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Pantelligent: Intelligent Pan – Cook Everything Perfectly (YC W13)

139 points by compumike 12y ago

bensedat 12y ago
I've been lucky enough to watch this throughout all of the evolutions and help test it. It's been great learning more about how the cooking process actually works and perfecting my technique. EDIT: More information was requested so here goes: I've always been interested in food science and trying to make food more predictable. I think that's why I like baking so much. Pantelligent has given me the tools and visualizations to figure out what is actually happening on my stove. I've learned how to gauge the temperature of the pan, and how my electric stove has a really huge carryover heat capacity. I can pretty much turn the stove off halfway through the cooking process and coast the rest of the way with residual heat and still cook all the way through, without overcooking.
cindywu123 12y ago
i've been testing the prototype for months. there's nothing like this pan. i love experimenting with cooking eggs. also perfect steak every time.
kogir 12y ago
I've had the chance to try the latest three versions and use it every time I cook now. Before I had no idea how wildly the temperature on my stove would vary, and would basically burn or undercook everything. I'd had luck using temperature probes for things like chicken, but that doesn't work for eggs, fish, etc. Now I just pull out my phone, pick what I'm cooking, and get a predictably delicious result.
- hackuser 12y ago
  > I'd had luck using temperature probes for things like chicken, but that doesn't work for eggs, fish, etc. Why not use a temperature sensor and an app; why do I need to buy a whole pan? Is it that hard to for a sensor to read the heat of the pan's surface without being integrated?
- compumike 12y ago
  Thanks for being a beta tester! I think that sums it up perfectly!
hackuser 12y ago
Summary: The pan has temperature sensors which report to an app via Bluetooth. The app displays the actual and desired temperatures, and the user adjusts the heat on their stove. The obvious next step is to connect the sensor to the heat control, eliminating the human from the loop, and to add sensors for humidity level, pressure, weight (e.g., to determine how much water has boiled off), smoke (either for that mesquite/caramelized touch, or perhaps it's a good place to display a sponsored link to a food delivery service) and more. EDIT: Come to think of it, microwaves use sensor AFAIK. I had one that defrosted surprisingly well by simply pressing the 'Defrost' button. My impression was that it used a moisture sensor.
- wdaher 12y ago
  They have a built-in recipe feature as well, sorta like GPS for cooking. "Hey, it's time to flip that salmon."
  - xallthey 12y ago
    Make sure to try my recorded recipe! Honey Seared Tuna Steak.
- compumike 12y ago
  Yup! And intelligent recipes have both a desired time & temperature curve, but also correct for deviations (i.e. extending the time slightly if the temperature is too low). We've found that temperature is the key variable to repeatably getting great meals.
borski 12y ago
I cook a ton, and I thought I would hate this. Having tested Pantelligent from very early alpha, though, I was really surprised. I thought it would be "cook-by-number" and for many people that's exactly what they need and exactly what they want. For me, "cook-by-number" would drive me crazy, since I like being in the driver's seat, so to speak. Over time, learning the temperatures of my pan and being able to have instant access to it in 'Freestyle' mode blew me away. No more infrared thermometers == mind blown. Also, the record feature is stupendous - I finally get that dish /just right/, and I never have to worry about it again. I have recorded the temperatures, the times, and everything so I can repeat it the same way every time. Seriously though, try the salmon. It will blow you away. You've never had salmon this good.
- kolev 12y ago
  This is a gross oversimplification of quality cooking. For amateurs, this might be great... but it will keep them amateurs as they won't be able to develop the chef skills. My wife always cooks perfect salmon without any gadgets - there are other low-tech ways to know when it's done.
  - compumike 12y ago
    You may mean something broader by "quality cooking". In the more specific sense of "cooking" being the controlled addition of heat to ingredients, Pantelligent solves that perfectly by enabling time and temperature control. It's still up to you to compose the meal, procure good ingredients, etc. Pantelligent is a tool, and a powerful one.
    - baldeagle 12y ago
      Can there be a hook on the end to hang it. Otherwise, looks like a bang up job. Congrats.
    - kolev 12y ago
      Well, it solves a problem (for some), but unsolves another - adds Teflon that's been out of my household for over 10 years! And I'm sure it's not just me, because all stores are full of alternative coatings.
hardwaresofton 12y ago
I'm sure the answer is yes, but is this being marketed to large corporate customers also? Because this seems like a great way to increase consistency and maybe even increase efficiency of cooks in large kitchens...
- compumike 12y ago
  Commercial kitchens already have some aspect of this technology in place: thermostatically-controlled griddles, and standardized cooking times. But yes, where our technology applies, we'd love to get into restaurants as well!
- analog31 12y ago
  Hasn't Cisco already solved this problem by doing the cooking at the factory? That would be an additional advantage of the sealed bag. It's basically a short term canning process.
  - hardwaresofton 12y ago
    Sorry, thought you were a bot -- I'm not sure what you mean, could you expand? Do you mean Sysco? Also, I don't think this is really the same as canned food... I'm thinking more of the case where there's a relatively large restaurant with lots of cooks in the kitchen (or even multiple kitchens)
    - analog31 12y ago
      I missed your comment until today. Sysco is a giant company that supplies food material to restaurants. I've read that even at supposedly fancy restaurants, if you order soup, it's likely to be canned. If you order meat, it's pre-cooked in a bag, and is re-heated by throwing in boiling water. It probably saves money and could be more sanitary. On the other hand, it kinda diminishes the appeal of restaurant dining for me.
      - hardwaresofton 12y ago
        Ah, yeah, I've heard of Sysco, they served my school lunches way back when. And yes, what you're saying is probably true... in that case this wouldn't do very much good, I think. Maybe the idea of a restaurant that still makes it's food completely from scratch at every order is farfetched nowadays
buss 12y ago
I like the idea of constant temperature feedback, but I'm not going to switch out the pans I already have. I'm inspired to tear apart an IR temperature gun, place the sensor above each burner and mount the guns' readouts to the front of the hood.
- compumike 12y ago
  Part of the trick is getting the pan surface temperature, which (to an overhead pyrometer) is often obscured by the food in the pan. But yes, an IR thermometer is a good kitchen tool!
  - Natsu 12y ago
    One thing I didn't see is how the pan's transmitter is powered? Is it drawing energy from the heat of the pan or is there a battery in there somewhere?
    - icebraining 12y ago
      The pictures on the bottom show common AA batteries inside the handle.
      - compumike 12y ago
