8 ms·

Apple iOffer (Offer letter done the Apple way)

150 points by sbhat7 17y ago

timdorr 17y ago
And yet us iPhone developers get the shaft. I can't help but think whatever part of the corporate culture that breeds this kind of stuff got cut off near the iTunes Connect department.
- borism 17y ago
  it's not just developers. it's also partners, subcontractors and, primarily, users. I also wonder whether Sun Danyong was treated as nicely?
- cubicle67 17y ago
  So, you're an iPhone dev getting the shaft hey? Prey tell, what do you think Apple owe you now?
- unalone 17y ago
  Okay. Tim. I understand why you're mad about the iPhone development situation. I would like to offer you, however, the following points to give you a teensy bit of perspective: * 99.9% of all applications submitted are approved without controversy. * The App Store is still new. It's slightly more than a year old. Therefore, it's still got glitches in its processes, very obviously. * For something so young, it's exploded in use. Two billion app downloads in just over a year? That's insane. That's so insane I doubt anybody can quite process it mentally. * Therefore, every small error in Apple's process has been magnified to the point it looks like a gaping wound. * Apple is certainly working on this, and putting a lot of effort into it. * Apple won't TELL you they're working on this until they've already come up with what they believe is an iron solution, because Apple doesn't like admitting their ideas don't spring fully-grown from the head of Zeus. * Apple's got an amazing track record, and so it's logical to think that within a year or two they will figure out how to suck a lot less. That's a reasonable amount of time to give them. * No excuse about "I can't make a living reliably until they fix this", because anybody insane enough to try and make a living from a brand-new piece of software ought to at least know the risks they made.
  - boucher 17y ago
    Do you work on the iTunes Store or in the Apple Developer program? If not, I question the authority of your "99.9%" claim. As far as all of the other arguments, they are very touchy feely. "The App Store is new" but it's built on top of a store that's been around for 7 years. And that store already processes billions of transactions annually, so those numbers don't strike me as crippling. I don't know what Apple is or isn't doing, but I do know what they've admitted to publicly, and I do know dozens of (well respected) developers who have had issues with the app store. I also know that Apple has lied about the store in the past. So, I think some criticism is deserved here. As far as relating it to the employee paperwork, that was absurd. They've been using the same paperwork for years. It's completely unrelated.
    - unalone 17y ago
      Selling an mp3 file is different from selling a bundled application that contains a slew of different features and functions. Apple has a whole bunch of things they don't want appearing on applications, because they want to control the coding environment. A song requires no control. An app requires a lot. So no, this isn't something that's been around for 7 years—though I recall iTunes store having its own problems when it launched. I do know dozens of (well respected) developers who have had issues with the app store. Dozens out of thousands of developers. 99.9% might have been a stretch, I don't know the exact numbers. 99% wouldn't have been. So, I think some criticism is deserved here. There's a difference between criticizing Apple and hijacking a conversation about something entirely different to rant about the App Store. There are critical essays about the latter every day or two. We can complain about Apple there.
  - timdorr 17y ago
    I meant the iTunes Connect application, not the review process. It's a hodgepodge of of a system that doesn't seem to have gotten the same care and attention that most other areas of Apple's business get. Especially considering the tens of thousands of people that view it regularly.
johnnybgoode 17y ago
That does indeed look very nice. I've heard some not-so-great things about actually being an Apple employee, though. Can anyone comment?
- chrischen 17y ago
  Getting yelled at (and terrified) by Steve Jobs? At least that's what I saw in Pirates of Silicon Valley.
  - borism 17y ago
    yeah, the glorious days... now I guess it's more like getting yelled at and terrified by your average middle manager.
- chrisrhee 17y ago
  I contracted on-site in Cupertino for a year. They have 35,000 employees, so if you're looking to join a tiny start-up where everyone is 23 years old and best friends, you're not going to find that at Apple. Actually, I used the large crowds of employees to my advantage and basically "snuck" into the offices every day for the last few months I worked there when my security badge stopped working (long/uninteresting story.) I've never worked for a big corporation, but working for Apple is probably like working for any other company with that size of a workforce. Some people love their job, some people are bored and a lot of it depends on which group/department you're in. I was a little turned off by the cubicle/office farms in some of the buildings, which are probably setup like that due to security. I saw Steve Jobs a few times at the cafeteria. But he did not yell at me. Or anyone else.
  - gjm11 17y ago
    and basically "snuck" into the offices every day for the last few months: In the unlikely event that you haven't already read http://www.pacifict.com/Story/ http://www.pacifict.com/Story/, you should. As should anyone else who doesn't immediately know what story that is from what I just said. It's simultaneously inspiring and horrifying. (More of the former.)
aw3c2 17y ago
This is, as it appears to be, a small, light folder with a few pieces of paper in it. Easily under a pound, it feels lighter than an iPod. Steve Jobs is the messiah and Apple his gospel.
rayboyd 17y ago
Company that is renowned for its brand-centric business practices uses branded paperwork. It must be a slow news day.
- unalone 17y ago
  Did you see the headings on those pages? "Ah, paperwork." "Ready, Set, Go." Details like that fascinate me. It suggests that even when making a document that very few people see, Apple sweats the small details. Also, it's not branded paperwork. It's well-designed paperwork. There's a difference, though I suppose if you're the sort of person who still thinks a Mac is just a "branded computer" we'll have to disagree here. Also also, I'm going to rant a second at you, because Apple is not brand-centric. I've got a Samsung phone that uses AT&T. The word Samsung appears three times on the phone's hardware, the word AT&T twice. When I open the phone, the AT&T logo is on the front screen and the back screen, and then it remains in the top bar no matter what I do. THAT'S branding for you. It's desperate, ugly branding. Meanwhile, if I total up ALL the Apple products I have with me, and that's a power cord, a laptop, an iPod touch, and an iPod cord, the Apple logo appears a total of three times, once a product; the name Apple appears a total of three times, once a product; I see the Apple logo briefly when I start up my Macbook Pro, but not when I open my iPod touch. Mac products are very not branded, compared to their competitors' products. The thing is, Apple's brand has a reputation, unlike Samsung/Motorola/Nokia or Dell/HP, and so when you see an Apple logo it means something. When you see a Windows logo plastered on the front of your laptop you don't call it "brand-centric" because nobody cares about the Windows brand. So when people complain about Apple's logo being ubiquitous on their product, I scoff, because the complaint's really that Apple made stuff good enough that people recognize the name Apple over their competitors.
  - rayboyd 17y ago
    Let's be clear. My comment was made in jest at this subject appearing on HN and not at Apple. This was in no way suggested. ---- Branding is much more than logo and where it is placed on an object. It is an entire experience targeting the consumer, employee and stake holder. It is entirely about product recognition and generating brand equity, which in turn provides real value to the business. Apple are masters of this. These documents are sample proof of this at work. It is all part of the Brand Experience. Apple are about as brand-centric as it gets. They are a case study on how to manage a brand properly. Perhaps next time you should familiarize yourself with the concept of branding and all it entails before you direct an unnecessary and ill advised rant (your words) at me or anyone else. Familiarity of the individuals background and knowledge of the subject might also be a good idea. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brand http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brand I wrote this on my 24" iMac by the way.
known 17y ago
Dick Hardt's brilliant presentation on Identity 2.0 is on similar principles. http://identity20.com/media/OSCON2005/ http://identity20.com/media/OSCON2005/
daniel-cussen 17y ago
It's very classy and has good production value. Really reminds me of the Caltech letter of admission.
joezydeco 17y ago
Okay, so what do their bong letters look like now? I've got one from the 1991 recession that's pretty nice. Let's compare!

