5 ms·

From the other article (http://www.vox.com/2014/9/9/6107039/23andme-ancestry-dna-testing http://www.vox.com/2014/9/9/6107039/23andme-ancestry-dna-tes...): When

by jobu 12y ago

From the other article (http://www.vox.com/2014/9/9/6107039/23andme-ancestry-dna-testing http://www.vox.com/2014/9/9/6107039/23andme-ancestry-dna-tes...): When George figured out his dad had conceived this child before getting married — that the child was not the result of adultery — he was excited. "I thought it was the coolest genetics story, my own personal genetics story. I wasn't particularly upset about it initially, until the rest of the family found out, and their reaction was different." His mother and sister could not handle the information, and his father went against their wishes, dedicating himself to reconnecting with his estranged son. "Years of repressed memories and emotions uncorked and resulted in tumultuous times that have torn my nuclear family apart. We're not anywhere close to being healed yet, and I don't know how long it will take to put the pieces back together."

toomuchtodo 12y ago
So it wasn't honesty that was the problem, its was people's emotions.
- fleitz 12y ago
  The facts are rarely in question, always the emotions. It's like soldiers, no one questions that they conspire to kill people, it's whether they are heros or murderers.
- metacorrector 12y ago
  It wasn't infidelity that was the problem, it was honest emotions.
- hyperliner 12y ago
  More than emotions, it was that their lives were being affected in some form: something else was being added to it that was not there when they decided to enter into a relationship. Particularly for the mother, she basically entered into a relationship without all the facts known. Maybe she would have decided differently at the beginning. Personally, I am not sure why the sister is so upset. It's just another sibling, which should bring happiness. But in a world where lawsuits are common, maybe she also feels threatened (sharing of inheritance, for example?). I think it is fair that the mother is upset. She has to deal with more "baggage." But I don't think this is worth divorcing over. Things must not have been that solid for this to end up in divorce. A strong marriage should have survived this.
  - mbreese 12y ago
    > A strong marriage should have survived this It's probably not a good idea to speculate on the relative strength of other people's marriages, especially internet speculation. We still don't know everything that happened; nor should we. So, let's not pretend that we know what is going on here. The basis of the story is that with genetic testing with a service like 23andMe you can find things that you may not have wanted to have known or expected. Let's just leave it at that.
    - stavrianos 12y ago
      A simple upvote does not express my approval of this comment strongly enough.
    - tjradcliffe 12y ago
      > So, let's not pretend that we know what is going on here. Absolutely. When we make bold assertions like "X would Y" we are bringing a huge amount of personal bias, baggage and most of all ignorance to the table. It blinkers us to the vast range of possible realities that our impoverished imaginations (and our imaginations are always impoverished) are incapable of conjuring. As an exercise, before posting "X must be Y" it is very much worth-while thinking of half-a-dozen movie scripts that could tell a story that would fit the known facts. In the present case they might look like: 1) Basil Fawlty-like character goes off the deep end upon discovering child from before his marriage 2) Uptight wife divorces husband for youthful indiscretion 3) Husband's former double-life as a spy revealed by accident of genetic testing 4) Husband's former criminal life revealed by accident of genetic testing 5) Christian wife divorces when accident of genetic testing reveals husband was not a virgin at marriage as he had always claimed 6) Radical feminist wife leaves husband when she finds out he once patronized--and impregnated--a prostitute... The only thing we can say with any degree of certainty is that the reality is far weirder than anything we can imagine. It almost always is. In none of the above cases would the marriage necessarily be describe as "not strong" prior to being put to the test. To claim that "a strong marriage should have survived this" is vacuous tautology: http://www.tjradcliffe.com/?p=1087 http://www.tjradcliffe.com/?p=1087. It is true that a marriage strong enough to survive whatever happened would have survived whatever happened. It is also true that a big enough blow will disrupt anything weak enough to be disrupted by that blow (http://www.cuug.ab.ca/~branderr/risk_essay/hymn_strain.html http://www.cuug.ab.ca/~branderr/risk_essay/hymn_strain.html)
bmm6o 12y ago
What does "years of repressed memories and emotions" refer to here? You can't repress memories and emotions you don't have.
- coldtea 12y ago
  His dad's obviously? Who tried to recconect with the son he had abandoned?
- dredmorbius 12y ago
  Likely those between "George"'s parents.
woodchuck64 12y ago
"George" says: "I would want a warning saying, "Check this box and FYI: people discover their parents aren't their parents, they have siblings they didn't know about. If you check this box, these are the things you'll find." Yeah, like that would have kept George or anyone else from opening this particularly fascinating Pandora's box.
- barrkel 12y ago
  I believe with 90% certainty that "George" is female. I have a complicated family background myself (not willing to go into it in public under this handle), but in George's shoes, I would not have pushed this; in particular, I would not have told Thomas about his father nearly as easily.
  - jacquesm 12y ago
    Why do you believe George is female?
    - barrkel 12y ago
      It's not important, but it's interesting that people reacted quite strongly to it. It was an off-hand comment based on the writing style, tone and perspective, a dozen or more things in the article. I should have parenthesized it, and left it at the end of my comment.
      - throwbie 12y ago
        >based on the writing style, tone Could you clarify?
        Vivtek 12y ago
        I had the same intuition, actually, and I can't really articulate it either. Interesting that someone else had the same notion. To the extent that I can back it up at all, it seems to be something to do with the concern George has with how his family feels about this - the interpersonal aspects. Which, when stated this clearly, seems ridiculous, since obviously men can have just as much concern about their families breaking up as women can. It was just a feeling I had while reading the piece.

