets in China a while ago. The fading or faltering of the tech sector could be related but who knows, this is a government that likes to keep a blanket over everything.

26 points by shahocean 12y ago

I don't think so.

This article is mostly about stock market numbers. Ok, its from Bloomberg. I don't think its useful to use words like boom and fade when your writing about companies that have been doing well for 10+ years: Alibaba, Sina/Weibo, Tencent, Baidu, Tudou. Hard to say what kind of future Sina/Weibo and video streaming companies Youku Tudou could have...I guess similar to Twitter and Youtube. Alibaba and Tencent could have a good shot at being world leading banks over the next 10 years among the things they already do well. The stock market may not see its fair shake on these deals, but users in and out of China are getting benefits. China's Internet companies are growing fine from my perspective as a consumer of online services and as a person building companies here. Software development and management gets better year over year. In the IT space, there seems to be organic evolution of treating employees better. More people are practicing taking risk in creating companies.

seanmcdirmid 12y ago
Bloomberg is blocked in China, so it has to be credible (otherwise, why would the Chinese government block it?). Most of these internet properties are practically restricted to operating in the sheltered mainland China market, so they'll have a different future from the more international Twitter and Youtube. The Chinese market is cut throat, and all the clones that operate here have super small margins as a result. WeChat announced just this week that they were giving up on international expansion. The question is: can these services exist in China alone, without the more stable revenue streams that come with a more diverse international market? > China's Internet companies are growing fine from my perspective as a consumer of online services and as a person building companies here. Software development and management gets better year over year. In the IT space, there seems to be organic evolution of treating employees better. More people are practicing taking risk in creating companies. I agree. Gone are the days of making your software developers clock in with time cards and mandatory Saturday work days...well, at least at most companies.
- ttflee 12y ago
  > why would the Chinese government block it So far as I remember, Bloomberg reported some taboos about corruption scandal of The First Family of China. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/04/us-china-censorship-bloomberg-idUSBRE86306820120704 http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/04/us-china-censorshi...
  - seanmcdirmid 12y ago
    Exactly. A news sources that isn't intimidated by the Chinese government is the best source for news about China.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
  - chkuendig 12y ago
    That's not completely true. They actually also pulled a very big story to not endanger their financial data business in the country: - http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2014/03/bloomberg-editor-quits-over-china-story-185626.html http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2014/03/bloomberg-editor... http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/d121fd70-49f2-11e3-9a21-00144feabdc0.html?siteedition=intl#axzz2wtsffALG http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/d121fd70-49f2-11e3-9a21-00144... They lost a lot of credibility when covering on Chinese matters due to this incident.
    - seanmcdirmid 12y ago
      Well, to be fair, only CNN isn't blocked now. Everyone else just aren't harmonious enough.
      - LiweiZ 12y ago
        Harmony has been replaced by Dream of China already. lol
        ttflee 12y ago

GreaterFool 12y ago

"The Shanghai Composite rose 0.7 percent to 3,641.83 at 9:48 a.m. local time, heading for a ninth day of gains, the longest winning streak since 2007." I like the use of the term "winning streak". No need to pretend it's more than gambling* I hate articles that perpetuate the notion that share price is the ultimate raison d'etre. *this is not supposed to be an absolute statement. it is to be taken with a pinch of salt!

seanmcdirmid 12y ago
Supposedly, they are finally cracking down on inside trading and the market will become more of a reliable place to make money without guangxi. So it is more like gambling with fair odds vs. having the cards all stacked against you.
- notsurewhat2 12y ago
  >Cracking down on insider trading, no longer needing guangxi Wumaos are on HN now?
  - hobs 12y ago
    Calling a contribution astroturfing is a fairly serious accusation, and signing up a new account to do it shows that I doubt you believe that.
  - seanmcdirmid 12y ago
    Never was accused of being a wumao before. I did say supposedly, I'm not sure if its really true or not. I'm not putting my money into the SH stock market yet even though I have plenty of RMB in the bank uninvested.
Gustomaximus 12y ago
Further, it's unhealthy how the news reports the days stock movement like it's almost the daily health of the ecomomy. It feels like it creates this incredibly short term thinking over a fairly a arbitary number.

contingencies 12y ago

Wechat is literally used by everyone in remotely major Chinese cities (say all cities with a population of 3+ million) these days. People that meet ask "Do you have wechat?" instead of "What's your phone number?". Sure, it might not generate any money, but suggesting they are fading is absolutely patently false in my experience: they have virtually achieved total market dominance.

seanmcdirmid 12y ago
> they have virtually achieved total market dominance. Of the PRC market. http://www.scmp.com/lifestyle/technology/enterprises/article/1741792/tencent-scraps-wechat-global-expansion-plans http://www.scmp.com/lifestyle/technology/enterprises/article...
siscia 12y ago
I would say it without "virtually"

notastartup 12y ago

I think there is another boom that is fading, a potentially more serious one that is China's housing market. It is flooded with supply. Capital flight to the West, with property developers defaulting on debt, li kai shing (richest HK dude) dumping all his assets in China a while ago. The fading or faltering of the tech sector could be related but who knows, this is a government that likes to keep a blanket over everything.