5 ms·

So here's why this is particularly awesome in my head. I am a digital nomad, and basically travel with a backpack's worth of stuff, developing off my 13"MBA. T

So here's why this is particularly awesome in my head. I am a digital nomad, and basically travel with a backpack's worth of stuff, developing off my 13"MBA. The thing I miss the most about my old office is having a nice monitor. The thing I miss most about having a home is my 3-monitor desktop setup. Both things I had to give up because they don't fit in my backpack and because I can't easily procure them wherever I travel to. But if I can pack an Oculus Rift headset into my pack, I dunno, a year from now. I can have all the multi-desktop computing environments I want, and they'd actually be way more awesome than just 3 flat monitors. Beyond all that, text editors and dev environments have seen little UX improvement given the rate of evolution for everything else digital. This looks like an awesome step to trying some really radical things (I know this is a previously explored topic though, but I love being reminded of it). OP, this is awesome. I happily leave the future of my dev environments in your hands.

zyxley 12y ago
>But if I can pack an Oculus Rift headset into my pack, I dunno, a year from now. I suspect it'll take longer than that for the resolution to get high enough to be usable for fine-detail tasks like professional coding.
- moron4hire 12y ago
  I would be surprised if it was a lot longer. And regardless, it seems very likely it will eventually happen, thus working towards that goal--even if the hardware isn't yet ideal--is probably a good idea.
- Paul_S 12y ago
  "resolution to get high enough to be usable for fine-detail tasks like professional coding" Coding does not require high resolution displays. You can code on a 80 character wide terminal with fonts of 8x8 pixels. I have. I still use bitmap fonts today (terminus). And let me remind you that blind people code as well. Visible text is just an abstraction, other ones are possible.
claudiusd 12y ago
Holy crap, great idea! Imagine if adding a "monitor" (virtually speaking, of course) to your setup was no more difficult than splitting a Vim window... that would be pretty rad. An Oculus Rift is much less expensive than your typical multi-monitor setup too, FWIW.
- zachrose 12y ago
  Finally, a virtual reality so immersive it can simulate a room full of teletypes.
  - JoshTriplett 12y ago
    "A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in." A VR headset is a device used to look at the xterm you want to type in.
  - e12e 12y ago
    Hehe. Well, text will be text... on a side note, those interested in this, might also like: https://github.com/brianpeiris/RiftSketch https://github.com/brianpeiris/RiftSketch
- moron4hire 12y ago
  Actually, I'm hoping to be able to experiment with code layout ideas that do not strictly adhere to a window. 2D elements tend to not map well to 3D spaces. One of the problems with the text-in-a-texture method that I've done here is that there is no relief of depth to the text, and relief is actually an important part of how we make sense out of objects in 3D space. It's fine on a 2D screen because the context is so restricted that it all stays consistent. But in 3D, it's kind of disconcerting to see completely flat textures. Like, why do we still use plain text in flat files for source code (for the most part, there are a few exceptions-that-prove-the-rule)? Why are there so many examples of graphical programming systems that have completely failed? Is it because there is something inherent to text that makes it superior for representing algorithms? Or is it because 1-dimensional text maps to our IO systems the best? I suspect there is a healthy dose of the latter, but we haven't ever had a significant "other" IO system to ever test that theory. In a lot of ways, Primrose isn't even my goal, more like a benchmark from which to start developing other ideas in text representation in VR UIs. I don't know what they will be, but at least I now have a starting point.