        Two AAA batteries, user replaceable. Lasts about 9 months. (We like the thermoelectric generator concept; maybe for a future version!)
jacobkg 12y ago
Try their instructions for cooking Trader Joes 'Mandarin Orange Chicken'. So good!! Better than any I have had anywhere. I'm probably making it like once a week now.
hackuser 12y ago
There are so many empty testimonials on this thread: "mind blown" "stupendous", "there's nothing like this pan", "perfect steak every time", "predictably delicious" etc. If you use the pan, a more insightful, informative report of the technology, its use, etc. would be helpful to your fellow readers.
- borski 12y ago
  Fair enough. The technology is, in itself, very simple: a temperature sensor built into the bottom of a frying pan, hooked up to an iOS app over low-power bluetooth. That's it. But the technology, in this case, isn't the point. It is a very simple idea, but one that works exceedingly well in doing its job. Not every solution to a problem has to be incredibly new technology - applications of simple technology to problems that lots of people have is just as much a definition of "make something people want" as building the Oculus Rift. Whether this is a problem that lots of people have is, I suppose, what this kickstarter will help elucidate. I didn't think I had this problem, and then I used the pan. My mind was changed solely because of the record feature and instant, always-on, access to the temperature of my pan. That's all.
  - hackuser 12y ago
    Borski: Thanks. But what are its strengths and weaknesses? When does it work well and where does it need work? Does it run only on iOS? How good is the pan as a frying pan? What's the construction quality? Customer service? etc etc. I did not mean to imply that it had to be cutting edge or complex tech.
    - borski 12y ago
      Fair enough. I'd say it works well for cooking protein or veg in a frying pan. It does run only in iOS. Construction quality is quite good - it's not a Calphalon pan, but it isn't the $10 Target pan either. It's somewhere in between. The construction of the handle (where the electronics are stored) is top-notch. Customer service I can't vouch for, as they're friends and live nearby, but I suspect they would make things right very quickly.
kolev 12y ago
It's been years since health-concerned people abandoned Teflon. From the pictures, it looks like this is still using Teflon.
cosmotron 12y ago
What's the plan for the Android version of the app?
ska 12y ago
An interesting idea, but a couple of things jumped out at me immediately. 1) Keeping track of surface and/or pan temperature is useful but it isn't nearly as useful as keeping track of internal temperature[1]. I'm not sure what the technical challenges are, but having one or more small wireless temperature probes would be far more useful to me than one limited use pan, which leads to ... 2) I cook a lot, but I have very few uses for a non-stick frypan, and very few uses for any pan that isn't oven safe[2]. That and the short useful lifetime of any non-stick pan (at any price range) make me wonder about this. [1] Otherwise you're just hoping your inputs are roughly equivalent to the last time you did this, or what the recipe assumes. [2] i'm making an assumption here, but couldn't find any info
- compumike 12y ago
  Keeping track of cooking surface time and temperature, plus knowing about what you're cooking (i.e. salmon fillet, 3/4" thick), lets us get a surprisingly good model of the internal conditions and adjust dynamically. The result is really quite delicious! We've done a lot of testing and development, and if you're following the interactive recipes in good faith, you'll get a good result when you cook. (Think about how much information even a trained chef has, using intuition about the right heat level and cooking time -- we can do better with quantitative temperature and time data, even though we can't actually poke the piece of salmon.) Pantelligent is not oven safe -- today's electronics would not operate at oven temperatures. Having temperature regulation avoids overcooking the nonstick coatings, which prolongs their life. (We just launched the Kickstarter campaign, and are in the middle of posting some FAQs right now!)
  - ska 12y ago
    You hit on the key problem, which is: what if my salmon steak is 1 1/2 " thick? Or 1/2" ? Are you going to have a selection grid? What if I just took it out of a fridge? What if its starting at room temperature? A bit dry? One of the first things you need to learn to improve as a cook (professional or just out of interest) is to control temperature. And that temperature isn't what it says on a dial, it's what's happening at the interface of your food and the heat. But pan temperature is only one variable, and others are at least as important. At the end of the day, you are never cooking "a salmon steak", you are cooking this salmon steak, with all it's characteristics, on this equipment. Part of getting better as a cook is to be aware of this and always adjust what you are doing, not to your expectations of what should happen (e.g. any recipe, or what happened last time, or ...) but to what is actually happening. To that degree having a live readout of a particular pan could be useful, but not earth shattering. Anyway, I don't think it's a terrible idea and may well help people who are afraid to diverge from a recipe. Heck, it may be very useful to some people who are very experienced, I don't know. My initial reaction though is the form factor is too constraining, and the benefit too marginal, for me to get excited about it.
mariusz79 12y ago
If you want to cook your food right check the temperature of the food not temperature of the pan. And cast iron is much better than teflon.
rickdale 12y ago
For whatever its worth, I find salmon to be the easiest thing to cook. Put oven on broil high. Salmon out of fridge. Little lemon, salt, pepper, dill, in the oven, 20-25 minutes and bam best salmon I ever made or had, every time. Also a lot probably depends on the quality or age of the fish.
JonLim 12y ago
I'm constantly cooking, and temperature is a constant worry. However, "affordable" may be a bit misleading, if $169 is the discounted version, I assume this will be under $200 at retail. I can pick up a durable frying pan for $15 at most, and it does the job with my skill level. What would the real draw for me be? Exact temperature readings are great, and interactive recipes are cool, but I'm not sure it's worth 10x more than I can get a regular frying pan. (Hope I didn't come off as snarky, I'm genuinely curious.)
- chewxy 12y ago
  I use a cast iron skillet + handheld IR thermometer for surface temp. Very cheap solution.
  - nicksergeant 12y ago
    I just bought one of these so I can cook more often with extra virgin olive oil without approaching the smoke point. At $19 for an IR thermometer, they should probably be in every kitchen next to the probe thermometer.
    - anigbrowl 12y ago
      Get in the habit of looking at the oil in the pan. As it approaches the smoke point, its refractive index will change and its viscosity will decrease, giving a dimpled appearance. This is due to convection cells from the heating; it's easier to see in olive oil because it's relatively thick and dark compared to other liquids or light oils. In a round, level pan, you'll get a pleasing hexagonal pattern. Once you have nice stable convection cells you're ready to cook. After a while you'll get used to your individual pans and how they transfer heat, to the point that you don't need to think about how to adjust the heat any more. Likewise watching the food itself will eventually tell you most of what you need to know about when it's done.
