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I work in a small prop-shop doing HFT. Most of the guys there are manual traders, and I've seen the same guys there for several years making steady money. I don

I work in a small prop-shop doing HFT. Most of the guys there are manual traders, and I've seen the same guys there for several years making steady money. I don't think this is bs or amateur hour, let me explain why. It is essentially the small (independent) traders that can make a win when the big guys (hedge funds, pension funds) are moving their positions around. Imagine a dude on a surfboard enjoying the wake of an oil tanker and you get the idea. Just don't get too close :-)

iaw 12y ago
Exactly, small moves that George Soros wouldn't blink at are the bread and butter of these guys. I think of it like a sea of fish, these guys are almost the smallest tuna out there and they find the food the bigger guys don't want.
FLUX-YOU 12y ago
Any suggestions for HFT programming reading material and background knowledge for that kind of work?
- mathgenius 12y ago
  I learned most of it on the job, from the masters. So I don't really know about the literature. The non-finance part of it involves alot of real-time stuff, which is found in game programming, and also audio software. Also, you could read up on networking, TCP/IP, etc. As for risk control (by risk I mean bugs) I often wonder if there are lessons from eg. the nuclear industry, on how to keep complex, highly-strung systems on track. That's another thing I learned on the job, and not always the easy way :-)
  - kasey_junk 12y ago
    The problem with using nuclear industry systems lessons is that the nuclear industry moves exceedingly slowly (for good reason) but trading needs to move fast. Opportunities exist for a very short time, so being able to find them, exploit them, and not blow yourself up in the process is the trick. A trick not many folks have proven they can do over the long haul.
  - FLUX-YOU 12y ago
    Cool, how'd you get into the industry if you don't mind me asking? Math background and/or degree I'm guessing by the username? Thanks for the response.
- seanwessmith 12y ago
  The book Flash Boys provides a solid understanding of how HFT got started. http://www.amazon.com/Flash-Boys-Michael-Lewis/dp/0393244660 http://www.amazon.com/Flash-Boys-Michael-Lewis/dp/0393244660
  - kasey_junk 12y ago
    No it doesn't. Everyone I know with HFT industry experience that has read it (including myself) has panned it. It is possibly the worst thing you can read if you are interested in how HFT works. "Dark Pools" has it's own faults but for narrative non-fiction it is the only game in town.

iaw 12y ago

Exactly, small moves that George Soros wouldn't blink at are the bread and butter of these guys. I think of it like a sea of fish, these guys are almost the smallest tuna out there and they find the food the bigger guys don't want.

FLUX-YOU 12y ago

Any suggestions for HFT programming reading material and background knowledge for that kind of work?

mathgenius 12y ago
I learned most of it on the job, from the masters. So I don't really know about the literature. The non-finance part of it involves alot of real-time stuff, which is found in game programming, and also audio software. Also, you could read up on networking, TCP/IP, etc. As for risk control (by risk I mean bugs) I often wonder if there are lessons from eg. the nuclear industry, on how to keep complex, highly-strung systems on track. That's another thing I learned on the job, and not always the easy way :-)
- kasey_junk 12y ago
  The problem with using nuclear industry systems lessons is that the nuclear industry moves exceedingly slowly (for good reason) but trading needs to move fast. Opportunities exist for a very short time, so being able to find them, exploit them, and not blow yourself up in the process is the trick. A trick not many folks have proven they can do over the long haul.
- FLUX-YOU 12y ago
  Cool, how'd you get into the industry if you don't mind me asking? Math background and/or degree I'm guessing by the username? Thanks for the response.
seanwessmith 12y ago
The book Flash Boys provides a solid understanding of how HFT got started. http://www.amazon.com/Flash-Boys-Michael-Lewis/dp/0393244660 http://www.amazon.com/Flash-Boys-Michael-Lewis/dp/0393244660
- kasey_junk 12y ago
  No it doesn't. Everyone I know with HFT industry experience that has read it (including myself) has panned it. It is possibly the worst thing you can read if you are interested in how HFT works. "Dark Pools" has it's own faults but for narrative non-fiction it is the only game in town.