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Show HN: Pacifica, daily tools for anxiety based on Cognitive Behavioral Therapy

107 points by beermann 12y ago

addydev 12y ago
I am a behavioural scientist and really liked your app. Good work. Get in touch.
- japhyr 12y ago
  You might want to modify your HN profile to include your email or some other contact information.
  - addydev 12y ago
    Contact me on twitter @gopcruise
airza 12y ago
I would love to disclose my extremely disturbing and potentially violent intrusive thoughts to an application with a completely murky privacy policy...
- beermann 12y ago
  As a fairly young company, this is something we can clearly improve. The privacy policy we have was written by our lawyers and is fairly standard. Could you expand a bit on what seems murky? In addition, it obviously isn't enough to just say that "we take privacy very seriously," although we do. While we don't store Protected Health Information, we treat the data we do store as such and are taking the same steps to protect users' data that we would have to if we were.
  - th3o6a1d 12y ago
    As a med student and someone interested in health tech startups, I wanted to ask how you can say you don't store Protected Health Information. Does this mean that you store no identifiers at all? As part of HIPAA compliance training at my school, we are taught that even acknowledging that a person is a patient in a hospital over the phone is a violation of their privacy. I wonder if the same can be said about an app -- just the fact that a person has downloaded and used it is quite revealing. Just curious, because I've spent a lot of time reading about how to set up a HIPAA compliant service.
    - beermann 12y ago
      Unfortunately there isn't a lot of guidance here. We store your email address, which doesn't have to be an identifier as it can be anonymous, but we have to have a way to communicate with you. And we do ask for a name, but you can put whatever you want. As mentioned in another comment, PHI is defined as something that originates from a healthcare provider. Some of the restrictions for what we can say the app does actually come from the FDA. We don't say that we treat specific anxiety disorders (we call it "stress and anxiety"), and we don't ask our users for that type of information. But it really is a bit of a grey area. It's something that we're acutely aware of though and are trying to follow all the guidelines we can find.
      - fluidcruft 12y ago
        I agree completely with the medical student's concerns. In particular your app asks for information the way a counselor would. See for example this "Record your thoughts..." image from Google Play https://imgur.com/C5C3A5j https://imgur.com/C5C3A5j. I think there is a very big difference between for example a paper self-help workbook that someone keeps in their own possessions or mental exercises that produce no records and making voice recordings in a networked app that accesses a centralized database stored in the cloud. Emails are often trivially linked to identity. It doesn't matter that someone could have generated an "anonymous" email address (I've very skeptical that user-provided email addresses would pass muster as de-identified identifiers), if you can use that email to communicate with the person, it's definitely linked to their identity. If they link the email address to their identity elsewhere, the burden is still on you, not the user. You cannot demand that users protect the email address they use to sign up for your service the same way they would protect a social security or medical record number. That's ridiculous. You should look into obtaining HIPAA/HITECH compliance training perhaps as an unaffiliated learner on https://www.citiprogram.org/ https://www.citiprogram.org/ to understand why those of us that work in health care are expressing concern.
- UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
  Totally agree. Looks like you have to login and your private medical data is stored "in the cloud." I have no idea why anyone would think this would be a good idea. Storing it locally would be the only remotely sane solution. I mean, I don't mind telling someone I have an anxiety disorder (and I do have one). But the content of some of those intrusive thoughts is something I don't want anyone to know. Especially not some startup who may sell their company to, say, Facebook one day. Some of my intrusive thoughts are things that I did wrong (10 years ago...). So logging them would mean a third party would have an entire database of almost every mistake I made in my life, out of context. The potential for that to go wrong is... extreme. I'd rather have nudes be leaked. And the stupid embedded video in a jQuery modal. Stop it, you're making your videos unusable. Let me pause. Oh wait, I can't. I need to pause the video because it runs at lighting speed, so fast it is impossible to gain any information at all from it unless you pause it.
  - UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