      - baudehlo 12y ago
        Note that this is a lot easier with Gas than with Electric due to the heat retention of the rings, at least I found. You can kill the heat really quickly with Gas (which is why no commercial kitchen uses electric).
qsymmachus 12y ago
This is pretty neat, but why not just learn how to cook? This is the kind of idea only Silicon Valley could cook up – if you've eaten nothing but catered meals your young adult life, you have no idea how to cook eggs without burning them. The solution is obviously a bluetooth enabled pan.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- icebraining 12y ago
  We'll see. As a citizen of a relatively poor European countries which owns a Thermomix for every 12 households, I wouldn't bet on it being a flop.
  - hackuser 12y ago
    What is a Thermomix? Wikipedia gives me the idea that it's a multifunction cooking machine, but leaves a lot of holes.
    - icebraining 12y ago
      That's essentially it. It's essentially a machine that combines a blender, mixer, steamer, slow cooker, a scale and a timer.
      - hackuser 12y ago
        Do you just drop in the raw ingredients and it processes them through those devices in serial? It is just all of those devices on one machine, no different than buying them separately? Thanks for explaining!
        icebraining 12y ago
        It can combine functions, e.g. mix while cooking. But as far as I know, it can't do anything that you couldn't do with separate devices (like using a hand mixer and a pot), it's just more convenient.
DanBC 12y ago
Looks amazing! I uaven't watched the video yet. Does it work on induction hobs? Is there an option to use Celsius? EDIT: is it aluminum? That won't work on induction hobs. Also, if anyone knows of good quality tiny non-stick pans that work on induction hobs, on sale in US, I'd be interested.
- compumike 12y ago
  Thanks! Currently: no and yes. (Posting more FAQs on the page now!)
alkonaut 12y ago
How can the pan know how cooked my steak is? If there was a spike at the center that measured the inner temperature of the meat, then I'd understand. But from just pan surface temp and time it must only be guessing? It would have to be fed (very) exact measurements of both meat thickness and initial temperature, right? The difference between 55 and 57 deg (C) steak is huge, so presumably you'd need to know the initial temp with a similar confidence? On the website, I can't see the app having inputs for exact thicknesses/temperatures? A comparison: even in an oven where you can set a perfect temperature, there is no way the oven temp + time will give you "perfect steak every time" (unless the oven temp is the target temp)? How is this different? Having the pan report its surface temp is neat of course, but wouldn't a tiny BT pinboard pin-style probe instead of a pan surface temp probe remove a lot of the variables involved, and report the thing I'm actually interested in (inner temp), rather than the pan. Edit: the temperature I'm looking for in a frying pan when cooking fish or meat is usually "as hot as it goes". Pan just to sear, and let the temperature be sorted out in Sous Vide or low temp oven.
jbob2000 12y ago
Can I wash it?
icki 12y ago
Interesting, seems to be competing with the Palate Smart Grill http://palatehome.com/ http://palatehome.com/
- pbhjpbhj 12y ago
  There seems to be very little info on that page other than that it's a grill of some form. No video?
chewxy 12y ago
This is a cool idea. I personally use a IR temperature gauge for the surface my pan (I thought of wiring it up once, but it was too fiddly for me), and a wired therm for internal meat temp. I'm currently in two minds about backing this. On the one hand, it frees me from using multiple devices. On the other hand, I already have a solution, and this solution is exactly the same as the one I have (I probably have more accurate readings). And this solution is a lot more expensive (199 for shipping to Australia) than my current solution An innovation I'd like to see is something like sous vide for a frypan, where the pan temperature automatically changes (this is hard because well, I like a flame stove too)
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
coldcode 12y ago
Interesting. What I wonder is how it compares to using a PIC which also does precise temp control (though not in an app obviously).
LukeB_UK 12y ago
I feel that this actually takes away from the experience of cooking. When I cook, I've always learned from playing around and experimenting, I only ever roughly read recipes and never follow one without a little change here or there. With this, people won't learn to cook, they'll learn to do x when y happens. That's not learning to cook, that's being a robot.
- dominotw 12y ago
  I don't want to learn to cook. I just want to eat cheap/healthy/homemade food.
- pjmax 12y ago
  It isn't learning at all, the users are just cooking their food, I don't see a problem in that if that's the desired goal.
  - cm2012 12y ago
    It's a gateway tool into good cooking - I can see users actually making something tasty and impressing their friends for the first time with this. That will make them want to learn more.
- morto091 12y ago
  If the end result is better, people will use it. At some point in history people were probably emotionally satisfied by knitting their own clothes. I'm sure some still do this for fun.
- compumike 12y ago
  If you love experimenting, Pantelligent gives you repeatability and data that you've never had before (Freestyle Mode), and the ability to walk away from the stove or get distracted and still keep an eye on your meal. You're still the chef -- Pantelligent is just a powerful tool.
- jkestner 12y ago
  "The experience of cooking" - this can be applied to most of the technologies we develop. (i.e. does the Kindle take away from the experience of reading?) But it's not just as simple as "better is better", either. If you want total convenience, you use a microwave, but it's not the do-all kitchen appliance that people originally thought it would be (see: microwave recipe books). If you want total experience and the joy of making something for your family with your own hands, you use traditional tools. Perhaps this pan meets some middle need, or provides a gateway for people who wouldn't cook otherwise, or perhaps it's an expensive novelty. But it's interesting to think about what we're losing when we replace old ways of doing things, and whether any of it's worth keeping around even if it isn't the most efficient way of doing things. The Betty Crocker add-egg trick tells us that there's a big emotional component wrapped up in this that isn't present in most product categories. (I make http://supermechanical.com/range http://supermechanical.com/range and enjoy Soylent, so the balance of new cooking interactions vs integration into an existing kitchen flow is something I think about.)
muraiki 12y ago
As a colorblind person, this is actually quite useful. It's probably significantly easier to use this than constantly checking using a meat thermometer (and needing to wash the thermometer between checks lest you contaminate cooked meat with residue from when it was raw) edit: To clarify, trying to cook meat by sight as a colorblind person (at least for me) typically results in either raw meat or dried out overcooked meat.
- compumike 12y ago
  Awesome! We hadn't thought of that specific use case, but that's great!
