6 ms·

Some people are going to stick on the old OS no matter what. Their computer still works, why buy another? We can stamp our feet or work with that reality. We h

Some people are going to stick on the old OS no matter what. Their computer still works, why buy another? We can stamp our feet or work with that reality. We have 70% of China on Windows XP with no hope of a modern browser from MS (http://www.computerworld.com/article/2484761/microsoft-windows/china-has-a-massive-windows-xp-problem.html http://www.computerworld.com/article/2484761/microsoft-windo...). At least Chrome will work on those old systems. At least web devs can use modern features on those systems. If the browser is the primary carrot to get someone to upgrade your OS, the OS value prop sucks.

grandalf 12y ago
Exactly. At least it may not be worth $200. Apple's $25 or free updates are much more reasonable and get people to actually stay current. The older hardware slows down gradually and people warm up to the idea of faster/newer hardware gradually, rather than thinking that the new OS broke their working computer. Please, Microsoft, switch to an evergreen OS model like Apple has.
- zemoo 12y ago
  Windows has moved to an evergreen OS model: http://blogs.windows.com/bloggingwindows/2015/01/21/the-next-generation-of-windows-windows-10/ http://blogs.windows.com/bloggingwindows/2015/01/21/the-next...
  - grandalf 12y ago
    Oh wow that is great news!
  - throwawaymsft 12y ago
    But it's for people running 7 and up, for one year. The 70% of Chinese users on XP aren't going to see the benefit of this. (Why didn't Microsoft make it for XP too? They want to squeeze that last sale out of people. They don't realize the greater threat is people leaving their platform entirely.)
    - grandalf 12y ago
      excellent point
    - seanmcdirmid 12y ago
      Even Google doesn't support new versions of Chrome on XP anymore. There is just a point where the OS is outdated. Not many people run XP in China anymore. Maybe some netcafes with pirated versions that they don't want to upgrade. Its really been a while since I've seen anyone run XP in Beijing.
      - yuhong 12y ago
        They still support Chrome on even XP SP2. What is frustrating is the users running XP SP2 (not even SP3) in Japan and France for example.
        seanmcdirmid 12y ago
        I stand corrected: http://chrome.blogspot.com/2013/10/extending-chrome-support-for-xp-users.html http://chrome.blogspot.com/2013/10/extending-chrome-support-... Until next month, anyways :)
        yuhong 12y ago
        Probably until the end of the year at least.
    - joshuapants 12y ago
      How many of the 70% of Chinese users on XP were using licensed copies in the first place?
joshuapants 12y ago
First, you don't have to buy a new computer to get a newer version of Windows (especially since 10 seems to run just as well as 7/8 on the same hardware, if not better). Second, since MS is apparently offering free upgrades to 10 for consumers on 7/8 it doesn't seem like cost is really a factor. The China case is interesting, but I'd like to see some more recent figures on usage, since that article is about 2 years old. I did some quick searching, but everything I could find seemed to be from around that timeframe. I don't know that the browser is a primary carrot, but it's part of the deal. If you can get enough of their new software to run on, say, Windows 7 to duplicate major functionality of 10, what's the point in upgrading at all? It doesn't make sense to have (people who will stick with the old OS no matter what) + (people who might upgrade, but don't because they can keep the old one and still get the cool new features of the new one) using older versions of Windows, thus increasing maintenance on old software.
- throwawaymsft 12y ago
  1/2: I'd posit the people using XP in 2015 are probably not the ones capable of upgrading their existing OS. New OS means new computer for them. 3: Users of every other OS are enticed by features other than the browser. Only Windows ties the OS to the browser.
  - joshuapants 12y ago
    > 1/2: I'd posit the people using XP in 2015 are probably not the ones capable of upgrading their existing OS. New OS means new computer for them. Are those people capable of installing a new browser after making the informed decision that it's better than IE 8? > 3: Users of every other OS are enticed by features other than the browser. Only Windows ties the OS to the browser. Every other OS? Let's look at the major players in desktop computing: Windows and OSX. Windows has IE/Spartan, you can as of now only get them on Windows. OSX has Safari, there was an abortive attempt to develop it for Windows but it didn't take off and is now abandoned. I don't think this is too surprising. Here I am on OSX Mavericks making this post from Safari 7.1.3 because Safari 8 is only available for Yosemite. Given that the browser is the main piece of software that many consumers interact with, I think it's fair to say that the browser is still a significant value proposition, even if it's not the only one.