    Ok, while I'm crapping all over your app (sorry...you were looking for feedback, right?) The website rendered so badly on my phone I went to go check out how it looked on the desktop. Well, the video pause issue is fixed... (I still think putting a video in a jQuery modal is incredibly annoying...just embed the video) You need to fire your "usability consultant." Your color scheme is absolutely horrible for anyone who is older or with less than perfect vision. It is very difficult to read for me. Any time your as yourself "should I display my -main content-* in white text" the answer should be no. Doublely so if you your background is light pastel green. Light grey on white is another combo that is extremely hard to read. So is white on very light picture of a beach. Animated backgrounds(?) (The background is not animated in my mobile browser) are not only are incredibly distracting, but also actually, ironically, cause anxiety for me. I'm sure I'm not the only one. I know different people have different preferences, but at LEAST give your color scheme some halfway sane contrast. And fix the rendering errors on mobile. Both issues, besides affecting usability, make you look amateurish. In my opinion. *not saying you should never use white text, ever. Just not in paragraph form.
    - gqvijay 12y ago
falcolas 12y ago
Being married to someone with an anxiety disorder, the best second-hand advice I can offer is: see a professional. If they recommend CBT, great, perhaps this tool can help. If they prescribe medication, pursue that as well. The medication they can prescribe really does help: it stops your heart from racing, it helps you stop the cyclic negative thinking... it just plain helps.
- beermann 12y ago
  Thanks for the comment. We actually agree entirely. One of the most effective ways to combat anxiety is through a combination of psychiatric drugs administered alongside CBT. Unfortunately, not everyone has the means to pursue professional help, for a variety of reasons. Of the 40 million people in the U.S. with anxiety disorders, only 1/3 of them are actually seeking help. We're hoping that Pacifica can help bridge that gap, ideally helping people find the care that they really need.
  - falcolas 12y ago
    I understand the challenges, they are similar to those faced by the adult ADHD community. Less than 1/5 of adults with ADHD are being treated. Our society puts so many negative connotations on the use of drugs to address mental deficiencies that even after learning how much they could help, we hesitate for fear of the peer pressure and social stigma of "popping pills" in favor of "shut up and man up". > We're hoping that Pacifica can help bridge that gap, ideally helping people find the care that they really need. Great! Might I recommend using your app to provide advice on how to approach discussing this issue with their GP, or even giving links to professionals in their area? Or even provide a "doctor's view" which can be passed to your GP to assist in their diagnosis? I make these suggestions because the emphasis on the word "privately" across your website concerns me. It seems to re-enforce the negative mindset of "this is your problem, don't bother anybody else" that I saw so profoundly affect my wife.
    - Deebot 12y ago
      The scary thing is that, in the context of this app, "privately" means "in the privacy of the cloud, which we have access to".
foolinaround 12y ago
1) What do you do with the data that you collect? -- Can it be turned over to other organizations? -- can it be used for identification. 2) How long do you retain data - -- How long is it needed for the proper functionality of the app -- How much longer do you store it for your internal research and data mining purposes. 3) Can the data be destroyed on demand, when an account is closed? 4)Can much of the data be stored on the device itself? Will this be on the roadmap? ( i have more questions, but this is a start :) )
- beermann 12y ago
  Thanks for the questions. Hopefully I can answer the satisfactorily: 1) We don't do anything with it other than use it to provide the best user experience we can. We won't turn it over to other organizations. Technically, the thought records could be used to identify an individual based on your voice, but someone would need to gain access to them. They are stored and transmitted encrypted. 2) Currently we retain all data. This may change in the future. For the progress to work correctly you'd want to retain a month's worth of data. The idea is that thought records help you analyze your thinking over time. This may take months, or longer. I kind of like the idea of allowing the user to set their own retention policy though. It would take a little work to implement, but I think it's reasonable. 3) Yes, if you close your account we will destroy everything (except for what we need to retain for purchasing records, but that is anonymized when we delete an account). You can't currently request that through the app though, you have to email us at info@thinkpacifica.com. 4) We actually have implemented a lot of offline functionality. We just couldn't get it to where we wanted to before launching. As a bootstrapped company, we need to try to ensure our longevity in order to provide this. But yes, it's definitely on the roadmap. Happy to answer anything else!
  - foolinaround 12y ago