by jobu 12y ago

toomuchtodo 12y ago

So it wasn't honesty that was the problem, its was people's emotions.

fleitz 12y ago
The facts are rarely in question, always the emotions. It's like soldiers, no one questions that they conspire to kill people, it's whether they are heros or murderers.
metacorrector 12y ago
It wasn't infidelity that was the problem, it was honest emotions.
hyperliner 12y ago
More than emotions, it was that their lives were being affected in some form: something else was being added to it that was not there when they decided to enter into a relationship. Particularly for the mother, she basically entered into a relationship without all the facts known. Maybe she would have decided differently at the beginning. Personally, I am not sure why the sister is so upset. It's just another sibling, which should bring happiness. But in a world where lawsuits are common, maybe she also feels threatened (sharing of inheritance, for example?). I think it is fair that the mother is upset. She has to deal with more "baggage." But I don't think this is worth divorcing over. Things must not have been that solid for this to end up in divorce. A strong marriage should have survived this.
- mbreese 12y ago
  > A strong marriage should have survived this It's probably not a good idea to speculate on the relative strength of other people's marriages, especially internet speculation. We still don't know everything that happened; nor should we. So, let's not pretend that we know what is going on here. The basis of the story is that with genetic testing with a service like 23andMe you can find things that you may not have wanted to have known or expected. Let's just leave it at that.
  - stavrianos 12y ago
    A simple upvote does not express my approval of this comment strongly enough.
  - tjradcliffe 12y ago
    > So, let's not pretend that we know what is going on here. Absolutely. When we make bold assertions like "X would Y" we are bringing a huge amount of personal bias, baggage and most of all ignorance to the table. It blinkers us to the vast range of possible realities that our impoverished imaginations (and our imaginations are always impoverished) are incapable of conjuring. As an exercise, before posting "X must be Y" it is very much worth-while thinking of half-a-dozen movie scripts that could tell a story that would fit the known facts. In the present case they might look like: 1) Basil Fawlty-like character goes off the deep end upon discovering child from before his marriage 2) Uptight wife divorces husband for youthful indiscretion 3) Husband's former double-life as a spy revealed by accident of genetic testing 4) Husband's former criminal life revealed by accident of genetic testing 5) Christian wife divorces when accident of genetic testing reveals husband was not a virgin at marriage as he had always claimed 6) Radical feminist wife leaves husband when she finds out he once patronized--and impregnated--a prostitute... The only thing we can say with any degree of certainty is that the reality is far weirder than anything we can imagine. It almost always is. In none of the above cases would the marriage necessarily be describe as "not strong" prior to being put to the test. To claim that "a strong marriage should have survived this" is vacuous tautology: http://www.tjradcliffe.com/?p=1087 http://www.tjradcliffe.com/?p=1087. It is true that a marriage strong enough to survive whatever happened would have survived whatever happened. It is also true that a big enough blow will disrupt anything weak enough to be disrupted by that blow (http://www.cuug.ab.ca/~branderr/risk_essay/hymn_strain.html http://www.cuug.ab.ca/~branderr/risk_essay/hymn_strain.html)

bmm6o 12y ago

What does "years of repressed memories and emotions" refer to here? You can't repress memories and emotions you don't have.

coldtea 12y ago
His dad's obviously? Who tried to recconect with the son he had abandoned?
dredmorbius 12y ago
Likely those between "George"'s parents.

woodchuck64 12y ago

"George" says: "I would want a warning saying, "Check this box and FYI: people discover their parents aren't their parents, they have siblings they didn't know about. If you check this box, these are the things you'll find." Yeah, like that would have kept George or anyone else from opening this particularly fascinating Pandora's box.

barrkel 12y ago
I believe with 90% certainty that "George" is female. I have a complicated family background myself (not willing to go into it in public under this handle), but in George's shoes, I would not have pushed this; in particular, I would not have told Thomas about his father nearly as easily.
- jacquesm 12y ago
  Why do you believe George is female?
  - barrkel 12y ago
    It's not important, but it's interesting that people reacted quite strongly to it. It was an off-hand comment based on the writing style, tone and perspective, a dozen or more things in the article. I should have parenthesized it, and left it at the end of my comment.
    - throwbie 12y ago
      >based on the writing style, tone Could you clarify?
      - Vivtek 12y ago
        I had the same intuition, actually, and I can't really articulate it either. Interesting that someone else had the same notion. To the extent that I can back it up at all, it seems to be something to do with the concern George has with how his family feels about this - the interpersonal aspects. Which, when stated this clearly, seems ridiculous, since obviously men can have just as much concern about their families breaking up as women can. It was just a feeling I had while reading the piece.