5 ms·

This is exactly why sync is not a commodity. Dropbox is the very best at what they do, and even they have bugs. So when someone offers to sync your files for le

This is exactly why sync is not a commodity. Dropbox is the very best at what they do, and even they have bugs. So when someone offers to sync your files for less, ask why.

wodenokoto 12y ago
I thought there were many robust open source solutions out there and what made dropbox the winner was not that it is able to reliably sync, but that they made it easy to install and sync.
- meowface 12y ago
  Dropbox is generally known for reliability in the face of competitors, however issues like this one and the highly embarrassing "anyone can login to anyone else's account" bug of 2011 definitely cast some doubt on using it as a sole storage option, or a solution to store any sensitive data. Most medium-sized and large companies refuse to touch Dropbox due to these reasons, especially in the financial and medical space. That said, I still employ it for personal use and like the product in general.
hyperbovine 12y ago
The sync heavy lifting in Dropbox is handled by librsync, or at least was at one point. librsync is very mature open source software, and this bug pertains to a particular interaction between the Dropbox GUI and a feature (selective sync) which they have somewhat tacked on to the core library. Long story short, you don't necessarily have to be Dropbox or employ a couple hundred software engineers to get inotify + rsync working well.
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]
- jamwt 12y ago
  > The sync heavy lifting in Dropbox is handled by librsync, or at least was at one point. Nope, highly custom process that involves librsync very little. The sophistication of what has to be done to solve this problem well would probably surprise you.
  - general_failure 12y ago
    Yeah, rsync != bidirectional sync.
    - rakoo 12y ago
      He wasn't talking about rsync the binary but rather about librsync [0], the library that allows you to calculate a diff between two byte arrays without needing the cooperation of the other side -- ie you can calculate an efficient delta to send to remote without needing remote to be online at the moment you calculate, and without needing the complete old version, only a signature of it. A good example use of it is the rdiff tool that allows you to do exactly what I said before. A better real-world example would be duplicity [1] or rdiff-backup [2] that use librsync to de-duplicate backups, without needing access to the whole previous value, only a small signature of it. [0] https://github.com/librsync/librsync https://github.com/librsync/librsync [1] http://www.nongnu.org/duplicity/ http://www.nongnu.org/duplicity/ [2] http://www.nongnu.org/rdiff-backup/ http://www.nongnu.org/rdiff-backup/
  - stephenr 12y ago
    Isn't the desktop sync client built around the csync tool? http://www.csync.org http://www.csync.org
zvrba 12y ago
> This is exactly why sync is not a commodity. Dropbox is the very best at what they do, The very best? I use OneDrive across all of my Windows machines and I don't even notice it exists; never had any problems. I just access all my files everywhere. If you buy a windows phone you even get a decent amount of space for free (15GB). (Though I subscribe to Office 365 so I have virtually unlimited space.)
- danieldk 12y ago
  It is a cliche, but the plural of anecdote is not data. I never had any problems with Dropbox, but had Office on OneDrive corrupt files. OneNote has also rendered some notes unreadable. The bottom line is that errors happen. You should prepare for that and make backups. Also, Dropbox are still among the very best when it comes to syncing. Many useful synchronization features are implemented by Dropbox, but not the competition. E.g., features that most competitors do not have: - Modifying a large file on Dropbox will only resync modified chunks. - DropBox avoids re-uploads, both when uploading identical files and moving files around: http://macography.net/2013/05/speed-test-dropbox-google-drive-box-skydrive-amazon-cloud-drive/ http://macography.net/2013/05/speed-test-dropbox-google-driv... - Dropbox does LAN sync. If a machine has to download a large file and another machine on the network has the same file, chunks are provided peer to peer. This makes using large files on multiple machines or in a team much faster. - Dropbox does streaming sync. A machine can already download chunks when another machine is still uploading: https://blog.dropbox.com/2014/07/introducing-streaming-sync-supercharged-sync-for-large-files/ https://blog.dropbox.com/2014/07/introducing-streaming-sync-... Sure, OneDrive and Google Drive do have many useful functions that Dropbox does not have, such as including complete office suites. But for the original task, file syncing, Dropbox is still pretty much unbeaten.
  - calinet6 12y ago
    I think you're attributing too much of Dropbox's success to simple technical reliability. It really isn't that difficult a problem, and many services and projects do it right. I have an rsync script that has been syncing my files reliably to an offsite location for 6 years. It's certain that Dropbox has a high quality syncing service, but there are other factors. Think, for example, how this case was handled: a fault in their core product, a breach of user trust in their service, and they understood that it needed more than a technical solution. None of this was part of their core sync reliability: it was part of a more broad quality, which is closer to their true reason for success.