    Thank you for patiently answering the questions, as I believe that this app can be valuable for many of us, as soon as details get clearer. I would request that you build a roadmap on your webpage, stating the various plans you have and appropriate current prioritization. If possible, allow registered users to add comments/votes. My comments on your answers above: 1) Am I correct in assuming that this data as such is not valuable without voice identification? Are there ways to anonymize this - just asking. The website talks vaguely about turning over to authorities, but more details in the privacy policy would assuage some of our fears. 2) You might want the user to download that data, and then get it off your system. Saves your space, liability etc without possibly impacting the app. If the user wants highly accurate data, he leaves it there. Otherwise he deletes it. The onus should be on the user. 3) I don't think this is mentioned on your site? 4) Awesome!
japhyr 12y ago
Does an app like this need to be HIPAA-compliant? I would guess that many people would consider building an app like this without thinking too much about HIPAA. "We're not doctors, we're just building an app that will help people manage their anxiety." But the app clearly asks questions of its users that are focused on mental health. If a situation arises in which a user has a bad experience related to how their information was shared, it seems quite reasonable to consider whether their right to medical privacy was violated. This seems particularly important with the unfortunate stigma associated with mental health issues. I don't ask this just to nitpick. I'm looking at building some projects related to education, and in education there's a comparable act called FERPA - Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act. It seems convenient to ignore these kind of regulations when building projects that are meant to be really helpful to everyone, but once a project like this takes off compliance with privacy acts seems critical. I'm quite curious to hear from the developers what their take on HIPAA has been.
- beermann 12y ago
  This is a great question. Technically, we don't store Protected Health Information ("Personal health information (PHI), also referred to as protected health information, generally refers to demographic information, medical history, test and laboratory results, insurance information and other data that is collected by a health care professional to identify an individual and determine appropriate care."). Everything is self-reported in Pacifica. That said, we treat our data as if it were PHI. We have a Business Associates Agreement signed with AWS, and take all of the precautions they require for an app that would claim it is HIPAA compliant. Technically, we could claim that we are HIPAA compliant, as we don't store PHI. But we didn't want to say that just for the sake of saying that. The bigger question, in my mind, is about whether or not a situation would arise as you mention. The FDA recently provided a little more clarity on some of this (http://mobihealthnews.com/39775/fda-clarifies-the-line-between-wellness-and-regulated-medical-devices/ http://mobihealthnews.com/39775/fda-clarifies-the-line-betwe...). Specifically, Pacifica seems to fall outside regulation as it "Claims to promote relaxation or manage stress when there is no reference to anxiety disorders or other reference to a disease or condition." We try to be pretty careful about the language that we use. We don't mention things like Generalized Anxiety Disorder, Panic Disorder, OCD, etc. The truth is that it still seems like a grey area. That same article mentions that we should not claim that we treat anxiety if we want to stay unregulated. I think that we're on the fence here. In the future, we will go after FDA clearance in any case. We just need the means to do so.
DanBC 12y ago
I'm always pleased to see new tools. Did you check the NICE guidance for Computer based CBT? http://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/TA97 http://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/TA97 They recommend some software; they do not recommend others. It would be interesting to see if your app avoids the mistakes made in the unrecommended softwares. (NICE is one of the English "DEATH PANELS" - commissioners of health services need to pay attention to what NICE says.)
Deebot 12y ago
Storing mental health data in the cloud with a random "startup" type company sounds like it would cause more anxiety than the app could possibly solve. If it doesn't, it should. What an awful idea. I can't help but wonder what their goal is with the data they're collecting via this app.
graycat 12y ago
Looking at the OP, at least in part they are addressing anxiety disease. Their suggestions sound good. If the suggestions work, terrific. But: As someone who had a close family member die from anxiety disease, I have to say that during the long course of the disease we thought of all those suggestions, especially cognitive ones, and many more, and they were all like a BB gun against a Russian tank. The real problems were much deeper. And the cognitive approaches, that didn't work, were being tried by a genuinely brilliant patient -- Valedictorian, PBK, Summa Cum Laude, world famous research university Ph.D. Cognitive? No shortage of cognitive ability: The patient saw and understood the cognitive ideas, maybe more deeply, and certainly faster than the professional could present them. At one