150 points by sbhat7 17y ago

And yet us iPhone developers get the shaft. I can't help but think whatever part of the corporate culture that breeds this kind of stuff got cut off near the iTunes Connect department.

borism 17y ago
it's not just developers. it's also partners, subcontractors and, primarily, users. I also wonder whether Sun Danyong was treated as nicely?
cubicle67 17y ago
So, you're an iPhone dev getting the shaft hey? Prey tell, what do you think Apple owe you now?
unalone 17y ago
Okay. Tim. I understand why you're mad about the iPhone development situation. I would like to offer you, however, the following points to give you a teensy bit of perspective: * 99.9% of all applications submitted are approved without controversy. * The App Store is still new. It's slightly more than a year old. Therefore, it's still got glitches in its processes, very obviously. * For something so young, it's exploded in use. Two billion app downloads in just over a year? That's insane. That's so insane I doubt anybody can quite process it mentally. * Therefore, every small error in Apple's process has been magnified to the point it looks like a gaping wound. * Apple is certainly working on this, and putting a lot of effort into it. * Apple won't TELL you they're working on this until they've already come up with what they believe is an iron solution, because Apple doesn't like admitting their ideas don't spring fully-grown from the head of Zeus. * Apple's got an amazing track record, and so it's logical to think that within a year or two they will figure out how to suck a lot less. That's a reasonable amount of time to give them. * No excuse about "I can't make a living reliably until they fix this", because anybody insane enough to try and make a living from a brand-new piece of software ought to at least know the risks they made.
- boucher 17y ago
  Do you work on the iTunes Store or in the Apple Developer program? If not, I question the authority of your "99.9%" claim. As far as all of the other arguments, they are very touchy feely. "The App Store is new" but it's built on top of a store that's been around for 7 years. And that store already processes billions of transactions annually, so those numbers don't strike me as crippling. I don't know what Apple is or isn't doing, but I do know what they've admitted to publicly, and I do know dozens of (well respected) developers who have had issues with the app store. I also know that Apple has lied about the store in the past. So, I think some criticism is deserved here. As far as relating it to the employee paperwork, that was absurd. They've been using the same paperwork for years. It's completely unrelated.
  - unalone 17y ago
    Selling an mp3 file is different from selling a bundled application that contains a slew of different features and functions. Apple has a whole bunch of things they don't want appearing on applications, because they want to control the coding environment. A song requires no control. An app requires a lot. So no, this isn't something that's been around for 7 years—though I recall iTunes store having its own problems when it launched. I do know dozens of (well respected) developers who have had issues with the app store. Dozens out of thousands of developers. 99.9% might have been a stretch, I don't know the exact numbers. 99% wouldn't have been. So, I think some criticism is deserved here. There's a difference between criticizing Apple and hijacking a conversation about something entirely different to rant about the App Store. There are critical essays about the latter every day or two. We can complain about Apple there.
- timdorr 17y ago
  I meant the iTunes Connect application, not the review process. It's a hodgepodge of of a system that doesn't seem to have gotten the same care and attention that most other areas of Apple's business get. Especially considering the tens of thousands of people that view it regularly.

