11 ms·

Google Isn’t Fixing Some Old Android Bugs

87 points by anorborg 12y ago

jaxbot 12y ago
Reminds me of the Android File Transfer bug that disables MacBook keyboard/trackpad if the phone is locked. It was recently marked as "obsolete", despite all Android documentation (and even software on the phone) suggests the user use it, and the bug still exists on Lollipop: https://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=39548 https://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=39548 I don't really understand how this has slipped through the cracks; Google has a decent number of MacBooks in their offices last time I was there, so maybe copying files just isn't popular? Either way, it's a pain that the tool is closed source and the maintainer won't maintain it.
- lnanek2 12y ago
  I've found Android File Transfer rarely even works for me nowadays. I ended up paying for a third party app called SyncMate, but it works flawlessly and even restores the ability to mount the phone and have everything just work easily instead of the broken media transfer protocol Google is trying to force on everyone.
- habosa 12y ago
  Wow thank you for pointing this out. I couldn't figure out why once in a while AFT would completely screw my Macbook. You're my hero of the day.
Karunamon 12y ago
That covers roughly two-thirds of the billion-plus Android devices in use, according to Google Wow. How is this even remotely acceptable? I get that they want to focus on the latest and greatest, but leaving 2/3 of your users out in the cold, in 2015's security climate is absolutely insane! Nevermind the fact that upgrading is a non starter for most users.
- alwaysdoit 12y ago
  From what I can tell, it doesn't affect Chrome, which is compatible with 4.3 devices. It's just a bug in the default browser, which they stopped working on a long time ago.
  - sanxiyn 12y ago
    Isn't it a bug in the default browser and WebView, which affects every single application using WebView?
- Mithaldu 12y ago
  Maybe they are hoping they'll be able to force ISPs to release upgrades for phones, since that's what's stopping the upgrades, not unwillingness by the users.
  - Karunamon 12y ago
    I don't think that's a play that will work. Considering that with the basic apps, the buck stops with Google (they could push something out via the Play store), it's all on them for refusing to support.
    - minot 12y ago
      How do you push updates to webview through the play store?
      - Karunamon 12y ago
        I thought this was just about the browser, not the inbuilt web view functionality. My bad!
        minot 12y ago
        No worries, friend :)
    - 12y ago
anorborg 12y ago
I think the eventual solution will be a software subscription fee that ends up going to the carriers. They are motivated to get people to upgrade their phones right now, and unless they are legally obligated or financially compensated, I doubt they will change their practices to enable people keeping their phones.
- jpollock 12y ago
  There used to be hardware rental and line maintenance charges in fixed line phone networks. There still are in cable networks. It's just another source of revenue, and it doesn't encourage software updates.
- _lce0 12y ago
  On Argentina, carriers usually block software updates so your phone gets "old" and they can sell you a new one, with a more expensive plan because you know this new phone requires a bigger plan, the one you already have doesn't fit that's all they care about, you paying them.
ufmace 12y ago
As I remember it, most of these critical bugs are in the Android browser, which is considered a core part of the OS in those versions. The trouble with that is there's no way to update it without doing all the work of a whole OS update, including the usual mess of getting approval and merging changes from device manufacturers and local carriers. It seems more understandable that way that Google told them to just upgrade to a newer Android version instead.
- outside1234 12y ago
  Maybe we should give them a 90 day deadline to fix them.
  - cheald 12y ago
    Or what, you'll disclose them?
    - outside1234 12y ago
      It sounds like that is what Google thinks is the right thing to do. Note: I don't.
      - cheald 12y ago
        (Hint: They're already disclosed.)
        wyldfire 12y ago
        Agreed. But it's disappointing that Google doesn't feel the same responsibility that they think Microsoft has.
  - magicalist 12y ago
    I doubt the carriers would care. There have been a bunch of published exploits that haven't motivated them to push updates.
  - 12y ago
Zigurd 12y ago
Chrome is available for Android 4.0+ which amounts to 85%+ of Android devices in the installed base, according to https://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/index.html https://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/index.html It's a non-issue, as with other bugs Google recently closed as NTBF.
- aroberge 12y ago
  These stats are based on people visiting the Google Play store. They are almost meaningless. I have an Android phone that works perfectly well and is paid for; I don't have money to burn to buy a new phone. I got it after I bought a Windows 7 computer - which will likely be updated for many years to come. When purchsed, the phone cost almost as much as my computer did. However ... the phone is running version 2.3.3 and can not be upgraded (and has not been updated for a few years now). And most new apps do not support this Android version (and have not for a few years now) so I have given up on visiting the Google Play store. My wife has an identical phone and has not bothered either trying to get new apps for a few years now. It's a "non-issue" only because Google (which I generally support) has a shitty policy when it comes to supporting old versions of their products.
  - Zigurd 12y ago
    Statistics based on visits to the Google Play store are certainly not meaningless. If you have a Kindle device you don't have this problem. Or, if you have a phone in China that's AOSP-based but using a Chinese portal's ecosystem you are probably running their browser. That leaves you among the small percentage who are in the Google ecosystem, but running an old version of Android. perhaps it was Google fault for OK'ing Google logo devices with trailing-edge OS versions when you bought your phone. But they've fixed that now with Android One and the inexpensive Moto phone. And, on top of that, if you really want a newer version of Android without buying a new phone, there's a decent chance that CyanogenMod or other aftermarket releases support your device. Google has never stopped anyone from "bootlegging" the Google ecosystem into such configurations.
  - notatoad 12y ago
    The stats are reported by google play services running on your phone, not by actual visits to the play store. As long as your phone can access the play store, it gets counted.

