25 ms·

Microsoft accepting Bitcoin

416 points by DavidSJ 12y ago

FatalLogic 12y ago
Better link: https://commerce.microsoft.com/PaymentHub/Help/Right?helppagename=CSV_BitcoinHowTo.htm https://commerce.microsoft.com/PaymentHub/Help/Right?helppag...
- dang 12y ago
  Thanks. Changed from https://commerce.microsoft.com/PaymentHub/Help/Show/toc_link_no_50?lang=en-ca https://commerce.microsoft.com/PaymentHub/Help/Show/toc_link....
  - oska 12y ago
    The official announcement is now available, if you want to consider changing the link again. http://blogs.microsoft.com/firehose/2014/12/11/now-you-can-exchange-bitcoins-to-buy-apps-games-and-more-for-windows-windows-phone-and-xbox/ http://blogs.microsoft.com/firehose/2014/12/11/now-you-can-e...
jc123 12y ago
Sounds big. Could get the other large tech companies to look into Bitcoin more and evaluate their efforts.
ubersync 12y ago
Bitcoin totally makes sense for digital products, especially for transaction with small amounts. With Bitcoin you can send even $0.01 for a very low fee.
- NhanH 12y ago
  Default fee for a transaction is 0.0001, which is ~$0.0355 at current bitcoin price.
  - baddox 12y ago
    In the current reference clients, transactions smaller than 1000 bytes and less than 0.01 BTC are sent without a transaction fee.
    - celticninja 12y ago
      i dont think the value is as important as the transaction size. I can send 10BTC for free, especially if the coins have not been moved for more than say a week. In fact smaller transactions are usually more costly (as a % of the sum being sent) than large transactions, see the recent US marshalls auctin as an example, $30M sent for $0.37.
  - roasbeef 12y ago
    The default relay fee is actually now 1,000 satoshis (0.00001), not 10,000 satoshis (0.0001).
    - pbhjpbhj 12y ago
      Who is that fee paid too?
      - aparadja 12y ago
        As a reward to the miner of the block, no?
      - dsil 12y ago
        Essentially the fee is split up by everyone who is running the nodes that make up the Bitcoin network. The more hash-power you have the larger your share of the fees.
        celticninja 12y ago
        this is incorrect, the transaction fee is paid to the miner that first includes your transaction in a block. this is their incentive for including transactions in blocks.
chuckup 12y ago
This is great news. I've always thought teenagers are the biggest market for bitcoin, they're less likely to have a bank/credit card. Knowing you can now exchange bitcoin for Xbox points makes accepting bitcoin a lot more attractive.
- JoshTriplett 12y ago
  > I've always thought teenagers are the biggest market for bitcoin, they're less likely to have a bank/credit card. Which makes it rather difficult to obtain bitcoin in the first place. > Knowing you can now exchange bitcoin for Xbox points makes accepting bitcoin a lot more attractive. One major reason for the popularity of the cards you can buy in various grocery/department stores providing points/credit for the various stories (Google Play, iTunes, Nintendo, Xbox, etc) is precisely because you can buy them with cash, redeem them at the online stores, and use the resulting credit to make purchases, all without using a credit card. This really doesn't solve that problem, it just shifts that problem to "how do you obtain bitcoin?" Idea for a business model: make Bitcoin gift cards, and get them into the various grocery/department stores.
  - Kortaggio 12y ago
    If you're comfortable with meeting a stranger in a public place and paying a small premium over market rates there's always the option to purchase Bitcoins with cash in person. Simply find your counterparty on a message board or LocalBitcoins.
    - kolev 12y ago
      Meet a stranger and take a risk just to load funds into Xbox Live?! Hmmm, why not just buy a prepaid Xbox card at most stores? Also, add the fact that you can lose value with Bitcoin.
    - GFK_of_xmaspast 12y ago
      I'm sure parents are going to love the idea of their child going to meet a strange adult from the internet who has unorthodox ideas about the government.
kolev 12y ago
Microsoft is accepting BitPay, not Bitcoin. It's like saying that Microsoft is accepting checking account payments, because PayPal supports it.
- martindale 12y ago
  BitPay employee here. Around 50% of our merchants actually accept some or all of their settlement in Bitcoin.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
  - kolev 12y ago
    What's the weighted average of that "some"? I doubt if it's above 10%!
    - laichzeit0 12y ago
      What were you expecting, 100%? This is a new technology. Obviously most people are going to be "cautious" about it. Think about it for a second. Now look back at Bitcoin 5 years ago and compare where we are today. You're really not putting things into perspective.
      - kolev 12y ago
        New technology? Docker is a new technology, yet, it's embraced by everybody and in production. Don't give lame excuses, please! Bitcoin is the third-grade speculator's paradise.
    - bob7a3 12y ago
      I doubt you know how Bitcoin works.
      - kolev 12y ago
        I smell the typical Bitcoin parrot - "you simply don't get it". Really? If I don't get it when I've been using it since 2011 for fun and profit and having 30 years of software engineering experience, then who will get it? You, for whom "HODL" is the gospel and the "allelujah"?! Get a life, seriously! If you didn't get the memo, the $40K apiece is not happening!
