5 ms·

> one 2007 study measured a small group of 21 college students and found their average typing speed was an abysmal 12.2 words per minute That blows my mind. Th

> one 2007 study measured a small group of 21 college students and found their average typing speed was an abysmal 12.2 words per minute That blows my mind. That's less than a tenth the speed I type at. How do they get anything done??

mikestew 12y ago
I can type that fast on a phone. I'll assume for the sake of discussion that this number is accurate across a general population. If you sit at a keyboard long enough, how can you not get faster than 12.2 wpm? So much for "kids growing up with computers". All that time in front of a keyboard since kindergarten, and you're output is still restricted by your abysmal typing speed? OTOH, do typing classes even exist anymore, are are we to assume that kids will just learn it by osmosis? When I was in high school I took typing class. On a real typewriter. And it was a manual typewriter...that we could only use in a blinding snow storm while walking uphill. Anyway, I type around 100 wpm now which I attribute to that typing class. Had I just been left to my own devices to hunt-and-peck my way around, I doubt I'd be anywhere near that speed.
- nerfhammer 12y ago
  I think I could only do like 30WPM until I sat down and trained myself to actually type correctly and promptly could type 2-3x that http://www.gnu.org/software/gtypist/ http://www.gnu.org/software/gtypist/
- sj4nz 12y ago
  We all can probably stand to use more remedial training at typing, even if we think that we're already pretty fast. Every once in a while I'll dust off [GNU Typist][0] and bash it at for ten-minutes. Unfortunately, its been nearly impossible to change kinetic memory for alternative layouts like [Workman][1], there hasn't been enough time to unlearn and learn it without suffering a huge productivity hit. [0]: https://www.gnu.org/software/gtypist/ https://www.gnu.org/software/gtypist/ [1]: http://www.workmanlayout.com/blog/ http://www.workmanlayout.com/blog/
- larrys 12y ago
  "which I attribute to that typing class. Had I just been left to my own devices to hunt-and-peck my way around" I learned on a manual as well. But by using a book. It took about 3 weeks. I actually stopped at the part where you practice numbers (and regret it to this day). "that we could only use in a blinding snow storm while walking uphill" I was lucky to be able to convince a college instructor to allow me to bring in the manual typewriter so I could type the answer to an essay instead of using one of the blue books. Same blinding snow storm that day!
  - mikestew 12y ago
    > I actually stopped at the part where you practice numbers (and regret it to this day). We learned that in typing class, but I never did "get" the number row. Bane of my existence to this day. I mean, mostly hit what I want but it's not thoughtless tapping like the rest of the keyboard. Don't know if it's my dainty little fingers or what the deal is. > Same blinding snow storm that day! Nah, probably not the same storm. Blinding snow storms were so common back then, it just seemed like it we shared the same weather pattern. Not like the constantly pleasant weather these kids today grow up with.
- NDizzle 12y ago
  Hey, I'm another person whose only class was on a manual typewriter. 7th grade, 1992ish. I'm at 85 wpm 100% accuracy, 130 wpm if I omit capitalization and punctuation. (and let the word processor pick it up)
  - mikestew 12y ago
    1992?! Holy smokes, and here I thought I went to a backwater school (and I did) because we were still using manual typewriters in 1980. :-) They upgraded to electrics a year or two later.
- Kluny 12y ago
  In contrast, I was given typing classes from first grade, for at least one semester per year, every year up until graduation (2007), and I still managed to avoid learning how to touch type for all that time. When I was 18 I decided I wanted to be a coder and found that my typing speed was a lousy 19-25wpm, and decided to get better. It took about a month of active practice to get up to my current plateau of about 60-70wpm. And it was entirely my own choice to learn - the years of classes didn't seem to have any effect. Edit for vanity: 60-70wpm tested. I'm pretty sure I can type faster than that sometimes.
- userbinator 12y ago
  All that time in front of a keyboard since kindergarten, and you're output is still restricted by your abysmal typing speed? You mean, "all that time in front of a keyboard - and mouse." GUIs and mouses (and now, touch screens) have made computer interaction largely keyboardless - most people would rather push the rodent around or touch the screen than make use of keyboard shortcuts, and interfaces are designed in that direction so it's not so surprising that people aren't learning how to type faster despite increased computer use.
- joesmo 12y ago
  The statistic about typing classes is indeed a sad one. You make an excellent point: "All that time in front of a keyboard since kindergarten, and you're output is still restricted by your abysmal typing speed?" Unfortunately, in my experience, yes. I spent years using a computer doing virtually everything with it including programming before I finally got fed up with not being able to touch type. I forced myself to not look at the keys and type. It worked. (How could it not?) Later on, I had a typing class as well, but by that time I was already an excellent typist. For the kids that are less motivated however, I think they'd be stuck where I was before I decided to force myself to learn it. Since typing classes are so rare, this means that they won't even be forced to learn it (a good thing). I don't think anyone is truly computer literate unless they can touch type. It's an essential skill, really, and while one can get by without it, the experience is hardly equivalent. So I wonder, with all the focus on CS classes in high schools, where is the focus on typing? After all, call me prejudiced, but I would never work with a programmer or writer who couldn't touch type. To me, that shows disdain or lack of interest for the profession.
