5 ms·

YouTube's Biggest Draw Plays Games, Earns $4 Million a Year

49 points by kapkapkap 12y ago

minimaxir 12y ago
PewDiePie is an interesting case. The YouTube gaming community envies his popularity so much that nearly every gaming commentator has tried to emulate his tactics: face-cams which overlaying game footage, exaggerated reactions to on-screen content, merchandizable catch-phrases, and nicknames for viewer fandom. Some have been nearly as successful as PewDiePie (Tobuscus is one), but PewDiePie has effectively created a content quality black hole on YouTube.
- krisgee 12y ago
  It works, 4 million dollars a year can attest to that. So even though I intensely dislike it I can't really argue against it.
  - minimaxir 12y ago
    The same "I can't argue with it because it works" logic can be used for startups who "growth hack" their way to success even if it means harassing their users with interrupting modals and deceptive links. That doesn't make it unimpeachable. Atleast with PewDiePie, you know what to expect.
    - vinceguidry 12y ago
      > startups who "growth hack" their way to success These exist? I mean, obviously the 'growth hacking' exists. Is there an example of a startup who managed to build a real business solely on the basis of these tactics? One that 'you can't argue with'? I wouldn't call Groupon a real business.
      - MichaelGG 12y ago
        Reddit setup fake accounts/content. RapGenius seems to have had a guy doing some underhanded promotion. LinkedIn still does this stuff (or maybe it just started). Safe to assume there are others.
        vinceguidry 12y ago
        None of these examples are unqualified successes. Neither Reddit nor RapGenius have business models yet that are making any money. LinkedIn made roughly $5,200 per employee last year.
        Vigil 12y ago
        Do you have anything to support those numbers? Honestly curious.
        vinceguidry 12y ago
        The LinkedIn number I got from their Wikipedia page. Just divide the net income of $26 million by their 5k employees. Article from last year about Reddit's struggle for profitability: http://www.businessinsider.com/reddit-is-trying-to-become-profitable-2013-12 http://www.businessinsider.com/reddit-is-trying-to-become-pr... Article on RapGenius's own struggle: http://techcrunch.com/2013/05/01/rap-genius-enterprise/ http://techcrunch.com/2013/05/01/rap-genius-enterprise/
        MichaelGG 12y ago
        Well, I guess you can say LinkedIn is not a success (and with a PE of almost 1000 I like to be indignant-on-the-Internet, too). But if you ask most startup founders if they'd feel getting to LinkedIn position is a success, I think you'd get a resounding, unanimous, yes. Ditto for reddit. Not sure how well the RapGenius people have made out but it seems they're doing well. Remember, being a viable business is different than being successful. Twitter hasn't turned a profit, but the people that started it made off quite well. Splunk still loses cash left-and-right, yet is considered solid. If I came up with a money-losing idea that got millions of users, never made a dime, and I sold it for even $10M, I'd be very happy with my "failure".
  - nikster 12y ago
    I don't watch that channel obviously but he's having fun and entertaining lots of people. I can't find anything wrong with that to be honest. It's not about making money for me, it's about how you make money. He's not scamming anyone, he's just providing content and people choose to watch it. And it's probably still better than most of what's on TV.
- jerf 12y ago
  Welcome to the lowest common denominator. No sarcasm, no cynicism, it simply is what it is. If you want something more, there's a ton of that, too. On the internet, the LCD doesn't have to crowd out the "better" stuff (for whatever personal definition of "better" you may like)... there's bandwidth enough for all. Which eliminates the biggest reason to hate it.
sixQuarks 12y ago
When I was a kid, I always promised myself I would never become one of those lame adults that said things like "kids these days, look at the junk they listen/watch etc...!". PewDiePie has single-handily made me break that promise. WTF are kids watching these days????
- minimaxir 12y ago
  If you think PewDiePie is ridiculous but still popular with kids, you won't believe YouTube's Minecraft subculture.
  - imaginenore 12y ago
    Or HowToBasic. https://www.youtube.com/user/HowToBasic https://www.youtube.com/user/HowToBasic
    - quink 12y ago
      For me, the only surprise was that the guy is from Perth - my number 2 guess - instead of Sydney's inner west or south or Campbelltown, which was my #1 general area guess.
    - skeletonjelly 12y ago
      yeah but this is a highbrow psychology experiment...or something
  - ktsmith 12y ago
    My son and all of his friends, ages 5-7, all love evantubehd and stampylonghead and I just don't get it. The weirder part for me is then they pretend they are making youtube shows when they are playing.
- cheald 12y ago
  That was basically "twerking" for me.
- niix 12y ago
  It's true. This is why websites like Twitch.tv are extremely popular and profitable as well.
andymcsherry 12y ago
Link to get around paywall: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCEQqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fonline.wsj.com%2Farticles%2Fyoutube-star-plays-videogames-earns-4-million-a-year-1402939896&ei=5Z2fU8KoCo6gsQTgy4GIBg&usg=AFQjCNHPKZNgJbz29IN-rKu5xiIrGMUFcg&bvm=bv.68911936,d.cWc https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&c...
- hollerith 12y ago
  Paywall's still there.
  - zanok 12y ago
    This should work: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:zL--e6724M8J:stream.wsj.com/story/latest-headlines/SS-2-63399/SS-2-556782/&hl=en&gl=us&strip=1 http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:zL--e67...
- notlisted 12y ago
  Worked for me, thanks.
JoshTriplett 12y ago