pjmorris 12y ago
How closed-source/open-source are the recipes? Are they stored in something like hRecipe [1] format? Can users edit them, or is that held within the company? [1] http://microformats.org/wiki/h-recipe http://microformats.org/wiki/h-recipe
matthewowen 12y ago
I would have assumed PG had eaten at decent restaurants, so the endorsement is weird. You can get OK salmon in a frying pan, but like pretty much every protein, you'll probably get better results with sous vide + a quick sear/blowtorch. Conveniently, it's also easier than frying, requires less hands-on time, and is tremendously repeatable. And you can now buy all the gear you need for about the price of one of these pans!
- xallthey 12y ago
  I have both and like both! I'll pick my weapon depending on time constraints (typically 55 minutes sous vide ~= 15 minutes on pan). The pan is also super repeatable.
- chewxy 12y ago
  It's harder to get a crispy skin with blowtorch. I pan sear my salmon skin post sous vide anyway - get the pan up to 220C - 250 and 30s skin down. Bam. Crispy skin.
- legohead 12y ago
  you can sous vide with ziplocs[1] and a temperature gauge. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qi-tyQvRgJw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qi-tyQvRgJw
- compumike 12y ago
  Honestly, we've tried sous vide before. Pantelligent is tastier. For many practical reasons, I believe that sous vide is not likely to become a standard household kitchen item. A frying pan and smartphone already are. See also comments here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8626599 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8626599
lifeformed 12y ago
The bluetooth aspect seems over-the-top; I'd rather just have a pan with a small display in the handle that shows the temperature.
- compumike 12y ago
  That would be simpler, but you would miss out on the biggest benefits of Pantelligent: one is being able to walk away or be doing something else and still get notifications. Two is the adaptive recipes. But you can certainly use "Freestyle Mode" and get the effect you're looking for!
wamatt 12y ago
Love the concept! This would be perfect for someone like me, that likes to eat home cooked meals, but loathes the time it takes to prepare. One thing however, I'm somewhat surprised to see no apparent mention of PFOA and PTFE being used? [1][2] The price point of $199, puts this product squarely in the high-end of cookware, where Teflon based non-stick has fallen out of favor these days. A smart pan that competes with Le Creuset's increasingly popular enamel pans, would be amazing. [3] [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfluorooctanoic_acid#Health_concerns http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfluorooctanoic_acid#Health_c... [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytetrafluoroethylene#Safety http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytetrafluoroethylene#Safety [3]http://www.lecreuset.com/cookware/skillets---saute-pans http://www.lecreuset.com/cookware/skillets---saute-pans
- compumike 12y ago
  Thanks! Non-stick pans are great. They're easy to cook on and clean. By actually knowing the temperature of the pan, you can avoid the deterioration of non-stick coatings that can occur in (non-smart) pans when they are unintentionally brought to very high temperatures.
unchocked 12y ago
This is almost the right solution. The right solution would include an integrated heating element, a smart pan-hotplate fusion.
- lightblade 12y ago
  Yup, preferably an separable induction heating surface that can be paired with the pan to intelligently control the temperature. Separate so that you can flip that pancake/burger.
malandrew 12y ago
Embed a sensor in an All Clad and I'm interested. The heat control and even heat distribution you get in a high quality multi-ply pan with a copper ply matter.
- compumike 12y ago
  The value proposition is similar, in some ways: better heating control through engineering. But Pantelligent actually delivers on that.
marc0 12y ago
Sorry, but that's a total overshoot. I definitivly won't sit next to my pan, monitoring its temperature on my smartphone to find the "perfect" moment when to stir the chopped onions. I would, maybe, if I did some extremely temperature sensitive chemical experiment. But not in my kitchen. And WFT: there are batteries in the handle? It's a joke, yes? A pan should be the perfect thing for energy harvesting, which would be at least to some extent innovative.
- compumike 12y ago
  That's the point -- you don't have to sit next to your pan monitoring anything at all. The Pantelligent app does that for you (and then sends you alerts), and it does it quite well! Even if you're an experienced chef already, this frees you up to do other things. Yes, batteries are great! Adding a thermoelectric generator is a possibility -- the power requirement is certainly met -- but it adds significant complexity.
mangecoeur 12y ago
Talk about over-engineering! Anyone can cook decently with a bit of care and attention. You're better off buying good quality ingredients and just taking the time to learn and experiment.
frownie 12y ago
Geek's dream... First, instead of providing tools, one could help people to develop taste. Many accept overcooked chicken or fish because they just catch the spices flavours. They can't judge what a well cooked dish is. Dry chicken is an abomination... 2/ The thickness of a salmon filet is everything but regular. So cooking it correctly involves a bit more than temperature handling 3/ As said, you don't cook "a steak", you cook "this steak". That's the thing. Cooking a good steak involves so many thing : quality of the steak (forget about supermarket), quality and handling of the fat (Gordon Ramsay once made a very good explanation on how to use butter on youtube), make sure the steak rest enough time off the heat before serving, cook for steak's colour first (so it is beautiful) and then cook for bloody/well done/cooked. Cook long and not short. Don't use a fork to manipulate the steak. Don't turn the steak upside down to often. With an autoamted pan you may sure cook a steak but you won't know why you did it right... 4/ If your problem is overcooking or undercooking a steak, learn to touch the steak. Hard means overcooked, soft means undercooked. With a bit of practice you'll be able to make good steaks, not 3 star michelin ones, but good ones. 5/ For steaks (not fish) you can buy cast iron skillets. These are super cheap (15 euros here !)and they live forever. But you have to learn to master/clean/season them (that's your old grand ma stuff, but knowledge is lost so it's pretty hard) 6/ The salmon on the web site looks super over cooked to me (it s top side is super borw and just below it's all white) 7/ said before : a fryin pan that doesn't go to the oven is useless. Countless times where I fry a piece of meat and finishes it in the oven where I can get the temperature righ everywhere. 8/ will the pan stand the "deglaçage" ? That's when you throw a cold liquid in the pan to grab all the softly burned piece of meat/fat. that's super important to making sauces. 9/ Will it stand the dish washer ? 10/ Where's the fun ? I mean, if you buy this because you can't find the time necessary to learn to cook, and thus, learn to appreciate good cooking, what's the point ? Do yourself a favour don't buy the pan, look for a good restaurant (and at the price of the pan you certainly can find a good one) and ask the chef to prepare a good steak for you. You'll learn something.

