5 ms·

Against the Grain: Should you go gluten-free?

37 points by srikar 12y ago

steven2012 12y ago
It's just another fad, like the Atkins Diet. That diet, for a few years, caused egg demand to skyrocket, forcing producers to change much like how this is currently causing change. But it will recede like all fads do.
- justifier 12y ago
  i think an analogy of high fructose corn syrup is more apt is removing HFCS from your personal diet a fad? is removing HFCS from your personal diet beneficial to ones health? are more products using HFCS or alternatives these days? personally after choosing to actively know what is in the food i am buying i find the nutrition labels to be too lacking in information: o, really, 20g of protein? what kind of protein? what ingredient is sourcing that protein? what scientific studies can be cited to explain how my body reacts to that protein? i want more information stead less so i can continue to make decisions for myself about how i fuel my body
scottlocklin 12y ago
Fun fact: if you look in an old copy of the Joy of Cooking, there are several references to wheat allergies (only found one in the index at a glance), including an old USDA publication on the subject (couldn't find that easily). This book has been around since 1931.
- maxerickson 12y ago
  Can you explain more about why you think that is interesting in this context?
  - valarauca1 12y ago
    Wheat allergy is more often then not a Gluten Allergy. The comment was to make a connection that this isn't just a new thing. People have been allergic to grains for a long time.
  - scottlocklin 12y ago
    Because several people below are asserting that sensitivity to gluten (or whatever it is in wheat that gives people the wheat heebie-jeebies) is some kind of modern thing. It's not; people just forgot about it, then remembered again. About half of what I consider noteworthy enough to say on HN or my blog is pointing out that humanity regularly forgets, then remembers important things. FWIIW, my own mild sensitivity is almost certainly not to gluten, as certain Italian 00 flours, rye and oatmeal don't bother me at all.
    - maxerickson 12y ago
      The popularity of self diagnosis with gluten sensitivities does seem to be a modern thing. I'm not saying self diagnosed allergies are nonsense (I know someone who is clearly allergic to Yellow #5), I guess I would just consider someone claiming it was all fake (rather than much of it being faddish) an ill-informed crank (and not really feel the need to push back on what they are saying).
      - scottlocklin 12y ago
        I was a little ahead of the curve on this: I figured it out going on a strict keto diet in furtherance of my hobby of picking up heavy things (then putting them down again). I couldn't believe how good I felt, even on a diet of nothing but tuna and water. When I added things back to my diet; milk, rice, beans; all no problemo. First time I ate spaghetti, I went back to feeling like dirt. The internets informed me that other people were sensitive to wheat as well (this was around ~ 2004), and I haven't looked back since then.
venomsnake 12y ago
In one word - nothing. Growing up in the 80s in Eastern Europe culinary allergies and the likes were virtually unheard of. Or autism and ADHD. Right now everyone has some kind of intolerance. I think for the majority it is reverse placebo effect. For the others - people spend so much time trying to be sterile and pop antibiotics like tic-tac that their immune system lacks any form of calibration and measurable response.
- Hytosys 12y ago
  >Or autism and ADHD Given our rapidly evolving understanding of these disorders in the past few decades, I don't see how anyone can claim a working knowledge of ASD or ADHD in the 1980s (especially in the bleak, grayscale zone of Europe). Seeing as the article makes no mention of either disorder, you seem to be lost also to its content.
  - adventured 12y ago
    The diagnosis rate of ADHD in Europe is half the rate of the US. That's very likely to be a case of rampant over-diagnosis.
    - DannyBee 12y ago
      Well, part of it is that often, diagnoses for ADHD in the US do not include learning disability testing.
    - deleted 12y ago
      [deleted]
- sasvari 12y ago
  Growing up in the 80s in Eastern Europe [..] were virtually unheard of. Or autism [..] Can you back that up? Is there some reliable data about the occurence of autism on both sides of the iron wall back in the days?
- Someone1234 12y ago
  > Growing up in the 80s in Eastern Europe culinary allergies and the likes were virtually unheard of. Or autism and ADHD. > Right now everyone has some kind of intolerance. I think for the majority it is reverse placebo effect. Did you just call autism a fake condition? Have you ever met anyone with severe autism before? Some of these people need near constant supervision for their entire adult lives, and you think they're just, what? Faking it? For the funzies? Sorry but that's a new level of dumb. Autism has gone by many names but it has been written about since at least the year 1566. The only thing that is relatively new is its name, and that might change a few more times as "autism" seems to contain at least three different distinct conditions.
justifier 12y ago
