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"(...) and I consider being gay among the greatest gifts God has given me". I can only imagine the reactions if the same was said by a heterosexual person, abou

"(...) and I consider being gay among the greatest gifts God has given me". I can only imagine the reactions if the same was said by a heterosexual person, about heterosexual orientation... :)

ghshephard 12y ago
That's the entire point being made here though - being straight isn't a particularly large challenge in today's society. What Tim is saying here, is that much of his empathy, and ability to appreciate minorities, and the oppressed, derives directly from being a member of a heretofore marginalized group. And, his ability to appreciate the importance of diversity, and to truly understand Dr. King and his message, is a result of that, "gift from god."
- paulojreis 12y ago
  I understand that point. The impact of something such as this on your shaping is incommensurable; I can only imagine how much being part of a minority (particularly, one which is prejudiced, mocked and even attacked) shaped his way of understanding and appreciating difference. However, I can't agree with putting it in "that" way ("among the greatest gifts God has given me"). Even taking into account how much such a thing will shape a person, it seems exaggerated (to me). It sounds like he is who (and where) he is because of his sexual orientation. He was, however, born in a developed (and rich country); he had food, parents and housing; he also education (and a good one, in great schools) and the privilege of working at IBM and Apple.
  - ghshephard 12y ago
    I was responding to your comment about why this statement would have been controversial if it had been "being heterosexual among the greatest gifts God has given me", and explaining why taking pride in being in the Majority/Dominant group (I am proud to be White, I am proud to be Straight, I am Proud to be a Man) is so different than taking pride in being a member of a marginalized group. Clearly there were a lot of things that put Tim Cook in the position that he is, far, far, far more important than his orientation; I.E. the fact that he is on earth, that he is human, born after 2000 BC, etc... are all more significant, but now we're going down a different rabbit hole than your original comment.
Gracana 12y ago
Yeah, if you changed the statement to refer to something with entirely different context and history, it sure would be different.
notahacker 12y ago
You mean like the bits about the "great gift" of holy matrimony and God's intention "man and wife" to be joined "as one flesh" that crop up at basically every single Christian wedding?
- pbhjpbhj 12y ago
  So are you're saying that expressing the Christian view that God intends for men and women to only have sexual relationships within [a heterosexual] marriage, that such marriage should be the basis under which children are raised, that marriage should be a singular unending union, expressing such things won't cause one to be vilified, on HN say? The evidence seems to be against you.
  - notahacker 12y ago
    I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest there probably isn't one person posting on HN that has ever interrupted a wedding to complain that all the man and wife stuff is a bit heterosexist. Surprisingly, HN - atheists included - is both capable of celebrating people's happiness when they express views on the amazing "god-given" nature of their romantic relationships, like Tim Cook did, and disapproving of people making statements to the effect that other people's romantic relationships are wrong, like Tim Cook didn't. Equating the two is a desperately poor excuse for an argument.

"(...) and I consider being gay among the greatest gifts God has given me". I can only imagine the reactions if the same was said by a heterosexual person, about heterosexual orientation... :)

ghshephard 12y ago

That's the entire point being made here though - being straight isn't a particularly large challenge in today's society. What Tim is saying here, is that much of his empathy, and ability to appreciate minorities, and the oppressed, derives directly from being a member of a heretofore marginalized group. And, his ability to appreciate the importance of diversity, and to truly understand Dr. King and his message, is a result of that, "gift from god."

paulojreis 12y ago
I understand that point. The impact of something such as this on your shaping is incommensurable; I can only imagine how much being part of a minority (particularly, one which is prejudiced, mocked and even attacked) shaped his way of understanding and appreciating difference. However, I can't agree with putting it in "that" way ("among the greatest gifts God has given me"). Even taking into account how much such a thing will shape a person, it seems exaggerated (to me). It sounds like he is who (and where) he is because of his sexual orientation. He was, however, born in a developed (and rich country); he had food, parents and housing; he also education (and a good one, in great schools) and the privilege of working at IBM and Apple.
- ghshephard 12y ago
  I was responding to your comment about why this statement would have been controversial if it had been "being heterosexual among the greatest gifts God has given me", and explaining why taking pride in being in the Majority/Dominant group (I am proud to be White, I am proud to be Straight, I am Proud to be a Man) is so different than taking pride in being a member of a marginalized group. Clearly there were a lot of things that put Tim Cook in the position that he is, far, far, far more important than his orientation; I.E. the fact that he is on earth, that he is human, born after 2000 BC, etc... are all more significant, but now we're going down a different rabbit hole than your original comment.

Gracana 12y ago

Yeah, if you changed the statement to refer to something with entirely different context and history, it sure would be different.

notahacker 12y ago

You mean like the bits about the "great gift" of holy matrimony and God's intention "man and wife" to be joined "as one flesh" that crop up at basically every single Christian wedding?

pbhjpbhj 12y ago
So are you're saying that expressing the Christian view that God intends for men and women to only have sexual relationships within [a heterosexual] marriage, that such marriage should be the basis under which children are raised, that marriage should be a singular unending union, expressing such things won't cause one to be vilified, on HN say? The evidence seems to be against you.
- notahacker 12y ago
  I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest there probably isn't one person posting on HN that has ever interrupted a wedding to complain that all the man and wife stuff is a bit heterosexist. Surprisingly, HN - atheists included - is both capable of celebrating people's happiness when they express views on the amazing "god-given" nature of their romantic relationships, like Tim Cook did, and disapproving of people making statements to the effect that other people's romantic relationships are wrong, like Tim Cook didn't. Equating the two is a desperately poor excuse for an argument.