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He said in his podcast a few weeks ago that he thought it was unnecessary, as the ambiguity allowed for different flavors with different uses. I'm assuming the

He said in his podcast a few weeks ago that he thought it was unnecessary, as the ambiguity allowed for different flavors with different uses. I'm assuming the reference to the Yankees being the best team in baseball is directed at Gruber. During that podcast, Gruber encouraged that group to consider not calling what they were doing Markdown. Something to the effect of, "Come up with your own thing, and see if it catches on." He noted that the ambiguity is probably what has made Markdown useful to such diverse groups with different needs, and should be preserved.

smackfu 12y ago
I remember listening, but wish I could find the episode again. Do you remember which one it was?
- swilliams 12y ago
  I believe it was the 2 parter with Marco Arment. Either this one: https://daringfireball.net/thetalkshow/2014/07/19/ep-088 https://daringfireball.net/thetalkshow/2014/07/19/ep-088 or this: https://daringfireball.net/thetalkshow/2014/07/19/ep-089 https://daringfireball.net/thetalkshow/2014/07/19/ep-089 Just several hours to sift through :)
- peterhajas 12y ago
  It's the episode of The Talk Show with Marco Arment as a guest.
- Marcus316 12y ago
  It's starts at about 1:15:00 in Episode 88.
- philoushka 12y ago
  Listen to it on Overcast.fm "Atwood's crusade" https://overcast.fm/podcasts/episode/344902019595#t=4527 https://overcast.fm/podcasts/episode/344902019595#t=4527
  - canadev 12y ago
    I've landed on the guy's markdown pages (he refers to this in the podcast) several times, trying to figure out how to do stuff in markdown. I find the page hard to read (the font is tiny; I always resize it), and the examples rarely seem to describe what I am trying to achieve.
apike 12y ago
> During that podcast, Gruber encouraged that group to consider not calling what they were doing Markdown. John Gruber's stance was a little stronger than this - he currently has a reasonable claim to the trademark Markdown, as a term he coined and popularized for this use. This group's use of the brand "Standard Markdown" to describe something the owner of "Markdown" disagrees with seems ill-advised. He's now forced to either try to push them off the name or effectively abandon the trademark to genericization.
- ealexhudson 12y ago
  He's already lost it to genericization. Trademarks distinguish vendors in a market place; plenty of different people operate services that provide "Markdown" formatting that are not the original vendor and are incompatible. Without having taken any steps to license other people's uses of the term, it's not operating as a trademark in any normal sense (unregistered or not).
  - RubyPinch 12y ago
    I don't know how well genericization applies to this, markdown was a loosely defined specification, intentionally encouraging modification. all the "incompatible" versions of markdown are within what he intended. further, its just the name of a spec, should the owner of a spec really be expected to continuously hunt down and test/validate every implementation of their specification? that doesn't exactly seem possible in the slightest. I don't think he would have trademark protections for something like this for other reasons, I do wonder if there is anything similar that applies in this situation
    - njr123 12y ago
      > should the owner of a spec really be expected to continuously hunt down and test/validate every implementation of their specification? I'm pretty sure thats exactly what trademark law says you have to do. You have to defend your trademark. You can't go ten years letting everyone use the Markdown brand where ever they want, and then suddenly decide one day you want to start controlling it.
gamache 12y ago
The ambiguity of Markdown formats has been nothing but a minor pain to me. It makes it harder to search for syntax advice, that's for sure, and 99% of us casual users are doing just that. I am excited for a well-documented, standard Markdown format to be the top link on Google.

smackfu 12y ago

I remember listening, but wish I could find the episode again. Do you remember which one it was?

swilliams 12y ago
I believe it was the 2 parter with Marco Arment. Either this one: https://daringfireball.net/thetalkshow/2014/07/19/ep-088 https://daringfireball.net/thetalkshow/2014/07/19/ep-088 or this: https://daringfireball.net/thetalkshow/2014/07/19/ep-089 https://daringfireball.net/thetalkshow/2014/07/19/ep-089 Just several hours to sift through :)
peterhajas 12y ago
It's the episode of The Talk Show with Marco Arment as a guest.
Marcus316 12y ago
It's starts at about 1:15:00 in Episode 88.
philoushka 12y ago
Listen to it on Overcast.fm "Atwood's crusade" https://overcast.fm/podcasts/episode/344902019595#t=4527 https://overcast.fm/podcasts/episode/344902019595#t=4527
- canadev 12y ago
  I've landed on the guy's markdown pages (he refers to this in the podcast) several times, trying to figure out how to do stuff in markdown. I find the page hard to read (the font is tiny; I always resize it), and the examples rarely seem to describe what I am trying to achieve.

apike 12y ago

> During that podcast, Gruber encouraged that group to consider not calling what they were doing Markdown. John Gruber's stance was a little stronger than this - he currently has a reasonable claim to the trademark Markdown, as a term he coined and popularized for this use. This group's use of the brand "Standard Markdown" to describe something the owner of "Markdown" disagrees with seems ill-advised. He's now forced to either try to push them off the name or effectively abandon the trademark to genericization.

ealexhudson 12y ago
He's already lost it to genericization. Trademarks distinguish vendors in a market place; plenty of different people operate services that provide "Markdown" formatting that are not the original vendor and are incompatible. Without having taken any steps to license other people's uses of the term, it's not operating as a trademark in any normal sense (unregistered or not).
- RubyPinch 12y ago
  I don't know how well genericization applies to this, markdown was a loosely defined specification, intentionally encouraging modification. all the "incompatible" versions of markdown are within what he intended. further, its just the name of a spec, should the owner of a spec really be expected to continuously hunt down and test/validate every implementation of their specification? that doesn't exactly seem possible in the slightest. I don't think he would have trademark protections for something like this for other reasons, I do wonder if there is anything similar that applies in this situation
  - njr123 12y ago
    > should the owner of a spec really be expected to continuously hunt down and test/validate every implementation of their specification? I'm pretty sure thats exactly what trademark law says you have to do. You have to defend your trademark. You can't go ten years letting everyone use the Markdown brand where ever they want, and then suddenly decide one day you want to start controlling it.

gamache 12y ago

The ambiguity of Markdown formats has been nothing but a minor pain to me. It makes it harder to search for syntax advice, that's for sure, and 99% of us casual users are doing just that. I am excited for a well-documented, standard Markdown format to be the top link on Google.