What makes me really sad is people who think this is the height of Let's Play video quality. There are quite a few higher-quality channels out there. http://lparchive.org/ http://lparchive.org/ is a good place to start. A few recommendations: Frankomatic (adventure games), Bobbin Threadbare (adventures and others), SimplySimon (Mega Man games), Deceased Crab (indie and lesser-known games), retsupurae (specifically their adventure game MST3Kings such as King's Quest 5/6), and Video Games Awesome (miscellaneous games streamed blind but with very high production values and an interactive chat). I also highly recommend the annual Speed Demos Archive charity marathons, especially the races and challenges. For instance, several top Super Metroid players racing for 45 minutes and finishing within seconds of each other, or players completing Punch-Out and Super Punch-Out blindfolded.
- quink 12y ago
  Just a guess... you were born before 1982, right? I think most of this really is just an age gap. I don't think that PewDiePie is the height of Let's Play quality (and definitely not any of those you listed) - that honour might as well go to Scott Manley playing Kerbal Space Program - but he's not as terrible by a long, long stretch as some in here make him out to be. > "content quality black hole", "I intensely dislike it", "WTF are kids watching these days" You know, there's a reason he's popular. And sure, 80% of his output aren't going to match your quality filter. But the remaining 20% will. And, if nothing else, he's a cultural influence. Here's an idea: Turn off your brain and just watch some highly rated or very popular ones in the background. Can't be worse than the vast majority of TV you (and I) watched in the 90s, all things considered. Edit: And, if nothing else, two decades from now whoever is going to be working with you as a statistical inevitability by then when you're older will have grown up on PewDiePie (or one would hope, something a bit more educational) in the same way that you did on The Simpsons?
  - JoshTriplett 12y ago
    > Just a guess... you were born before 1982, right? Nope; I'm in my 20s, not 30s. > And sure, 80% of his output aren't going to match your quality filter. But the remaining 20% will. Quantity has a quality all its own, but no, even 20% seems unlikely. > And, if nothing else, he's a cultural influence. Which brings me back to "What makes me really sad". > Turn off your brain No. I'm not a fan of "mindless" entertainment when there's so much that I don't have to turn off my brain to enjoy.
nickporter 12y ago
Well I'm glad he's getting rewarded for his original content. I no longer have time to play video games anymore, so this guy, along with Robbaz, Day9 and GameGrumps are pretty much the only way I get my gaming fix. I'm also really interested in apps/games (ex. strawpoll.me) that let viewers participate in their stream. Seems like a good use case for meteor.
searine 12y ago
Ehh, I like the grumps better. I feel like there is more effort put into the comedy.
- judk 12y ago
  What are the grumps?
  - drdeca 12y ago
    I believe they mean "game grumps". They also do videos of games.
aclements18 12y ago
Not to take anything away from this young man (and Maker Studios) success here, but I thought it might be a good time to point out how YouTube math works. If his channel generates $4 million in ad revenue, Google/YouTube keeps about 45% and issues a check to Maker for the remaining $2.2m. Maker then takes another 10-30%. Still a substantial sum in the end, but I felt the title may potentially be misleading.
- fekberg 12y ago
  > The 24-year-old Mr. Kjellberg, who created PewDiePie five years ago, has parlayed his persona into a brand name that pulls in the equivalent of $4 million in ad sales a year, most of it pure profit. If it's $4 million "mostly profit" I would take that as what he gets before taxes. If he pays his taxes in Sweden I think closer to 70% of that would disappear.
  - quink 12y ago
    What do you mean, 'disappear'? I'm pretty sure taxes charged on income doesn't just flow into government and then suddenly vanish without a trace. > The 24-year-old Mr. Kjellberg, who created PewDiePie five years ago, has parlayed his persona into a brand name that pulls in the equivalent of $4 million in ad sales a year, most of it pure profit. And I'm pretty sure the title isn't misleading - it's $4 million after YouTube's cut, which seems to check out, having cross-correlated other sources.
    - fekberg 12y ago
      'disappear' was probably a wrongly used word. It's money that will never be his, the income tax is paid to the government and they use it like any other tax money. There are different levels taxation in Sweden if I recall correctly the upper level takes out 70% of the income, that is income earned after $200.000. So if I understand it correctly that would mean he needs to pay $2.660.000 in taxes on those $4 million. I could be wrong though, but that is my understanding of it. If he's got a corporation where the money goes, that's an entirely different thing. My assumptions are it's a sole proprietorship or equal to that.
Kronopath 12y ago
Here's a video with some interesting theories about how PewDiePie, and other gaming channels, are so popular because they're effectively hyper-tuned for Youtube's promotion algorithms: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgMqhEMhVV8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgMqhEMhVV8
levifig 12y ago
I'm a 32-year old who has recorded some LP videos and who, not recording anymore, still watches other 30-some playing Minecraft on YouTube… :) I don't particularly jive with PewDiePie and the like but I watch others like Etho (ethoslab), BdoubleO (bdoubleo100) and a slew of others… :) It's fun! As a developer-designer, I've had a few ideas around potential services around this stuff that I wish I had the time and resources to execute because I can totally see this market exploding right now… :)
free2rhyme214 12y ago
I prefer Yogscast over this guy.
codelust 12y ago
Had written about this a while ago: http://frontiernxt.com/hybrid-entertainment-free-roam-network-games http://frontiernxt.com/hybrid-entertainment-free-roam-networ... Kjellberg maybe the biggest personality, but there is a significant group of people who make a decent living out of doing this. I do strongly believe that this will become a major genre in reality television/entertainment. And I am not taking into account the other universe called DOTA here.

