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I see the complete opposite. Virtually everyone in his position is pressured and expected to project a likeable image and recite a wholesome rolemodel's script.

I see the complete opposite. Virtually everyone in his position is pressured and expected to project a likeable image and recite a wholesome rolemodel's script. I thank God, my friends and family, and the perseverance of my teammates for what we've accomplished. I am blessed. Don't belive it? Too bad, the brand deal depends on it so stick to the script. Jordan was and is different. I might not agree with him, but he stands for what he believes, he speaks up about how he feels, and I admire that far more than I admire someone who has no opinions or suppresses them for the sake of being liked. It's sad that we live in a society where those who step out of line to say what they mean are told they're assholes who deserve their failures.

ekianjo 12y ago
> It's sad that we live in a society where those who step out of line to say what they mean are told they're assholes who deserve their failures. It's sad that you can't step out of line on HN and call people assholes without having someone telling you you should respect those a-holes JUST because they are successful.
- twinkletank 12y ago
  I don't think you should respect anyone because of their success. I never said anything about Jordan's success. I do however think you should respect people for being truthful and open, which I did credit to him.
  - ekianjo 12y ago
    > I do however think you should respect people for being truthful and open, which I did credit to him. No, if that person's being an ass, there's no reason to respect them, period. Even if they are truthfully, openly being an ass. It's only because he is in a position of influence that he can afford being an ass in public and still be respected by some people.
aswanson 12y ago
So running up and down a court and putting a ball in a hole better than anyone else gives you license to verbally shit on anyone you come across because they can't? What exactly does he stand for besides making as much as possible off overpriced sneakers/merch built off sweatshop labor, shooting a ball in a hole (extraordinarily well), and being a dick in general to most people he comes across?
- adventured 12y ago
  Can you show me where Jordan has spent his life shitting on everyone else that can't do what he did? You're going beyond exaggeration.
  - at-fates-hands 12y ago
    Actually he's not. You start with his Hall of Fame speech which was pretty shocking for everybody in attendance. Not before or since has a player admonished so many people he felt were beneath him. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLzBMGXfK4c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLzBMGXfK4c Here's some excerpt's from an ESPN article: "The greatest athlete of our time made sure to point out the high school coach who didn't put him on the varsity his sophomore year. (He was never cut, per se. That's an urban myth akin to Catfish Hunter's nickname origin.) He pointed out the guy who made the team "over" him, who was in the audience; his college roommate, Buzz Peterson; the NBA vets who froze him out in his first All-Star Game, two of whom were there, George Gervin (who presented David Robinson) and Isiah Thomas (who presented John Stockton); Jazz guard Bryon Russell, who was guarding him on his final shot in a Bulls uniform; and, of course, former Bulls general manager Jerry Krause, with whom he had real conflict during his career. Krause, forever the outsider looking in, made the mistake of claiming he was skipping Jordan's induction because former coach Tex Winter, the originator of the triangle offense, wasn't inducted." "Onstage, Jordan adroitly, and unnecessarily, noted Krause wasn't invited before going on a diatribe about how organizations don't win championships, great players like him do" "Jordan, not known for being cheap, even commented on the high prices the Hall of Fame charged for this evening because of his induction, noting that he had to pay for his tickets. It was a small sniping comment for a man who could be the first athlete to be worth $1 billion, but he hates people making money off him, unless he's getting a cut."
antimagic 12y ago
It's great that Jordan says what he really thinks. But we also like it when players are humble. We want both, there's no contradiction. So yes, that means we want players to say humble things, and mean it.

ekianjo 12y ago

> It's sad that we live in a society where those who step out of line to say what they mean are told they're assholes who deserve their failures. It's sad that you can't step out of line on HN and call people assholes without having someone telling you you should respect those a-holes JUST because they are successful.

twinkletank 12y ago
I don't think you should respect anyone because of their success. I never said anything about Jordan's success. I do however think you should respect people for being truthful and open, which I did credit to him.
- ekianjo 12y ago
  > I do however think you should respect people for being truthful and open, which I did credit to him. No, if that person's being an ass, there's no reason to respect them, period. Even if they are truthfully, openly being an ass. It's only because he is in a position of influence that he can afford being an ass in public and still be respected by some people.

aswanson 12y ago

So running up and down a court and putting a ball in a hole better than anyone else gives you license to verbally shit on anyone you come across because they can't? What exactly does he stand for besides making as much as possible off overpriced sneakers/merch built off sweatshop labor, shooting a ball in a hole (extraordinarily well), and being a dick in general to most people he comes across?

adventured 12y ago
Can you show me where Jordan has spent his life shitting on everyone else that can't do what he did? You're going beyond exaggeration.
- at-fates-hands 12y ago
  Actually he's not. You start with his Hall of Fame speech which was pretty shocking for everybody in attendance. Not before or since has a player admonished so many people he felt were beneath him. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLzBMGXfK4c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLzBMGXfK4c Here's some excerpt's from an ESPN article: "The greatest athlete of our time made sure to point out the high school coach who didn't put him on the varsity his sophomore year. (He was never cut, per se. That's an urban myth akin to Catfish Hunter's nickname origin.) He pointed out the guy who made the team "over" him, who was in the audience; his college roommate, Buzz Peterson; the NBA vets who froze him out in his first All-Star Game, two of whom were there, George Gervin (who presented David Robinson) and Isiah Thomas (who presented John Stockton); Jazz guard Bryon Russell, who was guarding him on his final shot in a Bulls uniform; and, of course, former Bulls general manager Jerry Krause, with whom he had real conflict during his career. Krause, forever the outsider looking in, made the mistake of claiming he was skipping Jordan's induction because former coach Tex Winter, the originator of the triangle offense, wasn't inducted." "Onstage, Jordan adroitly, and unnecessarily, noted Krause wasn't invited before going on a diatribe about how organizations don't win championships, great players like him do" "Jordan, not known for being cheap, even commented on the high prices the Hall of Fame charged for this evening because of his induction, noting that he had to pay for his tickets. It was a small sniping comment for a man who could be the first athlete to be worth $1 billion, but he hates people making money off him, unless he's getting a cut."

antimagic 12y ago

It's great that Jordan says what he really thinks. But we also like it when players are humble. We want both, there's no contradiction. So yes, that means we want players to say humble things, and mean it.