139 points by compumike 12y ago

I've been lucky enough to watch this throughout all of the evolutions and help test it. It's been great learning more about how the cooking process actually works and perfecting my technique. EDIT: More information was requested so here goes: I've always been interested in food science and trying to make food more predictable. I think that's why I like baking so much. Pantelligent has given me the tools and visualizations to figure out what is actually happening on my stove. I've learned how to gauge the temperature of the pan, and how my electric stove has a really huge carryover heat capacity. I can pretty much turn the stove off halfway through the cooking process and coast the rest of the way with residual heat and still cook all the way through, without overcooking.

cindywu123 12y ago

i've been testing the prototype for months. there's nothing like this pan. i love experimenting with cooking eggs. also perfect steak every time.

kogir 12y ago

I've had the chance to try the latest three versions and use it every time I cook now. Before I had no idea how wildly the temperature on my stove would vary, and would basically burn or undercook everything. I'd had luck using temperature probes for things like chicken, but that doesn't work for eggs, fish, etc. Now I just pull out my phone, pick what I'm cooking, and get a predictably delicious result.

hackuser 12y ago
> I'd had luck using temperature probes for things like chicken, but that doesn't work for eggs, fish, etc. Why not use a temperature sensor and an app; why do I need to buy a whole pan? Is it that hard to for a sensor to read the heat of the pan's surface without being integrated?
compumike 12y ago
Thanks for being a beta tester! I think that sums it up perfectly!

hackuser 12y ago

Summary: The pan has temperature sensors which report to an app via Bluetooth. The app displays the actual and desired temperatures, and the user adjusts the heat on their stove. The obvious next step is to connect the sensor to the heat control, eliminating the human from the loop, and to add sensors for humidity level, pressure, weight (e.g., to determine how much water has boiled off), smoke (either for that mesquite/caramelized touch, or perhaps it's a good place to display a sponsored link to a food delivery service) and more. EDIT: Come to think of it, microwaves use sensor AFAIK. I had one that defrosted surprisingly well by simply pressing the 'Defrost' button. My impression was that it used a moisture sensor.

wdaher 12y ago
They have a built-in recipe feature as well, sorta like GPS for cooking. "Hey, it's time to flip that salmon."
- xallthey 12y ago
  Make sure to try my recorded recipe! Honey Seared Tuna Steak.
compumike 12y ago
Yup! And intelligent recipes have both a desired time & temperature curve, but also correct for deviations (i.e. extending the time slightly if the temperature is too low). We've found that temperature is the key variable to repeatably getting great meals.

borski 12y ago

I cook a ton, and I thought I would hate this. Having tested Pantelligent from very early alpha, though, I was really surprised. I thought it would be "cook-by-number" and for many people that's exactly what they need and exactly what they want. For me, "cook-by-number" would drive me crazy, since I like being in the driver's seat, so to speak. Over time, learning the temperatures of my pan and being able to have instant access to it in 'Freestyle' mode blew me away. No more infrared thermometers == mind blown. Also, the record feature is stupendous - I finally get that dish /just right/, and I never have to worry about it again. I have recorded the temperatures, the times, and everything so I can repeat it the same way every time. Seriously though, try the salmon. It will blow you away. You've never had salmon this good.

kolev 12y ago
This is a gross oversimplification of quality cooking. For amateurs, this might be great... but it will keep them amateurs as they won't be able to develop the chef skills. My wife always cooks perfect salmon without any gadgets - there are other low-tech ways to know when it's done.
- compumike 12y ago
  You may mean something broader by "quality cooking". In the more specific sense of "cooking" being the controlled addition of heat to ingredients, Pantelligent solves that perfectly by enabling time and temperature control. It's still up to you to compose the meal, procure good ingredients, etc. Pantelligent is a tool, and a powerful one.
  - baldeagle 12y ago
    Can there be a hook on the end to hang it. Otherwise, looks like a bang up job. Congrats.
  - kolev 12y ago
    Well, it solves a problem (for some), but unsolves another - adds Teflon that's been out of my household for over 10 years! And I'm sure it's not just me, because all stores are full of alternative coatings.

hardwaresofton 12y ago

I'm sure the answer is yes, but is this being marketed to large corporate customers also? Because this seems like a great way to increase consistency and maybe even increase efficiency of cooks in large kitchens...

compumike 12y ago
Commercial kitchens already have some aspect of this technology in place: thermostatically-controlled griddles, and standardized cooking times. But yes, where our technology applies, we'd love to get into restaurants as well!
analog31 12y ago
Hasn't Cisco already solved this problem by doing the cooking at the factory? That would be an additional advantage of the sealed bag. It's basically a short term canning process.
- hardwaresofton 12y ago
  Sorry, thought you were a bot -- I'm not sure what you mean, could you expand? Do you mean Sysco? Also, I don't think this is really the same as canned food... I'm thinking more of the case where there's a relatively large restaurant with lots of cooks in the kitchen (or even multiple kitchens)
  - analog31 12y ago
    I missed your comment until today. Sysco is a giant company that supplies food material to restaurants. I've read that even at supposedly fancy restaurants, if you order soup, it's likely to be canned. If you order meat, it's pre-cooked in a bag, and is re-heated by throwing in boiling water. It probably saves money and could be more sanitary. On the other hand, it kinda diminishes the appeal of restaurant dining for me.
    - hardwaresofton 12y ago
      Ah, yeah, I've heard of Sysco, they served my school lunches way back when. And yes, what you're saying is probably true... in that case this wouldn't do very much good, I think. Maybe the idea of a restaurant that still makes it's food completely from scratch at every order is farfetched nowadays

buss 12y ago

I like the idea of constant temperature feedback, but I'm not going to switch out the pans I already have. I'm inspired to tear apart an IR temperature gun, place the sensor above each burner and mount the guns' readouts to the front of the hood.

compumike 12y ago
Part of the trick is getting the pan surface temperature, which (to an overhead pyrometer) is often obscured by the food in the pan. But yes, an IR thermometer is a good kitchen tool!
- Natsu 12y ago
  One thing I didn't see is how the pan's transmitter is powered? Is it drawing energy from the heat of the pan or is there a battery in there somewhere?
  - icebraining 12y ago
    The pictures on the bottom show common AA batteries inside the handle.
    - compumike 12y ago
      Two AAA batteries, user replaceable. Lasts about 9 months. (We like the thermoelectric generator concept; maybe for a future version!)