49 points by kapkapkap 12y ago

PewDiePie is an interesting case. The YouTube gaming community envies his popularity so much that nearly every gaming commentator has tried to emulate his tactics: face-cams which overlaying game footage, exaggerated reactions to on-screen content, merchandizable catch-phrases, and nicknames for viewer fandom. Some have been nearly as successful as PewDiePie (Tobuscus is one), but PewDiePie has effectively created a content quality black hole on YouTube.

krisgee 12y ago
It works, 4 million dollars a year can attest to that. So even though I intensely dislike it I can't really argue against it.
- minimaxir 12y ago
  The same "I can't argue with it because it works" logic can be used for startups who "growth hack" their way to success even if it means harassing their users with interrupting modals and deceptive links. That doesn't make it unimpeachable. Atleast with PewDiePie, you know what to expect.
  - vinceguidry 12y ago
    > startups who "growth hack" their way to success These exist? I mean, obviously the 'growth hacking' exists. Is there an example of a startup who managed to build a real business solely on the basis of these tactics? One that 'you can't argue with'? I wouldn't call Groupon a real business.
    - MichaelGG 12y ago
      Reddit setup fake accounts/content. RapGenius seems to have had a guy doing some underhanded promotion. LinkedIn still does this stuff (or maybe it just started). Safe to assume there are others.
      - vinceguidry 12y ago
        None of these examples are unqualified successes. Neither Reddit nor RapGenius have business models yet that are making any money. LinkedIn made roughly $5,200 per employee last year.
        Vigil 12y ago
        Do you have anything to support those numbers? Honestly curious.
        vinceguidry 12y ago
        The LinkedIn number I got from their Wikipedia page. Just divide the net income of $26 million by their 5k employees. Article from last year about Reddit's struggle for profitability: http://www.businessinsider.com/reddit-is-trying-to-become-profitable-2013-12 http://www.businessinsider.com/reddit-is-trying-to-become-pr... Article on RapGenius's own struggle: http://techcrunch.com/2013/05/01/rap-genius-enterprise/ http://techcrunch.com/2013/05/01/rap-genius-enterprise/
        MichaelGG 12y ago
        Well, I guess you can say LinkedIn is not a success (and with a PE of almost 1000 I like to be indignant-on-the-Internet, too). But if you ask most startup founders if they'd feel getting to LinkedIn position is a success, I think you'd get a resounding, unanimous, yes. Ditto for reddit. Not sure how well the RapGenius people have made out but it seems they're doing well. Remember, being a viable business is different than being successful. Twitter hasn't turned a profit, but the people that started it made off quite well. Splunk still loses cash left-and-right, yet is considered solid. If I came up with a money-losing idea that got millions of users, never made a dime, and I sold it for even $10M, I'd be very happy with my "failure".
- nikster 12y ago
  I don't watch that channel obviously but he's having fun and entertaining lots of people. I can't find anything wrong with that to be honest. It's not about making money for me, it's about how you make money. He's not scamming anyone, he's just providing content and people choose to watch it. And it's probably still better than most of what's on TV.
jerf 12y ago
Welcome to the lowest common denominator. No sarcasm, no cynicism, it simply is what it is. If you want something more, there's a ton of that, too. On the internet, the LCD doesn't have to crowd out the "better" stuff (for whatever personal definition of "better" you may like)... there's bandwidth enough for all. Which eliminates the biggest reason to hate it.

