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I think people in power realized that the counter culture of the 60s and 70s posed a real threat to a capitalistic society, so they eliminated factors that coul

I think people in power realized that the counter culture of the 60s and 70s posed a real threat to a capitalistic society, so they eliminated factors that could give people the idea their life purpose was not to be a drone in a large corporation.

adventured 12y ago
Capitalism - an actual free market - would require the complete legalization of all drugs. You've got it exactly backwards. The counter culture won. America is the world's largest welfare state, has the largest entitlement systems, with a total government system larger than the economy of Japan, hyper regulation, high taxation, and has very few remnants of Capitalism.
- orbifold 12y ago
  I did not mean some fantasy version of Capitalism, just the fact that for a modern capitalistic society to function, people have to want to buy a new car every few years, strife to have a house and take on consumer credits to buy a new flat screen TV. Maybe I should have used Consumerism. I think it is fairly indisputable that modern economies would not function, if there were not a constant and increasing demand for new stuff. From a global standpoint this seems far from optimal, if you want to optimize for conserving finite resources like oil. In a free market the only way to counter act that a finite resource is exhausted is by the fact that the price increases as time goes on. So there is a very long time where you can use a resource for frivolous stuff like Helium balloons, while at the same time being perfectly aware that it should probably be used for more useful things.
Nursie 12y ago
Did it though? AFAICT when people came down from whatever it was and actually tried to live their 'new' ways, they pretty much degenerated and fell apart after short times for all sorts of reasons. Being a corporate drone is not an aspiration. Feeding your family and having a nice place for them to live certainly is though.
- polshaw 12y ago
  I don't believe the 'threat to capitalism' that the parent referred to requires the hippies to immediately threaten to create a communist/anarchist/etc society, just to not participate in the capitalist rat race, to base their lives less around consumption. In that light a 'nice' place is very different from the typical "American dream"TM, and having such a place and feeding your family don't require the type of participation we're talking about.
- orbifold 12y ago
  Well, the drugs were just a side story to the political activism that took place along with it. The war on drugs is just one of several counter measures to the shock the political elite experienced, when suddenly "fringe elements of society" demanded active political participation. The cost of a college education would be another example. It has skyrocketed since then, and now to become a decently educated person, you basically have to work a high paid corporate job afterwards, unless you are lucky.

adventured 12y ago

Capitalism - an actual free market - would require the complete legalization of all drugs. You've got it exactly backwards. The counter culture won. America is the world's largest welfare state, has the largest entitlement systems, with a total government system larger than the economy of Japan, hyper regulation, high taxation, and has very few remnants of Capitalism.

orbifold 12y ago
I did not mean some fantasy version of Capitalism, just the fact that for a modern capitalistic society to function, people have to want to buy a new car every few years, strife to have a house and take on consumer credits to buy a new flat screen TV. Maybe I should have used Consumerism. I think it is fairly indisputable that modern economies would not function, if there were not a constant and increasing demand for new stuff. From a global standpoint this seems far from optimal, if you want to optimize for conserving finite resources like oil. In a free market the only way to counter act that a finite resource is exhausted is by the fact that the price increases as time goes on. So there is a very long time where you can use a resource for frivolous stuff like Helium balloons, while at the same time being perfectly aware that it should probably be used for more useful things.

Nursie 12y ago

Did it though? AFAICT when people came down from whatever it was and actually tried to live their 'new' ways, they pretty much degenerated and fell apart after short times for all sorts of reasons. Being a corporate drone is not an aspiration. Feeding your family and having a nice place for them to live certainly is though.

polshaw 12y ago
I don't believe the 'threat to capitalism' that the parent referred to requires the hippies to immediately threaten to create a communist/anarchist/etc society, just to not participate in the capitalist rat race, to base their lives less around consumption. In that light a 'nice' place is very different from the typical "American dream"TM, and having such a place and feeding your family don't require the type of participation we're talking about.
orbifold 12y ago
Well, the drugs were just a side story to the political activism that took place along with it. The war on drugs is just one of several counter measures to the shock the political elite experienced, when suddenly "fringe elements of society" demanded active political participation. The cost of a college education would be another example. It has skyrocketed since then, and now to become a decently educated person, you basically have to work a high paid corporate job afterwards, unless you are lucky.