jacobkg 12y ago

Try their instructions for cooking Trader Joes 'Mandarin Orange Chicken'. So good!! Better than any I have had anywhere. I'm probably making it like once a week now.

hackuser 12y ago

There are so many empty testimonials on this thread: "mind blown" "stupendous", "there's nothing like this pan", "perfect steak every time", "predictably delicious" etc. If you use the pan, a more insightful, informative report of the technology, its use, etc. would be helpful to your fellow readers.

borski 12y ago
Fair enough. The technology is, in itself, very simple: a temperature sensor built into the bottom of a frying pan, hooked up to an iOS app over low-power bluetooth. That's it. But the technology, in this case, isn't the point. It is a very simple idea, but one that works exceedingly well in doing its job. Not every solution to a problem has to be incredibly new technology - applications of simple technology to problems that lots of people have is just as much a definition of "make something people want" as building the Oculus Rift. Whether this is a problem that lots of people have is, I suppose, what this kickstarter will help elucidate. I didn't think I had this problem, and then I used the pan. My mind was changed solely because of the record feature and instant, always-on, access to the temperature of my pan. That's all.
- hackuser 12y ago
  Borski: Thanks. But what are its strengths and weaknesses? When does it work well and where does it need work? Does it run only on iOS? How good is the pan as a frying pan? What's the construction quality? Customer service? etc etc. I did not mean to imply that it had to be cutting edge or complex tech.
  - borski 12y ago
    Fair enough. I'd say it works well for cooking protein or veg in a frying pan. It does run only in iOS. Construction quality is quite good - it's not a Calphalon pan, but it isn't the $10 Target pan either. It's somewhere in between. The construction of the handle (where the electronics are stored) is top-notch. Customer service I can't vouch for, as they're friends and live nearby, but I suspect they would make things right very quickly.

kolev 12y ago

It's been years since health-concerned people abandoned Teflon. From the pictures, it looks like this is still using Teflon.

cosmotron 12y ago

What's the plan for the Android version of the app?

ska 12y ago

An interesting idea, but a couple of things jumped out at me immediately. 1) Keeping track of surface and/or pan temperature is useful but it isn't nearly as useful as keeping track of internal temperature[1]. I'm not sure what the technical challenges are, but having one or more small wireless temperature probes would be far more useful to me than one limited use pan, which leads to ... 2) I cook a lot, but I have very few uses for a non-stick frypan, and very few uses for any pan that isn't oven safe[2]. That and the short useful lifetime of any non-stick pan (at any price range) make me wonder about this. [1] Otherwise you're just hoping your inputs are roughly equivalent to the last time you did this, or what the recipe assumes. [2] i'm making an assumption here, but couldn't find any info

compumike 12y ago
Keeping track of cooking surface time and temperature, plus knowing about what you're cooking (i.e. salmon fillet, 3/4" thick), lets us get a surprisingly good model of the internal conditions and adjust dynamically. The result is really quite delicious! We've done a lot of testing and development, and if you're following the interactive recipes in good faith, you'll get a good result when you cook. (Think about how much information even a trained chef has, using intuition about the right heat level and cooking time -- we can do better with quantitative temperature and time data, even though we can't actually poke the piece of salmon.) Pantelligent is not oven safe -- today's electronics would not operate at oven temperatures. Having temperature regulation avoids overcooking the nonstick coatings, which prolongs their life. (We just launched the Kickstarter campaign, and are in the middle of posting some FAQs right now!)
- ska 12y ago
  You hit on the key problem, which is: what if my salmon steak is 1 1/2 " thick? Or 1/2" ? Are you going to have a selection grid? What if I just took it out of a fridge? What if its starting at room temperature? A bit dry? One of the first things you need to learn to improve as a cook (professional or just out of interest) is to control temperature. And that temperature isn't what it says on a dial, it's what's happening at the interface of your food and the heat. But pan temperature is only one variable, and others are at least as important. At the end of the day, you are never cooking "a salmon steak", you are cooking this salmon steak, with all it's characteristics, on this equipment. Part of getting better as a cook is to be aware of this and always adjust what you are doing, not to your expectations of what should happen (e.g. any recipe, or what happened last time, or ...) but to what is actually happening. To that degree having a live readout of a particular pan could be useful, but not earth shattering. Anyway, I don't think it's a terrible idea and may well help people who are afraid to diverge from a recipe. Heck, it may be very useful to some people who are very experienced, I don't know. My initial reaction though is the form factor is too constraining, and the benefit too marginal, for me to get excited about it.

mariusz79 12y ago

If you want to cook your food right check the temperature of the food not temperature of the pan. And cast iron is much better than teflon.

rickdale 12y ago

For whatever its worth, I find salmon to be the easiest thing to cook. Put oven on broil high. Salmon out of fridge. Little lemon, salt, pepper, dill, in the oven, 20-25 minutes and bam best salmon I ever made or had, every time. Also a lot probably depends on the quality or age of the fish.

JonLim 12y ago

I'm constantly cooking, and temperature is a constant worry. However, "affordable" may be a bit misleading, if $169 is the discounted version, I assume this will be under $200 at retail. I can pick up a durable frying pan for $15 at most, and it does the job with my skill level. What would the real draw for me be? Exact temperature readings are great, and interactive recipes are cool, but I'm not sure it's worth 10x more than I can get a regular frying pan. (Hope I didn't come off as snarky, I'm genuinely curious.)

chewxy 12y ago
I use a cast iron skillet + handheld IR thermometer for surface temp. Very cheap solution.
- nicksergeant 12y ago
  I just bought one of these so I can cook more often with extra virgin olive oil without approaching the smoke point. At $19 for an IR thermometer, they should probably be in every kitchen next to the probe thermometer.
  - anigbrowl 12y ago
    Get in the habit of looking at the oil in the pan. As it approaches the smoke point, its refractive index will change and its viscosity will decrease, giving a dimpled appearance. This is due to convection cells from the heating; it's easier to see in olive oil because it's relatively thick and dark compared to other liquids or light oils. In a round, level pan, you'll get a pleasing hexagonal pattern. Once you have nice stable convection cells you're ready to cook. After a while you'll get used to your individual pans and how they transfer heat, to the point that you don't need to think about how to adjust the heat any more. Likewise watching the food itself will eventually tell you most of what you need to know about when it's done.
    - baudehlo 12y ago
      Note that this is a lot easier with Gas than with Electric due to the heat retention of the rings, at least I found. You can kill the heat really quickly with Gas (which is why no commercial kitchen uses electric).

qsymmachus 12y ago

This is pretty neat, but why not just learn how to cook? This is the kind of idea only Silicon Valley could cook up – if you've eaten nothing but catered meals your young adult life, you have no idea how to cook eggs without burning them. The solution is obviously a bluetooth enabled pan.