aluhut 12y ago
Now I just need a anonymous way to get some BC without farming it or meeting some shady guy near the main station in Frankfurt... I hope those BC vending machines get more popular here.
- MichaelGG 12y ago
  Vending machines will almost certainly have cameras. And incautious use could still leave DNA or fingerprints. Best anonymity is to mail cash to a LocalBitcoin seller. Take care to get unregistered bills (ATMs and bank withdrawals could trace serial numbers, though WF claims they do not). Get big bills, then shop for change. Take great care in preparing the envelope. Consider using a remailer. Some post offices will even do that for you. Address it to the postmaster, and include a ready piece of mail inside. And remember, the seller could be an operative of whoever you're trying to keep anonymous from. Biggest issues are A: your general geo location is known (though remailing adds one more party to penetrate, OTOH, if the post scans every piece of mail, auto correlation could be easy). B: buying stamps is getting harder, anonymously. Cameras all over. Automatic machines require credit cards. Source: I was thinking of operating a hidden service for hosting. I wanted to see how much work it actually was for potential customers to buy anonymous BTC and spent a few days attempting to do so. For people wanting to have strong (state level) security, it seems very difficult to get it right. Edit: A real solution is, if zero knowledge proofs are real and can scale, is to have an active market that uses that tech. Then you go and trade in and out and can get lost in the noise, if enough transactions are occurring. But we'd need serious buy in, otherwise it's pretty unique behavior. But it could be a great extra layer.
  - aluhut 12y ago
    The one in Berlin Kreuzberg, in an "alternative" Bar looked nice. I think it's the only one in Germany atm. I don't think they have cameras. And yes. I had similar thoughts. The only local seller I came up with in my area that would sell smaller ammounts wanted to meet in person. Which is...I don't know. I have a bad feeling about that. Since I "only" want to pay an VPN with them (maybe some space also if that works out), I would probably take the mail-way you've described if it would have been aviable. I now think about paying the VPN with vouchers I can buy in a local shop somewhere but no idea if that works with vouchers I buy here in Germany.
Animats 12y ago
No, Microsoft is not accepting Bitcoin. Microsoft's hosted shopping cart program, like several other shopping cart programs, is now handling Bitcoins for merchants who accept them. Microsoft's page says: "You can only use Bitcoin to add money to your Microsoft account and then purchase digital goods at select Microsoft online stores. You can’t use Bitcoin to purchase Microsoft products and services directly at this time." So this is apparently for Microsoft partners who want to accept Bitcoin. Any idea which partners do? Microsoft's site is rather unhelpful; it keeps demanding a login.
- chuckup 12y ago
  This might sound corny, but you are my favorite gadfly. I've seen many posts from you over the years on slashdot and HN pointing out flaws with things I love such as python, and now lately bitcoin. I don't always agree with you, but I'm glad you're around.
- the_rosentotter 12y ago
  > for merchants who accept them Which now includes Microsoft. If you didn't know, Microsoft has chosen to accept bitcoin through their payment provider (otherwise that option would not appear). So I guess I don't understand what your point is.
  - Animats 12y ago
    Microsoft's announcement says "You can’t use Bitcoin to purchase Microsoft products and services directly at this time." It's not clear exactly what you can purchase. In-game items?
    - KJasper 12y ago
      You basically buy credit to buy apps, games, dlc, music, etc. This a bit of relic from the days of Microsoft points that you needed to use on the Xbox 360. When I buy an app with my Windows phone it can directly charge my provider.
    - DaFranker 12y ago
brayton 12y ago
Biggest point is someone fairly high up at Microsoft said yes to Bitcoin - executives at massive companies are taking it seriously.
- hnnewguy 12y ago
  >executives at massive companies are taking it seriously. Having come from they heydays of Facebook gaming, and having seen the rise and fall of numerous payment providers, I'm not sure how you draw that conclusion. Implementing a new form of payment is trivial, especially one that's now relatively "mainstream", as Bitcoin is. I doubt there were many late nights in the board room considering this decision.
ww520 12y ago
Bitcoin price seems to have settled down recently, which is good for its day to day usage.
dang 12y ago
Also https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8733551 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8733551.
NicoJuicy 12y ago
It's great for adding Bitcoin to their options, but is there some way to find out how much income someone has in Bitcoin (if they include it in their shop?) The closest thing i found was by an article about shitexpress on http://goo.gl/4ri1B5 http://goo.gl/4ri1B5 , they added paypal as payment method and their revenue was +370%.. So Bitcoin/Dogecoin/... was only 21,2% on day 1 of adding Paypal as payment option.
- josteink 12y ago
