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The Siberian crater phenomenon is more widespread than previously thought
- nsomaru 12y agoWhy are they calling this a crater when their theories don't include impact from space?
- Sommer717 12y agoCraters can be created by any kind of explosion or impact, in this case it's by underground gas explosions.
- theandrewbailey 12y agoAny distinct bowl-like land feature is a crater. Volcanoes have them, too.
- codewithcheese 12y agoSeems like a legitimate question. Why should it be downvoted.
- refurb 12y agoBecause folks here don't like to hear non-PC opinions?
- nl 12y agoGenuinely curious: what possible non-PC answer is there? (Ignoring that the OP didn't realise craters could be caused by many things)
- refurb 12y agoI'm guessing the OP got downvoted because his theory had nothing to do with climate change?
- mikeash 12y agoI'm pretty sure OP got downvoted because he asked a question he could have easily answered himself by looking up the definition of the word in question.
- Crito 12y agoHe didn't present a theory at all. He just asked a question about terminology.
- nl 12y agoThe definition of a crater has nothing to do with climate change. I thought there was some "interesting" conspiracy theory thatI'm not aware of about how we are being bombarded from outer space but it's being covered up.
- spacemanmatt 12y agoSince when was the definition of "crater" politicized? Oh wait, you're just making that up, aren't you!
- DanBC 12y agoBecause it's answered with a web search. The Google "instant result" (or whatever the hell they're called) says: "1. a large bowl-shaped cavity in the ground or on a celestial object, typically one caused by an explosion or the impact of a meteorite."
- Mithaldu 12y agoShort version: "Siberia is warming. Permafrost thaws and spews methane, and blasts out a burst of highly flammable gas." The consequences of that can include: Russia's economy being broken due to a main export literally vanishing into thin air. And worse: Green house gases getting into the atmosphere in vast amounts.
- speeder 12y agoWhen I read it I also wondered: "Why noone is pointing out that methane emissions also increase global warming?" I have no idea ho much methane can be released, since I don't even know how much Russia is mining or anything like that... But it sounds a lot (since in Ukraine crisis Russian gas is a big point), so if all that leaks out it would greatly accelerate global warming no? (thus releasing even more gas!)
- phkahler 12y ago>> Why noone is pointing out that methane emissions also increase global warming? Methane produces a much stronger greenhouse effect than CO2, so the obvious solution is to capture it and use it for fuel, which will convert it to CO2.
- cozzyd 12y agoSo we have to firebomb the craters?
- wavefunction 12y agoWouldn't that be too much, too late? The idea is to capture it before it escapes its previously permafrosted enclosure.
- gizmo686 12y agoThe idea is that if we cannot capture it, we should at least convert it to a less harmful gas (CO2).
- ChuckMcM 12y agoInteresting phenomena. Presumably this happens every time the average temperature rises above the melting point of the water and clathrates. Given that Methane is a pretty powerful greenhouse gas, it makes me curious what the mechanism is that converts a 'warm' earth into a 'frozen' earth.I think understanding that would help us understand what to expect as the temperature increases.
- CHsurfer 12y agoAsteroid strike, massive volcanic eruption, etc...
- jkot 12y agoMethane is unstable in oxygen atmosphere. Ice ages are caused by earth orbit and rotation axis orientation changes.
- Gravityloss 12y agoI guess people might be left with an incomplete image from that comment. The positive CO2 feedback loop amplifies ice ages a lot.
- jackgavigan 12y agoAm I the only one who feels that it is inappropriate to describe a saga as "more widespread" or as having "deepened"?
- dang 12y agos/saga/phenomenon/ just for you.
- davesque 12y agoYep, pretty scary. Even scarier, if oceanic methane clathrates are destabilized, we're pretty much fucked i.e. kiss your hopes for controlling global warming goodbye: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methane_clathrate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methane_clathrate
- mark-r 12y agoThanks for the link, it taught me something. I wonder if that's how Styx did that album cover long before Photoshop was invented? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinox_(Styx_album) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinox_(Styx_album)
- keslag 12y agoI just gave some guy shit this morning for playing the old man card, but you do realize we had special effects before photoshop, right? A lot of what you can do in photoshop is actually the digital translation of the analogue process. Photoshop didn't make this possible, it just made it easier and faster.
- VieElm 12y agoSeems to be evidence that the earth hasn't been this warm in a very long time or these pockets of gas wouldn't possibly even exist now.
- cjensen 12y agoIt was warmer 8000 years ago due to orbital effects. [1] [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocene_climatic_optimum http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocene_climatic_optimum
- arjn 12y agoSo is it old, buried organic (flora,fauna) matter thats causing the methane ? I'm wondering a couple of things : 1) Is there any way arial or satellite imaging can help predict where these methane bubbles in the permafrost will occur ? 2) Could this be tapped as a resource ? P.S , is anyone else reminded of the "Spice blooms" from Dune ?