coffeecodecouch 12y ago
> That blows my mind. Really? I don't find it that shocking at all that most people might type at a tenth of the speed a programmer can type. I'm sure a chef could express the same awe at my inefficiency when making Kraft Dinner.
- nbouscal 12y ago
  Realistically I don't think programmers type prose all that much more frequently than college students. Programming tends to involve lots of symbols, and most of the typing is in small edits rather than paragraphs. College students write long essays and term papers, whereas I rarely write anything longer than an in-depth comment on Hacker News. I agree that it makes sense that programmers type faster due to the general correlation with technology usage, but I'm still quite surprised by the magnitude of the difference.
- e12e 12y ago
  These are not "most people", these are college students. If you can't write an essay at a reasonable pace (and don't have an excuse like studying pure math -- by your own admission computer science is out) -- it would appear basic education has failed. Not that that's much of a surprise -- the only reason I'm not hobbled by poor, self-taught, typing is that I was offered touch typing (on a typewriter, mind) in junior high school. I suppose it's testament that for all the fun of being an autodidact, there are some skills that really do benefit from tutoring (I'd argue most skills do, but the challenge is to find a good tutor...).
  - Avshalom 12y ago
    What's a reasonable pace? 12 wpm is 2-3 pages an hour.
    - e12e 12y ago
      Obviously the most important is how well one writes, not the speed. But 12 wpm is basically a real handicap -- it is below reasonable speed. Consider that a short essay is maybe 10 pages, and needs a minimum of three drafts... that's 25 pages or so. 8-12 hours of just typing for 10 pages? I'd say 30 wpm is a reasonable low-bar average.
skywhopper 12y ago
I don't know how fast my middle-school daughter can type, but she doesn't touch-type. Her school does insist that they spend a lot of time using computers for research and writing, and they even take some standardized tests on computers, but they do not teach the kids how to type. Seems to me if you are going to have the kids using computers, then typing should be an early skill to teach them as well. On the flip side, I can see that for kids these days it must be much harder to learn to type. So much of their time is spent using computers, and so even spending an hour a day on touch-typing lessons is going to pale in comparison to the amount of time spent not touch typing because you don't know enough yet to touch type all the time. And that has to make the barrier much harder to overcome.
- mikestew 12y ago
  > Her school does insist that they spend a lot of time using computers for research and writing, and they even take some standardized tests on computers, but they do not teach the kids how to type. (emphasis mine) That's just asinine. When I was in high school 30 years ago, if a school had insisted that all reports be typewritten and yet did not offer typing classes, I'm pretty sure some job losses would have occurred. What other tools shall we insist that children use without instruction? Hand them pencils in 1st grade and demand that they produce legible communication that they're left to just figure out on their own? Here's a band saw for shop class, have a bookshelf done by end of day?
- ripter 12y ago
  That's crazy. My elementary and middle school required that we took typing classes. Mavis Beacon on Apple IIs FTW.
- izzydata 12y ago
  That seems ridiculous. They were having us do things like reader rabbit 15 years ago in elementary school. By middle school I was already typing at 80 wpm which unfortunately was faster than the fastest speeds for most of the typing games they were having us do at the times. Granted I'd imagine this could be a problem with funding for computers in certain areas, but I'd at least expect them to have typing classes early on if they are also expecting you to work with computers in other classes. This is one of those skills that is very beneficial to start on early. My father types nearly every day and can barely do 20 wpm.
beachstartup 12y ago
i spent a lot of time on the net (irc) as a kid, and even then my typing didn't go above 50wpm until i actually sat down and taught myself how to type correctly, and then practiced deliberately. i remember i went from 40wpm to 100wpm in a single summer. most people never actually learn to type correctly, they just keep doing the wrong thing forever. of course, once you actually learn to do it right, you're practicing all the time and after several years you can easily get up to and past 120wpm if you sit in front of a computer all day.
jimmaswell 12y ago
Most of them probably don't need to type that much.
Centigonal 12y ago
I skimmed the study, and that statistic is a little misleading. They weren't typing predetermined sentences. They were instructed to come up with a story based on some pictures and write it down. They weren't bottlenecked by typing speed, but rather by pauses for thought between words.
- kstenerud 12y ago
  This is why I hate these sorts of "X proven better than Y" posts. In this case, the study is available, so you can call the blogger on his BS. In many cases, the actual study is paywalled or not even linked to, leading to all sorts of misinformation.