  That's a great point. But it doesn't fully get the big picture. If you had asked anyone to implement PayPal support 10 years ago, you would probably not experience +370% increase in revenue. It would probably be more like 21,2%. But because it stuck around and gained traction, it is now a sort of "default" for non-credit card payment. Which explains the 370% figure. But PayPal is "evil" and we know this. It is a centralized outside your control. It can seize the funds in your account. It can be corrupted by governments. It can be instructed into what it can and can't support by credit-card companies, etc etc. That not how currency is supposed to work. You own it. You exchange it. You give it to who you like to give it to. Your money is yours to do with as you please. So we need a new approach which addresses the centralized nature of PayPal and the ownership issue of the funds. And BitCoin does just this! Today it is 21.2%, but who knows? It may stick around and completely decimate PayPal if it becomes a new "default" for non-credit card payments. After all, if BitCoin is supported and has zero costs and a lower risk, why would anyone need PayPal?
  - hnnewguy 12y ago
    >if BitCoin is supported and has zero costs and a lower risk That's a big "if". As it is, neither of these things are true. There's no such thing as "free"; services have to be implemented, infrastructure must be built, systems must be supported. Hopefully Bitcoin will be cheap, cheaper than the alternatives, but it won't be free.
Ologn 12y ago
Ah Silicon Valley's big ponzi scheme. A year ago today a Bitcoin was worth $820, right now one is worth $360. How long until it hits its inevitable price, $0.00, considering it has no value whatsoever? Who knows? As Keynes said, markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent. Marc Andreessen talks about how older people have dot-bomb hangover fears, but nothing screams bubble to me than this modern scam known as Bitcoin. It has all the attributes of a scam as well - the anonymous architect, all the big players running off with the money or getting raided by the police. Yet the big names in the Valley keep touting this worthless ripoff. Plenty of HN'ers are involved in the scam, so this post is sure to get downvoted to oblivion by them. What we have here on HN is me, who over a year ago when Bitcoin was worth $460 said it was worthless ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6753545 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6753545 ), and we also have the scam artists who were hyping it then, are hyping it now etc. The potential Bitcoin investor suckers who listened to me would have saved themselves from losing the $100+ dollars on each Bitcoin they bought since the current price is below $360. I've been prescient, they've been wrong, but they're still running their scam and will downvote me to oblivion - they still have some suckers to fleece. The real thing to note is how hard the big names in the Valley are pushing these hashes that they know to be worthless, which has been surrounded by an architect who hid his identity, and multiple ripoffs and police raids. Supposedly the Valley is about people who have insights that others don't. In this case though, the big names and big money have one insight, this is a scam, and try to hush those pointing that out, as there are still suckers left to fleece.
- VMG 12y ago
  > The potential Bitcoin investor suckers who listened to me would have saved themselves from losing the $100+ dollars on each Bitcoin they bought since the current price is below $360. What would you have said in 2011?
- esbio 12y ago
  Gold has no value whatsoever as well. Yet it's considered a commodity. Even money has no value whatsoever. Money is a promise from a government to grant some goods or services. If the government gives up, or its companies close down or leave, or decides to devalue its currency, you lose money regardless. Commodities are assigned the value humans agree on, according to market. Bitcoin is no different. It's a digital commodity, but a commodity nevertheless. It will have its bubbles, but they are fueled by human greed, not the nature of bitcoin per se.
sreyaNotfilc 12y ago
Hearing this news makes Bitcoin that much more legitimate. Having Microsoft, a company known for its money and its practices to obtain large amounts of it, accept Bitcoin will affect its value in a big way. Or at least one would believe. I kind of wish I bought Bitcoins when I heard about it a year or so ago (just like I wish I invested in Facebook). I did read an article explaining Bitcoin. Parts of it made sense, but other parts still left me confused. I wouldn't say that should deter anyone. As many things out there that we want or have, the results of the product is sometimes more important than its inner-workings.
- webaholic 12y ago
  If you had invested a year ago, you would have lost 70% of the money you invested. Consider yourself lucky that you didn't.
kleer001 12y ago
Well, at least it's a step in the right direction? >You can only use Bitcoin to add money to your Microsoft account and then purchase digital goods at select Microsoft online stores. You can’t use Bitcoin to purchase Microsoft products and services directly at this time.
gesman 12y ago
Curb your enthusiasm. You can't purchase laptops: http://mensk.com/PHOTOS/1/msft_bitcoin.png http://mensk.com/PHOTOS/1/msft_bitcoin.png