- acomjean 12y agoLandfills in the US are now esentially very large plastic bags. The problem is when the trash decays it produces methane (and other gasses), and having flamable gas in an many acre bag is bad.. So there are vents and the methane is captured. This is captured and piped to burn off. There are claims of generating power but the amount I've seen is not significant.
- g8oz 12y agoLandfill gas generation is quite significant. In the U.S alone as of 2013, 621 LFG projects were operational producing 1,978 MW. Another 850 MW worth of projects are candidates. See http://www.epa.gov/lmop/documents/pdfs/overview.pdf http://www.epa.gov/lmop/documents/pdfs/overview.pdf
- agapos 12y ago"So is it old, buried organic (flora, fauna) matter thats causing the methane ?" Yes, I believe so, though it could be still younger than the normal gas and oil fields (personal speculation). 1.) I think it may be possible, using a mix of infra and normal optical observations with a good algorithm to identify it on the images. Another but even smaller possibility would be the inspection of differences in the gravitational field * (though there may not be enough gas to be measurable this way). But for either of these to be even remotely possible, we would need a good idea of what to seek, namely a not-yet-popped methane lens under the permafrost. 2.) Unlikely. Suppose if we manage to find some intact ones, tapping into those would be dangerous to a currently unknown extent, maybe even compared to the normal hazards of working with explosive and flammable hydrocarbons. Secondly, the amount of gas may not be enough to clear the costs. Edit.: * Gravity gradiometry
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- gmuslera 12y agoThe scariest part of the slow trend of global warming is that maybe big positive feedback mechanisms could be literally hidden under our feets, pretty much ignored till now. Things could go wrong very fast, in ways that not even experts could had predicted.
- projectileboy 12y agoYou mess with a nonlinear system, you get nonlinear results.
- 1971genocide 12y agohaha, i have been saying people this thing to people for years. the climate is non-linear which means slight changes can result in bifurcations that are irreversible. When we lose all our mathematical models we lose our understanding and once that happens we are no different from cavemens who dont understand how fire works.
- jobu 12y agoWhat I'm curious about is the mechanisms that might counteract global warming. The earth has cycled in the past between hot and cold periods, so there are obviously natural mechanisms that cause it to reverse as well. Could we harness these mechanisms to keep the earth compatible with human habitation?
- dflock 12y agoI think that this mechanism is mostly CO2 being slowly weathered out of the atmosphere and disposed of, mostly via limestone formation. This takes a very long time and is very slow, so it can only catch up if you stop pumping it out.
- agapos 12y agoThe colder oceans are notable natural CO2 absorbents, plus we have to mention the effects of life itself: photo-synthesizing plants and unicellular creatures. Like the historical ones that fixated enough carbon to create today's wast coal, oil and methane fields. As I recall, there is a group of creatures that may did the first big wave of carbon fixation at the beginning of life, binding CO2 and releasing the important O2 that enabled the appearance of complex life forms, but I can't remember it's name.
- Figs 12y agoAre there any reports of this phenomenon occurring in Alaska and Canada?
- Shivetya 12y agoconsidering how watched they are I doubt it, it could be likely to destabilization brought on by developing the area for natural gas usage. Perhaps they are causing fractures as other fuels taken out. As for global warming or what not, its not like it wasn't warmer within periods of well documented history and we survived that just fine. It is more likely one volcano will do more than we think we do.
- dghughes 12y agoAs a Canadian I haven't heard of any but the current government is massively anti-science so if there were any projects they would have been stopped.
- Apofis 12y agoThe article that this article is about is a lot more informative and has a lot more photos. http://siberiantimes.com/science/casestudy/news/n0127-dozens-of-mysterious-new-craters-suspected-in-northern-russia/ http://siberiantimes.com/science/casestudy/news/n0127-dozens...
- cwal37 12y agoIf anyone is interested in learning more about permafrost methane, and a bit about clathrates as well, this paper[1] is a pretty good primer. I worked with the lead author over a summer around when he was publishing this a few years back. It's possible I can answer your questions, although I won't guarantee it. Clathrates/hydrates are a personal favorite of mine, even wrote up a short research paper in grad school on the possibility for their economic extraction. [1]http://www.climateemergencyinstitute.com/uploads/L_Livermore_lab_MH_article_2012.pdf http://www.climateemergencyinstitute.com/uploads/L_Livermore... EDIT: The URL is a bit hyperbolic, but the paper is legit, it's just the first host for this paper I found.
- youonlyliveonce 12y agoaround 90 years ago something very similar happened near the river Brahmaputra. I suspect it was the same phenomenon.
- appleflaxen 12y agoI find this process indescribably scary. It's understandable that the public is clueless, but can someone explain to me why the technologists aren't worried? Positive feedback would put us so far past the point of no return that earth will be unrecognizable.
- rasz_pl 12y agoThere is no point of no return, earth cycles temperatures regularly, humanity is just a pimple on its face.
- gd1 12y agoProbably the fact that no positive feedbacks or 'tipping points' happened during the Holocene Climate Optimum, so it's fairly easy to figure out that this is your usual alarmist nonsense.