4 ms·

He understands that. His problem is that the bureaucracy to comply with the rules is too high, and I agree. I have a SaaS service in the EU. I have always paid

He understands that. His problem is that the bureaucracy to comply with the rules is too high, and I agree. I have a SaaS service in the EU. I have always paid my taxes and I'm not against them. But I want to have a reliable and hopefully simple process to know how to process payments. The proposed changes are a bit PITA to everybody. I hope they will come with a simpler process, as it's scary all that I will have to do to add a foreign EU customer.

Silhouette 12y ago
There is a simpler (not simple) mechanism that is being set up to help administer this scheme. Here in the UK, it's the government's Mini One Stop Shop: https://www.gov.uk/register-and-use-the-vat-mini-one-stop-shop https://www.gov.uk/register-and-use-the-vat-mini-one-stop-sh... I gather similar schemes are being set up elsewhere in the EU, though I don't know if it's universal. It appears that as a business that is already VAT registered and filing quarterly returns in the UK, the key points for us will be that: 1. we have to charge VAT to customers elsewhere in the EU at their local rates, which we will be responsible for monitoring in all 28 states; 2. we have to submit all of the VAT to the UK tax authority (HMRC) as we do at present; 3. we have to file an additional quarterly return via MOSS breaking down exactly where our customers/revenues come from, so HMRC can distribute the funds to their counterparts around the EU; 4. we will be required to collect a completely impractical standard of evidence for the location of those customers and will be entirely responsible if and when we fail to do the impossible and it turns out someone lied to us about where they live; and 5. we will be subject to arbitrary audit/investigation by 28 tax authorities instead of just our own, at our own expense naturally (though there is some suggestion that the UK authorities will at least try to co-ordinate this to prevent what they consider an unreasonable burden being imposed). The real sting in the tail, if I've understood the announcements so far correctly, will be for those who have a low volume of trade and so currently do not have to register for VAT at all. In order to use MOSS, you have to be VAT registered within the UK, and thus either add the current VAT rate onto all your prices when charging customers or take a hit of the equivalent fraction of your existing revenues if you choose to keep prices the same. I really hope I'm wrong about this, but I haven't yet seen anything suggesting that just because you're under the threshold for VAT registration in any/all EU states you'll be exempt from the new funds transfer arrangements, meaning a single foreign customer could suddenly put your entire business within the range of requiring VAT registration.
- pbhjpbhj 12y ago
  >you have to be VAT registered within the UK // They're saying you can be registered purely for the VAT MOSS and so account for VAT as if your were unregistered for UK transactions. I've not read anything on whether you'll be allowed to reclaim VAT on your inputs on e-goods/services you sell with VAT though (which is the usual way VAT registration works, you don't pay VAT on your inputs). This group https://www.facebook.com/groups/DigitalVAT2015/ https://www.facebook.com/groups/DigitalVAT2015/ seems to be useful to keep track of it all from an SME perspective.

Silhouette 12y ago

There is a simpler (not simple) mechanism that is being set up to help administer this scheme. Here in the UK, it's the government's Mini One Stop Shop: https://www.gov.uk/register-and-use-the-vat-mini-one-stop-shop https://www.gov.uk/register-and-use-the-vat-mini-one-stop-sh... I gather similar schemes are being set up elsewhere in the EU, though I don't know if it's universal. It appears that as a business that is already VAT registered and filing quarterly returns in the UK, the key points for us will be that: 1. we have to charge VAT to customers elsewhere in the EU at their local rates, which we will be responsible for monitoring in all 28 states; 2. we have to submit all of the VAT to the UK tax authority (HMRC) as we do at present; 3. we have to file an additional quarterly return via MOSS breaking down exactly where our customers/revenues come from, so HMRC can distribute the funds to their counterparts around the EU; 4. we will be required to collect a completely impractical standard of evidence for the location of those customers and will be entirely responsible if and when we fail to do the impossible and it turns out someone lied to us about where they live; and 5. we will be subject to arbitrary audit/investigation by 28 tax authorities instead of just our own, at our own expense naturally (though there is some suggestion that the UK authorities will at least try to co-ordinate this to prevent what they consider an unreasonable burden being imposed). The real sting in the tail, if I've understood the announcements so far correctly, will be for those who have a low volume of trade and so currently do not have to register for VAT at all. In order to use MOSS, you have to be VAT registered within the UK, and thus either add the current VAT rate onto all your prices when charging customers or take a hit of the equivalent fraction of your existing revenues if you choose to keep prices the same. I really hope I'm wrong about this, but I haven't yet seen anything suggesting that just because you're under the threshold for VAT registration in any/all EU states you'll be exempt from the new funds transfer arrangements, meaning a single foreign customer could suddenly put your entire business within the range of requiring VAT registration.

pbhjpbhj 12y ago
>you have to be VAT registered within the UK // They're saying you can be registered purely for the VAT MOSS and so account for VAT as if your were unregistered for UK transactions. I've not read anything on whether you'll be allowed to reclaim VAT on your inputs on e-goods/services you sell with VAT though (which is the usual way VAT registration works, you don't pay VAT on your inputs). This group https://www.facebook.com/groups/DigitalVAT2015/ https://www.facebook.com/groups/DigitalVAT2015/ seems to be useful to keep track of it all from an SME perspective.