grandalf 12y ago

Exactly. At least it may not be worth $200. Apple's $25 or free updates are much more reasonable and get people to actually stay current. The older hardware slows down gradually and people warm up to the idea of faster/newer hardware gradually, rather than thinking that the new OS broke their working computer. Please, Microsoft, switch to an evergreen OS model like Apple has.

zemoo 12y ago
Windows has moved to an evergreen OS model: http://blogs.windows.com/bloggingwindows/2015/01/21/the-next-generation-of-windows-windows-10/ http://blogs.windows.com/bloggingwindows/2015/01/21/the-next...
- grandalf 12y ago
  Oh wow that is great news!
- throwawaymsft 12y ago
  But it's for people running 7 and up, for one year. The 70% of Chinese users on XP aren't going to see the benefit of this. (Why didn't Microsoft make it for XP too? They want to squeeze that last sale out of people. They don't realize the greater threat is people leaving their platform entirely.)
  - grandalf 12y ago
    excellent point
  - seanmcdirmid 12y ago
    Even Google doesn't support new versions of Chrome on XP anymore. There is just a point where the OS is outdated. Not many people run XP in China anymore. Maybe some netcafes with pirated versions that they don't want to upgrade. Its really been a while since I've seen anyone run XP in Beijing.
    - yuhong 12y ago
      They still support Chrome on even XP SP2. What is frustrating is the users running XP SP2 (not even SP3) in Japan and France for example.
      - seanmcdirmid 12y ago
        I stand corrected: http://chrome.blogspot.com/2013/10/extending-chrome-support-for-xp-users.html http://chrome.blogspot.com/2013/10/extending-chrome-support-... Until next month, anyways :)
        yuhong 12y ago
        Probably until the end of the year at least.
  - joshuapants 12y ago
    How many of the 70% of Chinese users on XP were using licensed copies in the first place?

joshuapants 12y ago

First, you don't have to buy a new computer to get a newer version of Windows (especially since 10 seems to run just as well as 7/8 on the same hardware, if not better). Second, since MS is apparently offering free upgrades to 10 for consumers on 7/8 it doesn't seem like cost is really a factor. The China case is interesting, but I'd like to see some more recent figures on usage, since that article is about 2 years old. I did some quick searching, but everything I could find seemed to be from around that timeframe. I don't know that the browser is a primary carrot, but it's part of the deal. If you can get enough of their new software to run on, say, Windows 7 to duplicate major functionality of 10, what's the point in upgrading at all? It doesn't make sense to have (people who will stick with the old OS no matter what) + (people who might upgrade, but don't because they can keep the old one and still get the cool new features of the new one) using older versions of Windows, thus increasing maintenance on old software.

throwawaymsft 12y ago
1/2: I'd posit the people using XP in 2015 are probably not the ones capable of upgrading their existing OS. New OS means new computer for them. 3: Users of every other OS are enticed by features other than the browser. Only Windows ties the OS to the browser.
- joshuapants 12y ago
  > 1/2: I'd posit the people using XP in 2015 are probably not the ones capable of upgrading their existing OS. New OS means new computer for them. Are those people capable of installing a new browser after making the informed decision that it's better than IE 8? > 3: Users of every other OS are enticed by features other than the browser. Only Windows ties the OS to the browser. Every other OS? Let's look at the major players in desktop computing: Windows and OSX. Windows has IE/Spartan, you can as of now only get them on Windows. OSX has Safari, there was an abortive attempt to develop it for Windows but it didn't take off and is now abandoned. I don't think this is too surprising. Here I am on OSX Mavericks making this post from Safari 7.1.3 because Safari 8 is only available for Yosemite. Given that the browser is the main piece of software that many consumers interact with, I think it's fair to say that the browser is still a significant value proposition, even if it's not the only one.