sixQuarks 12y ago

When I was a kid, I always promised myself I would never become one of those lame adults that said things like "kids these days, look at the junk they listen/watch etc...!". PewDiePie has single-handily made me break that promise. WTF are kids watching these days????

minimaxir 12y ago
If you think PewDiePie is ridiculous but still popular with kids, you won't believe YouTube's Minecraft subculture.
- imaginenore 12y ago
  Or HowToBasic. https://www.youtube.com/user/HowToBasic https://www.youtube.com/user/HowToBasic
  - quink 12y ago
    For me, the only surprise was that the guy is from Perth - my number 2 guess - instead of Sydney's inner west or south or Campbelltown, which was my #1 general area guess.
  - skeletonjelly 12y ago
    yeah but this is a highbrow psychology experiment...or something
- ktsmith 12y ago
  My son and all of his friends, ages 5-7, all love evantubehd and stampylonghead and I just don't get it. The weirder part for me is then they pretend they are making youtube shows when they are playing.
cheald 12y ago
That was basically "twerking" for me.
niix 12y ago
It's true. This is why websites like Twitch.tv are extremely popular and profitable as well.

andymcsherry 12y ago

Link to get around paywall: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCEQqQIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fonline.wsj.com%2Farticles%2Fyoutube-star-plays-videogames-earns-4-million-a-year-1402939896&ei=5Z2fU8KoCo6gsQTgy4GIBg&usg=AFQjCNHPKZNgJbz29IN-rKu5xiIrGMUFcg&bvm=bv.68911936,d.cWc https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&c...

hollerith 12y ago
Paywall's still there.
- zanok 12y ago
  This should work: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:zL--e6724M8J:stream.wsj.com/story/latest-headlines/SS-2-63399/SS-2-556782/&hl=en&gl=us&strip=1 http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:zL--e67...
notlisted 12y ago
Worked for me, thanks.

JoshTriplett 12y ago

What makes me really sad is people who think this is the height of Let's Play video quality. There are quite a few higher-quality channels out there. http://lparchive.org/ http://lparchive.org/ is a good place to start. A few recommendations: Frankomatic (adventure games), Bobbin Threadbare (adventures and others), SimplySimon (Mega Man games), Deceased Crab (indie and lesser-known games), retsupurae (specifically their adventure game MST3Kings such as King's Quest 5/6), and Video Games Awesome (miscellaneous games streamed blind but with very high production values and an interactive chat). I also highly recommend the annual Speed Demos Archive charity marathons, especially the races and challenges. For instance, several top Super Metroid players racing for 45 minutes and finishing within seconds of each other, or players completing Punch-Out and Super Punch-Out blindfolded.