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icebraining 12y ago
We'll see. As a citizen of a relatively poor European countries which owns a Thermomix for every 12 households, I wouldn't bet on it being a flop.
- hackuser 12y ago
  What is a Thermomix? Wikipedia gives me the idea that it's a multifunction cooking machine, but leaves a lot of holes.
  - icebraining 12y ago
    That's essentially it. It's essentially a machine that combines a blender, mixer, steamer, slow cooker, a scale and a timer.
    - hackuser 12y ago
      Do you just drop in the raw ingredients and it processes them through those devices in serial? It is just all of those devices on one machine, no different than buying them separately? Thanks for explaining!
      - icebraining 12y ago
        It can combine functions, e.g. mix while cooking. But as far as I know, it can't do anything that you couldn't do with separate devices (like using a hand mixer and a pot), it's just more convenient.

DanBC 12y ago

Looks amazing! I uaven't watched the video yet. Does it work on induction hobs? Is there an option to use Celsius? EDIT: is it aluminum? That won't work on induction hobs. Also, if anyone knows of good quality tiny non-stick pans that work on induction hobs, on sale in US, I'd be interested.

compumike 12y ago
Thanks! Currently: no and yes. (Posting more FAQs on the page now!)

alkonaut 12y ago

How can the pan know how cooked my steak is? If there was a spike at the center that measured the inner temperature of the meat, then I'd understand. But from just pan surface temp and time it must only be guessing? It would have to be fed (very) exact measurements of both meat thickness and initial temperature, right? The difference between 55 and 57 deg (C) steak is huge, so presumably you'd need to know the initial temp with a similar confidence? On the website, I can't see the app having inputs for exact thicknesses/temperatures? A comparison: even in an oven where you can set a perfect temperature, there is no way the oven temp + time will give you "perfect steak every time" (unless the oven temp is the target temp)? How is this different? Having the pan report its surface temp is neat of course, but wouldn't a tiny BT pinboard pin-style probe instead of a pan surface temp probe remove a lot of the variables involved, and report the thing I'm actually interested in (inner temp), rather than the pan. Edit: the temperature I'm looking for in a frying pan when cooking fish or meat is usually "as hot as it goes". Pan just to sear, and let the temperature be sorted out in Sous Vide or low temp oven.

jbob2000 12y ago

Can I wash it?

icki 12y ago

Interesting, seems to be competing with the Palate Smart Grill http://palatehome.com/ http://palatehome.com/

pbhjpbhj 12y ago
There seems to be very little info on that page other than that it's a grill of some form. No video?

chewxy 12y ago

This is a cool idea. I personally use a IR temperature gauge for the surface my pan (I thought of wiring it up once, but it was too fiddly for me), and a wired therm for internal meat temp. I'm currently in two minds about backing this. On the one hand, it frees me from using multiple devices. On the other hand, I already have a solution, and this solution is exactly the same as the one I have (I probably have more accurate readings). And this solution is a lot more expensive (199 for shipping to Australia) than my current solution An innovation I'd like to see is something like sous vide for a frypan, where the pan temperature automatically changes (this is hard because well, I like a flame stove too)

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coldcode 12y ago

Interesting. What I wonder is how it compares to using a PIC which also does precise temp control (though not in an app obviously).

LukeB_UK 12y ago

I feel that this actually takes away from the experience of cooking. When I cook, I've always learned from playing around and experimenting, I only ever roughly read recipes and never follow one without a little change here or there. With this, people won't learn to cook, they'll learn to do x when y happens. That's not learning to cook, that's being a robot.

dominotw 12y ago
I don't want to learn to cook. I just want to eat cheap/healthy/homemade food.
pjmax 12y ago
It isn't learning at all, the users are just cooking their food, I don't see a problem in that if that's the desired goal.
- cm2012 12y ago
  It's a gateway tool into good cooking - I can see users actually making something tasty and impressing their friends for the first time with this. That will make them want to learn more.
morto091 12y ago
If the end result is better, people will use it. At some point in history people were probably emotionally satisfied by knitting their own clothes. I'm sure some still do this for fun.
compumike 12y ago
If you love experimenting, Pantelligent gives you repeatability and data that you've never had before (Freestyle Mode), and the ability to walk away from the stove or get distracted and still keep an eye on your meal. You're still the chef -- Pantelligent is just a powerful tool.
jkestner 12y ago
"The experience of cooking" - this can be applied to most of the technologies we develop. (i.e. does the Kindle take away from the experience of reading?) But it's not just as simple as "better is better", either. If you want total convenience, you use a microwave, but it's not the do-all kitchen appliance that people originally thought it would be (see: microwave recipe books). If you want total experience and the joy of making something for your family with your own hands, you use traditional tools. Perhaps this pan meets some middle need, or provides a gateway for people who wouldn't cook otherwise, or perhaps it's an expensive novelty. But it's interesting to think about what we're losing when we replace old ways of doing things, and whether any of it's worth keeping around even if it isn't the most efficient way of doing things. The Betty Crocker add-egg trick tells us that there's a big emotional component wrapped up in this that isn't present in most product categories. (I make http://supermechanical.com/range http://supermechanical.com/range and enjoy Soylent, so the balance of new cooking interactions vs integration into an existing kitchen flow is something I think about.)

muraiki 12y ago

As a colorblind person, this is actually quite useful. It's probably significantly easier to use this than constantly checking using a meat thermometer (and needing to wash the thermometer between checks lest you contaminate cooked meat with residue from when it was raw) edit: To clarify, trying to cook meat by sight as a colorblind person (at least for me) typically results in either raw meat or dried out overcooked meat.

compumike 12y ago
Awesome! We hadn't thought of that specific use case, but that's great!