wlesieutre 12y ago
There are definitely people working on it, but I don't think the resolution is going to be there for text editing in the first (or even second) generation Rift. That said, take a look at these: http://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/2hbktl/best_virtual_desktop_display_application_for_the/ http://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/2hbktl/best_virtual_...
- moron4hire 12y ago
  This issue is actually where the idea came from to put the text on the inside of a sphere. I wanted to make a VERY big text field, so that I could fit a good amount of text on the object at a font size large enough to read the text well. At that size, the edges of a rectangular window are so much further away from the viewer that there is significant distortion. The sphere makes for a much more comfortable viewing angle. No, I wouldn't want to write Primrose itself in Primrose, and Primrose isn't a very big project. But little experiments with the live-coding have been fun. I'm still working out the use cases in my head. I suspect there might be more use for manipulating and visualizing code in VR--at least in the early days until resolution gets better--than straight, bulk writing code.
  - wlesieutre 12y ago
    Ah, interesting approach! I'd been stuck thinking about it in terms of replicating my standard multi-monitor setup in VR, but without the physical constraints of my desk and the manufacturing costs of large panels, there's really no need to set it up that way. Neat!
moron4hire 12y ago
Thank you. You have no idea how much that means to me. That's exactly why I'm working on VR projects right now, that "year from now" that you mentioned. I'm specifically going for WebVR because I believe the browser environment to be the most conducive to rapid prototyping
imaginenore 12y ago
What stops you from having multiple windows on your desktop? Oculus sucks at displaying text - it's low resolution (half of 1080p), it has crazy chromatic abberations, and you have to transform "spherize" your image to correct for the lens distortion, further reducting the resolution. Oculus is not light - it's pretty annoying to wear it for longer than 20-30 minutes.
- Tojiro 12y ago
  This is all true of the hardware as it exists right now. By the same token the original iPhone was low res, slow, only 2G, and bulky. The iPhone 4 (first with retina display) came out only 3 years later. That's a huge leap in such a short period of time. If VR catches on at all you can expect it to see the same type of acceleration.
  - moron4hire 12y ago
    Yeah, that was kind of a motivation for me. I was sick of standing around, talking about what was or was not good for VR, with people who didn't even own a Rift, let alone program anything for it.
- ibrahima 12y ago
  I think the version based on the Note 4 is 2560x1440 so that's already quite a big leap up. Give it two years and we might have usable text editing maybe?
- keerthiko 12y ago
  Nothing stops me from having multiple windows on my 13" desktop. But it's clunky to bounce between, and makes me lose context too easily ctrl/alt+shift/+tab/~/1/2/3-ing through my browser or text editor or output window. With a multi-display, I can just turn my face over or glance and look at what I need and be back in context right away. I mean, I hope I don't have to explain why multiple monitors are nice (for most people). The same is conceivable with a VR solution. That makes it awesome. As for the problems you mention, all extremely solvable. I'm sure you were alive when people were editing text on lower resolution displays. Lens technology for dealing with a great extent CA exists, it just needs to be tuned for VR settings. I could lie down and use it. Lighter materials could be used in future versions. It could be made disassemblable for easier packing/storage. I have faith in our current generation of technologists to make these things and more happen before my development career sunsets :)