mikestew 12y ago

I can type that fast on a phone. I'll assume for the sake of discussion that this number is accurate across a general population. If you sit at a keyboard long enough, how can you not get faster than 12.2 wpm? So much for "kids growing up with computers". All that time in front of a keyboard since kindergarten, and you're output is still restricted by your abysmal typing speed? OTOH, do typing classes even exist anymore, are are we to assume that kids will just learn it by osmosis? When I was in high school I took typing class. On a real typewriter. And it was a manual typewriter...that we could only use in a blinding snow storm while walking uphill. Anyway, I type around 100 wpm now which I attribute to that typing class. Had I just been left to my own devices to hunt-and-peck my way around, I doubt I'd be anywhere near that speed.

nerfhammer 12y ago
I think I could only do like 30WPM until I sat down and trained myself to actually type correctly and promptly could type 2-3x that http://www.gnu.org/software/gtypist/ http://www.gnu.org/software/gtypist/
sj4nz 12y ago
We all can probably stand to use more remedial training at typing, even if we think that we're already pretty fast. Every once in a while I'll dust off [GNU Typist][0] and bash it at for ten-minutes. Unfortunately, its been nearly impossible to change kinetic memory for alternative layouts like [Workman][1], there hasn't been enough time to unlearn and learn it without suffering a huge productivity hit. [0]: https://www.gnu.org/software/gtypist/ https://www.gnu.org/software/gtypist/ [1]: http://www.workmanlayout.com/blog/ http://www.workmanlayout.com/blog/
larrys 12y ago
"which I attribute to that typing class. Had I just been left to my own devices to hunt-and-peck my way around" I learned on a manual as well. But by using a book. It took about 3 weeks. I actually stopped at the part where you practice numbers (and regret it to this day). "that we could only use in a blinding snow storm while walking uphill" I was lucky to be able to convince a college instructor to allow me to bring in the manual typewriter so I could type the answer to an essay instead of using one of the blue books. Same blinding snow storm that day!
- mikestew 12y ago
  > I actually stopped at the part where you practice numbers (and regret it to this day). We learned that in typing class, but I never did "get" the number row. Bane of my existence to this day. I mean, mostly hit what I want but it's not thoughtless tapping like the rest of the keyboard. Don't know if it's my dainty little fingers or what the deal is. > Same blinding snow storm that day! Nah, probably not the same storm. Blinding snow storms were so common back then, it just seemed like it we shared the same weather pattern. Not like the constantly pleasant weather these kids today grow up with.
NDizzle 12y ago
Hey, I'm another person whose only class was on a manual typewriter. 7th grade, 1992ish. I'm at 85 wpm 100% accuracy, 130 wpm if I omit capitalization and punctuation. (and let the word processor pick it up)
- mikestew 12y ago
  1992?! Holy smokes, and here I thought I went to a backwater school (and I did) because we were still using manual typewriters in 1980. :-) They upgraded to electrics a year or two later.
Kluny 12y ago
In contrast, I was given typing classes from first grade, for at least one semester per year, every year up until graduation (2007), and I still managed to avoid learning how to touch type for all that time. When I was 18 I decided I wanted to be a coder and found that my typing speed was a lousy 19-25wpm, and decided to get better. It took about a month of active practice to get up to my current plateau of about 60-70wpm. And it was entirely my own choice to learn - the years of classes didn't seem to have any effect. Edit for vanity: 60-70wpm tested. I'm pretty sure I can type faster than that sometimes.
userbinator 12y ago
All that time in front of a keyboard since kindergarten, and you're output is still restricted by your abysmal typing speed? You mean, "all that time in front of a keyboard - and mouse." GUIs and mouses (and now, touch screens) have made computer interaction largely keyboardless - most people would rather push the rodent around or touch the screen than make use of keyboard shortcuts, and interfaces are designed in that direction so it's not so surprising that people aren't learning how to type faster despite increased computer use.
joesmo 12y ago
The statistic about typing classes is indeed a sad one. You make an excellent point: "All that time in front of a keyboard since kindergarten, and you're output is still restricted by your abysmal typing speed?" Unfortunately, in my experience, yes. I spent years using a computer doing virtually everything with it including programming before I finally got fed up with not being able to touch type. I forced myself to not look at the keys and type. It worked. (How could it not?) Later on, I had a typing class as well, but by that time I was already an excellent typist. For the kids that are less motivated however, I think they'd be stuck where I was before I decided to force myself to learn it. Since typing classes are so rare, this means that they won't even be forced to learn it (a good thing). I don't think anyone is truly computer literate unless they can touch type. It's an essential skill, really, and while one can get by without it, the experience is hardly equivalent. So I wonder, with all the focus on CS classes in high schools, where is the focus on typing? After all, call me prejudiced, but I would never work with a programmer or writer who couldn't touch type. To me, that shows disdain or lack of interest for the profession.

