4 ms·

We've already been over this ground more than once: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=733166 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=733166 http://news.ycombina

by xiaoma 17y ago

We've already been over this ground more than once: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=733166 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=733166 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=783074 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=783074 Summary: 100,000+ person study found that men who ran two or more marathons per year were 41 percent less likely to suffer from high blood pressure, 32 percent less likely to have high cholesterol, and 87 percent less likely to be diabetic than non-marathoners. Those who ran only one marathon every two to five years also had significantly lower risk for these conditions than non-marathoners. Other studies link long-distance cardio with neurogenesis, increased life expectancy, and more.

kingkongrevenge 17y ago
> 41 percent less likely to suffer from high blood pressure Compared to whom? Serious racquet sport competitors? Power lifters? No, compared to couch potatoes with lousy diets. Well no shit. That's not the point.
- xiaoma 17y ago
  Endurance athletes fare significantly better than basketball, soccer and sprinting athletes, who fare better than power athletes, who fare better than couch potatoes. In terms of life expectancy, endurance athletes such as marathoners and cross-country skiers live about 2 years longer than sprinters, 4 years longer than power lifters and 6 years longer than the general populace. http://www.mdconsult.com/das/citation/body/163630869-2/jorg=journal&source=MI&sp=2355041&sid=0/N/2355041/1.html?issn= http://www.mdconsult.com/das/citation/body/163630869-2/jorg=...
  - kingkongrevenge 17y ago
    The link is worthless. Some researchers say runners live long ... because their model says runners live long. Tautology. Why didn't they just look at dead olympic athletes? That would be an interesting and potentially worthwhile study. Actually, I know why: that study would have been hard work whereas for this garbage all they had to do was plug a canned data set into some silly unverified pharma model they tweaked for their own agenda. http://www.theheart.org/article/243897.do http://www.theheart.org/article/243897.do Endurance sports can mess up your heart rhythm. Here's the first google result for "runners die young": http://eurheartj.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/reprint/ehn273v1.pdf http://eurheartj.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/reprint/ehn273v1.pdf "The current report demonstrates a high prevalence of advanced coronary atherosclerosis and myocardial scar formation in see- mingly healthy marathon runners aged >50 years."
    - xiaoma 17y ago
      I've repeatedly cited gigantic peer-reviewed studies including the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition (1999) one in which participants were split into many groups based upon differing levels of activity from sedentary to daily runners. Each one has shown dose-dependent gains from cardio-vascular exercise. And in each case, you've shrugged off the research and then come back with something like this. From your links: "Heidbüchel's study included only a small, highly selective population of endurance athletes, predominantly cyclists, who engage in a particular type of strain, with preexisting arrhythmias." So even when you specifically searched for "runners die young", it came back with a paper that states that marathon running is part of a healthy lifestyle and then goes on to talk about possible risks for those who race without sufficient training or who are trying to undo decades of unhealthy living. Over half of the participants were former smokers. The paper does not in any way claim that "endurance sports can mess up your heart rhythm" nor is the quotation you took out of context representative. In fact, it said: "Marathon running is part of a healthy lifestyle. There is overwhelming evidence for the cardiovascular protective effects of physical activity." What is it with this? What ax to grind is so important that it's worth posting misleading, disingenuous summaries of research you find by googling for your already chosen conclusion? As I asked last time, Can you refer me to any peer-reviewed research linking sprint training or weight training with equal or greater benefit in any of the health indicators that Paul Williams's 100,000 person study found distance running improved?
      - kingkongrevenge 17y ago
        Your studies are all observational garbage, as were the two links I posted, more to make a point than anything. And they both did in fact raise questions about damage caused by distance training. They just couched their language with platitudes about how healthy distance training is, presumably to ward off concerted attack. I don't have an ax to grind. I literally don't want people trying to get in shape to waste large amounts of time and hurt their knees and so on doing long distance running when it is so much inferior for losing weight and maintaining fitness. I want to steer them in the right direction. They will have so much more success training in other ways. It is common knowledge at this point that interval training, sprints, and properly done strength training produce all the same cardiovascular health benefits as distance training but without the repetitive stress and other physiological stresses of long distance. Also without the huge time investment. Also with much better body fat percentage measurements. You can use google as well as I can. http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/06/05/for-heart-health-sprints-match-endurance-training/ http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/06/05/for-heart-health-sp... http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/health-news/2008/11/01/short-sprints-could-be-better-for-you-91466-22160950/ http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/health-news/2008/11/01/sho...

