8 ms·
I'm sorry but when you ship a machine with ONE PORT for the purposes of charging and peripherals, this absolutely needs to be in the box. Nickel and $80'ering
by nickysielicki 12y ago
I'm sorry but when you ship a machine with ONE PORT for the purposes of charging and peripherals, this absolutely needs to be in the box.
Nickel and $80'ering me on a $1400 computer is ridiculous. I'll stick with my thinkpad.
- pbreit 12y agoWith Bluetooth, the cloud and AirPlay, who even needs those ports? People are up in arms every time Apple changes/deletes ports and are almost always wrong. Go ahead and stick with your thinkpad.
- chronolitus 12y agoMost people I know, many times.
- robotresearcher 12y agoShow up to give a presentation anywhere in the world. Standard plug-in? VGA. Maybe HDMI. You can't count on an AirPlay connection being present and I wouldn't want to rely on wireless video for important presentations with 20 seconds set up time anyway.
- integraton 12y agoThat particular use case is apparently not expected by Apple to be a common use case for the target market of this particular device. Fortunately, other devices with different features focused on different usage patterns are available for purchase from Apple and other manufacturers. It's strange that this is at all controversial.
- robotresearcher 12y agoOn the contrary, it is totally expected. They sell a dongle with VGA out.
- integraton 12y agoIf it was expected to be a common use case, it would be included as a core feature. Furthermore, the number of people for whom "show[ing] up to give a presentation anywhere in the world" is a common use case is likely very small. I would go so far as to speculate that people in that category are greatly outnumbered by people across all demographics who use their laptops for sending emails, browsing the web, using productivity software, organizing media, and doing other software-centric tasks.
- robotresearcher 12y agoCars do not come with child seats included as a core feature. Would you say that transporting under-10s is not a common use case of a family car?
- mintplant 12y ago> Furthermore, the number of people for whom "show[ing] up to give a presentation anywhere in the world" is a common use case is likely very small. College students? It's always a big hassle finding a dongle whenever a MacBook user has to give a presentation in class.
- gedejong 12y agoTrue, but since Macs have lost the ports, better venues are finally starting to cater to modern standards. Personally, I think VGA is an abomination and people should react a bit stronger to be invited to a venue and having to deal with standards from 1987.
- robotresearcher 12y agoI think guests should graciously work with whatever hosts provide, as long as it works.
- acveilleux 12y agoThe thing is, it doesn't. It requires the device to be able to do a Digital to Analog conversion. In modern graphics chipsets, that capability is only needed for legacy compatibility with CRTs and old projectors. If you speak VGA to a projector or any flat panel monitor, you're really just feeding an Analog to Digital converter. It's nuts.
- largote 12y agoVGA has lower quality at high resolutions than something like DVI, DisplayPort, or HDMI. Then again, if the place still has a VGA connector, it's unlikely the projector is high-resolution.
- robotresearcher 12y agoYes. So as a guest do you make the best of it or whine that there are better things available?
- saraid216 12y agoBeing a good host is also kind of a thing, FYI, and part of that is going to the effort of making life nice for your guest. If you're going to harp on hospitality, please remember it cuts both ways.
- sswaner 12y agoThat is an atypical scenario unless your job requires frequent presentation. Even then, you are used to having an adapter in your bag or pocket. To me, this is a great tradeoff: I get a lighter and thinner laptop for 100% of my computing, the downside being an adapter when I return the the dark ages of VGA connectors. In fact, for my MacBook Pro, I will have fewer connections. Instead of power and Thunderbolt, I will just get one of the connectors that bridges power, external monitor and USB peripherals and plug in a single thing when I "dock" my laptop. I will take that any day over the awkward Dell and Thinkpad docking stations I see my coworkers use.
- urda 12y ago> That is an a typical scenario unless your job requires frequent presentation. I completely agree with this assessment. Even here on HN the majority of users are not giving presentations or even screen sharing. When it does matter, there is often a third party device they have to present from anway. I'll take the adapter not being in the box, as for most users they won't be using it enough to warrant the extra cost.
- robotresearcher 12y agoI agree completely. The top comment in this thread was about wireless connections making wired connections redundant. I want wired video output as I trust it more than wireless. VGA is an inelegant but working solution. Dongle is no problem.
- ceejayoz 12y agoBring a ChromeCast. Plug it in to an HDMI point, bring a VGA-HDMI adapter, and it'll work fine on your own ad-hoc network.
- niels_olson 12y agoI almost thought this was an amazing idea. Except most places venues I'm in don't offer HDMI either.
- sitkack 12y agoIdea. ChromeCast like device that can pump out HDMI, DVI, display port and VGA, attach to it over wifi, it has a fallback where it can run the presentation off an SD card while itself acts as a wifi base station. The ChromeCast of presentation hardware.
- arihant 12y agoNot to nitpick, but for a long time, to use a Mac with VGA you had to buy an adapter. Same for HDMI. There is a case that can be made on including this accessory in the box, but VGA cannot be part of that argument. Not for a Mac user. Instead of buying mini DVI to VGA or Lightening to HDMI adapter, just buy this?
- robotresearcher 12y agoYou are not nitpicking something I am not arguing. I'm happy with a VGA dongle.
- rsynnott 12y agoSo, er, carry a VGA dongle? I mean, most laptops don't have actual VGA ports these days.