the gluten argument, for me, is really a conversation about shitting'pooping'defecating'whatever-ing-you-need-to-talk-about-excrement-seriously do some light research, find grain alternatives that are gluten free, eat that for a week and see if how your body expels its used resources is changed it is interesting to me that the initial response to a 'fad' is aggressive denial stead some basic experimenting there is a world of interest for those that are willing or wanting to dig deep in giving up mass produced bread products i find with each limitation i place on my diet the more interesting my meals become because i am forced to think of alternatives to standard meals, similar to how artists will impose limitations to incite creativity meals without bread products remain unaffected but if you love baking, like the anecdotal couple at the end of the article, you baking can become even more interesting and involved using alt flours, baking with alt flours is like chemistry with each one having different bake reactions and health benefits also, there is beginning to be science to support the adverse effects one feels when ingesting gliadin class proteins, component to gluten, which increases intestinal permeability inhibiting nutrient absorbtion(i) the reality is the food industry is out for money stead your health if you change your mind on what your health requirements are the industry will follow and in due time we will have all the donuts and cookies anyone could want and they will be made with alt flours (i) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18485912 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18485912
- batbomb 12y ago
  farm to toilet
kolev 12y ago
Most GF foods may trade the cealiac disease for something worse - diabetes. The starches they replace wheat with (like tapioca) have much higher glycemic index than wheat! If you can't have wheat, trying avoiding all refined carbs! As it's hard to stay completely away from gluten foods, my family is sparingly using Italian einkorn wheat (the ancient non-GMO wheat) products by Jovial [1]. [1] https://jovialfoods.com/einkorn/ https://jovialfoods.com/einkorn/
- gregcrv 12y ago
  this. The problem is not gluten. The problem is how wheat, especially in the USA has been selected and/or modified to increase its gluten amount to a level more and more people can't tolerate. The increase of pollution and pesticides might also be responsible for our increased reactions to allergens. Arte showed a lot interesting documentaries about this subject last summer.
  - kolev 12y ago
    Yes, exactly. All foods contain some level of natural toxins and anti-nutrients, and wheat has a long history of consumption, i.e. we can assume that we've adapted to it already. What we haven't had time to adapt to is the modern wheat.
russnewcomer 12y ago
My wife was advised to try going gluten-free for a period of time to see if it would help with a condition she had been dealing with. It didn't help with that, but we did discover that she lost about 10 pounds and her previously regular bloating and intestinal discomfort went away. We have since observed a fairly strong correlation between consuming regular bread and bloating. So she largely eats gluten free foods. But we don't go to overboard on gluten-replaced foods, and instead try more for food choices that just don't have gluten either way. Sure, we do have rice noodles or corn pasta sometimes, and I do have gluten-free bread in the freezer for her for occasional sandwiches, but we usually just eat more like East Asians or Mexicans and just don't have bread. It's kind of like when I was ten, I noticed that sometimes I had bad diarrhea after we had spaghetti and so after running an experiment on myself, I deduced that a certain brands of sauce made me have diarrhea, along with raw tomatoes. I also discovered the same thing with soy sauce and peanuts, and although I no longer have that same sensitivity to soy sauce and lessened to peanuts, I still avoid those foods. Basically, I think almost everyone has some sensitivity to some kind of food, most of us just don't know it. If you do have to avoid some kind of food, avoid it, don't go for a substitute.
- batbomb 12y ago
  This is anecdotal still unless you control for other parts of the diet, such as total carb intake, total sodium intake, and/or dietary fiber intake. When many people stop eating gluten, they often just stop eating so much bread, usually lower their total carb, sodium intake (there's tons of it in bread), and often sugar and other things as well, sometimes substantially lower. Occasionally the opposite is true if people start swapping out large amounts of glutenous products for sugary fruits. The same thing happens with MSG and chinese restaurant syndrome. People tend to think MSG itself, and not their actual sodium intake (MSG is sodium + glutamic acid), makes them feel sick. In controlled studies with equivalent sodium intake and controlling for taste (basically two gelatin pills, one with MSG and the other with an equivalent amount of sodium), there's been no correlation.
  - russnewcomer 12y ago
    Totally agree that my wife going gluten free is relatively anecdotal. I didn't wish to put her through too much torture trying to run empirical tests, but I do know that there are times when she has accidentally consumed regular versions of food that she has no problems with the gluten-free version, and she has bloated. Doesn't really bloat with gluten-free. Relatively anecdotal and not the strongest causation, but definite correlation. My personal issues with spaghetti sauce however, I did control for as much as possible, purchasing enough ingredients to make multiple rounds of the rest of the meal, varying only spaghetti sauce. Basic outcome: Prego and some other local store brands from 10 years ago means diarrhea, Ragu does not. Same thing with nuts - eat peanuts, almonds, pistachios, wait an hour, diarrhea. Don't know if it's it's in my head or not, but since it happens, I try to avoid foods that make it happen.