point, the professional had the patient write a paper describing the cognitive approaches then exclaimed that the paper was "brilliant". Yes, it was -- very clear, etc. And the cognitive approaches? Total flop. So, after considering such suggestions, good ideas, and face validity, I get led to consider also the old, two criteria -- safety and efficacy. Again, if the suggestions work, terrific. But I would suggest for such patients and their families, ASAP, and maybe not in this order, (1), if only to be a better, loving family member, learn as much of the Clinical Psychology 101 level material you can and (2) get the best professional help you can. And for (2), if at first the treatment doesn't look quite promising and/or fairly soon there is no significant progress, which in my small sample size seems quite likely, then get some better professional help. Be careful with anxiety disease: Else members of the close family can throw away significant parts of their lives, and the patient, all of theirs. In K-12 or even in a college STEM BS you may not have been taught good information about anxiety disease -- so, at first symptoms, and you need to know about such symptoms, get caught up.
beermann 12y ago
Thanks for your comments everyone. I'm trying to keep up with them all. A little more information: Pacifica is a hybrid application, built on the Ionic Framework (http://ionicframework.com/ http://ionicframework.com/). We've been pretty happy with Ionic, it's the main reason we were able to release on Android and iOS simultaneously. Thanks to Max and the Drifty team for creating a great platform. There are a lot of comments and questions about privacy and compliance. I'll try to summarize some of my answers: We don't technically store what's called Protected (or Private) Health Information. This is because Pacifica is a self-help tool and PHI is defined as originating from a healthcare professional. That being said, we are taking steps to treat our data as if it were PHI. We have a signed Business Associated Agreement with Amazon and are trying to operate as if we were HIPAA compliant (we technically are, in the same way that any company that doesn't store PHI is HIPAA compliant). Regarding privacy and security: yes, we're in the cloud. Specifically, on AWS. While this may be contentious, we believe that there's no reason this is less secure than if you were hosted in a local colocation facility. Amazon has pretty rigorous requirements for who has access to machines and who can access data on those machines. Many of their services are HIPAA compliant, and they certainly take this extremely seriously. In addition, we do try to make sure everyone's data is as safe as possible. The mobile applications communicate with our servers over HTTPS. We're using Elastic Load Balancers but don't terminate SSL at the ELB, it passes through to our own server so Amazon doesn't have the private keys. Recordings are stored encrypted in S3, and our RDS instances are also encrypted. There's more that we can do (as there always is), but we wanted to provide a little information about what we are currently trying to do to protect things. We welcome any additional suggestions.
fluidcruft 12y ago
Maybe it's just me, but it seems like the person with the PhD is buried in the "About us" page and that made me instant less interested particularly given the heavy emphasis of CBT. So, to me the entire effort is now sorted into the marketing bullshit/MBA-lipstick/snake-oil category. I mean Dr Moberg seems bolted on as an afterthought when you realized "oh, shit people might actually expect to see relevant credentials". Apparently you don't even know what she does there besides "contributes to Pacifica’s development on a regular basis". The site is already dripping with Valley happy-derp marketing speak and that's the best spin you can do about someone that should be at the center of the project? If that's not the case, you really need to fix your messaging.
- beermann 12y ago
  Christine is our advisor, and an awesome one at that. We're certainly not trying to hide her. We created Pacifica because my co-founder, Chris, has struggled with anxiety his whole life. He came to me saying that we should try to do an app based on CBT. Personally, I've had insomnia for quite a while and I was really interested in how CBT might apply to both of our situations. We did a ton of research and Christine was one of the people we reached out to to make sure that we were adhering to the best practices in the profession. I'm sorry you see this as snake oil. We've really tried to build an app that fits into the daily lives of people with anxiety. Furthermore, it's designed from the perspective of someone with anxiety to provide tools that you can actually use throughout your day. Is there a particular aspect of the app that you don't like or is it simply the site itself?
mcfist 12y ago
That's what I'm getting as an opening screen: "The application Pacifica (process com.pacificalabs.pacifica) has stopped unexpectedly. Please try again."
- beermann 12y ago
  Would you be able to send an email to info (at) thinkpacifica (dot) com from the email address you created the account with. If you could let us know which device you're on, we'll check it out as soon as we can. Thanks and sorry for the trouble.