87 points by anorborg 12y ago

Reminds me of the Android File Transfer bug that disables MacBook keyboard/trackpad if the phone is locked. It was recently marked as "obsolete", despite all Android documentation (and even software on the phone) suggests the user use it, and the bug still exists on Lollipop: https://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=39548 https://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=39548 I don't really understand how this has slipped through the cracks; Google has a decent number of MacBooks in their offices last time I was there, so maybe copying files just isn't popular? Either way, it's a pain that the tool is closed source and the maintainer won't maintain it.

lnanek2 12y ago
I've found Android File Transfer rarely even works for me nowadays. I ended up paying for a third party app called SyncMate, but it works flawlessly and even restores the ability to mount the phone and have everything just work easily instead of the broken media transfer protocol Google is trying to force on everyone.
habosa 12y ago
Wow thank you for pointing this out. I couldn't figure out why once in a while AFT would completely screw my Macbook. You're my hero of the day.

Karunamon 12y ago

That covers roughly two-thirds of the billion-plus Android devices in use, according to Google Wow. How is this even remotely acceptable? I get that they want to focus on the latest and greatest, but leaving 2/3 of your users out in the cold, in 2015's security climate is absolutely insane! Nevermind the fact that upgrading is a non starter for most users.

alwaysdoit 12y ago
From what I can tell, it doesn't affect Chrome, which is compatible with 4.3 devices. It's just a bug in the default browser, which they stopped working on a long time ago.
- sanxiyn 12y ago
  Isn't it a bug in the default browser and WebView, which affects every single application using WebView?
Mithaldu 12y ago
Maybe they are hoping they'll be able to force ISPs to release upgrades for phones, since that's what's stopping the upgrades, not unwillingness by the users.
- Karunamon 12y ago
  I don't think that's a play that will work. Considering that with the basic apps, the buck stops with Google (they could push something out via the Play store), it's all on them for refusing to support.
  - minot 12y ago
    How do you push updates to webview through the play store?
    - Karunamon 12y ago
      I thought this was just about the browser, not the inbuilt web view functionality. My bad!
      - minot 12y ago
        No worries, friend :)
  - 12y ago

anorborg 12y ago

I think the eventual solution will be a software subscription fee that ends up going to the carriers. They are motivated to get people to upgrade their phones right now, and unless they are legally obligated or financially compensated, I doubt they will change their practices to enable people keeping their phones.

jpollock 12y ago
There used to be hardware rental and line maintenance charges in fixed line phone networks. There still are in cable networks. It's just another source of revenue, and it doesn't encourage software updates.
_lce0 12y ago
On Argentina, carriers usually block software updates so your phone gets "old" and they can sell you a new one, with a more expensive plan because you know this new phone requires a bigger plan, the one you already have doesn't fit that's all they care about, you paying them.

ufmace 12y ago

As I remember it, most of these critical bugs are in the Android browser, which is considered a core part of the OS in those versions. The trouble with that is there's no way to update it without doing all the work of a whole OS update, including the usual mess of getting approval and merging changes from device manufacturers and local carriers. It seems more understandable that way that Google told them to just upgrade to a newer Android version instead.

outside1234 12y ago
Maybe we should give them a 90 day deadline to fix them.
- cheald 12y ago
  Or what, you'll disclose them?
  - outside1234 12y ago
    It sounds like that is what Google thinks is the right thing to do. Note: I don't.
    - cheald 12y ago
      (Hint: They're already disclosed.)
      - wyldfire 12y ago
        Agreed. But it's disappointing that Google doesn't feel the same responsibility that they think Microsoft has.
- magicalist 12y ago
  I doubt the carriers would care. There have been a bunch of published exploits that haven't motivated them to push updates.
- 12y ago

Zigurd 12y ago

Chrome is available for Android 4.0+ which amounts to 85%+ of Android devices in the installed base, according to https://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/index.html https://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/index.html It's a non-issue, as with other bugs Google recently closed as NTBF.

aroberge 12y ago
These stats are based on people visiting the Google Play store. They are almost meaningless. I have an Android phone that works perfectly well and is paid for; I don't have money to burn to buy a new phone. I got it after I bought a Windows 7 computer - which will likely be updated for many years to come. When purchsed, the phone cost almost as much as my computer did. However ... the phone is running version 2.3.3 and can not be upgraded (and has not been updated for a few years now). And most new apps do not support this Android version (and have not for a few years now) so I have given up on visiting the Google Play store. My wife has an identical phone and has not bothered either trying to get new apps for a few years now. It's a "non-issue" only because Google (which I generally support) has a shitty policy when it comes to supporting old versions of their products.
- Zigurd 12y ago
  Statistics based on visits to the Google Play store are certainly not meaningless. If you have a Kindle device you don't have this problem. Or, if you have a phone in China that's AOSP-based but using a Chinese portal's ecosystem you are probably running their browser. That leaves you among the small percentage who are in the Google ecosystem, but running an old version of Android. perhaps it was Google fault for OK'ing Google logo devices with trailing-edge OS versions when you bought your phone. But they've fixed that now with Android One and the inexpensive Moto phone. And, on top of that, if you really want a newer version of Android without buying a new phone, there's a decent chance that CyanogenMod or other aftermarket releases support your device. Google has never stopped anyone from "bootlegging" the Google ecosystem into such configurations.
- notatoad 12y ago
  The stats are reported by google play services running on your phone, not by actual visits to the play store. As long as your phone can access the play store, it gets counted.