coffeecodecouch 12y ago

> That blows my mind. Really? I don't find it that shocking at all that most people might type at a tenth of the speed a programmer can type. I'm sure a chef could express the same awe at my inefficiency when making Kraft Dinner.

nbouscal 12y ago
Realistically I don't think programmers type prose all that much more frequently than college students. Programming tends to involve lots of symbols, and most of the typing is in small edits rather than paragraphs. College students write long essays and term papers, whereas I rarely write anything longer than an in-depth comment on Hacker News. I agree that it makes sense that programmers type faster due to the general correlation with technology usage, but I'm still quite surprised by the magnitude of the difference.
e12e 12y ago
These are not "most people", these are college students. If you can't write an essay at a reasonable pace (and don't have an excuse like studying pure math -- by your own admission computer science is out) -- it would appear basic education has failed. Not that that's much of a surprise -- the only reason I'm not hobbled by poor, self-taught, typing is that I was offered touch typing (on a typewriter, mind) in junior high school. I suppose it's testament that for all the fun of being an autodidact, there are some skills that really do benefit from tutoring (I'd argue most skills do, but the challenge is to find a good tutor...).
- Avshalom 12y ago
  What's a reasonable pace? 12 wpm is 2-3 pages an hour.
  - e12e 12y ago
    Obviously the most important is how well one writes, not the speed. But 12 wpm is basically a real handicap -- it is below reasonable speed. Consider that a short essay is maybe 10 pages, and needs a minimum of three drafts... that's 25 pages or so. 8-12 hours of just typing for 10 pages? I'd say 30 wpm is a reasonable low-bar average.

skywhopper 12y ago

I don't know how fast my middle-school daughter can type, but she doesn't touch-type. Her school does insist that they spend a lot of time using computers for research and writing, and they even take some standardized tests on computers, but they do not teach the kids how to type. Seems to me if you are going to have the kids using computers, then typing should be an early skill to teach them as well. On the flip side, I can see that for kids these days it must be much harder to learn to type. So much of their time is spent using computers, and so even spending an hour a day on touch-typing lessons is going to pale in comparison to the amount of time spent not touch typing because you don't know enough yet to touch type all the time. And that has to make the barrier much harder to overcome.

mikestew 12y ago
> Her school does insist that they spend a lot of time using computers for research and writing, and they even take some standardized tests on computers, but they do not teach the kids how to type. (emphasis mine) That's just asinine. When I was in high school 30 years ago, if a school had insisted that all reports be typewritten and yet did not offer typing classes, I'm pretty sure some job losses would have occurred. What other tools shall we insist that children use without instruction? Hand them pencils in 1st grade and demand that they produce legible communication that they're left to just figure out on their own? Here's a band saw for shop class, have a bookshelf done by end of day?
ripter 12y ago
That's crazy. My elementary and middle school required that we took typing classes. Mavis Beacon on Apple IIs FTW.
izzydata 12y ago
That seems ridiculous. They were having us do things like reader rabbit 15 years ago in elementary school. By middle school I was already typing at 80 wpm which unfortunately was faster than the fastest speeds for most of the typing games they were having us do at the times. Granted I'd imagine this could be a problem with funding for computers in certain areas, but I'd at least expect them to have typing classes early on if they are also expecting you to work with computers in other classes. This is one of those skills that is very beneficial to start on early. My father types nearly every day and can barely do 20 wpm.

beachstartup 12y ago

i spent a lot of time on the net (irc) as a kid, and even then my typing didn't go above 50wpm until i actually sat down and taught myself how to type correctly, and then practiced deliberately. i remember i went from 40wpm to 100wpm in a single summer. most people never actually learn to type correctly, they just keep doing the wrong thing forever. of course, once you actually learn to do it right, you're practicing all the time and after several years you can easily get up to and past 120wpm if you sit in front of a computer all day.

jimmaswell 12y ago

Most of them probably don't need to type that much.

Centigonal 12y ago

I skimmed the study, and that statistic is a little misleading. They weren't typing predetermined sentences. They were instructed to come up with a story based on some pictures and write it down. They weren't bottlenecked by typing speed, but rather by pauses for thought between words.

kstenerud 12y ago
This is why I hate these sorts of "X proven better than Y" posts. In this case, the study is available, so you can call the blogger on his BS. In many cases, the actual study is paywalled or not even linked to, leading to all sorts of misinformation.