pjmorris 12y ago

How closed-source/open-source are the recipes? Are they stored in something like hRecipe [1] format? Can users edit them, or is that held within the company? [1] http://microformats.org/wiki/h-recipe http://microformats.org/wiki/h-recipe

matthewowen 12y ago

I would have assumed PG had eaten at decent restaurants, so the endorsement is weird. You can get OK salmon in a frying pan, but like pretty much every protein, you'll probably get better results with sous vide + a quick sear/blowtorch. Conveniently, it's also easier than frying, requires less hands-on time, and is tremendously repeatable. And you can now buy all the gear you need for about the price of one of these pans!

xallthey 12y ago
I have both and like both! I'll pick my weapon depending on time constraints (typically 55 minutes sous vide ~= 15 minutes on pan). The pan is also super repeatable.
chewxy 12y ago
It's harder to get a crispy skin with blowtorch. I pan sear my salmon skin post sous vide anyway - get the pan up to 220C - 250 and 30s skin down. Bam. Crispy skin.
legohead 12y ago
you can sous vide with ziplocs[1] and a temperature gauge. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qi-tyQvRgJw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qi-tyQvRgJw
compumike 12y ago
Honestly, we've tried sous vide before. Pantelligent is tastier. For many practical reasons, I believe that sous vide is not likely to become a standard household kitchen item. A frying pan and smartphone already are. See also comments here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8626599 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8626599

lifeformed 12y ago

The bluetooth aspect seems over-the-top; I'd rather just have a pan with a small display in the handle that shows the temperature.

compumike 12y ago
That would be simpler, but you would miss out on the biggest benefits of Pantelligent: one is being able to walk away or be doing something else and still get notifications. Two is the adaptive recipes. But you can certainly use "Freestyle Mode" and get the effect you're looking for!

wamatt 12y ago

Love the concept! This would be perfect for someone like me, that likes to eat home cooked meals, but loathes the time it takes to prepare. One thing however, I'm somewhat surprised to see no apparent mention of PFOA and PTFE being used? [1][2] The price point of $199, puts this product squarely in the high-end of cookware, where Teflon based non-stick has fallen out of favor these days. A smart pan that competes with Le Creuset's increasingly popular enamel pans, would be amazing. [3] [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfluorooctanoic_acid#Health_concerns http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perfluorooctanoic_acid#Health_c... [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytetrafluoroethylene#Safety http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytetrafluoroethylene#Safety [3]http://www.lecreuset.com/cookware/skillets---saute-pans http://www.lecreuset.com/cookware/skillets---saute-pans

compumike 12y ago
Thanks! Non-stick pans are great. They're easy to cook on and clean. By actually knowing the temperature of the pan, you can avoid the deterioration of non-stick coatings that can occur in (non-smart) pans when they are unintentionally brought to very high temperatures.

unchocked 12y ago

This is almost the right solution. The right solution would include an integrated heating element, a smart pan-hotplate fusion.

lightblade 12y ago
Yup, preferably an separable induction heating surface that can be paired with the pan to intelligently control the temperature. Separate so that you can flip that pancake/burger.

malandrew 12y ago

Embed a sensor in an All Clad and I'm interested. The heat control and even heat distribution you get in a high quality multi-ply pan with a copper ply matter.

compumike 12y ago
The value proposition is similar, in some ways: better heating control through engineering. But Pantelligent actually delivers on that.

marc0 12y ago

Sorry, but that's a total overshoot. I definitivly won't sit next to my pan, monitoring its temperature on my smartphone to find the "perfect" moment when to stir the chopped onions. I would, maybe, if I did some extremely temperature sensitive chemical experiment. But not in my kitchen. And WFT: there are batteries in the handle? It's a joke, yes? A pan should be the perfect thing for energy harvesting, which would be at least to some extent innovative.

compumike 12y ago
That's the point -- you don't have to sit next to your pan monitoring anything at all. The Pantelligent app does that for you (and then sends you alerts), and it does it quite well! Even if you're an experienced chef already, this frees you up to do other things. Yes, batteries are great! Adding a thermoelectric generator is a possibility -- the power requirement is certainly met -- but it adds significant complexity.

mangecoeur 12y ago

Talk about over-engineering! Anyone can cook decently with a bit of care and attention. You're better off buying good quality ingredients and just taking the time to learn and experiment.

frownie 12y ago

Geek's dream... First, instead of providing tools, one could help people to develop taste. Many accept overcooked chicken or fish because they just catch the spices flavours. They can't judge what a well cooked dish is. Dry chicken is an abomination... 2/ The thickness of a salmon filet is everything but regular. So cooking it correctly involves a bit more than temperature handling 3/ As said, you don't cook "a steak", you cook "this steak". That's the thing. Cooking a good steak involves so many thing : quality of the steak (forget about supermarket), quality and handling of the fat (Gordon Ramsay once made a very good explanation on how to use butter on youtube), make sure the steak rest enough time off the heat before serving, cook for steak's colour first (so it is beautiful) and then cook for bloody/well done/cooked. Cook long and not short. Don't use a fork to manipulate the steak. Don't turn the steak upside down to often. With an autoamted pan you may sure cook a steak but you won't know why you did it right... 4/ If your problem is overcooking or undercooking a steak, learn to touch the steak. Hard means overcooked, soft means undercooked. With a bit of practice you'll be able to make good steaks, not 3 star michelin ones, but good ones. 5/ For steaks (not fish) you can buy cast iron skillets. These are super cheap (15 euros here !)and they live forever. But you have to learn to master/clean/season them (that's your old grand ma stuff, but knowledge is lost so it's pretty hard) 6/ The salmon on the web site looks super over cooked to me (it s top side is super borw and just below it's all white) 7/ said before : a fryin pan that doesn't go to the oven is useless. Countless times where I fry a piece of meat and finishes it in the oven where I can get the temperature righ everywhere. 8/ will the pan stand the "deglaçage" ? That's when you throw a cold liquid in the pan to grab all the softly burned piece of meat/fat. that's super important to making sauces. 9/ Will it stand the dish washer ? 10/ Where's the fun ? I mean, if you buy this because you can't find the time necessary to learn to cook, and thus, learn to appreciate good cooking, what's the point ? Do yourself a favour don't buy the pan, look for a good restaurant (and at the price of the pan you certainly can find a good one) and ask the chef to prepare a good steak for you. You'll learn something.