37 points by srikar 12y ago

steven2012 12y ago

It's just another fad, like the Atkins Diet. That diet, for a few years, caused egg demand to skyrocket, forcing producers to change much like how this is currently causing change. But it will recede like all fads do.

justifier 12y ago
i think an analogy of high fructose corn syrup is more apt is removing HFCS from your personal diet a fad? is removing HFCS from your personal diet beneficial to ones health? are more products using HFCS or alternatives these days? personally after choosing to actively know what is in the food i am buying i find the nutrition labels to be too lacking in information: o, really, 20g of protein? what kind of protein? what ingredient is sourcing that protein? what scientific studies can be cited to explain how my body reacts to that protein? i want more information stead less so i can continue to make decisions for myself about how i fuel my body

scottlocklin 12y ago

Fun fact: if you look in an old copy of the Joy of Cooking, there are several references to wheat allergies (only found one in the index at a glance), including an old USDA publication on the subject (couldn't find that easily). This book has been around since 1931.

maxerickson 12y ago
Can you explain more about why you think that is interesting in this context?
- valarauca1 12y ago
  Wheat allergy is more often then not a Gluten Allergy. The comment was to make a connection that this isn't just a new thing. People have been allergic to grains for a long time.
- scottlocklin 12y ago
  Because several people below are asserting that sensitivity to gluten (or whatever it is in wheat that gives people the wheat heebie-jeebies) is some kind of modern thing. It's not; people just forgot about it, then remembered again. About half of what I consider noteworthy enough to say on HN or my blog is pointing out that humanity regularly forgets, then remembers important things. FWIIW, my own mild sensitivity is almost certainly not to gluten, as certain Italian 00 flours, rye and oatmeal don't bother me at all.
  - maxerickson 12y ago
    The popularity of self diagnosis with gluten sensitivities does seem to be a modern thing. I'm not saying self diagnosed allergies are nonsense (I know someone who is clearly allergic to Yellow #5), I guess I would just consider someone claiming it was all fake (rather than much of it being faddish) an ill-informed crank (and not really feel the need to push back on what they are saying).
    - scottlocklin 12y ago
      I was a little ahead of the curve on this: I figured it out going on a strict keto diet in furtherance of my hobby of picking up heavy things (then putting them down again). I couldn't believe how good I felt, even on a diet of nothing but tuna and water. When I added things back to my diet; milk, rice, beans; all no problemo. First time I ate spaghetti, I went back to feeling like dirt. The internets informed me that other people were sensitive to wheat as well (this was around ~ 2004), and I haven't looked back since then.

venomsnake 12y ago

In one word - nothing. Growing up in the 80s in Eastern Europe culinary allergies and the likes were virtually unheard of. Or autism and ADHD. Right now everyone has some kind of intolerance. I think for the majority it is reverse placebo effect. For the others - people spend so much time trying to be sterile and pop antibiotics like tic-tac that their immune system lacks any form of calibration and measurable response.

Hytosys 12y ago
>Or autism and ADHD Given our rapidly evolving understanding of these disorders in the past few decades, I don't see how anyone can claim a working knowledge of ASD or ADHD in the 1980s (especially in the bleak, grayscale zone of Europe). Seeing as the article makes no mention of either disorder, you seem to be lost also to its content.
- adventured 12y ago
  The diagnosis rate of ADHD in Europe is half the rate of the US. That's very likely to be a case of rampant over-diagnosis.
  - DannyBee 12y ago
    Well, part of it is that often, diagnoses for ADHD in the US do not include learning disability testing.
  - deleted 12y ago
    [deleted]
sasvari 12y ago
Growing up in the 80s in Eastern Europe [..] were virtually unheard of. Or autism [..] Can you back that up? Is there some reliable data about the occurence of autism on both sides of the iron wall back in the days?
Someone1234 12y ago
> Growing up in the 80s in Eastern Europe culinary allergies and the likes were virtually unheard of. Or autism and ADHD. > Right now everyone has some kind of intolerance. I think for the majority it is reverse placebo effect. Did you just call autism a fake condition? Have you ever met anyone with severe autism before? Some of these people need near constant supervision for their entire adult lives, and you think they're just, what? Faking it? For the funzies? Sorry but that's a new level of dumb. Autism has gone by many names but it has been written about since at least the year 1566. The only thing that is relatively new is its name, and that might change a few more times as "autism" seems to contain at least three different distinct conditions.