- robotresearcher 12y agoYep, happy with that. I was responding to the parent comment that said roughly "with wireless everything, who needs wired ports?". Wireless is usually OK in my living room but I would not count on wireless video working reliably in a conference room with 500 people on their laptop/phone. Shudder.
- totalrobe 12y agoGee, and if you're one of the <20% in the US with access to fiber, you can even upload to the cloud at greater than 10 Mbps
- stouset 12y agoI have a YubiKey permanently occupying a USB port in my laptop for 2FA.
- Zombieball 12y agoWhoa thanks for brining this to attention. I have this as well and didn't even think about it! I would need to carry an adapter with my YubiKey.
- bronson 12y agoThat doesn't sound very 2 factor.
- acveilleux 12y agoIf you chose to read an unspoken "while I use it" it's more logical and in some environment required.
- stouset 12y agoYou have to physically touch the device in order for it to function.
- moe 12y agoIt may not be the purest usage mode but even a permanently inserted YubiKey protects you when your password got sniffed on the network or by a keylogger. Moreover the YubiKey also acts as a PGP smartcard, giving you a private key (for e.g. SSH) that an attacker can't extract even if they obtain root on your laptop. As much as I would like a "Retina MBA", the lack of a separate USB port is a dealbreaker for me too.
- gcr 12y agoAs long as the machine is on, can't the attacker ask the YubiKey to generate signatures on their behalf? This is similar to standard SSH agent forwarding attacks. A sysadmin connects to a malicious server via SSH. If the sysadmin turns on agent forwarding, then "malicious root" can remotely ask the sysadmin's agent (running on the sysadmin's laptop) to authenticate to any other machine that accepts the sysadmin's public key. The malicious root can log in to any other server the sysadmin has access to, as long as the sysadmin still stays connected.
- swang 12y agoMaybe it's just not set up correctly, but my company has airplay in every conference room and we very rarely use it because its so fickle whether or not it'll acknowledge your MacBook. Maybe Yosemite fixed these problems but that's just trading one set of bugs/problems for another.
- larzang 12y agoYeah, who on earth uses headphones with a laptop. Crazy.
- duskwuff 12y agoThere's a headphone jack on the right hand side.
- ctdonath 12y agoIn defense of the parent: Apple sells more than just the 12" MacBook, and if its specs aren't to your liking then you're not the intended demographic. Some people DO want an extremely thin/light Mac and don't need more than a charging cable & audio jack, enough people that Apple decided it was worth going to this extreme. Want more ports/power/etc? get a MacBook Air, MacBook Pro, iMac, or Mac Pro - each with a variety of configurations.
- untog 12y agoI'm still waiting for AirPlay to actually work in corporate environments. We have a mix of wired and wireless, which I believe live on different subnets. Bonjour just won't work with it.
- nigelsampson 12y agoThe Surface Pro's come with only one USB port on the device, they make it up for it with having one on the power brick which I think is an awesome idea.
- nickysielicki 12y agoThe surface pro also has a separate charging port. With this new macbook, one cannot charge and use a mouse at the same time without an $80 addon.
- largote 12y agoWell, the official Apple mouse does not require a dongle, their logic must be something along the lines of "that's what you get for using third party mice".
- falcolas 12y agoYou mean like this one? http://store.apple.com/us/product/MB112LL/B/apple-mouse http://store.apple.com/us/product/MB112LL/B/apple-mouse
- _nedR 12y agoWhat if i want to connect an external harddisk? or a pen drive having my work documents? or I want to connect a projector to do my presentation. Is Apple's logic "that's what you get for having friends or working with people who do not buy the latest apple devices"?
- emehrkay 12y agoDidn't MacBooks come with those connectors before? It's like when iPods and iPhones used to come with the desktop stands https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7357/11147888116_9be011e0b1_n.jpg https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7357/11147888116_9be011e0b1_n...
- jmilloy 12y agoSo they should increase the price of the laptop by $80 for everyone so that you don't feel nickel and dimed? Why do you care if your receipt has that $80 listed a separate item or not?
- Joky 12y agoThen it would be sold $1480... At some point I had 5 Nokia phone and 4 Dell laptop ones, power adapter. Why having an adaptor for VGA/HDMI/DVI/Display Port/USB/Ethernet/... shipped with all machines when all users probably won't need all but just one. This is a waste...
- batiudrami 12y agoI'm surprised it isn't. My ASUS Ultrabook came with a USB-Ethernet and MiniDP-DVI adapters in the box, despite coming with the usual 2xUSB3, MiniDP & Micro HDMI ports. Though I guess it's not that surprising. Back in the day, my Gen4 iPod came with a power brick, a USB cable and a Firewire cable. Now you get a single USB cable.
- X-Istence 12y agoThe iPhones at least -- haven't purchased an iPod in a long time -- still come with power bricks.
- iSnow 12y agoI don't get it. So you spend $1400 on a computer but a missing port adapter not everyone needs is deal breaker? I strongly believe you were never in the market for a Mac anyways, just using the opportunity to hate a bit.
- burger_moon 12y agoI own a macbook right now (it's one of the best laptops I've owned) and I will use this one until it dies because I dislike what they are doing with the new one. If it stays this way, I will likely go back to a windows machine. I agree with the above comment. It's ridiculous. Actually it's not. It's pretty typical of Apple.