416 points by DavidSJ 12y ago

Better link: https://commerce.microsoft.com/PaymentHub/Help/Right?helppagename=CSV_BitcoinHowTo.htm https://commerce.microsoft.com/PaymentHub/Help/Right?helppag...

dang 12y ago
Thanks. Changed from https://commerce.microsoft.com/PaymentHub/Help/Show/toc_link_no_50?lang=en-ca https://commerce.microsoft.com/PaymentHub/Help/Show/toc_link....
- oska 12y ago
  The official announcement is now available, if you want to consider changing the link again. http://blogs.microsoft.com/firehose/2014/12/11/now-you-can-exchange-bitcoins-to-buy-apps-games-and-more-for-windows-windows-phone-and-xbox/ http://blogs.microsoft.com/firehose/2014/12/11/now-you-can-e...

jc123 12y ago

Sounds big. Could get the other large tech companies to look into Bitcoin more and evaluate their efforts.

ubersync 12y ago

Bitcoin totally makes sense for digital products, especially for transaction with small amounts. With Bitcoin you can send even $0.01 for a very low fee.

NhanH 12y ago
Default fee for a transaction is 0.0001, which is ~$0.0355 at current bitcoin price.
- baddox 12y ago
  In the current reference clients, transactions smaller than 1000 bytes and less than 0.01 BTC are sent without a transaction fee.
  - celticninja 12y ago
    i dont think the value is as important as the transaction size. I can send 10BTC for free, especially if the coins have not been moved for more than say a week. In fact smaller transactions are usually more costly (as a % of the sum being sent) than large transactions, see the recent US marshalls auctin as an example, $30M sent for $0.37.
- roasbeef 12y ago
  The default relay fee is actually now 1,000 satoshis (0.00001), not 10,000 satoshis (0.0001).
  - pbhjpbhj 12y ago
    Who is that fee paid too?
    - aparadja 12y ago
      As a reward to the miner of the block, no?
    - dsil 12y ago
      Essentially the fee is split up by everyone who is running the nodes that make up the Bitcoin network. The more hash-power you have the larger your share of the fees.
      - celticninja 12y ago
        this is incorrect, the transaction fee is paid to the miner that first includes your transaction in a block. this is their incentive for including transactions in blocks.

chuckup 12y ago

This is great news. I've always thought teenagers are the biggest market for bitcoin, they're less likely to have a bank/credit card. Knowing you can now exchange bitcoin for Xbox points makes accepting bitcoin a lot more attractive.