107 points by beermann 12y ago

addydev 12y ago

I am a behavioural scientist and really liked your app. Good work. Get in touch.

japhyr 12y ago
You might want to modify your HN profile to include your email or some other contact information.
- addydev 12y ago
  Contact me on twitter @gopcruise

airza 12y ago

I would love to disclose my extremely disturbing and potentially violent intrusive thoughts to an application with a completely murky privacy policy...

beermann 12y ago
As a fairly young company, this is something we can clearly improve. The privacy policy we have was written by our lawyers and is fairly standard. Could you expand a bit on what seems murky? In addition, it obviously isn't enough to just say that "we take privacy very seriously," although we do. While we don't store Protected Health Information, we treat the data we do store as such and are taking the same steps to protect users' data that we would have to if we were.
- th3o6a1d 12y ago
  As a med student and someone interested in health tech startups, I wanted to ask how you can say you don't store Protected Health Information. Does this mean that you store no identifiers at all? As part of HIPAA compliance training at my school, we are taught that even acknowledging that a person is a patient in a hospital over the phone is a violation of their privacy. I wonder if the same can be said about an app -- just the fact that a person has downloaded and used it is quite revealing. Just curious, because I've spent a lot of time reading about how to set up a HIPAA compliant service.
  - beermann 12y ago
    Unfortunately there isn't a lot of guidance here. We store your email address, which doesn't have to be an identifier as it can be anonymous, but we have to have a way to communicate with you. And we do ask for a name, but you can put whatever you want. As mentioned in another comment, PHI is defined as something that originates from a healthcare provider. Some of the restrictions for what we can say the app does actually come from the FDA. We don't say that we treat specific anxiety disorders (we call it "stress and anxiety"), and we don't ask our users for that type of information. But it really is a bit of a grey area. It's something that we're acutely aware of though and are trying to follow all the guidelines we can find.
    - fluidcruft 12y ago
      I agree completely with the medical student's concerns. In particular your app asks for information the way a counselor would. See for example this "Record your thoughts..." image from Google Play https://imgur.com/C5C3A5j https://imgur.com/C5C3A5j. I think there is a very big difference between for example a paper self-help workbook that someone keeps in their own possessions or mental exercises that produce no records and making voice recordings in a networked app that accesses a centralized database stored in the cloud. Emails are often trivially linked to identity. It doesn't matter that someone could have generated an "anonymous" email address (I've very skeptical that user-provided email addresses would pass muster as de-identified identifiers), if you can use that email to communicate with the person, it's definitely linked to their identity. If they link the email address to their identity elsewhere, the burden is still on you, not the user. You cannot demand that users protect the email address they use to sign up for your service the same way they would protect a social security or medical record number. That's ridiculous. You should look into obtaining HIPAA/HITECH compliance training perhaps as an unaffiliated learner on https://www.citiprogram.org/ https://www.citiprogram.org/ to understand why those of us that work in health care are expressing concern.
UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
Totally agree. Looks like you have to login and your private medical data is stored "in the cloud." I have no idea why anyone would think this would be a good idea. Storing it locally would be the only remotely sane solution. I mean, I don't mind telling someone I have an anxiety disorder (and I do have one). But the content of some of those intrusive thoughts is something I don't want anyone to know. Especially not some startup who may sell their company to, say, Facebook one day. Some of my intrusive thoughts are things that I did wrong (10 years ago...). So logging them would mean a third party would have an entire database of almost every mistake I made in my life, out of context. The potential for that to go wrong is... extreme. I'd rather have nudes be leaked. And the stupid embedded video in a jQuery modal. Stop it, you're making your videos unusable. Let me pause. Oh wait, I can't. I need to pause the video because it runs at lighting speed, so fast it is impossible to gain any information at all from it unless you pause it.
- UrMomReadsHN 12y ago
  Ok, while I'm crapping all over your app (sorry...you were looking for feedback, right?) The website rendered so badly on my phone I went to go check out how it looked on the desktop. Well, the video pause issue is fixed... (I still think putting a video in a jQuery modal is incredibly annoying...just embed the video) You need to fire your "usability consultant." Your color scheme is absolutely horrible for anyone who is older or with less than perfect vision. It is very difficult to read for me. Any time your as yourself "should I display my -main content-* in white text" the answer should be no. Doublely so if you your background is light pastel green. Light grey on white is another combo that is extremely hard to read. So is white on very light picture of a beach. Animated backgrounds(?) (The background is not animated in my mobile browser) are not only are incredibly distracting, but also actually, ironically, cause anxiety for me. I'm sure I'm not the only one. I know different people have different preferences, but at LEAST give your color scheme some halfway sane contrast. And fix the rendering errors on mobile. Both issues, besides affecting usability, make you look amateurish. In my opinion. *not saying you should never use white text, ever. Just not in paragraph form.
  - gqvijay 12y ago