justifier 12y ago

the gluten argument, for me, is really a conversation about shitting'pooping'defecating'whatever-ing-you-need-to-talk-about-excrement-seriously do some light research, find grain alternatives that are gluten free, eat that for a week and see if how your body expels its used resources is changed it is interesting to me that the initial response to a 'fad' is aggressive denial stead some basic experimenting there is a world of interest for those that are willing or wanting to dig deep in giving up mass produced bread products i find with each limitation i place on my diet the more interesting my meals become because i am forced to think of alternatives to standard meals, similar to how artists will impose limitations to incite creativity meals without bread products remain unaffected but if you love baking, like the anecdotal couple at the end of the article, you baking can become even more interesting and involved using alt flours, baking with alt flours is like chemistry with each one having different bake reactions and health benefits also, there is beginning to be science to support the adverse effects one feels when ingesting gliadin class proteins, component to gluten, which increases intestinal permeability inhibiting nutrient absorbtion(i) the reality is the food industry is out for money stead your health if you change your mind on what your health requirements are the industry will follow and in due time we will have all the donuts and cookies anyone could want and they will be made with alt flours (i) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18485912 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18485912

batbomb 12y ago
farm to toilet

kolev 12y ago

Most GF foods may trade the cealiac disease for something worse - diabetes. The starches they replace wheat with (like tapioca) have much higher glycemic index than wheat! If you can't have wheat, trying avoiding all refined carbs! As it's hard to stay completely away from gluten foods, my family is sparingly using Italian einkorn wheat (the ancient non-GMO wheat) products by Jovial [1]. [1] https://jovialfoods.com/einkorn/ https://jovialfoods.com/einkorn/

gregcrv 12y ago
this. The problem is not gluten. The problem is how wheat, especially in the USA has been selected and/or modified to increase its gluten amount to a level more and more people can't tolerate. The increase of pollution and pesticides might also be responsible for our increased reactions to allergens. Arte showed a lot interesting documentaries about this subject last summer.
- kolev 12y ago
  Yes, exactly. All foods contain some level of natural toxins and anti-nutrients, and wheat has a long history of consumption, i.e. we can assume that we've adapted to it already. What we haven't had time to adapt to is the modern wheat.

russnewcomer 12y ago

My wife was advised to try going gluten-free for a period of time to see if it would help with a condition she had been dealing with. It didn't help with that, but we did discover that she lost about 10 pounds and her previously regular bloating and intestinal discomfort went away. We have since observed a fairly strong correlation between consuming regular bread and bloating. So she largely eats gluten free foods. But we don't go to overboard on gluten-replaced foods, and instead try more for food choices that just don't have gluten either way. Sure, we do have rice noodles or corn pasta sometimes, and I do have gluten-free bread in the freezer for her for occasional sandwiches, but we usually just eat more like East Asians or Mexicans and just don't have bread. It's kind of like when I was ten, I noticed that sometimes I had bad diarrhea after we had spaghetti and so after running an experiment on myself, I deduced that a certain brands of sauce made me have diarrhea, along with raw tomatoes. I also discovered the same thing with soy sauce and peanuts, and although I no longer have that same sensitivity to soy sauce and lessened to peanuts, I still avoid those foods. Basically, I think almost everyone has some sensitivity to some kind of food, most of us just don't know it. If you do have to avoid some kind of food, avoid it, don't go for a substitute.

batbomb 12y ago
This is anecdotal still unless you control for other parts of the diet, such as total carb intake, total sodium intake, and/or dietary fiber intake. When many people stop eating gluten, they often just stop eating so much bread, usually lower their total carb, sodium intake (there's tons of it in bread), and often sugar and other things as well, sometimes substantially lower. Occasionally the opposite is true if people start swapping out large amounts of glutenous products for sugary fruits. The same thing happens with MSG and chinese restaurant syndrome. People tend to think MSG itself, and not their actual sodium intake (MSG is sodium + glutamic acid), makes them feel sick. In controlled studies with equivalent sodium intake and controlling for taste (basically two gelatin pills, one with MSG and the other with an equivalent amount of sodium), there's been no correlation.
- russnewcomer 12y ago
  Totally agree that my wife going gluten free is relatively anecdotal. I didn't wish to put her through too much torture trying to run empirical tests, but I do know that there are times when she has accidentally consumed regular versions of food that she has no problems with the gluten-free version, and she has bloated. Doesn't really bloat with gluten-free. Relatively anecdotal and not the strongest causation, but definite correlation. My personal issues with spaghetti sauce however, I did control for as much as possible, purchasing enough ingredients to make multiple rounds of the rest of the meal, varying only spaghetti sauce. Basic outcome: Prego and some other local store brands from 10 years ago means diarrhea, Ragu does not. Same thing with nuts - eat peanuts, almonds, pistachios, wait an hour, diarrhea. Don't know if it's it's in my head or not, but since it happens, I try to avoid foods that make it happen.