JoshTriplett 12y ago
> I've always thought teenagers are the biggest market for bitcoin, they're less likely to have a bank/credit card. Which makes it rather difficult to obtain bitcoin in the first place. > Knowing you can now exchange bitcoin for Xbox points makes accepting bitcoin a lot more attractive. One major reason for the popularity of the cards you can buy in various grocery/department stores providing points/credit for the various stories (Google Play, iTunes, Nintendo, Xbox, etc) is precisely because you can buy them with cash, redeem them at the online stores, and use the resulting credit to make purchases, all without using a credit card. This really doesn't solve that problem, it just shifts that problem to "how do you obtain bitcoin?" Idea for a business model: make Bitcoin gift cards, and get them into the various grocery/department stores.
- Kortaggio 12y ago
  If you're comfortable with meeting a stranger in a public place and paying a small premium over market rates there's always the option to purchase Bitcoins with cash in person. Simply find your counterparty on a message board or LocalBitcoins.
  - kolev 12y ago
    Meet a stranger and take a risk just to load funds into Xbox Live?! Hmmm, why not just buy a prepaid Xbox card at most stores? Also, add the fact that you can lose value with Bitcoin.
  - GFK_of_xmaspast 12y ago
    I'm sure parents are going to love the idea of their child going to meet a strange adult from the internet who has unorthodox ideas about the government.

kolev 12y ago

Microsoft is accepting BitPay, not Bitcoin. It's like saying that Microsoft is accepting checking account payments, because PayPal supports it.

martindale 12y ago
BitPay employee here. Around 50% of our merchants actually accept some or all of their settlement in Bitcoin.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- kolev 12y ago
  What's the weighted average of that "some"? I doubt if it's above 10%!
  - laichzeit0 12y ago
    What were you expecting, 100%? This is a new technology. Obviously most people are going to be "cautious" about it. Think about it for a second. Now look back at Bitcoin 5 years ago and compare where we are today. You're really not putting things into perspective.
    - kolev 12y ago
      New technology? Docker is a new technology, yet, it's embraced by everybody and in production. Don't give lame excuses, please! Bitcoin is the third-grade speculator's paradise.
  - bob7a3 12y ago
    I doubt you know how Bitcoin works.
    - kolev 12y ago
      I smell the typical Bitcoin parrot - "you simply don't get it". Really? If I don't get it when I've been using it since 2011 for fun and profit and having 30 years of software engineering experience, then who will get it? You, for whom "HODL" is the gospel and the "allelujah"?! Get a life, seriously! If you didn't get the memo, the $40K apiece is not happening!

aluhut 12y ago

Now I just need a anonymous way to get some BC without farming it or meeting some shady guy near the main station in Frankfurt... I hope those BC vending machines get more popular here.

