3 ms·

I've noticed that in the US, one will "lay down" in a bed. I have trouble knowing how to reconcile this in my mind. Would one day that in American English, a di

I've noticed that in the US, one will "lay down" in a bed. I have trouble knowing how to reconcile this in my mind. Would one day that in American English, a different dialect to British English, this is the correct usage? Can dialects have distant grammar rules? Or can it only be considered a colloquialism?

chias 12y ago
My ex-girlfriend was just very nervous about saying "lie" because it's "bad". So "I'm just going to go lay down on the couch" because "I'm not lying!". Which results in amusing scenarios in which people don't realize that e.g. this song is about sex: https://play.google.com/music/preview/Txqbmvyo63hydudrvpj3gfszl7q?lyrics=1 https://play.google.com/music/preview/Txqbmvyo63hydudrvpj3gf...
- Zuider 12y ago
  You have probably hit on the real reason for the odd choice of verb 'lain' in the Guardian article - the sexual connotations of the word 'laid' (especially in the context of bodies, and given that the location was in France). I suspect that 'laid' was changed to 'lain' after the first draft was submitted, possibly following some ribaldry from the copy editor and colleagues.
Fishkins 12y ago
I wonder how much this was influenced by the common bedtime prayer[0]. "Lay" is the right conjugation with the reflexive pronoun added ("I lay [myself] down"), and people probably don't consider that "I lie down" needs to be conjugated differently. [0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Now_I_Lay_Me_Down_to_Sleep http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Now_I_Lay_Me_Down_to_Sleep
richardfontana 12y ago
Use of "lay" as present tense equivalent of "lie" is not universal in American English, though it occurs in many dialects. (For example, I don't think it is prevalent in the coastal Northeast dialects. It sounds vaguely 'rustic' to me - I grew up in New York City.) It was traditionally considered incorrect by American English usage prescriptivists. Today perhaps it would be seen as a widespread colloquialism. I'm sure there are US-authored books on proper English usage that still call it out as incorrect or nonstandard. Of course dialects have grammar rules which may be distinct (I assume that's what you meant instead of 'distant', 'distinct from what's officially supposed to be correct'). "Lay" for "lie" is not a matter of grammar, though, but vocabulary.

chias 12y ago

My ex-girlfriend was just very nervous about saying "lie" because it's "bad". So "I'm just going to go lay down on the couch" because "I'm not lying!". Which results in amusing scenarios in which people don't realize that e.g. this song is about sex: https://play.google.com/music/preview/Txqbmvyo63hydudrvpj3gfszl7q?lyrics=1 https://play.google.com/music/preview/Txqbmvyo63hydudrvpj3gf...

Zuider 12y ago
You have probably hit on the real reason for the odd choice of verb 'lain' in the Guardian article - the sexual connotations of the word 'laid' (especially in the context of bodies, and given that the location was in France). I suspect that 'laid' was changed to 'lain' after the first draft was submitted, possibly following some ribaldry from the copy editor and colleagues.

Fishkins 12y ago

I wonder how much this was influenced by the common bedtime prayer[0]. "Lay" is the right conjugation with the reflexive pronoun added ("I lay [myself] down"), and people probably don't consider that "I lie down" needs to be conjugated differently. [0] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Now_I_Lay_Me_Down_to_Sleep http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Now_I_Lay_Me_Down_to_Sleep

richardfontana 12y ago

Use of "lay" as present tense equivalent of "lie" is not universal in American English, though it occurs in many dialects. (For example, I don't think it is prevalent in the coastal Northeast dialects. It sounds vaguely 'rustic' to me - I grew up in New York City.) It was traditionally considered incorrect by American English usage prescriptivists. Today perhaps it would be seen as a widespread colloquialism. I'm sure there are US-authored books on proper English usage that still call it out as incorrect or nonstandard. Of course dialects have grammar rules which may be distinct (I assume that's what you meant instead of 'distant', 'distinct from what's officially supposed to be correct'). "Lay" for "lie" is not a matter of grammar, though, but vocabulary.