johnnybgoode 17y ago

That does indeed look very nice. I've heard some not-so-great things about actually being an Apple employee, though. Can anyone comment?

chrischen 17y ago
Getting yelled at (and terrified) by Steve Jobs? At least that's what I saw in Pirates of Silicon Valley.
- borism 17y ago
  yeah, the glorious days... now I guess it's more like getting yelled at and terrified by your average middle manager.
chrisrhee 17y ago
I contracted on-site in Cupertino for a year. They have 35,000 employees, so if you're looking to join a tiny start-up where everyone is 23 years old and best friends, you're not going to find that at Apple. Actually, I used the large crowds of employees to my advantage and basically "snuck" into the offices every day for the last few months I worked there when my security badge stopped working (long/uninteresting story.) I've never worked for a big corporation, but working for Apple is probably like working for any other company with that size of a workforce. Some people love their job, some people are bored and a lot of it depends on which group/department you're in. I was a little turned off by the cubicle/office farms in some of the buildings, which are probably setup like that due to security. I saw Steve Jobs a few times at the cafeteria. But he did not yell at me. Or anyone else.
- gjm11 17y ago
  and basically "snuck" into the offices every day for the last few months: In the unlikely event that you haven't already read http://www.pacifict.com/Story/ http://www.pacifict.com/Story/, you should. As should anyone else who doesn't immediately know what story that is from what I just said. It's simultaneously inspiring and horrifying. (More of the former.)

aw3c2 17y ago

This is, as it appears to be, a small, light folder with a few pieces of paper in it. Easily under a pound, it feels lighter than an iPod. Steve Jobs is the messiah and Apple his gospel.

rayboyd 17y ago

Company that is renowned for its brand-centric business practices uses branded paperwork. It must be a slow news day.

unalone 17y ago
Did you see the headings on those pages? "Ah, paperwork." "Ready, Set, Go." Details like that fascinate me. It suggests that even when making a document that very few people see, Apple sweats the small details. Also, it's not branded paperwork. It's well-designed paperwork. There's a difference, though I suppose if you're the sort of person who still thinks a Mac is just a "branded computer" we'll have to disagree here. Also also, I'm going to rant a second at you, because Apple is not brand-centric. I've got a Samsung phone that uses AT&T. The word Samsung appears three times on the phone's hardware, the word AT&T twice. When I open the phone, the AT&T logo is on the front screen and the back screen, and then it remains in the top bar no matter what I do. THAT'S branding for you. It's desperate, ugly branding. Meanwhile, if I total up ALL the Apple products I have with me, and that's a power cord, a laptop, an iPod touch, and an iPod cord, the Apple logo appears a total of three times, once a product; the name Apple appears a total of three times, once a product; I see the Apple logo briefly when I start up my Macbook Pro, but not when I open my iPod touch. Mac products are very not branded, compared to their competitors' products. The thing is, Apple's brand has a reputation, unlike Samsung/Motorola/Nokia or Dell/HP, and so when you see an Apple logo it means something. When you see a Windows logo plastered on the front of your laptop you don't call it "brand-centric" because nobody cares about the Windows brand. So when people complain about Apple's logo being ubiquitous on their product, I scoff, because the complaint's really that Apple made stuff good enough that people recognize the name Apple over their competitors.
- rayboyd 17y ago
  Let's be clear. My comment was made in jest at this subject appearing on HN and not at Apple. This was in no way suggested. ---- Branding is much more than logo and where it is placed on an object. It is an entire experience targeting the consumer, employee and stake holder. It is entirely about product recognition and generating brand equity, which in turn provides real value to the business. Apple are masters of this. These documents are sample proof of this at work. It is all part of the Brand Experience. Apple are about as brand-centric as it gets. They are a case study on how to manage a brand properly. Perhaps next time you should familiarize yourself with the concept of branding and all it entails before you direct an unnecessary and ill advised rant (your words) at me or anyone else. Familiarity of the individuals background and knowledge of the subject might also be a good idea. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brand http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brand I wrote this on my 24" iMac by the way.

known 17y ago

Dick Hardt's brilliant presentation on Identity 2.0 is on similar principles. http://identity20.com/media/OSCON2005/ http://identity20.com/media/OSCON2005/

daniel-cussen 17y ago

It's very classy and has good production value. Really reminds me of the Caltech letter of admission.

joezydeco 17y ago

Okay, so what do their bong letters look like now? I've got one from the 1991 recession that's pretty nice. Let's compare!