zyxley 12y ago

>But if I can pack an Oculus Rift headset into my pack, I dunno, a year from now. I suspect it'll take longer than that for the resolution to get high enough to be usable for fine-detail tasks like professional coding.

moron4hire 12y ago
I would be surprised if it was a lot longer. And regardless, it seems very likely it will eventually happen, thus working towards that goal--even if the hardware isn't yet ideal--is probably a good idea.
Paul_S 12y ago
"resolution to get high enough to be usable for fine-detail tasks like professional coding" Coding does not require high resolution displays. You can code on a 80 character wide terminal with fonts of 8x8 pixels. I have. I still use bitmap fonts today (terminus). And let me remind you that blind people code as well. Visible text is just an abstraction, other ones are possible.

claudiusd 12y ago

Holy crap, great idea! Imagine if adding a "monitor" (virtually speaking, of course) to your setup was no more difficult than splitting a Vim window... that would be pretty rad. An Oculus Rift is much less expensive than your typical multi-monitor setup too, FWIW.

zachrose 12y ago
Finally, a virtual reality so immersive it can simulate a room full of teletypes.
- JoshTriplett 12y ago
  "A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in." A VR headset is a device used to look at the xterm you want to type in.
- e12e 12y ago
  Hehe. Well, text will be text... on a side note, those interested in this, might also like: https://github.com/brianpeiris/RiftSketch https://github.com/brianpeiris/RiftSketch
moron4hire 12y ago
Actually, I'm hoping to be able to experiment with code layout ideas that do not strictly adhere to a window. 2D elements tend to not map well to 3D spaces. One of the problems with the text-in-a-texture method that I've done here is that there is no relief of depth to the text, and relief is actually an important part of how we make sense out of objects in 3D space. It's fine on a 2D screen because the context is so restricted that it all stays consistent. But in 3D, it's kind of disconcerting to see completely flat textures. Like, why do we still use plain text in flat files for source code (for the most part, there are a few exceptions-that-prove-the-rule)? Why are there so many examples of graphical programming systems that have completely failed? Is it because there is something inherent to text that makes it superior for representing algorithms? Or is it because 1-dimensional text maps to our IO systems the best? I suspect there is a healthy dose of the latter, but we haven't ever had a significant "other" IO system to ever test that theory. In a lot of ways, Primrose isn't even my goal, more like a benchmark from which to start developing other ideas in text representation in VR UIs. I don't know what they will be, but at least I now have a starting point.

wlesieutre 12y ago

There are definitely people working on it, but I don't think the resolution is going to be there for text editing in the first (or even second) generation Rift. That said, take a look at these: http://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/2hbktl/best_virtual_desktop_display_application_for_the/ http://www.reddit.com/r/oculus/comments/2hbktl/best_virtual_...

moron4hire 12y ago
This issue is actually where the idea came from to put the text on the inside of a sphere. I wanted to make a VERY big text field, so that I could fit a good amount of text on the object at a font size large enough to read the text well. At that size, the edges of a rectangular window are so much further away from the viewer that there is significant distortion. The sphere makes for a much more comfortable viewing angle. No, I wouldn't want to write Primrose itself in Primrose, and Primrose isn't a very big project. But little experiments with the live-coding have been fun. I'm still working out the use cases in my head. I suspect there might be more use for manipulating and visualizing code in VR--at least in the early days until resolution gets better--than straight, bulk writing code.
- wlesieutre 12y ago
  Ah, interesting approach! I'd been stuck thinking about it in terms of replicating my standard multi-monitor setup in VR, but without the physical constraints of my desk and the manufacturing costs of large panels, there's really no need to set it up that way. Neat!

moron4hire 12y ago

Thank you. You have no idea how much that means to me. That's exactly why I'm working on VR projects right now, that "year from now" that you mentioned. I'm specifically going for WebVR because I believe the browser environment to be the most conducive to rapid prototyping

imaginenore 12y ago

What stops you from having multiple windows on your desktop? Oculus sucks at displaying text - it's low resolution (half of 1080p), it has crazy chromatic abberations, and you have to transform "spherize" your image to correct for the lens distortion, further reducting the resolution. Oculus is not light - it's pretty annoying to wear it for longer than 20-30 minutes.

Tojiro 12y ago
This is all true of the hardware as it exists right now. By the same token the original iPhone was low res, slow, only 2G, and bulky. The iPhone 4 (first with retina display) came out only 3 years later. That's a huge leap in such a short period of time. If VR catches on at all you can expect it to see the same type of acceleration.
- moron4hire 12y ago
  Yeah, that was kind of a motivation for me. I was sick of standing around, talking about what was or was not good for VR, with people who didn't even own a Rift, let alone program anything for it.
ibrahima 12y ago
I think the version based on the Note 4 is 2560x1440 so that's already quite a big leap up. Give it two years and we might have usable text editing maybe?
keerthiko 12y ago
Nothing stops me from having multiple windows on my 13" desktop. But it's clunky to bounce between, and makes me lose context too easily ctrl/alt+shift/+tab/~/1/2/3-ing through my browser or text editor or output window. With a multi-display, I can just turn my face over or glance and look at what I need and be back in context right away. I mean, I hope I don't have to explain why multiple monitors are nice (for most people). The same is conceivable with a VR solution. That makes it awesome. As for the problems you mention, all extremely solvable. I'm sure you were alive when people were editing text on lower resolution displays. Lens technology for dealing with a great extent CA exists, it just needs to be tuned for VR settings. I could lie down and use it. Lighter materials could be used in future versions. It could be made disassemblable for easier packing/storage. I have faith in our current generation of technologists to make these things and more happen before my development career sunsets :)