falcolas 12y ago

Being married to someone with an anxiety disorder, the best second-hand advice I can offer is: see a professional. If they recommend CBT, great, perhaps this tool can help. If they prescribe medication, pursue that as well. The medication they can prescribe really does help: it stops your heart from racing, it helps you stop the cyclic negative thinking... it just plain helps.

beermann 12y ago
Thanks for the comment. We actually agree entirely. One of the most effective ways to combat anxiety is through a combination of psychiatric drugs administered alongside CBT. Unfortunately, not everyone has the means to pursue professional help, for a variety of reasons. Of the 40 million people in the U.S. with anxiety disorders, only 1/3 of them are actually seeking help. We're hoping that Pacifica can help bridge that gap, ideally helping people find the care that they really need.
- falcolas 12y ago
  I understand the challenges, they are similar to those faced by the adult ADHD community. Less than 1/5 of adults with ADHD are being treated. Our society puts so many negative connotations on the use of drugs to address mental deficiencies that even after learning how much they could help, we hesitate for fear of the peer pressure and social stigma of "popping pills" in favor of "shut up and man up". > We're hoping that Pacifica can help bridge that gap, ideally helping people find the care that they really need. Great! Might I recommend using your app to provide advice on how to approach discussing this issue with their GP, or even giving links to professionals in their area? Or even provide a "doctor's view" which can be passed to your GP to assist in their diagnosis? I make these suggestions because the emphasis on the word "privately" across your website concerns me. It seems to re-enforce the negative mindset of "this is your problem, don't bother anybody else" that I saw so profoundly affect my wife.
  - Deebot 12y ago
    The scary thing is that, in the context of this app, "privately" means "in the privacy of the cloud, which we have access to".

foolinaround 12y ago

1) What do you do with the data that you collect? -- Can it be turned over to other organizations? -- can it be used for identification. 2) How long do you retain data - -- How long is it needed for the proper functionality of the app -- How much longer do you store it for your internal research and data mining purposes. 3) Can the data be destroyed on demand, when an account is closed? 4)Can much of the data be stored on the device itself? Will this be on the roadmap? ( i have more questions, but this is a start :) )

beermann 12y ago
Thanks for the questions. Hopefully I can answer the satisfactorily: 1) We don't do anything with it other than use it to provide the best user experience we can. We won't turn it over to other organizations. Technically, the thought records could be used to identify an individual based on your voice, but someone would need to gain access to them. They are stored and transmitted encrypted. 2) Currently we retain all data. This may change in the future. For the progress to work correctly you'd want to retain a month's worth of data. The idea is that thought records help you analyze your thinking over time. This may take months, or longer. I kind of like the idea of allowing the user to set their own retention policy though. It would take a little work to implement, but I think it's reasonable. 3) Yes, if you close your account we will destroy everything (except for what we need to retain for purchasing records, but that is anonymized when we delete an account). You can't currently request that through the app though, you have to email us at info@thinkpacifica.com. 4) We actually have implemented a lot of offline functionality. We just couldn't get it to where we wanted to before launching. As a bootstrapped company, we need to try to ensure our longevity in order to provide this. But yes, it's definitely on the roadmap. Happy to answer anything else!
- foolinaround 12y ago
  Thank you for patiently answering the questions, as I believe that this app can be valuable for many of us, as soon as details get clearer. I would request that you build a roadmap on your webpage, stating the various plans you have and appropriate current prioritization. If possible, allow registered users to add comments/votes. My comments on your answers above: 1) Am I correct in assuming that this data as such is not valuable without voice identification? Are there ways to anonymize this - just asking. The website talks vaguely about turning over to authorities, but more details in the privacy policy would assuage some of our fears. 2) You might want the user to download that data, and then get it off your system. Saves your space, liability etc without possibly impacting the app. If the user wants highly accurate data, he leaves it there. Otherwise he deletes it. The onus should be on the user. 3) I don't think this is mentioned on your site? 4) Awesome!