This is exactly why sync is not a commodity. Dropbox is the very best at what they do, and even they have bugs. So when someone offers to sync your files for less, ask why.

wodenokoto 12y ago

I thought there were many robust open source solutions out there and what made dropbox the winner was not that it is able to reliably sync, but that they made it easy to install and sync.

meowface 12y ago
Dropbox is generally known for reliability in the face of competitors, however issues like this one and the highly embarrassing "anyone can login to anyone else's account" bug of 2011 definitely cast some doubt on using it as a sole storage option, or a solution to store any sensitive data. Most medium-sized and large companies refuse to touch Dropbox due to these reasons, especially in the financial and medical space. That said, I still employ it for personal use and like the product in general.

hyperbovine 12y ago

The sync heavy lifting in Dropbox is handled by librsync, or at least was at one point. librsync is very mature open source software, and this bug pertains to a particular interaction between the Dropbox GUI and a feature (selective sync) which they have somewhat tacked on to the core library. Long story short, you don't necessarily have to be Dropbox or employ a couple hundred software engineers to get inotify + rsync working well.

deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
jamwt 12y ago
> The sync heavy lifting in Dropbox is handled by librsync, or at least was at one point. Nope, highly custom process that involves librsync very little. The sophistication of what has to be done to solve this problem well would probably surprise you.
- general_failure 12y ago
  Yeah, rsync != bidirectional sync.
  - rakoo 12y ago
    He wasn't talking about rsync the binary but rather about librsync [0], the library that allows you to calculate a diff between two byte arrays without needing the cooperation of the other side -- ie you can calculate an efficient delta to send to remote without needing remote to be online at the moment you calculate, and without needing the complete old version, only a signature of it. A good example use of it is the rdiff tool that allows you to do exactly what I said before. A better real-world example would be duplicity [1] or rdiff-backup [2] that use librsync to de-duplicate backups, without needing access to the whole previous value, only a small signature of it. [0] https://github.com/librsync/librsync https://github.com/librsync/librsync [1] http://www.nongnu.org/duplicity/ http://www.nongnu.org/duplicity/ [2] http://www.nongnu.org/rdiff-backup/ http://www.nongnu.org/rdiff-backup/
- stephenr 12y ago
  Isn't the desktop sync client built around the csync tool? http://www.csync.org http://www.csync.org

zvrba 12y ago

> This is exactly why sync is not a commodity. Dropbox is the very best at what they do, The very best? I use OneDrive across all of my Windows machines and I don't even notice it exists; never had any problems. I just access all my files everywhere. If you buy a windows phone you even get a decent amount of space for free (15GB). (Though I subscribe to Office 365 so I have virtually unlimited space.)

danieldk 12y ago
It is a cliche, but the plural of anecdote is not data. I never had any problems with Dropbox, but had Office on OneDrive corrupt files. OneNote has also rendered some notes unreadable. The bottom line is that errors happen. You should prepare for that and make backups. Also, Dropbox are still among the very best when it comes to syncing. Many useful synchronization features are implemented by Dropbox, but not the competition. E.g., features that most competitors do not have: - Modifying a large file on Dropbox will only resync modified chunks. - DropBox avoids re-uploads, both when uploading identical files and moving files around: http://macography.net/2013/05/speed-test-dropbox-google-drive-box-skydrive-amazon-cloud-drive/ http://macography.net/2013/05/speed-test-dropbox-google-driv... - Dropbox does LAN sync. If a machine has to download a large file and another machine on the network has the same file, chunks are provided peer to peer. This makes using large files on multiple machines or in a team much faster. - Dropbox does streaming sync. A machine can already download chunks when another machine is still uploading: https://blog.dropbox.com/2014/07/introducing-streaming-sync-supercharged-sync-for-large-files/ https://blog.dropbox.com/2014/07/introducing-streaming-sync-... Sure, OneDrive and Google Drive do have many useful functions that Dropbox does not have, such as including complete office suites. But for the original task, file syncing, Dropbox is still pretty much unbeaten.
- calinet6 12y ago
  I think you're attributing too much of Dropbox's success to simple technical reliability. It really isn't that difficult a problem, and many services and projects do it right. I have an rsync script that has been syncing my files reliably to an offsite location for 6 years. It's certain that Dropbox has a high quality syncing service, but there are other factors. Think, for example, how this case was handled: a fault in their core product, a breach of user trust in their service, and they understood that it needed more than a technical solution. None of this was part of their core sync reliability: it was part of a more broad quality, which is closer to their true reason for success.