MichaelGG 12y ago
Vending machines will almost certainly have cameras. And incautious use could still leave DNA or fingerprints. Best anonymity is to mail cash to a LocalBitcoin seller. Take care to get unregistered bills (ATMs and bank withdrawals could trace serial numbers, though WF claims they do not). Get big bills, then shop for change. Take great care in preparing the envelope. Consider using a remailer. Some post offices will even do that for you. Address it to the postmaster, and include a ready piece of mail inside. And remember, the seller could be an operative of whoever you're trying to keep anonymous from. Biggest issues are A: your general geo location is known (though remailing adds one more party to penetrate, OTOH, if the post scans every piece of mail, auto correlation could be easy). B: buying stamps is getting harder, anonymously. Cameras all over. Automatic machines require credit cards. Source: I was thinking of operating a hidden service for hosting. I wanted to see how much work it actually was for potential customers to buy anonymous BTC and spent a few days attempting to do so. For people wanting to have strong (state level) security, it seems very difficult to get it right. Edit: A real solution is, if zero knowledge proofs are real and can scale, is to have an active market that uses that tech. Then you go and trade in and out and can get lost in the noise, if enough transactions are occurring. But we'd need serious buy in, otherwise it's pretty unique behavior. But it could be a great extra layer.
- aluhut 12y ago
  The one in Berlin Kreuzberg, in an "alternative" Bar looked nice. I think it's the only one in Germany atm. I don't think they have cameras. And yes. I had similar thoughts. The only local seller I came up with in my area that would sell smaller ammounts wanted to meet in person. Which is...I don't know. I have a bad feeling about that. Since I "only" want to pay an VPN with them (maybe some space also if that works out), I would probably take the mail-way you've described if it would have been aviable. I now think about paying the VPN with vouchers I can buy in a local shop somewhere but no idea if that works with vouchers I buy here in Germany.

Animats 12y ago

No, Microsoft is not accepting Bitcoin. Microsoft's hosted shopping cart program, like several other shopping cart programs, is now handling Bitcoins for merchants who accept them. Microsoft's page says: "You can only use Bitcoin to add money to your Microsoft account and then purchase digital goods at select Microsoft online stores. You can’t use Bitcoin to purchase Microsoft products and services directly at this time." So this is apparently for Microsoft partners who want to accept Bitcoin. Any idea which partners do? Microsoft's site is rather unhelpful; it keeps demanding a login.

chuckup 12y ago
This might sound corny, but you are my favorite gadfly. I've seen many posts from you over the years on slashdot and HN pointing out flaws with things I love such as python, and now lately bitcoin. I don't always agree with you, but I'm glad you're around.
the_rosentotter 12y ago
> for merchants who accept them Which now includes Microsoft. If you didn't know, Microsoft has chosen to accept bitcoin through their payment provider (otherwise that option would not appear). So I guess I don't understand what your point is.
- Animats 12y ago
  Microsoft's announcement says "You can’t use Bitcoin to purchase Microsoft products and services directly at this time." It's not clear exactly what you can purchase. In-game items?
  - KJasper 12y ago
    You basically buy credit to buy apps, games, dlc, music, etc. This a bit of relic from the days of Microsoft points that you needed to use on the Xbox 360. When I buy an app with my Windows phone it can directly charge my provider.
  - DaFranker 12y ago

brayton 12y ago

Biggest point is someone fairly high up at Microsoft said yes to Bitcoin - executives at massive companies are taking it seriously.

hnnewguy 12y ago
>executives at massive companies are taking it seriously. Having come from they heydays of Facebook gaming, and having seen the rise and fall of numerous payment providers, I'm not sure how you draw that conclusion. Implementing a new form of payment is trivial, especially one that's now relatively "mainstream", as Bitcoin is. I doubt there were many late nights in the board room considering this decision.

ww520 12y ago

Bitcoin price seems to have settled down recently, which is good for its day to day usage.

dang 12y ago

Also https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8733551 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8733551.

NicoJuicy 12y ago

It's great for adding Bitcoin to their options, but is there some way to find out how much income someone has in Bitcoin (if they include it in their shop?) The closest thing i found was by an article about shitexpress on http://goo.gl/4ri1B5 http://goo.gl/4ri1B5 , they added paypal as payment method and their revenue was +370%.. So Bitcoin/Dogecoin/... was only 21,2% on day 1 of adding Paypal as payment option.