japhyr 12y ago

Does an app like this need to be HIPAA-compliant? I would guess that many people would consider building an app like this without thinking too much about HIPAA. "We're not doctors, we're just building an app that will help people manage their anxiety." But the app clearly asks questions of its users that are focused on mental health. If a situation arises in which a user has a bad experience related to how their information was shared, it seems quite reasonable to consider whether their right to medical privacy was violated. This seems particularly important with the unfortunate stigma associated with mental health issues. I don't ask this just to nitpick. I'm looking at building some projects related to education, and in education there's a comparable act called FERPA - Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act. It seems convenient to ignore these kind of regulations when building projects that are meant to be really helpful to everyone, but once a project like this takes off compliance with privacy acts seems critical. I'm quite curious to hear from the developers what their take on HIPAA has been.

beermann 12y ago
This is a great question. Technically, we don't store Protected Health Information ("Personal health information (PHI), also referred to as protected health information, generally refers to demographic information, medical history, test and laboratory results, insurance information and other data that is collected by a health care professional to identify an individual and determine appropriate care."). Everything is self-reported in Pacifica. That said, we treat our data as if it were PHI. We have a Business Associates Agreement signed with AWS, and take all of the precautions they require for an app that would claim it is HIPAA compliant. Technically, we could claim that we are HIPAA compliant, as we don't store PHI. But we didn't want to say that just for the sake of saying that. The bigger question, in my mind, is about whether or not a situation would arise as you mention. The FDA recently provided a little more clarity on some of this (http://mobihealthnews.com/39775/fda-clarifies-the-line-between-wellness-and-regulated-medical-devices/ http://mobihealthnews.com/39775/fda-clarifies-the-line-betwe...). Specifically, Pacifica seems to fall outside regulation as it "Claims to promote relaxation or manage stress when there is no reference to anxiety disorders or other reference to a disease or condition." We try to be pretty careful about the language that we use. We don't mention things like Generalized Anxiety Disorder, Panic Disorder, OCD, etc. The truth is that it still seems like a grey area. That same article mentions that we should not claim that we treat anxiety if we want to stay unregulated. I think that we're on the fence here. In the future, we will go after FDA clearance in any case. We just need the means to do so.

DanBC 12y ago

I'm always pleased to see new tools. Did you check the NICE guidance for Computer based CBT? http://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/TA97 http://www.nice.org.uk/guidance/TA97 They recommend some software; they do not recommend others. It would be interesting to see if your app avoids the mistakes made in the unrecommended softwares. (NICE is one of the English "DEATH PANELS" - commissioners of health services need to pay attention to what NICE says.)

Deebot 12y ago

Storing mental health data in the cloud with a random "startup" type company sounds like it would cause more anxiety than the app could possibly solve. If it doesn't, it should. What an awful idea. I can't help but wonder what their goal is with the data they're collecting via this app.