by xiaoma 17y ago

kingkongrevenge 17y ago

> 41 percent less likely to suffer from high blood pressure Compared to whom? Serious racquet sport competitors? Power lifters? No, compared to couch potatoes with lousy diets. Well no shit. That's not the point.

xiaoma 17y ago
Endurance athletes fare significantly better than basketball, soccer and sprinting athletes, who fare better than power athletes, who fare better than couch potatoes. In terms of life expectancy, endurance athletes such as marathoners and cross-country skiers live about 2 years longer than sprinters, 4 years longer than power lifters and 6 years longer than the general populace. http://www.mdconsult.com/das/citation/body/163630869-2/jorg=journal&source=MI&sp=2355041&sid=0/N/2355041/1.html?issn= http://www.mdconsult.com/das/citation/body/163630869-2/jorg=...
- kingkongrevenge 17y ago
  The link is worthless. Some researchers say runners live long ... because their model says runners live long. Tautology. Why didn't they just look at dead olympic athletes? That would be an interesting and potentially worthwhile study. Actually, I know why: that study would have been hard work whereas for this garbage all they had to do was plug a canned data set into some silly unverified pharma model they tweaked for their own agenda. http://www.theheart.org/article/243897.do http://www.theheart.org/article/243897.do Endurance sports can mess up your heart rhythm. Here's the first google result for "runners die young": http://eurheartj.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/reprint/ehn273v1.pdf http://eurheartj.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/reprint/ehn273v1.pdf "The current report demonstrates a high prevalence of advanced coronary atherosclerosis and myocardial scar formation in see- mingly healthy marathon runners aged >50 years."
  - xiaoma 17y ago
    I've repeatedly cited gigantic peer-reviewed studies including the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition (1999) one in which participants were split into many groups based upon differing levels of activity from sedentary to daily runners. Each one has shown dose-dependent gains from cardio-vascular exercise. And in each case, you've shrugged off the research and then come back with something like this. From your links: "Heidbüchel's study included only a small, highly selective population of endurance athletes, predominantly cyclists, who engage in a particular type of strain, with preexisting arrhythmias." So even when you specifically searched for "runners die young", it came back with a paper that states that marathon running is part of a healthy lifestyle and then goes on to talk about possible risks for those who race without sufficient training or who are trying to undo decades of unhealthy living. Over half of the participants were former smokers. The paper does not in any way claim that "endurance sports can mess up your heart rhythm" nor is the quotation you took out of context representative. In fact, it said: "Marathon running is part of a healthy lifestyle. There is overwhelming evidence for the cardiovascular protective effects of physical activity." What is it with this? What ax to grind is so important that it's worth posting misleading, disingenuous summaries of research you find by googling for your already chosen conclusion? As I asked last time, Can you refer me to any peer-reviewed research linking sprint training or weight training with equal or greater benefit in any of the health indicators that Paul Williams's 100,000 person study found distance running improved?
    - kingkongrevenge 17y ago
      Your studies are all observational garbage, as were the two links I posted, more to make a point than anything. And they both did in fact raise questions about damage caused by distance training. They just couched their language with platitudes about how healthy distance training is, presumably to ward off concerted attack. I don't have an ax to grind. I literally don't want people trying to get in shape to waste large amounts of time and hurt their knees and so on doing long distance running when it is so much inferior for losing weight and maintaining fitness. I want to steer them in the right direction. They will have so much more success training in other ways. It is common knowledge at this point that interval training, sprints, and properly done strength training produce all the same cardiovascular health benefits as distance training but without the repetitive stress and other physiological stresses of long distance. Also without the huge time investment. Also with much better body fat percentage measurements. You can use google as well as I can. http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/06/05/for-heart-health-sprints-match-endurance-training/ http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/06/05/for-heart-health-sp... http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/health-news/2008/11/01/short-sprints-could-be-better-for-you-91466-22160950/ http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/health-news/2008/11/01/sho...