quink 12y ago
Just a guess... you were born before 1982, right? I think most of this really is just an age gap. I don't think that PewDiePie is the height of Let's Play quality (and definitely not any of those you listed) - that honour might as well go to Scott Manley playing Kerbal Space Program - but he's not as terrible by a long, long stretch as some in here make him out to be. > "content quality black hole", "I intensely dislike it", "WTF are kids watching these days" You know, there's a reason he's popular. And sure, 80% of his output aren't going to match your quality filter. But the remaining 20% will. And, if nothing else, he's a cultural influence. Here's an idea: Turn off your brain and just watch some highly rated or very popular ones in the background. Can't be worse than the vast majority of TV you (and I) watched in the 90s, all things considered. Edit: And, if nothing else, two decades from now whoever is going to be working with you as a statistical inevitability by then when you're older will have grown up on PewDiePie (or one would hope, something a bit more educational) in the same way that you did on The Simpsons?
- JoshTriplett 12y ago
  > Just a guess... you were born before 1982, right? Nope; I'm in my 20s, not 30s. > And sure, 80% of his output aren't going to match your quality filter. But the remaining 20% will. Quantity has a quality all its own, but no, even 20% seems unlikely. > And, if nothing else, he's a cultural influence. Which brings me back to "What makes me really sad". > Turn off your brain No. I'm not a fan of "mindless" entertainment when there's so much that I don't have to turn off my brain to enjoy.

nickporter 12y ago

Well I'm glad he's getting rewarded for his original content. I no longer have time to play video games anymore, so this guy, along with Robbaz, Day9 and GameGrumps are pretty much the only way I get my gaming fix. I'm also really interested in apps/games (ex. strawpoll.me) that let viewers participate in their stream. Seems like a good use case for meteor.

searine 12y ago

Ehh, I like the grumps better. I feel like there is more effort put into the comedy.

judk 12y ago
What are the grumps?
- drdeca 12y ago
  I believe they mean "game grumps". They also do videos of games.

aclements18 12y ago

Not to take anything away from this young man (and Maker Studios) success here, but I thought it might be a good time to point out how YouTube math works. If his channel generates $4 million in ad revenue, Google/YouTube keeps about 45% and issues a check to Maker for the remaining $2.2m. Maker then takes another 10-30%. Still a substantial sum in the end, but I felt the title may potentially be misleading.

fekberg 12y ago
> The 24-year-old Mr. Kjellberg, who created PewDiePie five years ago, has parlayed his persona into a brand name that pulls in the equivalent of $4 million in ad sales a year, most of it pure profit. If it's $4 million "mostly profit" I would take that as what he gets before taxes. If he pays his taxes in Sweden I think closer to 70% of that would disappear.
- quink 12y ago
  What do you mean, 'disappear'? I'm pretty sure taxes charged on income doesn't just flow into government and then suddenly vanish without a trace. > The 24-year-old Mr. Kjellberg, who created PewDiePie five years ago, has parlayed his persona into a brand name that pulls in the equivalent of $4 million in ad sales a year, most of it pure profit. And I'm pretty sure the title isn't misleading - it's $4 million after YouTube's cut, which seems to check out, having cross-correlated other sources.
  - fekberg 12y ago
    'disappear' was probably a wrongly used word. It's money that will never be his, the income tax is paid to the government and they use it like any other tax money. There are different levels taxation in Sweden if I recall correctly the upper level takes out 70% of the income, that is income earned after $200.000. So if I understand it correctly that would mean he needs to pay $2.660.000 in taxes on those $4 million. I could be wrong though, but that is my understanding of it. If he's got a corporation where the money goes, that's an entirely different thing. My assumptions are it's a sole proprietorship or equal to that.

Kronopath 12y ago

Here's a video with some interesting theories about how PewDiePie, and other gaming channels, are so popular because they're effectively hyper-tuned for Youtube's promotion algorithms: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgMqhEMhVV8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgMqhEMhVV8

levifig 12y ago

I'm a 32-year old who has recorded some LP videos and who, not recording anymore, still watches other 30-some playing Minecraft on YouTube… :) I don't particularly jive with PewDiePie and the like but I watch others like Etho (ethoslab), BdoubleO (bdoubleo100) and a slew of others… :) It's fun! As a developer-designer, I've had a few ideas around potential services around this stuff that I wish I had the time and resources to execute because I can totally see this market exploding right now… :)

free2rhyme214 12y ago

I prefer Yogscast over this guy.

codelust 12y ago

Had written about this a while ago: http://frontiernxt.com/hybrid-entertainment-free-roam-network-games http://frontiernxt.com/hybrid-entertainment-free-roam-networ... Kjellberg maybe the biggest personality, but there is a significant group of people who make a decent living out of doing this. I do strongly believe that this will become a major genre in reality television/entertainment. And I am not taking into account the other universe called DOTA here.