josteink 12y ago
That's a great point. But it doesn't fully get the big picture. If you had asked anyone to implement PayPal support 10 years ago, you would probably not experience +370% increase in revenue. It would probably be more like 21,2%. But because it stuck around and gained traction, it is now a sort of "default" for non-credit card payment. Which explains the 370% figure. But PayPal is "evil" and we know this. It is a centralized outside your control. It can seize the funds in your account. It can be corrupted by governments. It can be instructed into what it can and can't support by credit-card companies, etc etc. That not how currency is supposed to work. You own it. You exchange it. You give it to who you like to give it to. Your money is yours to do with as you please. So we need a new approach which addresses the centralized nature of PayPal and the ownership issue of the funds. And BitCoin does just this! Today it is 21.2%, but who knows? It may stick around and completely decimate PayPal if it becomes a new "default" for non-credit card payments. After all, if BitCoin is supported and has zero costs and a lower risk, why would anyone need PayPal?
- hnnewguy 12y ago
  >if BitCoin is supported and has zero costs and a lower risk That's a big "if". As it is, neither of these things are true. There's no such thing as "free"; services have to be implemented, infrastructure must be built, systems must be supported. Hopefully Bitcoin will be cheap, cheaper than the alternatives, but it won't be free.

Ologn 12y ago

Ah Silicon Valley's big ponzi scheme. A year ago today a Bitcoin was worth $820, right now one is worth $360. How long until it hits its inevitable price, $0.00, considering it has no value whatsoever? Who knows? As Keynes said, markets can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent. Marc Andreessen talks about how older people have dot-bomb hangover fears, but nothing screams bubble to me than this modern scam known as Bitcoin. It has all the attributes of a scam as well - the anonymous architect, all the big players running off with the money or getting raided by the police. Yet the big names in the Valley keep touting this worthless ripoff. Plenty of HN'ers are involved in the scam, so this post is sure to get downvoted to oblivion by them. What we have here on HN is me, who over a year ago when Bitcoin was worth $460 said it was worthless ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6753545 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6753545 ), and we also have the scam artists who were hyping it then, are hyping it now etc. The potential Bitcoin investor suckers who listened to me would have saved themselves from losing the $100+ dollars on each Bitcoin they bought since the current price is below $360. I've been prescient, they've been wrong, but they're still running their scam and will downvote me to oblivion - they still have some suckers to fleece. The real thing to note is how hard the big names in the Valley are pushing these hashes that they know to be worthless, which has been surrounded by an architect who hid his identity, and multiple ripoffs and police raids. Supposedly the Valley is about people who have insights that others don't. In this case though, the big names and big money have one insight, this is a scam, and try to hush those pointing that out, as there are still suckers left to fleece.

VMG 12y ago
> The potential Bitcoin investor suckers who listened to me would have saved themselves from losing the $100+ dollars on each Bitcoin they bought since the current price is below $360. What would you have said in 2011?
esbio 12y ago
Gold has no value whatsoever as well. Yet it's considered a commodity. Even money has no value whatsoever. Money is a promise from a government to grant some goods or services. If the government gives up, or its companies close down or leave, or decides to devalue its currency, you lose money regardless. Commodities are assigned the value humans agree on, according to market. Bitcoin is no different. It's a digital commodity, but a commodity nevertheless. It will have its bubbles, but they are fueled by human greed, not the nature of bitcoin per se.

sreyaNotfilc 12y ago

Hearing this news makes Bitcoin that much more legitimate. Having Microsoft, a company known for its money and its practices to obtain large amounts of it, accept Bitcoin will affect its value in a big way. Or at least one would believe. I kind of wish I bought Bitcoins when I heard about it a year or so ago (just like I wish I invested in Facebook). I did read an article explaining Bitcoin. Parts of it made sense, but other parts still left me confused. I wouldn't say that should deter anyone. As many things out there that we want or have, the results of the product is sometimes more important than its inner-workings.

webaholic 12y ago
If you had invested a year ago, you would have lost 70% of the money you invested. Consider yourself lucky that you didn't.

kleer001 12y ago

Well, at least it's a step in the right direction? >You can only use Bitcoin to add money to your Microsoft account and then purchase digital goods at select Microsoft online stores. You can’t use Bitcoin to purchase Microsoft products and services directly at this time.

gesman 12y ago

Curb your enthusiasm. You can't purchase laptops: http://mensk.com/PHOTOS/1/msft_bitcoin.png http://mensk.com/PHOTOS/1/msft_bitcoin.png