graycat 12y ago

Looking at the OP, at least in part they are addressing anxiety disease. Their suggestions sound good. If the suggestions work, terrific. But: As someone who had a close family member die from anxiety disease, I have to say that during the long course of the disease we thought of all those suggestions, especially cognitive ones, and many more, and they were all like a BB gun against a Russian tank. The real problems were much deeper. And the cognitive approaches, that didn't work, were being tried by a genuinely brilliant patient -- Valedictorian, PBK, Summa Cum Laude, world famous research university Ph.D. Cognitive? No shortage of cognitive ability: The patient saw and understood the cognitive ideas, maybe more deeply, and certainly faster than the professional could present them. At one point, the professional had the patient write a paper describing the cognitive approaches then exclaimed that the paper was "brilliant". Yes, it was -- very clear, etc. And the cognitive approaches? Total flop. So, after considering such suggestions, good ideas, and face validity, I get led to consider also the old, two criteria -- safety and efficacy. Again, if the suggestions work, terrific. But I would suggest for such patients and their families, ASAP, and maybe not in this order, (1), if only to be a better, loving family member, learn as much of the Clinical Psychology 101 level material you can and (2) get the best professional help you can. And for (2), if at first the treatment doesn't look quite promising and/or fairly soon there is no significant progress, which in my small sample size seems quite likely, then get some better professional help. Be careful with anxiety disease: Else members of the close family can throw away significant parts of their lives, and the patient, all of theirs. In K-12 or even in a college STEM BS you may not have been taught good information about anxiety disease -- so, at first symptoms, and you need to know about such symptoms, get caught up.

beermann 12y ago

Thanks for your comments everyone. I'm trying to keep up with them all. A little more information: Pacifica is a hybrid application, built on the Ionic Framework (http://ionicframework.com/ http://ionicframework.com/). We've been pretty happy with Ionic, it's the main reason we were able to release on Android and iOS simultaneously. Thanks to Max and the Drifty team for creating a great platform. There are a lot of comments and questions about privacy and compliance. I'll try to summarize some of my answers: We don't technically store what's called Protected (or Private) Health Information. This is because Pacifica is a self-help tool and PHI is defined as originating from a healthcare professional. That being said, we are taking steps to treat our data as if it were PHI. We have a signed Business Associated Agreement with Amazon and are trying to operate as if we were HIPAA compliant (we technically are, in the same way that any company that doesn't store PHI is HIPAA compliant). Regarding privacy and security: yes, we're in the cloud. Specifically, on AWS. While this may be contentious, we believe that there's no reason this is less secure than if you were hosted in a local colocation facility. Amazon has pretty rigorous requirements for who has access to machines and who can access data on those machines. Many of their services are HIPAA compliant, and they certainly take this extremely seriously. In addition, we do try to make sure everyone's data is as safe as possible. The mobile applications communicate with our servers over HTTPS. We're using Elastic Load Balancers but don't terminate SSL at the ELB, it passes through to our own server so Amazon doesn't have the private keys. Recordings are stored encrypted in S3, and our RDS instances are also encrypted. There's more that we can do (as there always is), but we wanted to provide a little information about what we are currently trying to do to protect things. We welcome any additional suggestions.

fluidcruft 12y ago

Maybe it's just me, but it seems like the person with the PhD is buried in the "About us" page and that made me instant less interested particularly given the heavy emphasis of CBT. So, to me the entire effort is now sorted into the marketing bullshit/MBA-lipstick/snake-oil category. I mean Dr Moberg seems bolted on as an afterthought when you realized "oh, shit people might actually expect to see relevant credentials". Apparently you don't even know what she does there besides "contributes to Pacifica’s development on a regular basis". The site is already dripping with Valley happy-derp marketing speak and that's the best spin you can do about someone that should be at the center of the project? If that's not the case, you really need to fix your messaging.

beermann 12y ago
Christine is our advisor, and an awesome one at that. We're certainly not trying to hide her. We created Pacifica because my co-founder, Chris, has struggled with anxiety his whole life. He came to me saying that we should try to do an app based on CBT. Personally, I've had insomnia for quite a while and I was really interested in how CBT might apply to both of our situations. We did a ton of research and Christine was one of the people we reached out to to make sure that we were adhering to the best practices in the profession. I'm sorry you see this as snake oil. We've really tried to build an app that fits into the daily lives of people with anxiety. Furthermore, it's designed from the perspective of someone with anxiety to provide tools that you can actually use throughout your day. Is there a particular aspect of the app that you don't like or is it simply the site itself?

mcfist 12y ago

That's what I'm getting as an opening screen: "The application Pacifica (process com.pacificalabs.pacifica) has stopped unexpectedly. Please try again."

beermann 12y ago
Would you be able to send an email to info (at) thinkpacifica (dot) com from the email address you created the account with. If you could let us know which device you're on, we'll check it out as soon as we can. Thanks and sorry for the trouble.